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Archives of frequently discussed topics Taxonomy • Etymology • Popular culture |
The consensus is that the article should not mention Stufful and Bewear.
Should this article mention Stufful and Bewear? Red Panda 25 13:01, 1 November 2017 (UTC)
RedPanda25 - there are two reasons why this newest instance of "eeeeh, I recognize an animal in Pokemon!" should not be added to the article: a) providing the inspiration for a comic, animation, or game character is not an indication of notability. You may notice that House mouse does not include a five-screen list of cartoon mice. b) Even if if this were sufficient, you would need to provide an authoritative source that states, expressly, "Pokemon X is based on the red panda". What you or anyone else concludes privately, based on similarity, has no weight whatsoever. We summarize existing sources, we don't insert our own conclusions. -- Elmidae ( talk · contribs) 20:57, 31 October 2017 (UTC)
In this article, several place names mentioned include:
This is all very inconsistent. Some countries (Holland, India, England) are mentioned explicitly, whereas some countries (America) are omitted.
If counties / states are important, then Darjeeling should be "Darjeeling, West Bengal, India" and Birmingham should be "Birmingham, West Midlands, England". If countries / states are not important, then Knoxville Zoo should be in "Knoxville, America", etc. to be consistent.
If it's important to specify the country when mentioning Darjeeling, Birmingham, etc. then it is also important to specify the country for American locations to be consistent. 58.166.139.124 ( talk) 09:32, 7 June 2018 (UTC)
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I would like to add that in Nepal they are called Fire Foxes. RedPanda06 ( talk) 11:30, 27 February 2019 (UTC)
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Kindly add a weblink to the Sorbus wardii /info/en/?search=Sorbus Zakir09135 ( talk) 12:28, 16 June 2019 (UTC)
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ADD news that red pandas are TWO species not one:
https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-51632790
"The red panda is not one species but two, according to DNA evidence.
...Researchers in China analysed the DNA of 65 wild red pandas. This revealed two separate species which went their own separate ways after populations were divided by a river about 250 thousand years ago."
-- Saltation (not logged in for ~decade, looks like either my account's been suspended or I didn't record a changed password)
202.86.32.140 ( talk) 05:44, 27 February 2020 (UTC)
[ article] has now been published. Given the rather large size and scope of the red panda page, how should we split it up? Geekgecko ( talk) 15:27, 27 February 2020 (UTC)
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🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯 soooo many errors lema fix em 70.185.18.232 ( talk) 13:36, 28 February 2020 (UTC)
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Request to remove citation (3): Flynn(2000), p 197. As any attempt to find such a journal or paper proves fruitless and it appears to be unverified Somethingoriginalwastaken ( talk) 07:04, 11 May 2020 (UTC)
Recent genome sequencing of distinct populations of red panda has revealed significant genetic divergence in mitochondrial DNA, whole genome DNA and Y chromosome DNA [1]. This genetic divergence corresponds to the distribution of the Himalayan and Chinese red panda subspecies and is the first convincing evidence that the two species exist as two separate species of red panda, the Himalayan red panda (A. fulgens) and the Chinese red panda (A. styani). I propose the re-listing of the two red panda subspecies as separate species, or at least a mention under the 'Phylogeny' heading that it has been proposed they form two separate species.
DocLovely ( talk) 11:00, 24 October 2020 (UTC)
References
The existence of 2 distinct species is very well supported in the scientific literature. Furthermore, there are by now multiple secondary sources stating this clearly. A revision of the article is therefore warranted. Smithsonian/National Zoo for example lists them clearly as 2 species: https://nationalzoo.si.edu/animals/red-panda. Similarlly the BBC agrees: https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-51632790 Here's the Guardian: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/feb/28/red-pandas-are-actually-two-separate-species-study-finds and finally here we have CNN: https://www.cnn.com/2020/02/27/world/red-panda-species-scli-intl-scn/index.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.80.64.216 ( talk) 17:52, 27 March 2023 (UTC)
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in Cultural references add
Kichi - Mowgli's red panda friend in The Jungle Book (1989 TV series) Rmhegde ( talk) 10:21, 2 November 2020 (UTC)
I'm thinking about making this article refer to the genus and create new pages for both species, but I am unsure as to whether that would be permissible, as it might depend on which taxonomic authority Wikipedia follows. Currently [ MammalDiversity], which seems to be the primary online database for mammal species, has split it into two species, but I'm sure that other, older authorities that Wikipedia follows might not have. Geekgecko ( talk) 02:00, 28 November 2020 (UTC)
Not all species need have separate articles. The simplest (and probably best) rule is to have no rule: if you have the time and energy to write up some particularly obscure subspecies that most people have never even heard of, go for it! As a general guideline, though, it's best to combine separate species into a single entry whenever it seems likely that there won't be enough text to make more than a short, unsatisfying stub otherwise. If the entry grows large enough to deserve splitting, that can always be done later.
Hello, I am a new user so please forgive any mistakes.
I would suggest changing the phrase "active from dusk to dawn" in the intro to simply "nocturnal" as it is more direct in regards to the animal's activity.
I also noticed two irregularities in the hyperlinks to other articles. These include:
The word "Japan" is not linked in its first instance, but rather in the second instance.
The instances of "North America" are not linked anywhere in the article.
Nikitamazepin ( talk) 03:00, 24 February 2021 (UTC)
A cryptocurrency Ethereum Token - RedPanda Earth Token, uses red pandas as a mascot to raise cryptocurrency funds to save endangered species, adopt red pandas, and conserve wildlife. RedPanda Earth Token has also released non-fungible tokens or NFTs called Red Panda Pals to raise capital to donate to save red pandas. RedPandaEarth ( talk) 02:51, 13 July 2021 (UTC)
This paper: [1] puts the red panda as being a genus of two species, instead of a monotypic species. This move was accepted by the most recent ASM edition: [1] [2]. Should we make this page a genus page, and create two new pages for each species? Reply with your thoughts. J0ngM0ng ( talk) 01:34, 31 August 2021 (UTC)
References
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Please add to the Cultural Depictions section.
A cryptocurrency Ethereum Token - RedPanda Earth Token, uses red pandas as a mascot to raise cryptocurrency funds to save endangered species, adopt red pandas, and conserve wildlife. RedPanda Earth Token has also released non-fungible tokens or NFTs called Red Panda Pals to raise capital to save red pandas. Source - https://redpanda.earth/ Donation Proof - https://redpanda.earth/donation-tracker.html NFTs - https://opensea.io/collection/red-panda-pals RedPandaEarth ( talk) 01:35, 24 September 2021 (UTC)
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{{subst:trim|1=
Red Pandas aren't carnivores, they are omnivores. They eat bamboo and small rodents, therfore making them an omnivore.
58.8.235.43 ( talk) 03:37, 20 October 2021 (UTC)
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In the Cultural depiction section, there is an unsourced statement "The red panda is primarily featured in the upcoming Pixar film, Turning Red." Pls, cite it with this citation here [3]. 2001:4455:1A9:E100:5023:99FB:2ED1:17B6 ( talk) 06:10, 23 December 2021 (UTC)
I hope to make this my next FAC mammal project. Anybody want to join? I see that the person who brought this to GA is no longer active. LittleJerry ( talk) 22:23, 29 December 2021 (UTC)
BhagyaMani, Okay so I think its best to write this article from scratch or if we are reusing old text, check the sources and make sure the text accurately reflects them. We have to be extra safe or we'll get nailed at FAC. Now for organization, I propose:
For major sources: I recently bought his book. The first edition can be downloaded here We can use both. LittleJerry ( talk) 14:06, 10 January 2022 (UTC)
LittleJerry ( talk) 13:57, 10 January 2022 (UTC)
I shall ... subjoin a fresh trivial name, Panda ...– BhagyaMani ( talk) 15:08, 11 January 2022 (UTC)
BhagyaMani, could you look though the sources for "Distribution and habitat" to see if they are accurately cited? You can also search z-library for the article that don't have a linked URL. I'll be rewriting the "Characteristics" section. LittleJerry ( talk) 03:32, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
Lets keep this image taken in Sikkim in mind for the taxobox instead of the captive one. – BhagyaMani ( talk) 19:01, 21 January 2022 (UTC)
My last edit about RP in 3 Indian states was about it. Ghose & Dutta (2011) in their book-chapter do not provide much info about habitat, but lots of details of individuals when and where encountered since the mid 1990s. I suggest to keep that paragraph separate as is for now. The next will be about Myanmar and then China. Then we can later see whether and what needs cutting down or extending or merging. – BhagyaMani ( talk) 19:55, 22 January 2022 (UTC)
Re subspecies: just saw that you already use 2 different names for the 2 sub/species, so I'll continue using Chinese red panda also in section on distribution in China. I think this ref name 1994 needs to be replaced with the one to the 2022 book-chapter 23 : the 3 authors already recognise 2 species. – BhagyaMani ( talk) 17:38, 23 January 2022 (UTC)
We may have to recheck all the bamboo species + resp. links : bamboo classification has been revised profoundly in recent years, but changes are yet not reflected in many referenced articles. E.g. Arundinaria aristata is now a syn of Thamnocalamus spathiflorus, see https://wcsp.science.kew.org/synonomy.do?name_id=446354. And Arundinaria inludes only 3 species native to Americas. – BhagyaMani ( talk) 05:29, 25 January 2022 (UTC)
Re section conservation : we need to decide whether we list all the protected areas in this section or in the section on distribution. I'm fine with either one but think it not necessary to repeat them. Your thoughts? – BhagyaMani ( talk) 06:35, 25 January 2022 (UTC)
We can keep protected areas in distribution for now. LittleJerry ( talk) 18:37, 25 January 2022 (UTC)
Since Joshi et al. (2021) suggested that the upper Brahmaputra forms the boundary between the 2 sub/species, but not the Nujiang Salween river, the question is : how shall we treat this here in regards to names – Himalayan + Chinese RP – used in the other sections? Shall we keep on assuming that all records in Tibet, NE India, Myanmar are of Himalayan RP, even when east of Brahmaputra valley? Or shall we skip using sub/specific names throughout ? I'd prefer latter. Your thoughts? – BhagyaMani ( talk) 10:05, 26 January 2022 (UTC)
I would like to replace the outcommented content in the section on captivity that is based on old studbooks. But after hours of searching I did still not find any article containing info on when the red panda SSP was established, how many zoos participate and how many individuals are kept in those zoos. Not even refs in this one give away anything useful in this regard. Does the book chapter 11 contain sth. that you can add ? – BhagyaMani ( talk) 15:30, 26 January 2022 (UTC)
Cuvier used the word 'panda' for the 1st time, but it is hardly possible that he knew a Nepali word. Documented is that Duvaucel was posted in West Bengal from where he sent a specimen and description to Paris; he travelled a lot in the region and also employed hunters to supply him with live and dead animals. On the other hand, each ethnic group in Nepal has a different name for the red panda, e.g. thokya, thongwa, wah, wakdonka + a few more, but none sounds remotely like 'panda'. Pocock was the 1st who listed 'nigálya ponya' as being a local name, but did not explain who told him; Hodgson is the most likely source for names : when he described a red panda specimen, he was already posted in Darjeeling. – BhagyaMani ( talk) 07:18, 27 January 2022 (UTC)
We should probably add information on predators and parasites. I have trouble finding much on predators from quality sources. I may also add some more on feeding. After that, the lead paragraphs should be fixed up and then we can submit to peer review and/or the copyeditors guild. LittleJerry ( talk) 15:23, 28 January 2022 (UTC)
Can you add references for the 2 alternative names red bear-cat and red cat-bear that presently have redirects? Most suitable may also be the section Etymology for these names. – BhagyaMani ( talk) 15:40, 29 January 2022 (UTC)
The map is wrong : northern Myanmar should be INcluded. I'll download distribution data and make a new one. – BhagyaMani ( talk) 16:38, 29 January 2022 (UTC)
BhagyaMani: I think we should note in the "Distribution and habitat" section that the range of the two pandas overlap in some areas and they use different micro-habitats. See cite 47. LittleJerry ( talk) 18:12, 16 February 2022 (UTC)
Oh no. I meant overlap between the red panda and the giant panda. LittleJerry ( talk) 19:26, 16 February 2022 (UTC)
|page=
that did not look right to me. –
Jonesey95 (
talk) 23:55, 20 February 2022 (UTC)
@ BhagyaMani: I have one last point regarding prose. I addressed it earlier but it may have been overlooked: "Compared to other mammals, the microbe community in red pandas is less diverse." Do you mean "Compared to other mammals, the microbiome in red pandas is less diverse"? Wretchskull ( talk) 12:00, 21 February 2022 (UTC)
I am not sure I saw a citation for the number of pandas left. I think the 10000 is accurate I just couldn't find the citation for it. Lubakhalil ( talk) 21:54, 23 January 2022 (UTC)
Do you guys think this 2 images here might be better to be on infobox? [4] and [5]. 2001:4455:364:A800:E5E5:3906:820:3691 ( talk) 03:47, 27 January 2022 (UTC)
Regarding this edit by Cygnis insignis: This is Wikipedia's article for the genus Ailurus as well as for the species Ailurus fulgens; the taxonbar should reflect that (see template documentation in {{ taxonbar}}: "The same approach can be used when monotypic taxa have a single article, but there are multiple entries in Wikidata"). Also on this topic, the lead should also probably mention/bold the genus qua genus, not just part of the binomial. Umimmak ( talk) 05:20, 25 February 2022 (UTC)
the boldfaced common name is followed by the italic un-boldfaced scientific name. – BhagyaMani ( talk) 07:01, 25 February 2022 (UTC)
So because of recent studies and considering that many scholars are now starting to think that there are two red panda species as opposed to one, should articles about the new species (and the genus) be made? 24.150.121.149 ( talk) 00:47, 28 June 2022 (UTC)
An edit earlier today added firefox as an alternative common name for the red panda, which was removed. However, in 'Cultural significance', the article identifies the red panda as 'the namesake of the Firefox browser'. I don't have full access to the citation, so if somebody could clear this up, thanks, Vortex ( talk) 10:32, 28 June 2022 (UTC)
This animal was named in 1825 using an anglisized approximation of a Nepalese word. It was another 44 years later before the completely unrelated species of black and white striped bear required a name, and so, it was decided to reuse the word panda from the smaller but similarly striped creature. The point is the Red Panda is the true Panda - because it was both the first and original named species known as the Panda. It should be made clear that the bear species that has become synonymous with the word that everyone associates, when you say "Panda", is named in error from a completely unrelated species. A naming convention that makes as much sense as calling humming birds something like "hover parrots" because of their bright colors or zebras the "stripey horses". Red Pandas are the true Pandas, the Giant Panda is a taxonomical naming error that has snowballed into an error that cannot be corrected but it can be acknowledged. 146.200.202.126 ( talk) 16:29, 28 June 2022 (UTC)
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Please add, "The classification of red pandas has been very difficult due to the lack of genetic evidence and DNA extraction. Although previous studies have attempted to tackle this issue by utilizing the very little DNA they were able to extract from blood, muscle, and skin, they have relied on the morphological similarities between red pandas and raccoons, such as similar skull, tail, and teeth structures." after, "The evolutionary lineage of the red panda (Ailuridae) stretches back around 25 to 18 million years ago, as indicated by extinct fossil relatives found in Eurasia and North America."
ScarJo1 ( talk) 16:19, 17 July 2022 (UTC)
I want to add into the article that the red panda can be considered to be the "only true and the original panda". [6] [7] Many reliable academic sources explain why that is, however it seems at least one editor don't want that fact to be allowed in. Which I do not understand the reason why and so making this thread. I believe such info is noteworthy, significant and deserving to be in the article. Instead of reverting my edits, do please provide at least one sufficient reasoning here as am curious what could possibly be the reason to forbid this. SolarDGrayson ( talk) 08:31, 8 August 2023 (UTC)
and was the only animal known under this name for more than 40 years", which segues into noting the later discovery of the giant panda. Sourcing to Glatston already in place. I suggest this covers the basic statement that should be made here without going off on tangents re "originality". I will also port the source over to Giant panda (if needed - will check). -- Elmidae ( talk · contribs) 17:27, 11 August 2023 (UTC)
[19] There seems to a wide consensus among scholars that "panda" comes from a Nepali word, "nigalya ponya" which may mean "bamboo footed or bamboo eater". I don't do original research and simply relay what she and all the other actual experts say on the matter. And so should you. SolarDGrayson ( talk) 07:14, 9 August 2023 (UTC)The word panda is derived from a Nepali dialect word nigalya ponya: nigalya is thought to come from nigalo meaning bamboo, but the source of ponya is less certain, although it may come from ponja meaning the ball of the foot or claws -making the complete meaning 'bamboo foot' (Glatston 2011).
[21] What makes you think I haven't quoted an academic book from Glatson when I made that clear above? [22] SolarDGrayson ( talk) 10:35, 11 August 2023 (UTC)The word panda is derived from a Nepali dialect word nigalya ponya: nigalya is thought to come from nigalo meaning bamboo, but the source of ponya is less certain, although it may come from ponja meaning the ball of the foot or claws -making the complete meaning 'bamboo foot' (Glatston 2011).
I want some more of red panda facts. You need better hand writing. I can barely read what you said on this thing.❤Boo 76.80.194.146 ( talk) 18:22, 13 October 2023 (UTC)
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This article is written in British English, which has its own spelling conventions (colour, travelled, centre, defence, artefact, analyse) and some terms that are used in it may be different or absent from other varieties of English. According to the relevant style guide, this should not be changed without broad consensus. |
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1, 2 |
Archives of frequently discussed topics Taxonomy • Etymology • Popular culture |
The consensus is that the article should not mention Stufful and Bewear.
Should this article mention Stufful and Bewear? Red Panda 25 13:01, 1 November 2017 (UTC)
RedPanda25 - there are two reasons why this newest instance of "eeeeh, I recognize an animal in Pokemon!" should not be added to the article: a) providing the inspiration for a comic, animation, or game character is not an indication of notability. You may notice that House mouse does not include a five-screen list of cartoon mice. b) Even if if this were sufficient, you would need to provide an authoritative source that states, expressly, "Pokemon X is based on the red panda". What you or anyone else concludes privately, based on similarity, has no weight whatsoever. We summarize existing sources, we don't insert our own conclusions. -- Elmidae ( talk · contribs) 20:57, 31 October 2017 (UTC)
In this article, several place names mentioned include:
This is all very inconsistent. Some countries (Holland, India, England) are mentioned explicitly, whereas some countries (America) are omitted.
If counties / states are important, then Darjeeling should be "Darjeeling, West Bengal, India" and Birmingham should be "Birmingham, West Midlands, England". If countries / states are not important, then Knoxville Zoo should be in "Knoxville, America", etc. to be consistent.
If it's important to specify the country when mentioning Darjeeling, Birmingham, etc. then it is also important to specify the country for American locations to be consistent. 58.166.139.124 ( talk) 09:32, 7 June 2018 (UTC)
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I would like to add that in Nepal they are called Fire Foxes. RedPanda06 ( talk) 11:30, 27 February 2019 (UTC)
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Kindly add a weblink to the Sorbus wardii /info/en/?search=Sorbus Zakir09135 ( talk) 12:28, 16 June 2019 (UTC)
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ADD news that red pandas are TWO species not one:
https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-51632790
"The red panda is not one species but two, according to DNA evidence.
...Researchers in China analysed the DNA of 65 wild red pandas. This revealed two separate species which went their own separate ways after populations were divided by a river about 250 thousand years ago."
-- Saltation (not logged in for ~decade, looks like either my account's been suspended or I didn't record a changed password)
202.86.32.140 ( talk) 05:44, 27 February 2020 (UTC)
[ article] has now been published. Given the rather large size and scope of the red panda page, how should we split it up? Geekgecko ( talk) 15:27, 27 February 2020 (UTC)
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🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯 soooo many errors lema fix em 70.185.18.232 ( talk) 13:36, 28 February 2020 (UTC)
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Request to remove citation (3): Flynn(2000), p 197. As any attempt to find such a journal or paper proves fruitless and it appears to be unverified Somethingoriginalwastaken ( talk) 07:04, 11 May 2020 (UTC)
Recent genome sequencing of distinct populations of red panda has revealed significant genetic divergence in mitochondrial DNA, whole genome DNA and Y chromosome DNA [1]. This genetic divergence corresponds to the distribution of the Himalayan and Chinese red panda subspecies and is the first convincing evidence that the two species exist as two separate species of red panda, the Himalayan red panda (A. fulgens) and the Chinese red panda (A. styani). I propose the re-listing of the two red panda subspecies as separate species, or at least a mention under the 'Phylogeny' heading that it has been proposed they form two separate species.
DocLovely ( talk) 11:00, 24 October 2020 (UTC)
References
The existence of 2 distinct species is very well supported in the scientific literature. Furthermore, there are by now multiple secondary sources stating this clearly. A revision of the article is therefore warranted. Smithsonian/National Zoo for example lists them clearly as 2 species: https://nationalzoo.si.edu/animals/red-panda. Similarlly the BBC agrees: https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-51632790 Here's the Guardian: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/feb/28/red-pandas-are-actually-two-separate-species-study-finds and finally here we have CNN: https://www.cnn.com/2020/02/27/world/red-panda-species-scli-intl-scn/index.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.80.64.216 ( talk) 17:52, 27 March 2023 (UTC)
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in Cultural references add
Kichi - Mowgli's red panda friend in The Jungle Book (1989 TV series) Rmhegde ( talk) 10:21, 2 November 2020 (UTC)
I'm thinking about making this article refer to the genus and create new pages for both species, but I am unsure as to whether that would be permissible, as it might depend on which taxonomic authority Wikipedia follows. Currently [ MammalDiversity], which seems to be the primary online database for mammal species, has split it into two species, but I'm sure that other, older authorities that Wikipedia follows might not have. Geekgecko ( talk) 02:00, 28 November 2020 (UTC)
Not all species need have separate articles. The simplest (and probably best) rule is to have no rule: if you have the time and energy to write up some particularly obscure subspecies that most people have never even heard of, go for it! As a general guideline, though, it's best to combine separate species into a single entry whenever it seems likely that there won't be enough text to make more than a short, unsatisfying stub otherwise. If the entry grows large enough to deserve splitting, that can always be done later.
Hello, I am a new user so please forgive any mistakes.
I would suggest changing the phrase "active from dusk to dawn" in the intro to simply "nocturnal" as it is more direct in regards to the animal's activity.
I also noticed two irregularities in the hyperlinks to other articles. These include:
The word "Japan" is not linked in its first instance, but rather in the second instance.
The instances of "North America" are not linked anywhere in the article.
Nikitamazepin ( talk) 03:00, 24 February 2021 (UTC)
A cryptocurrency Ethereum Token - RedPanda Earth Token, uses red pandas as a mascot to raise cryptocurrency funds to save endangered species, adopt red pandas, and conserve wildlife. RedPanda Earth Token has also released non-fungible tokens or NFTs called Red Panda Pals to raise capital to donate to save red pandas. RedPandaEarth ( talk) 02:51, 13 July 2021 (UTC)
This paper: [1] puts the red panda as being a genus of two species, instead of a monotypic species. This move was accepted by the most recent ASM edition: [1] [2]. Should we make this page a genus page, and create two new pages for each species? Reply with your thoughts. J0ngM0ng ( talk) 01:34, 31 August 2021 (UTC)
References
This
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Please add to the Cultural Depictions section.
A cryptocurrency Ethereum Token - RedPanda Earth Token, uses red pandas as a mascot to raise cryptocurrency funds to save endangered species, adopt red pandas, and conserve wildlife. RedPanda Earth Token has also released non-fungible tokens or NFTs called Red Panda Pals to raise capital to save red pandas. Source - https://redpanda.earth/ Donation Proof - https://redpanda.earth/donation-tracker.html NFTs - https://opensea.io/collection/red-panda-pals RedPandaEarth ( talk) 01:35, 24 September 2021 (UTC)
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{{subst:trim|1=
Red Pandas aren't carnivores, they are omnivores. They eat bamboo and small rodents, therfore making them an omnivore.
58.8.235.43 ( talk) 03:37, 20 October 2021 (UTC)
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In the Cultural depiction section, there is an unsourced statement "The red panda is primarily featured in the upcoming Pixar film, Turning Red." Pls, cite it with this citation here [3]. 2001:4455:1A9:E100:5023:99FB:2ED1:17B6 ( talk) 06:10, 23 December 2021 (UTC)
I hope to make this my next FAC mammal project. Anybody want to join? I see that the person who brought this to GA is no longer active. LittleJerry ( talk) 22:23, 29 December 2021 (UTC)
BhagyaMani, Okay so I think its best to write this article from scratch or if we are reusing old text, check the sources and make sure the text accurately reflects them. We have to be extra safe or we'll get nailed at FAC. Now for organization, I propose:
For major sources: I recently bought his book. The first edition can be downloaded here We can use both. LittleJerry ( talk) 14:06, 10 January 2022 (UTC)
LittleJerry ( talk) 13:57, 10 January 2022 (UTC)
I shall ... subjoin a fresh trivial name, Panda ...– BhagyaMani ( talk) 15:08, 11 January 2022 (UTC)
BhagyaMani, could you look though the sources for "Distribution and habitat" to see if they are accurately cited? You can also search z-library for the article that don't have a linked URL. I'll be rewriting the "Characteristics" section. LittleJerry ( talk) 03:32, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
Lets keep this image taken in Sikkim in mind for the taxobox instead of the captive one. – BhagyaMani ( talk) 19:01, 21 January 2022 (UTC)
My last edit about RP in 3 Indian states was about it. Ghose & Dutta (2011) in their book-chapter do not provide much info about habitat, but lots of details of individuals when and where encountered since the mid 1990s. I suggest to keep that paragraph separate as is for now. The next will be about Myanmar and then China. Then we can later see whether and what needs cutting down or extending or merging. – BhagyaMani ( talk) 19:55, 22 January 2022 (UTC)
Re subspecies: just saw that you already use 2 different names for the 2 sub/species, so I'll continue using Chinese red panda also in section on distribution in China. I think this ref name 1994 needs to be replaced with the one to the 2022 book-chapter 23 : the 3 authors already recognise 2 species. – BhagyaMani ( talk) 17:38, 23 January 2022 (UTC)
We may have to recheck all the bamboo species + resp. links : bamboo classification has been revised profoundly in recent years, but changes are yet not reflected in many referenced articles. E.g. Arundinaria aristata is now a syn of Thamnocalamus spathiflorus, see https://wcsp.science.kew.org/synonomy.do?name_id=446354. And Arundinaria inludes only 3 species native to Americas. – BhagyaMani ( talk) 05:29, 25 January 2022 (UTC)
Re section conservation : we need to decide whether we list all the protected areas in this section or in the section on distribution. I'm fine with either one but think it not necessary to repeat them. Your thoughts? – BhagyaMani ( talk) 06:35, 25 January 2022 (UTC)
We can keep protected areas in distribution for now. LittleJerry ( talk) 18:37, 25 January 2022 (UTC)
Since Joshi et al. (2021) suggested that the upper Brahmaputra forms the boundary between the 2 sub/species, but not the Nujiang Salween river, the question is : how shall we treat this here in regards to names – Himalayan + Chinese RP – used in the other sections? Shall we keep on assuming that all records in Tibet, NE India, Myanmar are of Himalayan RP, even when east of Brahmaputra valley? Or shall we skip using sub/specific names throughout ? I'd prefer latter. Your thoughts? – BhagyaMani ( talk) 10:05, 26 January 2022 (UTC)
I would like to replace the outcommented content in the section on captivity that is based on old studbooks. But after hours of searching I did still not find any article containing info on when the red panda SSP was established, how many zoos participate and how many individuals are kept in those zoos. Not even refs in this one give away anything useful in this regard. Does the book chapter 11 contain sth. that you can add ? – BhagyaMani ( talk) 15:30, 26 January 2022 (UTC)
Cuvier used the word 'panda' for the 1st time, but it is hardly possible that he knew a Nepali word. Documented is that Duvaucel was posted in West Bengal from where he sent a specimen and description to Paris; he travelled a lot in the region and also employed hunters to supply him with live and dead animals. On the other hand, each ethnic group in Nepal has a different name for the red panda, e.g. thokya, thongwa, wah, wakdonka + a few more, but none sounds remotely like 'panda'. Pocock was the 1st who listed 'nigálya ponya' as being a local name, but did not explain who told him; Hodgson is the most likely source for names : when he described a red panda specimen, he was already posted in Darjeeling. – BhagyaMani ( talk) 07:18, 27 January 2022 (UTC)
We should probably add information on predators and parasites. I have trouble finding much on predators from quality sources. I may also add some more on feeding. After that, the lead paragraphs should be fixed up and then we can submit to peer review and/or the copyeditors guild. LittleJerry ( talk) 15:23, 28 January 2022 (UTC)
Can you add references for the 2 alternative names red bear-cat and red cat-bear that presently have redirects? Most suitable may also be the section Etymology for these names. – BhagyaMani ( talk) 15:40, 29 January 2022 (UTC)
The map is wrong : northern Myanmar should be INcluded. I'll download distribution data and make a new one. – BhagyaMani ( talk) 16:38, 29 January 2022 (UTC)
BhagyaMani: I think we should note in the "Distribution and habitat" section that the range of the two pandas overlap in some areas and they use different micro-habitats. See cite 47. LittleJerry ( talk) 18:12, 16 February 2022 (UTC)
Oh no. I meant overlap between the red panda and the giant panda. LittleJerry ( talk) 19:26, 16 February 2022 (UTC)
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that did not look right to me. –
Jonesey95 (
talk) 23:55, 20 February 2022 (UTC)
@ BhagyaMani: I have one last point regarding prose. I addressed it earlier but it may have been overlooked: "Compared to other mammals, the microbe community in red pandas is less diverse." Do you mean "Compared to other mammals, the microbiome in red pandas is less diverse"? Wretchskull ( talk) 12:00, 21 February 2022 (UTC)
I am not sure I saw a citation for the number of pandas left. I think the 10000 is accurate I just couldn't find the citation for it. Lubakhalil ( talk) 21:54, 23 January 2022 (UTC)
Do you guys think this 2 images here might be better to be on infobox? [4] and [5]. 2001:4455:364:A800:E5E5:3906:820:3691 ( talk) 03:47, 27 January 2022 (UTC)
Regarding this edit by Cygnis insignis: This is Wikipedia's article for the genus Ailurus as well as for the species Ailurus fulgens; the taxonbar should reflect that (see template documentation in {{ taxonbar}}: "The same approach can be used when monotypic taxa have a single article, but there are multiple entries in Wikidata"). Also on this topic, the lead should also probably mention/bold the genus qua genus, not just part of the binomial. Umimmak ( talk) 05:20, 25 February 2022 (UTC)
the boldfaced common name is followed by the italic un-boldfaced scientific name. – BhagyaMani ( talk) 07:01, 25 February 2022 (UTC)
So because of recent studies and considering that many scholars are now starting to think that there are two red panda species as opposed to one, should articles about the new species (and the genus) be made? 24.150.121.149 ( talk) 00:47, 28 June 2022 (UTC)
An edit earlier today added firefox as an alternative common name for the red panda, which was removed. However, in 'Cultural significance', the article identifies the red panda as 'the namesake of the Firefox browser'. I don't have full access to the citation, so if somebody could clear this up, thanks, Vortex ( talk) 10:32, 28 June 2022 (UTC)
This animal was named in 1825 using an anglisized approximation of a Nepalese word. It was another 44 years later before the completely unrelated species of black and white striped bear required a name, and so, it was decided to reuse the word panda from the smaller but similarly striped creature. The point is the Red Panda is the true Panda - because it was both the first and original named species known as the Panda. It should be made clear that the bear species that has become synonymous with the word that everyone associates, when you say "Panda", is named in error from a completely unrelated species. A naming convention that makes as much sense as calling humming birds something like "hover parrots" because of their bright colors or zebras the "stripey horses". Red Pandas are the true Pandas, the Giant Panda is a taxonomical naming error that has snowballed into an error that cannot be corrected but it can be acknowledged. 146.200.202.126 ( talk) 16:29, 28 June 2022 (UTC)
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Please add, "The classification of red pandas has been very difficult due to the lack of genetic evidence and DNA extraction. Although previous studies have attempted to tackle this issue by utilizing the very little DNA they were able to extract from blood, muscle, and skin, they have relied on the morphological similarities between red pandas and raccoons, such as similar skull, tail, and teeth structures." after, "The evolutionary lineage of the red panda (Ailuridae) stretches back around 25 to 18 million years ago, as indicated by extinct fossil relatives found in Eurasia and North America."
ScarJo1 ( talk) 16:19, 17 July 2022 (UTC)
I want to add into the article that the red panda can be considered to be the "only true and the original panda". [6] [7] Many reliable academic sources explain why that is, however it seems at least one editor don't want that fact to be allowed in. Which I do not understand the reason why and so making this thread. I believe such info is noteworthy, significant and deserving to be in the article. Instead of reverting my edits, do please provide at least one sufficient reasoning here as am curious what could possibly be the reason to forbid this. SolarDGrayson ( talk) 08:31, 8 August 2023 (UTC)
and was the only animal known under this name for more than 40 years", which segues into noting the later discovery of the giant panda. Sourcing to Glatston already in place. I suggest this covers the basic statement that should be made here without going off on tangents re "originality". I will also port the source over to Giant panda (if needed - will check). -- Elmidae ( talk · contribs) 17:27, 11 August 2023 (UTC)
[19] There seems to a wide consensus among scholars that "panda" comes from a Nepali word, "nigalya ponya" which may mean "bamboo footed or bamboo eater". I don't do original research and simply relay what she and all the other actual experts say on the matter. And so should you. SolarDGrayson ( talk) 07:14, 9 August 2023 (UTC)The word panda is derived from a Nepali dialect word nigalya ponya: nigalya is thought to come from nigalo meaning bamboo, but the source of ponya is less certain, although it may come from ponja meaning the ball of the foot or claws -making the complete meaning 'bamboo foot' (Glatston 2011).
[21] What makes you think I haven't quoted an academic book from Glatson when I made that clear above? [22] SolarDGrayson ( talk) 10:35, 11 August 2023 (UTC)The word panda is derived from a Nepali dialect word nigalya ponya: nigalya is thought to come from nigalo meaning bamboo, but the source of ponya is less certain, although it may come from ponja meaning the ball of the foot or claws -making the complete meaning 'bamboo foot' (Glatston 2011).
I want some more of red panda facts. You need better hand writing. I can barely read what you said on this thing.❤Boo 76.80.194.146 ( talk) 18:22, 13 October 2023 (UTC)