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One line is more than enough weight for that particular article from the Altoona Mirror (a newspaper which doesn't even have its own article yet). The term is colloquial, which means there is no standard accepted definition, and therefore the statistics are without direct relevance. The stats the Altoona Mirror article used are simply one person's personal opinion as to what "Quarterback U" should mean. Conflating the term and those stats here would be original research.
It is a fact that BYU and Maryland were each referred to by that term by many different media sources at different times in the past. The opinion that Purdue might be "Quarterback U" because it has the most NFL starts is nothing more than that, and I have seen that mentioned in no other sources. I think it may even be generous to give that a full sentence.
If you can find additional references that claim to use those metrics (number of NFL starts, Heismans, etc.) to determine usage of the term, and cite independent sources for the raw data (the statistics themselves) rather than the Altoona Mirror article, then I am not opposed to its inclusion. Otherwise I don't think its appropriate for the above stated reasons.
Cgsports12, you wrote a well-researched interesting article, but this is not the appropriate place to promote either it or your particular view as to what "Quarterback U" actually means. If you disagree, we can bring the discussion to the talk page for the College Football Project to get more editors' input. Strikehold ( talk) 02:18, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
The beginning of the existing Quarterback U article states, "Generally speaking, this has the implication that many of the schools' former quarterbacks continue on to successful careers in professional football." The stats I presented address that topic specifically, thereby making them relevant based on one of the primary premises of the article. The existing article also had components discussing Brandon Dorman, Robbie Boscoe and Gino Torretta. None of those three ever started a game in the NFL, so why give them notable mention when they directly contradict the "generally speaking" statement?
Looking at the original article, much of it was based on conjecture, old arguments and speculation by various writers based on less than all the facts and opinions. What I have attempted to do is include comparative facts that were not present before, based on a sizable period of time such as the Super Bowl era. Cgsports12 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cgsports12 ( talk • contribs) 03:48, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
This is not original research at all. It is a compilation of statistics. It's like looking up all of Barry Bonds' home run totals, adding them up and then posting the total. The starting statistics, number of games, alma mater, Super Bowl titles and Hall of Famers can be verified on pro-football-reference.com. The Heisman winners can be verified on heisman.com. Cgsports12 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cgsports12 ( talk • contribs) 03:56, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
After reading all the stats and thinking about it, it's my opinion that the stats, while interesting, add very little of use to the article. The only thing I'd probably keep is the number of NFL starters, which I think I would sum up by saying "In the Superbowl era USC (15), Notre Dame (13), Washington (12), Miami, Fla. (10), Stanford (10), and UCLA (10) have each produced 10 or more starting quarterbacks." Ryan2845 ( talk) 19:31, 25 August 2009 (UTC)
I think that is more than fair compromise. Strikehold ( talk) 23:21, 25 August 2009 (UTC)"In August 2009, the Altoona Mirror published an article that sought to name the most appropriate "Quarterback U" in relation to player achievements, such as NFL starts, Pro Bowl appearances, and Heisman Trophies won. It found that in the Super Bowl era USC (15), Notre Dame (13), Washington (12), Miami (10), Stanford (10), and UCLA (10) each produced at least ten starting NFL quarterbacks, while Purdue recorded the most combined NFL career starts (704). The article concluded that no single program deserved the title significantly more than others."
Whatever. I'll delete it. I'm not going to fight City Hall here and your incredibly limited view of what's pertinent information. Your original article is so weak that it's barely informational at all on the subject. I'll kill my updates, but please, get rid of the garbage information you have on there that doesn't give any insight at all into the discussion. I also noticed you made sure you included Maryland in there, while also appearing to be a Maryland fan/follower or whatever with all the Terrapins pages you've worked on. Maryland doesn't even belong in the current discussion when the two best QBs from that school are Esiason and O'Donnell and then barely anyone else of note. So be sure to check your COI at the door when trying to debate what should and should not be on here. And BYU? Way to keep the page 20 years outdated. All I did was try to give the very weak original article -- which had a C rating, mind you -- some pertinent information and comparisons that people all over the Internet have found interesting and informative, except for you.
I read an article on the Wikipedia editing information that says the site is becoming more and more stale because of elitist editors who get so nit-picky about information and updates that most people don't bother fighting the small-mindedness and just quit trying to post updates. That is clearly the case in this instance. You win the fight. I quit. And your article will continue to be weak and based on outdated, pointless conjecture. -- Cgsports12 ( talk) 00:33, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
As was pointed out above, I would argue that the inclusion of the University of Maryland is a stretch. I would imagine that if one were to conduct a national poll as to whether or not the University of Maryland could ever be described by the term "Quarterback U", only people in the state of Maryland would agree. Looking at the list of quarterbacks the paragraph cites for inclusion, only Boomer Esiason could be considered by any measure as being worthy of this list. One QB is not enough to call a school "Quarterback U".
Some of the schools mentioned in the article give a time period, others do not. Could each person who added a school state the time period associated with this nickname? Racepacket ( talk) 04:05, 15 October 2009 (UTC)
I could not find any official action by the University of Miami declaring itself to be "Quarterback U." Admittedly, I don't have access to the UM Board of Trustee minutes, but I am sure that if there was such an official action, I would find some news report. What are your sources for attributing this to the University instead of just someone who happens to work at the University or is otherwise connected to the University? Racepacket ( talk) 22:08, 15 October 2009 (UTC)
I have restored the order which covers the recent uses of Quaterback U before discussing the older uses (which may no longer apply). A college's media guide may not be a reliable source if the statement made is self-serving. Racepacket ( talk) 08:48, 27 October 2009 (UTC)
Previously, the article was grouped into an "Early Usage" with five team sections and a "more"-type section with references to various stats and another four teams. The Early Usage section included teams with "early" links to the term, but each team section carried content through to the present day -not "early usage." The "more" section held another group of teams with appropriate and current citations. As the article content itself was not structured in a "early" format and was current to present day, I delineated it as nine team sections and moved all of the broad summary info to the top. Bold, but open to other ideas. UW Dawgs ( talk) 02:44, 7 February 2013 (UTC)
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One line is more than enough weight for that particular article from the Altoona Mirror (a newspaper which doesn't even have its own article yet). The term is colloquial, which means there is no standard accepted definition, and therefore the statistics are without direct relevance. The stats the Altoona Mirror article used are simply one person's personal opinion as to what "Quarterback U" should mean. Conflating the term and those stats here would be original research.
It is a fact that BYU and Maryland were each referred to by that term by many different media sources at different times in the past. The opinion that Purdue might be "Quarterback U" because it has the most NFL starts is nothing more than that, and I have seen that mentioned in no other sources. I think it may even be generous to give that a full sentence.
If you can find additional references that claim to use those metrics (number of NFL starts, Heismans, etc.) to determine usage of the term, and cite independent sources for the raw data (the statistics themselves) rather than the Altoona Mirror article, then I am not opposed to its inclusion. Otherwise I don't think its appropriate for the above stated reasons.
Cgsports12, you wrote a well-researched interesting article, but this is not the appropriate place to promote either it or your particular view as to what "Quarterback U" actually means. If you disagree, we can bring the discussion to the talk page for the College Football Project to get more editors' input. Strikehold ( talk) 02:18, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
The beginning of the existing Quarterback U article states, "Generally speaking, this has the implication that many of the schools' former quarterbacks continue on to successful careers in professional football." The stats I presented address that topic specifically, thereby making them relevant based on one of the primary premises of the article. The existing article also had components discussing Brandon Dorman, Robbie Boscoe and Gino Torretta. None of those three ever started a game in the NFL, so why give them notable mention when they directly contradict the "generally speaking" statement?
Looking at the original article, much of it was based on conjecture, old arguments and speculation by various writers based on less than all the facts and opinions. What I have attempted to do is include comparative facts that were not present before, based on a sizable period of time such as the Super Bowl era. Cgsports12 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cgsports12 ( talk • contribs) 03:48, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
This is not original research at all. It is a compilation of statistics. It's like looking up all of Barry Bonds' home run totals, adding them up and then posting the total. The starting statistics, number of games, alma mater, Super Bowl titles and Hall of Famers can be verified on pro-football-reference.com. The Heisman winners can be verified on heisman.com. Cgsports12 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cgsports12 ( talk • contribs) 03:56, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
After reading all the stats and thinking about it, it's my opinion that the stats, while interesting, add very little of use to the article. The only thing I'd probably keep is the number of NFL starters, which I think I would sum up by saying "In the Superbowl era USC (15), Notre Dame (13), Washington (12), Miami, Fla. (10), Stanford (10), and UCLA (10) have each produced 10 or more starting quarterbacks." Ryan2845 ( talk) 19:31, 25 August 2009 (UTC)
I think that is more than fair compromise. Strikehold ( talk) 23:21, 25 August 2009 (UTC)"In August 2009, the Altoona Mirror published an article that sought to name the most appropriate "Quarterback U" in relation to player achievements, such as NFL starts, Pro Bowl appearances, and Heisman Trophies won. It found that in the Super Bowl era USC (15), Notre Dame (13), Washington (12), Miami (10), Stanford (10), and UCLA (10) each produced at least ten starting NFL quarterbacks, while Purdue recorded the most combined NFL career starts (704). The article concluded that no single program deserved the title significantly more than others."
Whatever. I'll delete it. I'm not going to fight City Hall here and your incredibly limited view of what's pertinent information. Your original article is so weak that it's barely informational at all on the subject. I'll kill my updates, but please, get rid of the garbage information you have on there that doesn't give any insight at all into the discussion. I also noticed you made sure you included Maryland in there, while also appearing to be a Maryland fan/follower or whatever with all the Terrapins pages you've worked on. Maryland doesn't even belong in the current discussion when the two best QBs from that school are Esiason and O'Donnell and then barely anyone else of note. So be sure to check your COI at the door when trying to debate what should and should not be on here. And BYU? Way to keep the page 20 years outdated. All I did was try to give the very weak original article -- which had a C rating, mind you -- some pertinent information and comparisons that people all over the Internet have found interesting and informative, except for you.
I read an article on the Wikipedia editing information that says the site is becoming more and more stale because of elitist editors who get so nit-picky about information and updates that most people don't bother fighting the small-mindedness and just quit trying to post updates. That is clearly the case in this instance. You win the fight. I quit. And your article will continue to be weak and based on outdated, pointless conjecture. -- Cgsports12 ( talk) 00:33, 26 August 2009 (UTC)
As was pointed out above, I would argue that the inclusion of the University of Maryland is a stretch. I would imagine that if one were to conduct a national poll as to whether or not the University of Maryland could ever be described by the term "Quarterback U", only people in the state of Maryland would agree. Looking at the list of quarterbacks the paragraph cites for inclusion, only Boomer Esiason could be considered by any measure as being worthy of this list. One QB is not enough to call a school "Quarterback U".
Some of the schools mentioned in the article give a time period, others do not. Could each person who added a school state the time period associated with this nickname? Racepacket ( talk) 04:05, 15 October 2009 (UTC)
I could not find any official action by the University of Miami declaring itself to be "Quarterback U." Admittedly, I don't have access to the UM Board of Trustee minutes, but I am sure that if there was such an official action, I would find some news report. What are your sources for attributing this to the University instead of just someone who happens to work at the University or is otherwise connected to the University? Racepacket ( talk) 22:08, 15 October 2009 (UTC)
I have restored the order which covers the recent uses of Quaterback U before discussing the older uses (which may no longer apply). A college's media guide may not be a reliable source if the statement made is self-serving. Racepacket ( talk) 08:48, 27 October 2009 (UTC)
Previously, the article was grouped into an "Early Usage" with five team sections and a "more"-type section with references to various stats and another four teams. The Early Usage section included teams with "early" links to the term, but each team section carried content through to the present day -not "early usage." The "more" section held another group of teams with appropriate and current citations. As the article content itself was not structured in a "early" format and was current to present day, I delineated it as nine team sections and moved all of the broad summary info to the top. Bold, but open to other ideas. UW Dawgs ( talk) 02:44, 7 February 2013 (UTC)
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