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This guy had an international role, being king-elect of another country. (And, for other factors supporting internationality, please read the article.) his name was in translated form when elected monarch (Fredrik Kaarle) - as is the custom dealing with princes. 217.140.193.123 2 July 2005 19:11 (UTC)
I wonder about the content on this page. It seems to me that much, maybe the most, of it is irrelevant to the person and is better covered in an article on Germany's non-military strategies to increase her influence in Central Europe during WWI. Parts of it would also surely fit in nicely in the articles on other countries (Baltic countries and Finland) history.
/Tuomas — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tuomas ( talk • contribs) 10:15, 3 April 2004 (UTC)
See discussion at: Talk:Väinö I of Finland -- Jniemenmaa 11:24, 4 Apr 2004 (UTC)
Jniemenmaa's revert was reasonable.
According to my understanding, Prinz Friedrich Karl was not so much a force behind the development, which is the impression one gets from the longer, now reverted, version of the article.
I might be wrong, and might have read only the wrong books, but I see him rather as a representative for his class, prepared to "serve" as a ruler if history directed him to such a position – to which he, after all, had been brought up.
--
Ruhrjung 12:01, 4 Apr 2004 (UTC)
As he is perceived to have come to contact with Finland as a real foreigner, I intend to peruse some published information about his antecedents. In order not to burden the article with details, there goes only clear points. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.140.193.123 ( talk) 17:08, 3 July 2005 (UTC)
1 Frederick Charles of Hesse
2 Anna of Prussia
3 Frederik of Hesse
4 Marie of Weimar
5 Carl of Prussia
6 Charlotte of Denmark
7 Wilhelm of Hesse
8 Maria Pavlovna of Russia
9 Carl Frederick of Weimar
10 Louise of Mecklenburg
11 Frederick William III of Prussia
12 Sophie Frederikke of Mecklenburg
13 Frederik of Denmark and Norway
14 Caroline of Nassau
15 Frederik of Hesse
16 Maria Fedorovna of Wurttemberg
17 Pavel Petrovich of Russia
18 Louis of Hesse
19 Carl August of Weimar
20 Frederikke of Hesse
21 Carl of Strelitz
22 Frederikke of Hesse
23 Frederick William II of Prussia
24 Charlotte of Coburg
25 Louis of Schwerin
26 Juliane Marie of Brunswick
27 Frederick V of Denmark
28 Caroline of Leiningen
29 Carl of Usingen
30 Mary of Great Britain
31 Frederick II of Hesse
32 Sophie Dorothea of Brandenburg-Schwedt
33 Frederick II Eugen of Wurttemberg
34 Catherine II of Russia, of Anhalt, descendant of Charles IX of Sweden, and also descendant of Dukes of Gottorp
35 Peter III Fedorovich of Russia, Duke of Gottorp, descendant of Charles XI of Sweden
36 Caroline of Palatinate-Birkenfeld
37 Louis IX of Hesse-Darmstadt, descendant of Charles IX of Sweden
38 Anna Amalia of Brunswick, descendant of Charles IX of Sweden
39 Ernest August II of Saxe-Weimar, descendant of Dukes of Sonderburg-Beck
40 Marie Louise of Leiningen, descendant of Counts of Ahlefeld
41 Georg Wilhelm of Hesse-Darmstadt, descendant of Charles IX of Sweden
42 Elisabeth of Saxe-Hildburghausen
43 Carl of Mecklenburg, descendant of Countess of Ostfriesland, the eldest daughter of Gustav I of Sweden
44 Caroline of Palatinate-Birkenfeld (=36)
45 Louis IX of Hesse-Darmstadt (=37), descendant of Charles IX of Sweden
46 Louise of Brunswick, descendant of Charles IX of Sweden
47 August Wilhelm of Prussia
48 Anne Sophie of Schwarzburg, descendant of Countess of Ostfriesland, the eldest daughter of Gustav I of Sweden
49 Francis of Saxony Coburg
50 Gustave Caroline of Mecklenburg, descendant of Countess of Ostfriesland, the eldest daughter of Gustav I of Sweden, and also descendant of Dukes of Gottorp
51 Christian Ludwig II of Mecklenburg-Schwerin, descendant of Countess of Ostfriesland, the eldest daughter of Gustav I of Sweden
52 Antoinette Amalie of Brunswick, descendant of Dukes of Schleswig-Norburg
53 Ferdinand Albrecht II of Wolfenbuttel, descendant of Charles IX of Sweden
54 Sophia Magdalena of Brandenburg-Kulmbach, descendant of Dukes of Sonderburg-Glucksburg
55 Christian VI of Denmark
56 Catherine of Solms, descendant of Counts of Ahlefeld
57 Christian of Leiningen
58 Christina Wilhelmina of Saxe-Eisenach, descendant of Countess of Ostfriesland, the eldest daughter of Gustav I of Sweden
59 Carl of Nassau-Usingen
60 Caroline of Brandenburg-Ansbach
61 George II of Great Britain
62 Dorothea Wilhelmine of Saxe-Zeitz, descendant of Dukes of Sonderburg-Glucksburg
63 William VIII of Hesse, nephew of Frederick I of Sweden
— Preceding
unsigned comment added by
217.140.193.123 (
talk) 19:17, 3 July 2005 (UTC)
There should not be separate articles on Friedrich Karl as Friedrich Karl and on him as Vaino I of Finland. They are the same person. There should be a single encyclopedia article. john k 17:51, 4 Feb 2005 (UTC)
(4 months later - Jeez, I drop a lot of talk page threads) - Väinö is certainly not the name by which the man is best known. I don't know about monarchistical adventure, but I think renaming the Vaino article to something more generic would be worthwhile. john k 3 July 2005 17:58 (UTC)
Did Frederick Charles of Hesse ever actually set foot in Finland? JIP | Talk 10:27, 25 January 2006 (UTC)
Request to move this either to Frederick Charles of Finland or to Charles of Finland. Henq 16:27, 19 June 2006 (UTC) This person was, briefly, the elected King of Finland. It has been his highest title ever, and now he is long dead. He is mostly remembered in connection to his kingship of Finland. The naming conventions direct to use such article name that indicates the highest title. This is at least as entitled to king's title as are Napoleon II of France and Louis XVII of France, who are under those titles and not under any "lower" naming.
Result: No consensus; page not moved. Eugène van der Pijll 20:53, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
I created an ancestry section incorporating all relevant information form Ancestry of Prince Wolfgang of Hesse prior to making it a redirect. davidwr/( talk)/( contribs)/( e-mail) 03:15, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
In the parliamentary resolution which chose him to the kingship, he is mentioned as 'Fredrik Kaarle'.
In drafted documents (never 'signed' to effect), I think in foreign ministry, there were designations for the royal titulary. There he was named as King Kaarle. (Fredrik was possibly to be dropped, as it was and is somewhat alien to the Finnish language; whereas Kaarle is usual enough in Finnish
Väinämöinen is one of chief figures in the Kalevala, the epic of the 'nation'. Reconstrued (from chieftain) as sorta king.... However, there exists no contemporary (= historical) attestation of that Väinämöinen. National romantics in latter half of the 1800s had made several boys to be named Väinö, as a revitalization of 'ethnic' Finnish names (the name had NOT been in any use for centuries). There were therefore many Väinös floating around in 1918. (Most of them were young at that time, it was not long enough of that fashioability, to have many elderly men in 1918 with that name) But, I think, people in 1910s still more or less knew that it was an 'concocted' or 'invented' -at most, reconstrued- name, something which people were not at all using some decades (a generation) earlier.
At the time of the short-lived monarchy (autumn 1918), a republican satirist (Nuorteva, 'Olli') in his newspaper column made fun of the monarchy and there (as far as can be determined, the first ever time) pushed the satirical naming, 'Väinö I', to him. It looks to me that particularly some later republican propaganda perpetuated (-tendentiously-) that name 'Väinö I', and in that way, it has become something like an urban legend about the matter of the regnal name - believed by gullible people.
What is certain, is that no document of the government at the time ever mentions that 'Väinö' name for him. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.181.239.182 ( talk) 00:10, 3 October 2009 (UTC)
I think we should change the name since he was King of Finland and not Prince. Spongie555 ( talk) 03:53, 26 October 2010 (UTC)
Prince Moritz of Hesse died recently, so the sentence "the source Viini 2/2007 (in Finnish) indicates a view that Moritz of Hesse is the current successor, and prince Donatus is the heir" should probably be changed. Ape89 ( talk) 22:45, 26 May 2013 (UTC)
see Prince Wolfgang of Hesse about Moritz and order of succession. :) 88.195.126.19 ( talk) 02:40, 3 June 2013 (UTC)
Michael L Nash (2012) The last King of Finland. Royalty Digest Quarterly, 2012 : 1 88.195.248.164 ( talk) 22:25, 22 December 2013 (UTC)
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect
Frederik Kaarle I of Finland and has thus listed it
for discussion. This discussion will occur at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 March 22#Frederik Kaarle I of Finland until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.
DrKay (
talk) 07:30, 22 March 2022 (UTC)
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect
Väinö I of Finland and has thus listed it
for discussion. This discussion will occur at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 March 22#Väinö I of Finland until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.
DrKay (
talk) 12:16, 22 March 2022 (UTC)
I'm not an expert, but "Leader of Nazi Finland"? 2A02:14F:17A:C49A:9580:6521:F80B:B95A ( talk) 10:07, 20 May 2022 (UTC)
![]() | A fact from this article was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the On this day section on December 14, 2004, December 14, 2005, December 14, 2006, and December 14, 2007. |
![]() | This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
This guy had an international role, being king-elect of another country. (And, for other factors supporting internationality, please read the article.) his name was in translated form when elected monarch (Fredrik Kaarle) - as is the custom dealing with princes. 217.140.193.123 2 July 2005 19:11 (UTC)
I wonder about the content on this page. It seems to me that much, maybe the most, of it is irrelevant to the person and is better covered in an article on Germany's non-military strategies to increase her influence in Central Europe during WWI. Parts of it would also surely fit in nicely in the articles on other countries (Baltic countries and Finland) history.
/Tuomas — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tuomas ( talk • contribs) 10:15, 3 April 2004 (UTC)
See discussion at: Talk:Väinö I of Finland -- Jniemenmaa 11:24, 4 Apr 2004 (UTC)
Jniemenmaa's revert was reasonable.
According to my understanding, Prinz Friedrich Karl was not so much a force behind the development, which is the impression one gets from the longer, now reverted, version of the article.
I might be wrong, and might have read only the wrong books, but I see him rather as a representative for his class, prepared to "serve" as a ruler if history directed him to such a position – to which he, after all, had been brought up.
--
Ruhrjung 12:01, 4 Apr 2004 (UTC)
As he is perceived to have come to contact with Finland as a real foreigner, I intend to peruse some published information about his antecedents. In order not to burden the article with details, there goes only clear points. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.140.193.123 ( talk) 17:08, 3 July 2005 (UTC)
1 Frederick Charles of Hesse
2 Anna of Prussia
3 Frederik of Hesse
4 Marie of Weimar
5 Carl of Prussia
6 Charlotte of Denmark
7 Wilhelm of Hesse
8 Maria Pavlovna of Russia
9 Carl Frederick of Weimar
10 Louise of Mecklenburg
11 Frederick William III of Prussia
12 Sophie Frederikke of Mecklenburg
13 Frederik of Denmark and Norway
14 Caroline of Nassau
15 Frederik of Hesse
16 Maria Fedorovna of Wurttemberg
17 Pavel Petrovich of Russia
18 Louis of Hesse
19 Carl August of Weimar
20 Frederikke of Hesse
21 Carl of Strelitz
22 Frederikke of Hesse
23 Frederick William II of Prussia
24 Charlotte of Coburg
25 Louis of Schwerin
26 Juliane Marie of Brunswick
27 Frederick V of Denmark
28 Caroline of Leiningen
29 Carl of Usingen
30 Mary of Great Britain
31 Frederick II of Hesse
32 Sophie Dorothea of Brandenburg-Schwedt
33 Frederick II Eugen of Wurttemberg
34 Catherine II of Russia, of Anhalt, descendant of Charles IX of Sweden, and also descendant of Dukes of Gottorp
35 Peter III Fedorovich of Russia, Duke of Gottorp, descendant of Charles XI of Sweden
36 Caroline of Palatinate-Birkenfeld
37 Louis IX of Hesse-Darmstadt, descendant of Charles IX of Sweden
38 Anna Amalia of Brunswick, descendant of Charles IX of Sweden
39 Ernest August II of Saxe-Weimar, descendant of Dukes of Sonderburg-Beck
40 Marie Louise of Leiningen, descendant of Counts of Ahlefeld
41 Georg Wilhelm of Hesse-Darmstadt, descendant of Charles IX of Sweden
42 Elisabeth of Saxe-Hildburghausen
43 Carl of Mecklenburg, descendant of Countess of Ostfriesland, the eldest daughter of Gustav I of Sweden
44 Caroline of Palatinate-Birkenfeld (=36)
45 Louis IX of Hesse-Darmstadt (=37), descendant of Charles IX of Sweden
46 Louise of Brunswick, descendant of Charles IX of Sweden
47 August Wilhelm of Prussia
48 Anne Sophie of Schwarzburg, descendant of Countess of Ostfriesland, the eldest daughter of Gustav I of Sweden
49 Francis of Saxony Coburg
50 Gustave Caroline of Mecklenburg, descendant of Countess of Ostfriesland, the eldest daughter of Gustav I of Sweden, and also descendant of Dukes of Gottorp
51 Christian Ludwig II of Mecklenburg-Schwerin, descendant of Countess of Ostfriesland, the eldest daughter of Gustav I of Sweden
52 Antoinette Amalie of Brunswick, descendant of Dukes of Schleswig-Norburg
53 Ferdinand Albrecht II of Wolfenbuttel, descendant of Charles IX of Sweden
54 Sophia Magdalena of Brandenburg-Kulmbach, descendant of Dukes of Sonderburg-Glucksburg
55 Christian VI of Denmark
56 Catherine of Solms, descendant of Counts of Ahlefeld
57 Christian of Leiningen
58 Christina Wilhelmina of Saxe-Eisenach, descendant of Countess of Ostfriesland, the eldest daughter of Gustav I of Sweden
59 Carl of Nassau-Usingen
60 Caroline of Brandenburg-Ansbach
61 George II of Great Britain
62 Dorothea Wilhelmine of Saxe-Zeitz, descendant of Dukes of Sonderburg-Glucksburg
63 William VIII of Hesse, nephew of Frederick I of Sweden
— Preceding
unsigned comment added by
217.140.193.123 (
talk) 19:17, 3 July 2005 (UTC)
There should not be separate articles on Friedrich Karl as Friedrich Karl and on him as Vaino I of Finland. They are the same person. There should be a single encyclopedia article. john k 17:51, 4 Feb 2005 (UTC)
(4 months later - Jeez, I drop a lot of talk page threads) - Väinö is certainly not the name by which the man is best known. I don't know about monarchistical adventure, but I think renaming the Vaino article to something more generic would be worthwhile. john k 3 July 2005 17:58 (UTC)
Did Frederick Charles of Hesse ever actually set foot in Finland? JIP | Talk 10:27, 25 January 2006 (UTC)
Request to move this either to Frederick Charles of Finland or to Charles of Finland. Henq 16:27, 19 June 2006 (UTC) This person was, briefly, the elected King of Finland. It has been his highest title ever, and now he is long dead. He is mostly remembered in connection to his kingship of Finland. The naming conventions direct to use such article name that indicates the highest title. This is at least as entitled to king's title as are Napoleon II of France and Louis XVII of France, who are under those titles and not under any "lower" naming.
Result: No consensus; page not moved. Eugène van der Pijll 20:53, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
I created an ancestry section incorporating all relevant information form Ancestry of Prince Wolfgang of Hesse prior to making it a redirect. davidwr/( talk)/( contribs)/( e-mail) 03:15, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
In the parliamentary resolution which chose him to the kingship, he is mentioned as 'Fredrik Kaarle'.
In drafted documents (never 'signed' to effect), I think in foreign ministry, there were designations for the royal titulary. There he was named as King Kaarle. (Fredrik was possibly to be dropped, as it was and is somewhat alien to the Finnish language; whereas Kaarle is usual enough in Finnish
Väinämöinen is one of chief figures in the Kalevala, the epic of the 'nation'. Reconstrued (from chieftain) as sorta king.... However, there exists no contemporary (= historical) attestation of that Väinämöinen. National romantics in latter half of the 1800s had made several boys to be named Väinö, as a revitalization of 'ethnic' Finnish names (the name had NOT been in any use for centuries). There were therefore many Väinös floating around in 1918. (Most of them were young at that time, it was not long enough of that fashioability, to have many elderly men in 1918 with that name) But, I think, people in 1910s still more or less knew that it was an 'concocted' or 'invented' -at most, reconstrued- name, something which people were not at all using some decades (a generation) earlier.
At the time of the short-lived monarchy (autumn 1918), a republican satirist (Nuorteva, 'Olli') in his newspaper column made fun of the monarchy and there (as far as can be determined, the first ever time) pushed the satirical naming, 'Väinö I', to him. It looks to me that particularly some later republican propaganda perpetuated (-tendentiously-) that name 'Väinö I', and in that way, it has become something like an urban legend about the matter of the regnal name - believed by gullible people.
What is certain, is that no document of the government at the time ever mentions that 'Väinö' name for him. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.181.239.182 ( talk) 00:10, 3 October 2009 (UTC)
I think we should change the name since he was King of Finland and not Prince. Spongie555 ( talk) 03:53, 26 October 2010 (UTC)
Prince Moritz of Hesse died recently, so the sentence "the source Viini 2/2007 (in Finnish) indicates a view that Moritz of Hesse is the current successor, and prince Donatus is the heir" should probably be changed. Ape89 ( talk) 22:45, 26 May 2013 (UTC)
see Prince Wolfgang of Hesse about Moritz and order of succession. :) 88.195.126.19 ( talk) 02:40, 3 June 2013 (UTC)
Michael L Nash (2012) The last King of Finland. Royalty Digest Quarterly, 2012 : 1 88.195.248.164 ( talk) 22:25, 22 December 2013 (UTC)
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect
Frederik Kaarle I of Finland and has thus listed it
for discussion. This discussion will occur at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 March 22#Frederik Kaarle I of Finland until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.
DrKay (
talk) 07:30, 22 March 2022 (UTC)
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect
Väinö I of Finland and has thus listed it
for discussion. This discussion will occur at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 March 22#Väinö I of Finland until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion.
DrKay (
talk) 12:16, 22 March 2022 (UTC)
I'm not an expert, but "Leader of Nazi Finland"? 2A02:14F:17A:C49A:9580:6521:F80B:B95A ( talk) 10:07, 20 May 2022 (UTC)