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This article is pretty bad. It's making comments and referencing sources that don't back up statements. The truth is enough without this embellishment.
Crinock (
talk)
19:09, 11 March 2011 (UTC)
The Counterclaim is listed on the Capitol Ministries site, but I was not convinced it was legitimate until I found it at the site of the original lawsuit filed by Capitol Commission. To see the original, scroll down to document #36 and you have to spend $6.99. It was indeed the same document. AccuracyInPosting ( talk) 07:01, 2 March 2012 (UTC)
Hi Orange Mike. I was wondering if you could help me understand why you deleted the edits I did for Ralph Drollinger. I spent about 3 hours doing research and thought I had done a pretty good job of editing (no I am not a copy writer, but working to improve). Am I missing something? Thanks AccuracyInPosting ( talk) 20:28, 2 March 2012 (UTC)
There are several additional credible, major newspaper articles that should serve to inform the ministry section of this Wiki. The information in those articles can be accessed by a search on Capitol Ministries; they are right on top.----AccuracyInPosting— Preceding unsigned comment added by AccuracyInPosting ( talk • contribs)
Here are the two articles (the Fresno Bee article is the third but appears to be a reprint of the SacBee article: A holy war between two statehouse ministries - The News & Observer www.newsobserver.com/.../a-holy-war-between-two-statehouse.html
Bible groups battling over capitol ministries - Capitol and California ... www.fresnobee.com/2012/.../rival-bible-study-groups-compete.html
It doesn't appear I have posted them correctly to the Wiki. — Preceding unsigned comment added by AccuracyInPosting ( talk • contribs) 17:41, 5 October 2012 (UTC)
Mike, The reasons I took down the comments Drollinger supposedly made in the CA capitol years ago, is because of their mention in the new articles. First, Drollinger says the comments were taken out of context in the one source that cites them (the Capitol Weekly Report). Secondly, Jim Young of Capitol Commission states that those comments had no relation to the split (the church that supposedly disqualified him holds to those positions) in the Raleigh Observer article. And thirdly, the placement and posting of that comment was by OCNative, who throughout the history of the posting page, repeatedly cites and over writes. OC Native is a former employee of one individual who is now implicated in computer fraud. For these reasons, I think the negative comments have a questionable basis and should be eliminated from the section. — Preceding unsigned comment added by AccuracyInPosting ( talk • contribs) 17:56, 5 October 2012 (UTC)
This article is now being discussed at the BLP noticeboard. -- Orange Mike | Talk 18:24, 5 October 2012 (UTC)
It has been quite some time since the disputes/discussion bars were added to the top; of this article -- and no one has registered any disputes. It seems fair that they should now be removed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Accuracymattersman ( talk • contribs) 09:40, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
Almost exactly a year ago, I wrote on this page to User:AccuracyInPosting
note that we don't generally allow links to, much less rely on, stuff like court filings by either side of a lawsuit/counterclaim situation such as this. What was needed was reportage from neutral third parties such as newspapers and books from reliable publishers.
I am sorely disappointed to see that this has once again become a problem for this article, and I'm sorry I needed to reverse some of Accuracy's edits again for the same darned reason. -- Orange Mike | Talk 23:08, 16 March 2013 (UTC)
The article used to say, " The case is set for trial by jury in the US District Court of North Carolina in the spring of 2013." Is that still true? Spring is almost over, and we never had a clear source for this statement to begin with. Zagalejo ^^^ 16:45, 6 June 2013 (UTC)
I have fully protected this article indefinitely, because of a long-running edit war between single-purpose accounts who have relied overwhelmingly on primary sources, and appear to be engaged in a POV battle to support or oppose the subject of he article.
I have left a full explanation [2] at the BLP noticeboard: see Wikipedia:Biographies of living persons/Noticeboard/Archive204#Ralph Drollinger, where I have tried to summarise the scope and history of the problems. (It stretches back several years).
Please note that I have removed [3] all the disputed material. It may be that some of what I removed should be restored, but I do not have the time to assess it all.
Please note that I have no view on any of the issues which have been in dispute, and no view about whether the current title or contents of the article are appropriate. My only concerns are that the controversial material relating to a BLP should be properly sourced, and that the edit war should not continue.
Please note that at WP:AN I have asked [4] for an uninvolved admin to review my actions in relation to this page. -- BrownHairedGirl (talk) • ( contribs) 22:43, 1 August 2014 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
This article has been subject to disputed editing over how much space to devote to Capitol Ministries - see this revision vs the current. We need to gain consensus on how much detail to include, so all comments invited. I won't structure this yet as I have no idea..am only trying to admin this. Cas Liber ( talk · contribs) 02:09, 2 August 2014 (UTC)
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edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Could someone with access change the google books ref to <ref name="Quatro2009">{{cite book|author=Steve Quatro|title=Intentional Outreach|url=http://books.google.com/books?id=N-V2GVs1KqIC&pg=PA9|date=27 August 2009|publisher=Xulon Press|isbn=978-1-60791-850-9|page=9|chapter=Introduction}}</ref>
Other changes need to be made to tidy references.-- Auric talk 15:00, 3 August 2014 (UTC)
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edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
This sentence should be removed. It is referencing an article on bipartisonreport.com which includes information that is simply not true. I can't imagine Wikipedia allowing articles which include opinion, as references. {sigh} I would suggest taking out the sentence and then fully protecting the page so that no opinions for or against the ministry can be added.
Drollinger has previously been kicked out of a church for bigotry, refers to the Catholic church as “the world’s largest false religion,” says women working in Congress after bearing children are “sinners,” and that homosexuality is “an abomination." [14][15] 1Cor1614 ( talk) 10:35, 22 April 2017 (UTC)— 1Cor1614 ( talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
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edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Admin, Could the following please be removed along with the reference 12 because 1) The referenced article is an op ed piece (and libelous); and 2) This has nothing to do with sports ministry, the category it was placed under:
Please remove, Under "Sports Ministry": An article in the New York Times stated: "Mr. Drollinger believes that social welfare programs “have no basis in Scripture,” that Christians in government have an obligation to hire only Christians and that women should not be allowed to teach grown men."[12]
Finally, could this page be fully protected so that only admins can make suggested additions to avoid defamation? Beyondgr8ful ( talk) 18:45, 19 January 2018 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Requested changes:
1. UNDER CAPITOL MINISTRIES Change 1997 to 1996 (Date found at https://capmin.org/about/)
and
"Drollinger also leads several senior Trump administration officials in a similar group at the White House," could be more precisely written as In addition to House and Senate Bible studies, Ralph leads a White House Cabinet study with 10 members. (can reference one of the Bible Studies which lists members on the masthead ( https://capmin.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/Critical-Sound-Doctrine-When-Ministering-to-Public-Servants-by-Ralph-Drollinger-2018.pdf)
2.UNDER POLITICAL PHILOSOPHY Please remove "He has also asked President Trump to use his presidency to turn the American government into a "benevolent dictatorship."[19]
Reason: That particular comment within the article misinformed - the article often shares false or misleading information as fact and not sourced. This particular claim has no evidence whatsoever, in the way of transcript, audio, or video, nor is it corroborating by any other organization, except those citing this particular article. It is also contested by Capitol Ministries. https://capmin.org/capitol-ministries-responds-to-newsweek/
3. Please remove reference #16. Instead of referencing an op/ed piece, it could reference the url from Capitol Ministries' site as an ORIGINAL source about the White House Cabinet Study: https://capmin.org/ministries/washington-dc/
Beyondgr8ful ( talk) 02:12, 11 April 2018 (UTC)
{{
edit semi-protected}}
template. Sources may not be considered reliable -
FlightTime (
open channel)
01:20, 25 April 2018 (UTC)This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page. |
![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
![]() | The following Wikipedia contributor may be personally or professionally connected to the subject of this article. Relevant policies and guidelines may include
conflict of interest,
autobiography, and
neutral point of view.
|
![]() | The following Wikipedia contributor may be personally or professionally connected to the subject of this article. Relevant policies and guidelines may include conflict of interest, autobiography, and neutral point of view. |
![]() | The following Wikipedia contributor has declared a personal or professional connection to the subject of this article. Relevant policies and guidelines may include conflict of interest, autobiography, and neutral point of view. |
This article is pretty bad. It's making comments and referencing sources that don't back up statements. The truth is enough without this embellishment.
Crinock (
talk)
19:09, 11 March 2011 (UTC)
The Counterclaim is listed on the Capitol Ministries site, but I was not convinced it was legitimate until I found it at the site of the original lawsuit filed by Capitol Commission. To see the original, scroll down to document #36 and you have to spend $6.99. It was indeed the same document. AccuracyInPosting ( talk) 07:01, 2 March 2012 (UTC)
Hi Orange Mike. I was wondering if you could help me understand why you deleted the edits I did for Ralph Drollinger. I spent about 3 hours doing research and thought I had done a pretty good job of editing (no I am not a copy writer, but working to improve). Am I missing something? Thanks AccuracyInPosting ( talk) 20:28, 2 March 2012 (UTC)
There are several additional credible, major newspaper articles that should serve to inform the ministry section of this Wiki. The information in those articles can be accessed by a search on Capitol Ministries; they are right on top.----AccuracyInPosting— Preceding unsigned comment added by AccuracyInPosting ( talk • contribs)
Here are the two articles (the Fresno Bee article is the third but appears to be a reprint of the SacBee article: A holy war between two statehouse ministries - The News & Observer www.newsobserver.com/.../a-holy-war-between-two-statehouse.html
Bible groups battling over capitol ministries - Capitol and California ... www.fresnobee.com/2012/.../rival-bible-study-groups-compete.html
It doesn't appear I have posted them correctly to the Wiki. — Preceding unsigned comment added by AccuracyInPosting ( talk • contribs) 17:41, 5 October 2012 (UTC)
Mike, The reasons I took down the comments Drollinger supposedly made in the CA capitol years ago, is because of their mention in the new articles. First, Drollinger says the comments were taken out of context in the one source that cites them (the Capitol Weekly Report). Secondly, Jim Young of Capitol Commission states that those comments had no relation to the split (the church that supposedly disqualified him holds to those positions) in the Raleigh Observer article. And thirdly, the placement and posting of that comment was by OCNative, who throughout the history of the posting page, repeatedly cites and over writes. OC Native is a former employee of one individual who is now implicated in computer fraud. For these reasons, I think the negative comments have a questionable basis and should be eliminated from the section. — Preceding unsigned comment added by AccuracyInPosting ( talk • contribs) 17:56, 5 October 2012 (UTC)
This article is now being discussed at the BLP noticeboard. -- Orange Mike | Talk 18:24, 5 October 2012 (UTC)
It has been quite some time since the disputes/discussion bars were added to the top; of this article -- and no one has registered any disputes. It seems fair that they should now be removed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Accuracymattersman ( talk • contribs) 09:40, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
Almost exactly a year ago, I wrote on this page to User:AccuracyInPosting
note that we don't generally allow links to, much less rely on, stuff like court filings by either side of a lawsuit/counterclaim situation such as this. What was needed was reportage from neutral third parties such as newspapers and books from reliable publishers.
I am sorely disappointed to see that this has once again become a problem for this article, and I'm sorry I needed to reverse some of Accuracy's edits again for the same darned reason. -- Orange Mike | Talk 23:08, 16 March 2013 (UTC)
The article used to say, " The case is set for trial by jury in the US District Court of North Carolina in the spring of 2013." Is that still true? Spring is almost over, and we never had a clear source for this statement to begin with. Zagalejo ^^^ 16:45, 6 June 2013 (UTC)
I have fully protected this article indefinitely, because of a long-running edit war between single-purpose accounts who have relied overwhelmingly on primary sources, and appear to be engaged in a POV battle to support or oppose the subject of he article.
I have left a full explanation [2] at the BLP noticeboard: see Wikipedia:Biographies of living persons/Noticeboard/Archive204#Ralph Drollinger, where I have tried to summarise the scope and history of the problems. (It stretches back several years).
Please note that I have removed [3] all the disputed material. It may be that some of what I removed should be restored, but I do not have the time to assess it all.
Please note that I have no view on any of the issues which have been in dispute, and no view about whether the current title or contents of the article are appropriate. My only concerns are that the controversial material relating to a BLP should be properly sourced, and that the edit war should not continue.
Please note that at WP:AN I have asked [4] for an uninvolved admin to review my actions in relation to this page. -- BrownHairedGirl (talk) • ( contribs) 22:43, 1 August 2014 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
This article has been subject to disputed editing over how much space to devote to Capitol Ministries - see this revision vs the current. We need to gain consensus on how much detail to include, so all comments invited. I won't structure this yet as I have no idea..am only trying to admin this. Cas Liber ( talk · contribs) 02:09, 2 August 2014 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Could someone with access change the google books ref to <ref name="Quatro2009">{{cite book|author=Steve Quatro|title=Intentional Outreach|url=http://books.google.com/books?id=N-V2GVs1KqIC&pg=PA9|date=27 August 2009|publisher=Xulon Press|isbn=978-1-60791-850-9|page=9|chapter=Introduction}}</ref>
Other changes need to be made to tidy references.-- Auric talk 15:00, 3 August 2014 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
This sentence should be removed. It is referencing an article on bipartisonreport.com which includes information that is simply not true. I can't imagine Wikipedia allowing articles which include opinion, as references. {sigh} I would suggest taking out the sentence and then fully protecting the page so that no opinions for or against the ministry can be added.
Drollinger has previously been kicked out of a church for bigotry, refers to the Catholic church as “the world’s largest false religion,” says women working in Congress after bearing children are “sinners,” and that homosexuality is “an abomination." [14][15] 1Cor1614 ( talk) 10:35, 22 April 2017 (UTC)— 1Cor1614 ( talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
![]() | This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Admin, Could the following please be removed along with the reference 12 because 1) The referenced article is an op ed piece (and libelous); and 2) This has nothing to do with sports ministry, the category it was placed under:
Please remove, Under "Sports Ministry": An article in the New York Times stated: "Mr. Drollinger believes that social welfare programs “have no basis in Scripture,” that Christians in government have an obligation to hire only Christians and that women should not be allowed to teach grown men."[12]
Finally, could this page be fully protected so that only admins can make suggested additions to avoid defamation? Beyondgr8ful ( talk) 18:45, 19 January 2018 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Requested changes:
1. UNDER CAPITOL MINISTRIES Change 1997 to 1996 (Date found at https://capmin.org/about/)
and
"Drollinger also leads several senior Trump administration officials in a similar group at the White House," could be more precisely written as In addition to House and Senate Bible studies, Ralph leads a White House Cabinet study with 10 members. (can reference one of the Bible Studies which lists members on the masthead ( https://capmin.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/Critical-Sound-Doctrine-When-Ministering-to-Public-Servants-by-Ralph-Drollinger-2018.pdf)
2.UNDER POLITICAL PHILOSOPHY Please remove "He has also asked President Trump to use his presidency to turn the American government into a "benevolent dictatorship."[19]
Reason: That particular comment within the article misinformed - the article often shares false or misleading information as fact and not sourced. This particular claim has no evidence whatsoever, in the way of transcript, audio, or video, nor is it corroborating by any other organization, except those citing this particular article. It is also contested by Capitol Ministries. https://capmin.org/capitol-ministries-responds-to-newsweek/
3. Please remove reference #16. Instead of referencing an op/ed piece, it could reference the url from Capitol Ministries' site as an ORIGINAL source about the White House Cabinet Study: https://capmin.org/ministries/washington-dc/
Beyondgr8ful ( talk) 02:12, 11 April 2018 (UTC)
{{
edit semi-protected}}
template. Sources may not be considered reliable -
FlightTime (
open channel)
01:20, 25 April 2018 (UTC)