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this sentence sounds like marketing-blabla because i couldn't find any information that more than the name has changed:
In this incarnation, the organization is much more autonomous from the main Diebold company, both financially and regarding decision making.
and the real reasons are obviously named here http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2006/11/13/8393084/index.htm ;)
-- Taintain 19:26, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
http://www.bradblog.com/?p=4066
—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 207.62.247.10 ( talk) 20:52, 25 January 2007 (UTC).
I've started a thread at Talk:Diebold#Diebold Election Systems about merging this article with the Diebold article. JamesMLane 07:30, 19 Dec 2004 (UTC)
Where does the 80% figure come from? 22:06, 10 February 2006 (UTC)
This article needs serious cleanup. Anyone want to help? -- Joebeone ( Talk) 00:15, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
I've created some section titles and moved stuff around, so we can at least see what's going on in this article. Lots more to do though. Kisch 11:02, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
Page links to the unrelated composer Stephen Heller, not a new stub
I contacted Kathy Dopp of the newly formed National Election Data Archive, who has all the last minute information about Diebold. I hope she will post.
Here is the link to the National Election Data Archive, headed by Kathy Dopp.
Originally a group of statisticians compared the national 2006 election exit polls to the voting results and determined that mathematically the differences were too great to explain in any legitimate way. However it was not possible to get all the data needed to prove this definitively.
They formed NEDA with the purpose of creating a national database of election results to bring transparency to the election process. With all the numbers available, any statistician could do the math.
As part of this mission, NEDA follows the Diebold situation and lobbies for voter-verified ballots. A record of their activities, with many articles about the Diebold machines, can be found on this website:
USA Count Votes
-- Aenb 13:21, 17 September 2006 (UTC)
The Princeton [1] analysis of the Deibold's weakness has been referenced as further reading but not mentioned. └ VodkaJazz / talk ┐ 12:44, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
Hi, the references section of this article needs help. Each ref should use one of the WP:CITET templates. -- Joebeone ( Talk) 23:15, 31 March 2007 (UTC)
As user:Rosicrucian noted, [2] Diebold Election Systems has announced that it's changing its name to "Premier Election Solutions". Their website has already changed over. The company's is governance structure is also being changed significantly. We'll need to move the article and we should add some text on the changes. I'll take care of the move. Though I can think of some good reasons to leave the article name unchanged, those are all overriden by the undeniable fact of the new name. Any other views? ·:· Will Beback ·:· 08:42, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
Recently read this report on BBC: [4] Perhaps this might be included in the main body of the article? User talk:Anonymous(first time posting, hope I did correctly.) 04:06 19 August —The preceding signed but undated comment was added at 20:53:05, August 19, 2007 (UTC).
is a blog... should be removed 71.225.205.124 ( talk) 06:33, 17 December 2007 (UTC)
[moved to bottom because of 15 May 2008 edit]
I've alerted Kathy Dopp to the presence of this page. She runs the newly formed National Election Data Archive. Their purpose is to create a database for all election results so discrepancies are easily examined. She knows every last detail of the Diebold story.
I don't want to OWN the discussion; I've made my points. Anyone else want to respond to this? - Dan Dank55 ( talk)( mistakes) 14:36, 16 May 2008 (UTC)
They have now admitted that an error in their software causes votes to be dropped. [7]. Superm401 - Talk 04:30, 22 August 2008 (UTC)
1. Removed: The following allegations have been unsourced for nearly 2 years:
2. Removed: The following allegations have been unsourced for 6 months:
3. Removed: Clearly POV content, with a duplicative wikilink and unnecessary external link. Seems very much link an advertisement for a book:
4. Edited: Language appears unencylopedic and potentially POV. (i.e. "votes disappear...")
5. Removed: Entirely unsourced and clearly POV content:
6. Edited: Content duplicative of previous paragraph. Prof Rubin already introduced along with school.
71.178.193.134 ( talk) 21:16, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
Notes on Sept 2009 edits
1. The usage of "Bev Harris" (an individual) in place of Black Box Voting (a 501c(3) nonprofit group) is inaccurate. There is no book for sale, by the way, and hasn't been for five years, so stop with the "advertising for a book" nonsense. "Bev Harris" did not execute the Tallahassee hack; this was a project conducted by and funded by Black Box Voting, the nonprofit, and to do this we hired Harri Hursti, who actually conducted the hack as the lead researcher for a Black Box Voting project. Bev Harris founded Black Box Voting, but isn't synonymous with the organization. Corrected attributions accordingly.
2. The characterization of the electronic voting controversy as one of open source vs. closed source is inaccurate. The issue is concealed counting vs. publicly observable counting (or alternatively, publicly observable input vs output); that's a longer discussion. This is now well articulated in a constitutional court case, have made the nature of the argument more precise in the section leading into security and concealment issues.
3. The 2005 hack reported in the Tallahassee Democrat was of the optical scan; it was conducted by Black Box Voting (not "Bev Harris") and was executed by Harri Hursti and Dr. Herbert Thompson. The 2006 hack which caused such consternation in Pennsylvania was of the TSx DRE machine; like the 2005 hack, it was conducted by Black Box Voting and executed by Harri Hursti, with on-site corroboration by Dr. Herbert Thompson. Corrected the attribution for this test.
4. The state of Florida and Diebold offered rebuttals to the 2005 hack, which was the hack shown in Hacking Democracy. However, the state of California report makes it explicitly clear that the Black Box Voting/Harri Hursti memory card attack performed in the 2005 study is real, accurate, and debunks the Diebold and Florida excuses. Therefore, it is important to include the study for California by the University of California scientists; added it.
5. The lawsuit in California was filed by Bev Harris and Jim March (filed before Black Box Voting existed, so in this case use of individual names is appropriate). The lawsuit was then "joined" by the state of California. In other words, lawsuit by Harris and March joined by California, resulting in the $2.6 million settlement.
6. The Stephen Spoonamore material is not particularly credible. I can find no evidence that he was a "long time Republican operative" so I deleted that sentence. I also see no evidence that he found anything "new" and in fact, some of his first report mixed up the program for the GEMS central tabulator run on a Windows NT machine with the Windows CE program run on the precinct touchscreens. Therefore, I find his studies to be factually weak. But more than that, I examined the campaign finance reports for Republican Party and John McCain and found no expenditures indicating he had ever been hired, nor for any of his companies. When I questioned reporters of this story about this, they said he said he may have been a volunteer for McCain. At any rate, I dug up an old (also non-credible) press release from Spoonamore from 2006 where he was claiming that the Republicans rigged the election. It seems unlikely that a John McCain operative (2007) would have written that piece back in 2006 if he was really a Republican operative. I would delete that whole paragraph if I felt bolder.
7. The Diebold memos were published on Black Box Voting .org and only AFTER the Diebold cease and desist order, issued Sept. 23 2003, shuts us down did any other sites post the memos. In fact about 32 sites published them. After defeating the cease and desist (which happened due to Kucinich's actions) Black Box Voting reposted the memos. I added the correct timeline on this and a link to the memos themselves. Realize that I should probably find a citation for that, would have to poke around, not sure how germane it is. But it is accurate to at least include Black Box Voting among the web sites that got shut down, since we were the first to publish and the first to get shut down, and we were shut down the longest.
8. The ES&S acquisition, because of the size (market share-wise), still needs review by the DoJ and FTC. It's not a done deal. I added that caveat to the end of the article. It could use a link to the Clayton Act.
Bev Harris ( talk) 03:19, 8 September 2009 (UTC)Bev Harris
This whole section is of dubious value to this article. The wired magazine that is the primary source for this section says that the employees named here left the company when PES acquired GES. If so, what is the relevance to an article about Premier? Bonewah ( talk) 15:13, 8 September 2009 (UTC)
Have the Wikipedia articles on Diebold/Premier Elections Solutions been whitewashed again? For example, there is no longer any mention that that some of the people responsible for Global Election Systems's software (i.e. Jeff Dean) had previously been convicted for embezzlement and electronic fraud. -- 96.255.132.51 ( talk)
Also in terms of whitewashing I wonder why there is no reference to the "Rob Georgia" file involved in allegedly a 12% vote flip in the Max Cleland vs. Saxby Chambliss race in Georgia? Citing sources, e.g.: 1. Published on Thursday, March 10, 2005 by CommonDreams.org Teresa Heinz Kerry - Hacking the "Mother Machine"? by Thom Hartmann
Democratic concern about electronic voting machines has floated around for several years, particularly since voting rights activist Bev Harris (of www.blackboxvoting.org) reported that she was Googling around the internet and stumbled across an FTP backdoor on Diebold's website that, just after the 2002 election, contained a folder titled "Rob Georgia." (Cleland's 2002 loss in Georgia helped hand control of the Senate back to the Republicans, who had lost it when Jim Jeffords of Vermont left the party to become an independent.)
In Georgia and Florida, where paper had been totally replaced by touch-screen machines in many to most precincts during 2001 and 2002, the 2002 election produced some of the nation's most startling precursors to the alarming shift from an "exit poll win" for Kerry to the "voting-machine win" for Bush in 2004.
2. In blackboxvoting.org, Harris: “What was rob-georgia?” Rob: “I believe what that file was for, I did a — well, there were a ton of holes with the programs on those machines. When they all came into the warehouse, I did a quality check; this was something I did on a Saturday. I found that 25 percent of the machines on the floor would fail KSU testing —” Dr. Clown Shoes ( talk) 09:31, 11 March 2013 (UTC)
It might be good to update this article to reflect the recent sale of Premier assets from ES&S to Dominion voting. -- Joebeone ( Talk) 12:07, 10 September 2010 (UTC)
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I'm making a bunch of the content from here appear in the Dominion_Voting_Systems, which is lacking any of the history at the moment; without the change, you read the Dominion article and you have no idea the company has an uber-sordid history, which is absurd... [ https://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Dominion_Voting_Systems&diff=1004350951&oldid=1004213009 this is my first stab at it; using code like this: {{ Excerpt}}. After discussing the problem on the talk page. -- 50.201.195.170 ( talk) 05:19, 2 February 2021 (UTC)
Se quiserem traduzir é só dar um toque. att 2804:14C:5BB1:8FDA:4465:DE7A:A35B:FB33 ( talk) 22:59, 29 September 2021 (UTC)
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
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this sentence sounds like marketing-blabla because i couldn't find any information that more than the name has changed:
In this incarnation, the organization is much more autonomous from the main Diebold company, both financially and regarding decision making.
and the real reasons are obviously named here http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2006/11/13/8393084/index.htm ;)
-- Taintain 19:26, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
http://www.bradblog.com/?p=4066
—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 207.62.247.10 ( talk) 20:52, 25 January 2007 (UTC).
I've started a thread at Talk:Diebold#Diebold Election Systems about merging this article with the Diebold article. JamesMLane 07:30, 19 Dec 2004 (UTC)
Where does the 80% figure come from? 22:06, 10 February 2006 (UTC)
This article needs serious cleanup. Anyone want to help? -- Joebeone ( Talk) 00:15, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
I've created some section titles and moved stuff around, so we can at least see what's going on in this article. Lots more to do though. Kisch 11:02, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
Page links to the unrelated composer Stephen Heller, not a new stub
I contacted Kathy Dopp of the newly formed National Election Data Archive, who has all the last minute information about Diebold. I hope she will post.
Here is the link to the National Election Data Archive, headed by Kathy Dopp.
Originally a group of statisticians compared the national 2006 election exit polls to the voting results and determined that mathematically the differences were too great to explain in any legitimate way. However it was not possible to get all the data needed to prove this definitively.
They formed NEDA with the purpose of creating a national database of election results to bring transparency to the election process. With all the numbers available, any statistician could do the math.
As part of this mission, NEDA follows the Diebold situation and lobbies for voter-verified ballots. A record of their activities, with many articles about the Diebold machines, can be found on this website:
USA Count Votes
-- Aenb 13:21, 17 September 2006 (UTC)
The Princeton [1] analysis of the Deibold's weakness has been referenced as further reading but not mentioned. └ VodkaJazz / talk ┐ 12:44, 10 November 2006 (UTC)
Hi, the references section of this article needs help. Each ref should use one of the WP:CITET templates. -- Joebeone ( Talk) 23:15, 31 March 2007 (UTC)
As user:Rosicrucian noted, [2] Diebold Election Systems has announced that it's changing its name to "Premier Election Solutions". Their website has already changed over. The company's is governance structure is also being changed significantly. We'll need to move the article and we should add some text on the changes. I'll take care of the move. Though I can think of some good reasons to leave the article name unchanged, those are all overriden by the undeniable fact of the new name. Any other views? ·:· Will Beback ·:· 08:42, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
Recently read this report on BBC: [4] Perhaps this might be included in the main body of the article? User talk:Anonymous(first time posting, hope I did correctly.) 04:06 19 August —The preceding signed but undated comment was added at 20:53:05, August 19, 2007 (UTC).
is a blog... should be removed 71.225.205.124 ( talk) 06:33, 17 December 2007 (UTC)
[moved to bottom because of 15 May 2008 edit]
I've alerted Kathy Dopp to the presence of this page. She runs the newly formed National Election Data Archive. Their purpose is to create a database for all election results so discrepancies are easily examined. She knows every last detail of the Diebold story.
I don't want to OWN the discussion; I've made my points. Anyone else want to respond to this? - Dan Dank55 ( talk)( mistakes) 14:36, 16 May 2008 (UTC)
They have now admitted that an error in their software causes votes to be dropped. [7]. Superm401 - Talk 04:30, 22 August 2008 (UTC)
1. Removed: The following allegations have been unsourced for nearly 2 years:
2. Removed: The following allegations have been unsourced for 6 months:
3. Removed: Clearly POV content, with a duplicative wikilink and unnecessary external link. Seems very much link an advertisement for a book:
4. Edited: Language appears unencylopedic and potentially POV. (i.e. "votes disappear...")
5. Removed: Entirely unsourced and clearly POV content:
6. Edited: Content duplicative of previous paragraph. Prof Rubin already introduced along with school.
71.178.193.134 ( talk) 21:16, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
Notes on Sept 2009 edits
1. The usage of "Bev Harris" (an individual) in place of Black Box Voting (a 501c(3) nonprofit group) is inaccurate. There is no book for sale, by the way, and hasn't been for five years, so stop with the "advertising for a book" nonsense. "Bev Harris" did not execute the Tallahassee hack; this was a project conducted by and funded by Black Box Voting, the nonprofit, and to do this we hired Harri Hursti, who actually conducted the hack as the lead researcher for a Black Box Voting project. Bev Harris founded Black Box Voting, but isn't synonymous with the organization. Corrected attributions accordingly.
2. The characterization of the electronic voting controversy as one of open source vs. closed source is inaccurate. The issue is concealed counting vs. publicly observable counting (or alternatively, publicly observable input vs output); that's a longer discussion. This is now well articulated in a constitutional court case, have made the nature of the argument more precise in the section leading into security and concealment issues.
3. The 2005 hack reported in the Tallahassee Democrat was of the optical scan; it was conducted by Black Box Voting (not "Bev Harris") and was executed by Harri Hursti and Dr. Herbert Thompson. The 2006 hack which caused such consternation in Pennsylvania was of the TSx DRE machine; like the 2005 hack, it was conducted by Black Box Voting and executed by Harri Hursti, with on-site corroboration by Dr. Herbert Thompson. Corrected the attribution for this test.
4. The state of Florida and Diebold offered rebuttals to the 2005 hack, which was the hack shown in Hacking Democracy. However, the state of California report makes it explicitly clear that the Black Box Voting/Harri Hursti memory card attack performed in the 2005 study is real, accurate, and debunks the Diebold and Florida excuses. Therefore, it is important to include the study for California by the University of California scientists; added it.
5. The lawsuit in California was filed by Bev Harris and Jim March (filed before Black Box Voting existed, so in this case use of individual names is appropriate). The lawsuit was then "joined" by the state of California. In other words, lawsuit by Harris and March joined by California, resulting in the $2.6 million settlement.
6. The Stephen Spoonamore material is not particularly credible. I can find no evidence that he was a "long time Republican operative" so I deleted that sentence. I also see no evidence that he found anything "new" and in fact, some of his first report mixed up the program for the GEMS central tabulator run on a Windows NT machine with the Windows CE program run on the precinct touchscreens. Therefore, I find his studies to be factually weak. But more than that, I examined the campaign finance reports for Republican Party and John McCain and found no expenditures indicating he had ever been hired, nor for any of his companies. When I questioned reporters of this story about this, they said he said he may have been a volunteer for McCain. At any rate, I dug up an old (also non-credible) press release from Spoonamore from 2006 where he was claiming that the Republicans rigged the election. It seems unlikely that a John McCain operative (2007) would have written that piece back in 2006 if he was really a Republican operative. I would delete that whole paragraph if I felt bolder.
7. The Diebold memos were published on Black Box Voting .org and only AFTER the Diebold cease and desist order, issued Sept. 23 2003, shuts us down did any other sites post the memos. In fact about 32 sites published them. After defeating the cease and desist (which happened due to Kucinich's actions) Black Box Voting reposted the memos. I added the correct timeline on this and a link to the memos themselves. Realize that I should probably find a citation for that, would have to poke around, not sure how germane it is. But it is accurate to at least include Black Box Voting among the web sites that got shut down, since we were the first to publish and the first to get shut down, and we were shut down the longest.
8. The ES&S acquisition, because of the size (market share-wise), still needs review by the DoJ and FTC. It's not a done deal. I added that caveat to the end of the article. It could use a link to the Clayton Act.
Bev Harris ( talk) 03:19, 8 September 2009 (UTC)Bev Harris
This whole section is of dubious value to this article. The wired magazine that is the primary source for this section says that the employees named here left the company when PES acquired GES. If so, what is the relevance to an article about Premier? Bonewah ( talk) 15:13, 8 September 2009 (UTC)
Have the Wikipedia articles on Diebold/Premier Elections Solutions been whitewashed again? For example, there is no longer any mention that that some of the people responsible for Global Election Systems's software (i.e. Jeff Dean) had previously been convicted for embezzlement and electronic fraud. -- 96.255.132.51 ( talk)
Also in terms of whitewashing I wonder why there is no reference to the "Rob Georgia" file involved in allegedly a 12% vote flip in the Max Cleland vs. Saxby Chambliss race in Georgia? Citing sources, e.g.: 1. Published on Thursday, March 10, 2005 by CommonDreams.org Teresa Heinz Kerry - Hacking the "Mother Machine"? by Thom Hartmann
Democratic concern about electronic voting machines has floated around for several years, particularly since voting rights activist Bev Harris (of www.blackboxvoting.org) reported that she was Googling around the internet and stumbled across an FTP backdoor on Diebold's website that, just after the 2002 election, contained a folder titled "Rob Georgia." (Cleland's 2002 loss in Georgia helped hand control of the Senate back to the Republicans, who had lost it when Jim Jeffords of Vermont left the party to become an independent.)
In Georgia and Florida, where paper had been totally replaced by touch-screen machines in many to most precincts during 2001 and 2002, the 2002 election produced some of the nation's most startling precursors to the alarming shift from an "exit poll win" for Kerry to the "voting-machine win" for Bush in 2004.
2. In blackboxvoting.org, Harris: “What was rob-georgia?” Rob: “I believe what that file was for, I did a — well, there were a ton of holes with the programs on those machines. When they all came into the warehouse, I did a quality check; this was something I did on a Saturday. I found that 25 percent of the machines on the floor would fail KSU testing —” Dr. Clown Shoes ( talk) 09:31, 11 March 2013 (UTC)
It might be good to update this article to reflect the recent sale of Premier assets from ES&S to Dominion voting. -- Joebeone ( Talk) 12:07, 10 September 2010 (UTC)
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I'm making a bunch of the content from here appear in the Dominion_Voting_Systems, which is lacking any of the history at the moment; without the change, you read the Dominion article and you have no idea the company has an uber-sordid history, which is absurd... [ https://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Dominion_Voting_Systems&diff=1004350951&oldid=1004213009 this is my first stab at it; using code like this: {{ Excerpt}}. After discussing the problem on the talk page. -- 50.201.195.170 ( talk) 05:19, 2 February 2021 (UTC)
Se quiserem traduzir é só dar um toque. att 2804:14C:5BB1:8FDA:4465:DE7A:A35B:FB33 ( talk) 22:59, 29 September 2021 (UTC)