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I just researched this case here. It also seems relevant since it involves a case in Canada where people are prosecuted as a result of literature, which references the judgements made in this Sharpe case. Does it deserve an article? Tyciol ( talk) 00:51, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
This article is linked to from there, and references the following quote by McLachlin (representing the supreme court) presumably from Paragraph 38 of this trial:
This article mentions that he was charged with (4) and (3). (1) does not involve an actual charge, but rather clarifies the terms under which the following charges are written. I was hoping someone with a better understanding of this case might shed some light on some aspects of Judge McLachlin's statement. What would she mean by " charging section"? The word 'charging' does not show up in 163.1 at all. It is not clear which section she was referring to which would couple with (b) in regards to referencing only flesh and blood people.
I would think her judgement in this situation would imply that 163.1 should be rewritten to make this more clear, such as mentioning that it can apply to imaginary human beings. For example, the Person article on Wikipedia doesn't mention imaginary people being classed as a person. Nor does the Legal person article. While the subject of personhood is addressed in fiction, we do not consider fictional characters to be people. This is why the word 'character' ( fictional character and non-fictional character respectively) exists, to denote that it is a characterization and not a real person. While it is certainly within the realm of the Supreme court to change laws or draft new ones, I think it is important that the wording of laws clearly state what it is they outlaw. Currently it is ambiguous.
It seems that this interpretation has set a precedent as in the origin linked in the title of this topic, a man was later convicted solely for possession of media portraying characters, presumably fictional ones. Tyciol ( talk) 01:28, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
I think this needs to be sourced. The text of the decision, which is the only source of the article that I see listed, does not contain the word 'professor' and the only use of the word 'english' is in describing an Oxford english dictionary. Where is the source of this data? Perhaps it was included in the court's decision process, but in that case, we would require data regarding that, because the decision text is not a source for it. I think it would also be interesting, if this data is publically available, to source the name and credentials of this Professor. That is only if it can be sourced by court documents of course. If they were private for the witness' protection then obviously they should stay so. Tyciol ( talk) 01:43, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
To me, these two terms used in the article hold different sorts of impacts. Is it appropriate to use them both, or just one? If so, which one should be used? This is in regards to the second sentence "'The Court upheld the child pornography provisions of the Criminal Code of Canada as a valid limitation of the right to freedom of expression..." compared to the opening sentence of the last section "Chief Justice Beverley McLachlin, writing for the majority, held that the provision in the Code violated the freedom of expression...". Furthermore the first says 'right to freedom of expression' and the second omits 'right to'. Which is more appropriate terminology? Tyciol ( talk) 19:39, 3 July 2008 (UTC)
- A statute can "violate" the free speech right but still be valid as a rights "limitation" if it is saved despite being a rights violation by the criteria set out in the s. 1 rights limitation clause for justifying rights infractions. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.198.12.4 ( talk) 00:32, 9 January 2011 (UTC)
User:Lairor saw fit to delete these four paragraphs. "Deleted last four paragraphs as they were mostly just analyzing this case as compared to other cases and was a violation of WP:NOR" I'm too tired to argue about it, however in general when doing mass deletions it's more polite to discuss it first. I'm adding them here for people who are interested in further details on the case, and if they are deemed relevant additions in the future.
I will need some time to review these policies which are foreign to me, but there are more delicate ways of handling objections to article additions I think. Tyciol ( talk) 13:29, 23 July 2008 (UTC)
![]() | This article is written in Canadian English, which has its own spelling conventions (colour, centre, travelled, realize, analyze) and some terms that are used in it may be different or absent from other varieties of English. According to the relevant style guide, this should not be changed without broad consensus. |
![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
I just researched this case here. It also seems relevant since it involves a case in Canada where people are prosecuted as a result of literature, which references the judgements made in this Sharpe case. Does it deserve an article? Tyciol ( talk) 00:51, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
This article is linked to from there, and references the following quote by McLachlin (representing the supreme court) presumably from Paragraph 38 of this trial:
This article mentions that he was charged with (4) and (3). (1) does not involve an actual charge, but rather clarifies the terms under which the following charges are written. I was hoping someone with a better understanding of this case might shed some light on some aspects of Judge McLachlin's statement. What would she mean by " charging section"? The word 'charging' does not show up in 163.1 at all. It is not clear which section she was referring to which would couple with (b) in regards to referencing only flesh and blood people.
I would think her judgement in this situation would imply that 163.1 should be rewritten to make this more clear, such as mentioning that it can apply to imaginary human beings. For example, the Person article on Wikipedia doesn't mention imaginary people being classed as a person. Nor does the Legal person article. While the subject of personhood is addressed in fiction, we do not consider fictional characters to be people. This is why the word 'character' ( fictional character and non-fictional character respectively) exists, to denote that it is a characterization and not a real person. While it is certainly within the realm of the Supreme court to change laws or draft new ones, I think it is important that the wording of laws clearly state what it is they outlaw. Currently it is ambiguous.
It seems that this interpretation has set a precedent as in the origin linked in the title of this topic, a man was later convicted solely for possession of media portraying characters, presumably fictional ones. Tyciol ( talk) 01:28, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
I think this needs to be sourced. The text of the decision, which is the only source of the article that I see listed, does not contain the word 'professor' and the only use of the word 'english' is in describing an Oxford english dictionary. Where is the source of this data? Perhaps it was included in the court's decision process, but in that case, we would require data regarding that, because the decision text is not a source for it. I think it would also be interesting, if this data is publically available, to source the name and credentials of this Professor. That is only if it can be sourced by court documents of course. If they were private for the witness' protection then obviously they should stay so. Tyciol ( talk) 01:43, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
To me, these two terms used in the article hold different sorts of impacts. Is it appropriate to use them both, or just one? If so, which one should be used? This is in regards to the second sentence "'The Court upheld the child pornography provisions of the Criminal Code of Canada as a valid limitation of the right to freedom of expression..." compared to the opening sentence of the last section "Chief Justice Beverley McLachlin, writing for the majority, held that the provision in the Code violated the freedom of expression...". Furthermore the first says 'right to freedom of expression' and the second omits 'right to'. Which is more appropriate terminology? Tyciol ( talk) 19:39, 3 July 2008 (UTC)
- A statute can "violate" the free speech right but still be valid as a rights "limitation" if it is saved despite being a rights violation by the criteria set out in the s. 1 rights limitation clause for justifying rights infractions. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.198.12.4 ( talk) 00:32, 9 January 2011 (UTC)
User:Lairor saw fit to delete these four paragraphs. "Deleted last four paragraphs as they were mostly just analyzing this case as compared to other cases and was a violation of WP:NOR" I'm too tired to argue about it, however in general when doing mass deletions it's more polite to discuss it first. I'm adding them here for people who are interested in further details on the case, and if they are deemed relevant additions in the future.
I will need some time to review these policies which are foreign to me, but there are more delicate ways of handling objections to article additions I think. Tyciol ( talk) 13:29, 23 July 2008 (UTC)