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I've stubbed out this article with little more than a dictionary definition. It had been a redirect to power system automation but that seems inappropriate because it's too specific. I would redirect it to telemetry directly, but there is some suggestion that the name "telemeter" can refer to a distance-measuring device (like a theodolite, I guess) such as at Telemeter Glacier. Make of it what you will; I'm a little too confused to fix it all. Morrand ( talk) 03:46, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
The original meaning of telemeter, and still one of the main uses of the word, was a device used to measure distances to remote objects (1)
Yes, a telemeter is an optical rangefinder used often in the past for artillery, or in viewfinder cameras: "split-image telemeter", "inverted image telemeter", "double image telemeter" are of type "coincidence telemeter". Another optical type using binocular vision is the "stereoscopic telemeter". A simple optical method is stadiametric rangefinding.
More generally, a telemeter is a device used to remotely measure any quantity. (2)
That sounds reasonable, as "tele" = distant and "to meter" = to measure may not only mean measuring the distance (1) but also measuring distantly (2). But you can't say here that (1) is the definition of telemeter in a narrow sense, and (2) is the definition in a broad sense. If there is a "more general" definition there is also a less general, more specific definition. In this case, both definitions have to be related, and the general term (2) has to comprise the more specific term (1). This is not the case here, as there are tow different technical areas: (1) is rangefinding and (2) is operating a sensor and remotely receiving its data. Thus, the telemetry domain is not more general, but the term has been used in this field more recently, whereas the rangefinding use for telemeter is 200 (coincidence telemeter) or 100 (stereoscopic telemeter) years old. -- Gunnar ( talk) 15:05, 27 August 2019 (UTC)
A pay television system by the name Telemeter was used in the United States from 1951 to 1965. See at [1]. Morrand ( talk) 03:46, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
Isn't it obvious? Fgnievinski ( talk) 19:26, 29 October 2013 (UTC)
"I don't understand your point that rangefinding is not a subset of telemetry." Telemetry is a rather new sport about measuring and transmitting the data to a hub. Rangefinding as an older discipline about measuring distances. These are two different things, which are not related to each other. So, there is no general and more specific interpretation of what a telemeter could be (Btw, before reading this article I never heard that a telemetry device is called telemeter, but we should never stop learning). There are just two different interpretations of the noun "telemeter", and one is older (rangefinder) and the other one is newer (remote measurements), but it is not that one is a wider sense and the other is a narrow sense: rangefinding is measuring distances, and telemetry is measuring anything somewhere in a remote location and transmitting the measured data to a central data hub. -- Gunnar ( talk) 15:19, 27 August 2019 (UTC)
"Examples of these are James Watt's (1736-1819) additions to his steam engines of the mercury pressure gauge and the fly-ball governor." - I don't understand this sentence. Why is a fly-ball governer a remote sensor? Why is a mercury pressure gauge a remote sensor? The principle of telemetry is that you can place the point of mesurement and the point of display anywhere you want, isn't it? Is the lookout at the top of sailing ship's mast also a telemeter as he shouts down if he sees land or another ship? -- Gunnar ( talk) 12:10, 28 August 2019 (UTC)
These early devices monitored and controlled the inhospitable internal processes of a steam engine from a distance, albeit a short one. This was telemetry in its crude beginning.
— Brian Kopp
I just checked the other souce on the claim that telemetry was already invented in the steam age, e.g. by Watt: ( Kirby 1990), p 167-169. In these three pages the steam engine of Watt is discribed, but nowhere is written that it can be interpreted as the first steps of telemetry. -- Gunnar ( talk) 12:31, 31 August 2019 (UTC)
The question to me is: Is the telemeter Selligue (from Switzerland) the same as Alexander François Selligue who died in Paris more than 20 years later after the improved telemeter invention. See Talk:Alexander_Selligue#Switzerland? -- Gunnar ( talk) 12:36, 31 August 2019 (UTC)
Let's have a look how often the terms "telemeter" and "telemetry" have been used according to the Google Book DB: The timeframe up to WWII shows that the word "telemetry" was rather seldom use, and "telemeter" prevailed. After the Second World War, the use of "telemetry" declassified the term "telemeter" and had a distinctive peak in the 1960s. The use of "Telemeter" declined further on. Comparing "telemeter" with "rangefinder", these two words show the same range of frequencies, but while the telemeter had his peak in the 50s and 60s, the rangefinder took over in the 70s and 80s and went down later. -- Gunnar ( talk) 14:09, 31 August 2019 (UTC)
@ Fgnievinski: I don't especially object to the move to Rangefinding telemeter, but I do strongly object to the removal of large chunks of content that do not fit with the new title. There was not the slightest attempt to merge any of that material into the new redirect to Telemetry. That article does not even contain the term telemeter making the redirect something of an Easter egg. Spinning Spark 12:51, 21 September 2020 (UTC)
The change to the article title violates WP:Title as "rangefinding telemeter" is not a common name for a rangefinder. In fact, I've never heard of the former term despite using rangefinders extensively during my army career. Nor was it used by my few naval references from the 1930s–1950s, much less anything more recent. Perhaps the term was used by surveyors or such types, but it's not in common use in any military or naval context within the last 90 years, which is likely the majority of such instruments in use during that time. Please be so kind as to restore the article to its original title.-- Sturmvogel 66 ( talk) 12:50, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
![]() | It was proposed in this section that
Rangefinding telemeter be
renamed and moved to
Rangefinder.
result: Move logs:
source title ·
target title
This is template {{
subst:Requested move/end}} |
Rangefinding telemeter → Rangefinder – This article started out at Telemeter, but that created ambiguity with other uses of that term. The ambiguity was resolved by moving the article to the current title, but that does not satisfy WP:COMMONNAME. "Telemeter" and "rangefinder" both appear to be common names for this type of device, but "rangefinding telemeter" is not. The article should have been moved to Rangefinder. Srleffler ( talk) 04:49, 10 April 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. Colonestarrice ( talk) 08:47, 9 May 2022 (UTC)
![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||
|
I've stubbed out this article with little more than a dictionary definition. It had been a redirect to power system automation but that seems inappropriate because it's too specific. I would redirect it to telemetry directly, but there is some suggestion that the name "telemeter" can refer to a distance-measuring device (like a theodolite, I guess) such as at Telemeter Glacier. Make of it what you will; I'm a little too confused to fix it all. Morrand ( talk) 03:46, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
The original meaning of telemeter, and still one of the main uses of the word, was a device used to measure distances to remote objects (1)
Yes, a telemeter is an optical rangefinder used often in the past for artillery, or in viewfinder cameras: "split-image telemeter", "inverted image telemeter", "double image telemeter" are of type "coincidence telemeter". Another optical type using binocular vision is the "stereoscopic telemeter". A simple optical method is stadiametric rangefinding.
More generally, a telemeter is a device used to remotely measure any quantity. (2)
That sounds reasonable, as "tele" = distant and "to meter" = to measure may not only mean measuring the distance (1) but also measuring distantly (2). But you can't say here that (1) is the definition of telemeter in a narrow sense, and (2) is the definition in a broad sense. If there is a "more general" definition there is also a less general, more specific definition. In this case, both definitions have to be related, and the general term (2) has to comprise the more specific term (1). This is not the case here, as there are tow different technical areas: (1) is rangefinding and (2) is operating a sensor and remotely receiving its data. Thus, the telemetry domain is not more general, but the term has been used in this field more recently, whereas the rangefinding use for telemeter is 200 (coincidence telemeter) or 100 (stereoscopic telemeter) years old. -- Gunnar ( talk) 15:05, 27 August 2019 (UTC)
A pay television system by the name Telemeter was used in the United States from 1951 to 1965. See at [1]. Morrand ( talk) 03:46, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
Isn't it obvious? Fgnievinski ( talk) 19:26, 29 October 2013 (UTC)
"I don't understand your point that rangefinding is not a subset of telemetry." Telemetry is a rather new sport about measuring and transmitting the data to a hub. Rangefinding as an older discipline about measuring distances. These are two different things, which are not related to each other. So, there is no general and more specific interpretation of what a telemeter could be (Btw, before reading this article I never heard that a telemetry device is called telemeter, but we should never stop learning). There are just two different interpretations of the noun "telemeter", and one is older (rangefinder) and the other one is newer (remote measurements), but it is not that one is a wider sense and the other is a narrow sense: rangefinding is measuring distances, and telemetry is measuring anything somewhere in a remote location and transmitting the measured data to a central data hub. -- Gunnar ( talk) 15:19, 27 August 2019 (UTC)
"Examples of these are James Watt's (1736-1819) additions to his steam engines of the mercury pressure gauge and the fly-ball governor." - I don't understand this sentence. Why is a fly-ball governer a remote sensor? Why is a mercury pressure gauge a remote sensor? The principle of telemetry is that you can place the point of mesurement and the point of display anywhere you want, isn't it? Is the lookout at the top of sailing ship's mast also a telemeter as he shouts down if he sees land or another ship? -- Gunnar ( talk) 12:10, 28 August 2019 (UTC)
These early devices monitored and controlled the inhospitable internal processes of a steam engine from a distance, albeit a short one. This was telemetry in its crude beginning.
— Brian Kopp
I just checked the other souce on the claim that telemetry was already invented in the steam age, e.g. by Watt: ( Kirby 1990), p 167-169. In these three pages the steam engine of Watt is discribed, but nowhere is written that it can be interpreted as the first steps of telemetry. -- Gunnar ( talk) 12:31, 31 August 2019 (UTC)
The question to me is: Is the telemeter Selligue (from Switzerland) the same as Alexander François Selligue who died in Paris more than 20 years later after the improved telemeter invention. See Talk:Alexander_Selligue#Switzerland? -- Gunnar ( talk) 12:36, 31 August 2019 (UTC)
Let's have a look how often the terms "telemeter" and "telemetry" have been used according to the Google Book DB: The timeframe up to WWII shows that the word "telemetry" was rather seldom use, and "telemeter" prevailed. After the Second World War, the use of "telemetry" declassified the term "telemeter" and had a distinctive peak in the 1960s. The use of "Telemeter" declined further on. Comparing "telemeter" with "rangefinder", these two words show the same range of frequencies, but while the telemeter had his peak in the 50s and 60s, the rangefinder took over in the 70s and 80s and went down later. -- Gunnar ( talk) 14:09, 31 August 2019 (UTC)
@ Fgnievinski: I don't especially object to the move to Rangefinding telemeter, but I do strongly object to the removal of large chunks of content that do not fit with the new title. There was not the slightest attempt to merge any of that material into the new redirect to Telemetry. That article does not even contain the term telemeter making the redirect something of an Easter egg. Spinning Spark 12:51, 21 September 2020 (UTC)
The change to the article title violates WP:Title as "rangefinding telemeter" is not a common name for a rangefinder. In fact, I've never heard of the former term despite using rangefinders extensively during my army career. Nor was it used by my few naval references from the 1930s–1950s, much less anything more recent. Perhaps the term was used by surveyors or such types, but it's not in common use in any military or naval context within the last 90 years, which is likely the majority of such instruments in use during that time. Please be so kind as to restore the article to its original title.-- Sturmvogel 66 ( talk) 12:50, 6 April 2022 (UTC)
![]() | It was proposed in this section that
Rangefinding telemeter be
renamed and moved to
Rangefinder.
result: Move logs:
source title ·
target title
This is template {{
subst:Requested move/end}} |
Rangefinding telemeter → Rangefinder – This article started out at Telemeter, but that created ambiguity with other uses of that term. The ambiguity was resolved by moving the article to the current title, but that does not satisfy WP:COMMONNAME. "Telemeter" and "rangefinder" both appear to be common names for this type of device, but "rangefinding telemeter" is not. The article should have been moved to Rangefinder. Srleffler ( talk) 04:49, 10 April 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. Colonestarrice ( talk) 08:47, 9 May 2022 (UTC)