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Joaopais, the candidature of Veloso, that had been accepted by the Constitutional Court, was removed shortly before the election after an agreement between the PCP, the PRD and Zenha. So, the PCP supported Zenha at the day of the election, and that's shown in the election article as Zenha had the majority in Beja, Évora and Setúbal, the communist strongholds. The communists voted for Zenha, so, the Party's candidate was Zenha. And one more thing, I wrote the article of the election myself, I don't need to refer to it. Regards! Afonso Silva 16:24, 11 January 2006 (UTC)
Is the PCP the only party not persecuted during the Purge? Xx236 13:30, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
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This article has several issues that will need to be resolved in order for it to retain its good article status. Issues include but are not limited to:
Please keep this page updated with the article's status. Thanks! Gary King ( talk) 17:31, 3 December 2008 (UTC)
Like it never happened. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.203.58.101 ( talk) 21:52, 31 March 2014 (UTC)
I think the political position for this party should either be changed or removed. For a long time the political position had stood in the info box as "left-wing to far-left". However this has recently been changed to just left-wing by one editor. I would argue the party is far-left, at the very least to a certain degree. This is due to its ideological basis. Communist and Marxist-Leninist parties are virtually always far-left, due to the extreme nature of these combined ideological stances and the belief in the "dictatorship of the proletariat". Currently neither position has been evidenced, nor discussed, nor received consensus for this party and some sort of discussion should have happened here before changing a long standing position. I have tried to revert things to the way they were, until there had been proper discussion and I offered to use talk here, only to have my edits constantly reverted. I see no reason why this should have been changed. Only one editors perspective was given for the change, no evidence, nor consensus. A change such as this should have been given evidence and / or discussion before being changed. If a position cannot be agreed upon I would opt that it be removed from the info box of this page. Helper201 ( talk) 11:56, 27 August 2017 (UTC)
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The section on quotes should be removed immediately. Wikipedia should never uses quotes as the way BunnyHopp typed things, the current quotes gives a soapbox for the party, this is against Wikipedia's terms on a NPOV, BunnyHopp there is way to twist this it will be removed. It doesn't constitute a NPOV. However please state your rational for keeping it which it won't because the way it is constituted can and will never be allowed on Wikipedia. Vallee01 ( talk) 20:08, 24 November 2020 (UTC)
As stated by other editors, the insentient use of quotes completely fails at making this article have a neutral POV. The way in which this article uses quotes gives a soapbox for Portuguese Communist Party. BunnyyHop's edits are all giving a soapbox to the Portuguese Communist Party and is therefor unacceptable. Vallee01 ( talk) 23:32, 28 November 2020 (UTC)
Vallee01, I'm not blocked on the Portuguese Wikipedia.
"outright state" I did not "outright state" those things. According to the party is something stated in a lot of articles, as shown by the Google Search. This is just to make you understand what neutral is and isn't. Jobbik, for example, has the following in the lead: "According to the party's "Manifesto on the Guidelines of a Future Government", Jobbik represents all Hungarian citizens and people and aims to build a modern national identity, while rejecting the chauvinism of the 20th century." In this case, according to the political thesis of the party, it maintains its "vanguard role in the service of the class interests of the workers, of the process of social transformation, for the revolutionary overcoming of capitalism". To say this is a soapbox is to not understand what a soapbox is. It's the official party line and it should be stated in the lead. And this is not something redundant - vanguardism and revolution are central aspects to understading the party line. It's in quotes because it's not something neutral or factual but their opinion - which is in quotes and written in an impartial tone, it's an opinion stated as an opinion and not as fact. If it was stated as a fact - then we would have a problem. It's right there on the WP:NPOV article, and like Soman, I struggle to see where the problem is. BunnyyHop ( talk) 23:28, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
Vallee01, consensus in many debates and discussions should ideally not be based upon number of votes, but upon policy-related points made by editors. This new edit is tendentious, it's a manner of editing that is partisan, biased, or skewed taken as a whole. You have removed policy-abiding paragraphs and replaced them with original research such as "the stated goal of the PCG is to adhere to Marxism-Leninism, and to be a synthesis of patriotism, and state communism". So far, two editors have strongly opposed your edits. They are based on a strawman of MOS:QUOTE, where there should be no quotes because otherwise it's WP:PROMOTION. But where the promotion is, is yet to be seen. Everything is written according to WP:NPOV - a simple formulation is to assert facts, including facts about opinions, but to not assert opinions themselves.
Quotation should be used, with attribution, to present emotive opinions that cannot be expressed in Wikipedia's own voice, but never to present cultural norms as simply opinional:
Acceptable: Siskel and Ebert called the film "unforgettable". Unacceptable: The site is considered "sacred" by the religion's scriptures.
Concise opinions that are not overly emotive can often be reported with attribution instead of direct quotation. Use of quotation marks around simple descriptive terms can imply something doubtful regarding the material being quoted; sarcasm or weasel words such as supposedly or so-called, might be inferred.
Permissible: Siskel and Ebert called the film interesting. Unnecessary and may imply doubt: Siskel and Ebert called the film "interesting". Should be quoted: Siskel and Ebert called the film "interesting but heart-wrenching". BunnyyHop ( talk) 23:53, 7 December 2020 (UTC)
maintaining, according to the party, "vanguard role in the service of the class interests of the workers, of the process of social transformation, for the revolutionary overcoming of capitalism" is completely necessary and constitutes neutral editing. There's absolutely no problem with this, and the quotes are needed because otherwise you would be stating an opinion, which is against neutral editing. My version is the stable version - it was the version in place before you started the dispute. Moreover, your version has been reverted by another editor who claimed yours "introduced heavily pov". BunnyyHop ( talk) 01:22, 8 December 2020 (UTC)
sam1370 I don't think it constitutes "relatively small". 4th largest with 50.000 members in a near 11 million population where there's 50% of absentees? The current government would fall]] apart if it wasn't the support of this party in the parliament. 6% of a vote share isn't relatively small, unless you count every party to be relatively small compared to the one who got most votes. I have made a quick Google search, and "relatively small" appears to be used for the Catalonian Communist Party - when it had around 400 members. This List of political parties in Italy article defines major as "more than 4%". List of political parties in the United Kingdom defines minor parties as parties with no elected UK representation. Thus it shows the arbitrariness of using "relatively small compared to other parties". In fact, this is the only wikipedia page with the phrase "relatively small compared to other parties", Here. Because this violates WP:ASSERT -- BunnyyHop ( talk) 21:41, 9 December 2020 (UTC)
References
Response to third opinion request: |
Good evening, I am Springnuts. As far as I know I have neither previously edited this article, nor interacted with any of the editors involved. I am a Brit, and we have a soft spot for Portugal, our oldest ally and one of the 22 countries in the world we have never invaded. So I hope I may be able to help.
I would like to thank you for a very clearly expressed request for a 3O: “Whether «relatively small» should be stated or not”. May I first of all draw your attention to a discrepancy in the encyclopedia: according to Assembly of the Republic (Portugal) the Portuguese Communist Party has ten seats; according to this article it has twelve – likely due to participation in the Unitary Democratic Coalition, I assume. I don’t consider this difference significant to my opinion. I note membership figures of 54k (17% of those who are members of any party), compared to the 129k (40% of those who are members of any party) who are SD members. But I am unsure what weight you can give to such a comparison, because the figures are not necessarily comparing like with like; nor are they, from a quick scan of the articles and sources, official or externally audited figures. Number of votes in a national election seems a more reliable figure, and I note that in the election of 2019 the Unitary Democratic Coalition, which includes the PCP, gained around 5% of the vote. My opinion is that «relatively small» is used appropriately in the article. It seems to me that here we have an assembly; within which are two large parties, a couple of relatively small parties and a number of very small parties. Relatively here naturally refers to the size of the whole assembly, and to the size of this party relative to the largest party. My opinion is a linguistic one and not in any way a political one; and fwiw I do not see there being any moral or value judgment in the description, nor do I see the words as being in any way POV or weaselly. That is my 3O. With all respect, |
Great response, thank you for your time colleague Springnuts. -- BunnyyHop ( talk) 22:34, 18 December 2020 (UTC)
What is the rationale for keeping the «neutrality is disputed» template when the «dispute» has ended? This tag is not for a single editor to filibuster or complain about an article when they don't get their way. -- BunnyyHop ( talk) 01:05, 26 December 2020 (UTC)
BunnyyHop, JMagalhães, Eta Carinae, Young Brujah, just to name a few of the portuguese language users with deep sympathy towards the PCP have absolute rule over the portuguese language version of this page and have posted blatant disinformation and party propaganda as facts to the point that it is completly compromised. Under no circunstances should that page be used as a standart for the english language page, which although still slightly biased towards the PCP, it still is far more neutral than the portuguese language page will ever be. The extreme left-wing bias in the portuguese politics pages remains a stain in Wikipedia's reputation and integrity. TheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 18:58, 6 January 2023 (UTC)
Then why is there a warning that says: "This article may be expanded with text translated from the corresponding article in Portuguese"? TheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 21:50, 7 January 2023 (UTC)
Even you if can't read in portuguese, you can just read the other discussions about BunnyyHop ideologically motivated editing on the english language Wikipedia, then you can check that he is the main contributor for the portuguese language article and that will tell you everything you need to know about its neutrality. Most of the references are either from the party's website, the Avante newspaper or other media affiliated with the PCP. The portuguese language Wikipedia has insane left-wing bias from people that have barricated themselfs behind moderation roles and should NOT be used under any circumstances to improve english articles. TheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 15:56, 8 January 2023 (UTC)
It is so ridiculously lopsided that even though the last portuguese local elections were on the 26th of September 2021, the infobox still displayed the amount of mayors and councillors from the 2017 local elections. And the section about the party's reaction about the russian invasion of Ukraine is pure unfiltered party propaganda. TheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 11:57, 14 January 2023 (UTC)
@Use a neutral source to back up your argument. That's the only way you can convince us. 아키라 ( talk) 18:17, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
I understand that you are unable to see beyond your bias, but it is me who must challenge you to prove my sources, which include academic journals, aren't neutral. NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 11:14, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
As for your request for the pro-russian sentiment within the party:
https://www.portugal.com/news/pcp-will-not-be-present-for-president-zelenskys-speech/
https://www.portugalresident.com/cdu-refuses-to-condemn-russia/ NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 11:53, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
are you still at this? you've been obsessed with editing this page for the last month. none of those sources you keep trying to use are good enough for your claims, as 20 days ago myself and a few other editors had to keep reverting your vandalism. you've been warned to stop multiple times Castroonthemoon ( talk) 18:11, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
I'm sorry if you are unable to cope with facts. The sources stated are either from newspapers or academic journals, but I guess you would prefer more party propaganda. Your comrade was the one crying about the edits, to the point that he left me a mensage. NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 10:38, 22 January 2023 (UTC)
there's really no need to get uncivil here, it's wikipedia. You're the only one in these discussions getting emotionally involved in this Castroonthemoon ( talk) 21:08, 26 January 2023 (UTC)
You really should bother reading the whole discussion thread before making stuff up in your head. It would really improve the quality of your arguments, instead of complaining endlessly that academic peer review sources aren't valid. Either try to keep your bias away or refrain from editing this page. I am always open for civil discussions, but unfortunatly you and your comrades have failed to do that since the very beginning. NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 13:02, 27 January 2023 (UTC)
I recently found a non-neutral addition to this article. The sources accompanying the additions are uncomfortably biased, inconsistent with the text, and generally long written. Therefore, it is absurd that 'anti-reformism' and 'euroscepticism' were added to the ideology. I think there is a serious problem with the content, and it is necessary to delete it.---- 아키라 ( talk) 18:01, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
In addition, I think the user who added this content needs to know the exact meaning of 'anti-revisionism' and 'euroscepticism'. Finally, I think there needs to be a serious talk on this. 아키라 ( talk) 18:06, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
In particular, for sources added to anti-revisionism, one was written in 1990 and one in 2006. In the latter case, bias is serious, and the former does not contain the latest content. 아키라 ( talk) 18:11, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
The PCP is well known as an eurosceptic party. It is documented in the run up to the 2019 european elections, when the center-left Socialist Party accused it of having an "extremelly dangerous project", even when the PCP was giving parlimentary support to the minority PS government. As for anti-revisionist, the fact that the eurocommunists and pro-Perestroika faction that were purged in the 90s remain outside of the party speaks for itself. I do agree that more updated academic sources would be better, but there are not that much english sources to chose from. NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 11:23, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
Also if the Left Bloc, a soft-eurosceptic party, is described as such on Wikipedia, I would like for you to provide valid reasons for a hard-eurosceptic party to not be described as such. Again, it does seem that you have big ideological bias and have become quite emotional on this subject. NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 11:26, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
"Concerning the parliamentary representation, only the aforementioned PCP and BE contain Eurosceptic elements in their programs. The PCP is economically one of the most orthodox and conservative Communist parties in Europe"
Source: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41599-017-0062-8
Is this better for you? NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 11:59, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
"2. The main political parties seemed to agree upon their European perspectives. The decreasing politicization of Europe in Portuguese politics – when compared with what happened with the “hard” Eurosceptic position of the Communist Party or the “soft” Euroscepticism of the right-wing CDS-PP in the 90’s (until the demise of Manuel Monteiro’s leadership) – might explain the absence of a “European cleavage” in voting behaviour and, thus, a higher abstention rate."
source: https://dcubrexitinstitute.eu/2019/06/european-elections-the-silence-of-the-lambs-and-the-dangerous-political-resignation-in-portugal/#_ftn12 NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 12:02, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
Data are also limited to the '90s. Whose is the source? Attempts to link the conservative Communist Party to anti-revisionism are incomprehensible. Why is your point of view the standard of PCP? 아키라 ( talk) 05:31, 24 January 2023 (UTC)
You should read that again, it is pretty clear that 90s reference is about the CDS-PP and not about the PCP. In the early 90s the hardline wing of the party took over and started to have an eurosceptic outlook, to the point that it was kicked out the EPP. In the late 90s the establishment wing took over again under Paulo Portas, and the party returned to being pro-EU. It is quite clear you don't know much of anything about portuguese politics and should refrain from editing anything related to it. NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 18:51, 24 January 2023 (UTC)
I'm using the same standarts used for another ideologically similar party, the Communist Party of Greece (KKE). The anti-Perestroika sentiment is what defines the Syrian Communist Party (Bakdash) as anti-revisionist, but not the Syrian Communist Party (Unified). Several PCP members celebrated the death of Gorbachev and the party still has not reinstated the purged pro-Perestroika and eurocommunist factions. You cannot claim that the PCP, by far one of the most hardline communist parties in Europe, is not anti-revisionist, specially when compared to the PCF or the PCE. Are we done here? NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 19:01, 24 January 2023 (UTC)
Portuguese Communist Party was one of the Social sciences and society good articles, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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Joaopais, the candidature of Veloso, that had been accepted by the Constitutional Court, was removed shortly before the election after an agreement between the PCP, the PRD and Zenha. So, the PCP supported Zenha at the day of the election, and that's shown in the election article as Zenha had the majority in Beja, Évora and Setúbal, the communist strongholds. The communists voted for Zenha, so, the Party's candidate was Zenha. And one more thing, I wrote the article of the election myself, I don't need to refer to it. Regards! Afonso Silva 16:24, 11 January 2006 (UTC)
Is the PCP the only party not persecuted during the Purge? Xx236 13:30, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
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BetacommandBot ( talk) 19:55, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
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BetacommandBot ( talk) 17:16, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
This article has several issues that will need to be resolved in order for it to retain its good article status. Issues include but are not limited to:
Please keep this page updated with the article's status. Thanks! Gary King ( talk) 17:31, 3 December 2008 (UTC)
Like it never happened. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.203.58.101 ( talk) 21:52, 31 March 2014 (UTC)
I think the political position for this party should either be changed or removed. For a long time the political position had stood in the info box as "left-wing to far-left". However this has recently been changed to just left-wing by one editor. I would argue the party is far-left, at the very least to a certain degree. This is due to its ideological basis. Communist and Marxist-Leninist parties are virtually always far-left, due to the extreme nature of these combined ideological stances and the belief in the "dictatorship of the proletariat". Currently neither position has been evidenced, nor discussed, nor received consensus for this party and some sort of discussion should have happened here before changing a long standing position. I have tried to revert things to the way they were, until there had been proper discussion and I offered to use talk here, only to have my edits constantly reverted. I see no reason why this should have been changed. Only one editors perspective was given for the change, no evidence, nor consensus. A change such as this should have been given evidence and / or discussion before being changed. If a position cannot be agreed upon I would opt that it be removed from the info box of this page. Helper201 ( talk) 11:56, 27 August 2017 (UTC)
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The section on quotes should be removed immediately. Wikipedia should never uses quotes as the way BunnyHopp typed things, the current quotes gives a soapbox for the party, this is against Wikipedia's terms on a NPOV, BunnyHopp there is way to twist this it will be removed. It doesn't constitute a NPOV. However please state your rational for keeping it which it won't because the way it is constituted can and will never be allowed on Wikipedia. Vallee01 ( talk) 20:08, 24 November 2020 (UTC)
As stated by other editors, the insentient use of quotes completely fails at making this article have a neutral POV. The way in which this article uses quotes gives a soapbox for Portuguese Communist Party. BunnyyHop's edits are all giving a soapbox to the Portuguese Communist Party and is therefor unacceptable. Vallee01 ( talk) 23:32, 28 November 2020 (UTC)
Vallee01, I'm not blocked on the Portuguese Wikipedia.
"outright state" I did not "outright state" those things. According to the party is something stated in a lot of articles, as shown by the Google Search. This is just to make you understand what neutral is and isn't. Jobbik, for example, has the following in the lead: "According to the party's "Manifesto on the Guidelines of a Future Government", Jobbik represents all Hungarian citizens and people and aims to build a modern national identity, while rejecting the chauvinism of the 20th century." In this case, according to the political thesis of the party, it maintains its "vanguard role in the service of the class interests of the workers, of the process of social transformation, for the revolutionary overcoming of capitalism". To say this is a soapbox is to not understand what a soapbox is. It's the official party line and it should be stated in the lead. And this is not something redundant - vanguardism and revolution are central aspects to understading the party line. It's in quotes because it's not something neutral or factual but their opinion - which is in quotes and written in an impartial tone, it's an opinion stated as an opinion and not as fact. If it was stated as a fact - then we would have a problem. It's right there on the WP:NPOV article, and like Soman, I struggle to see where the problem is. BunnyyHop ( talk) 23:28, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
Vallee01, consensus in many debates and discussions should ideally not be based upon number of votes, but upon policy-related points made by editors. This new edit is tendentious, it's a manner of editing that is partisan, biased, or skewed taken as a whole. You have removed policy-abiding paragraphs and replaced them with original research such as "the stated goal of the PCG is to adhere to Marxism-Leninism, and to be a synthesis of patriotism, and state communism". So far, two editors have strongly opposed your edits. They are based on a strawman of MOS:QUOTE, where there should be no quotes because otherwise it's WP:PROMOTION. But where the promotion is, is yet to be seen. Everything is written according to WP:NPOV - a simple formulation is to assert facts, including facts about opinions, but to not assert opinions themselves.
Quotation should be used, with attribution, to present emotive opinions that cannot be expressed in Wikipedia's own voice, but never to present cultural norms as simply opinional:
Acceptable: Siskel and Ebert called the film "unforgettable". Unacceptable: The site is considered "sacred" by the religion's scriptures.
Concise opinions that are not overly emotive can often be reported with attribution instead of direct quotation. Use of quotation marks around simple descriptive terms can imply something doubtful regarding the material being quoted; sarcasm or weasel words such as supposedly or so-called, might be inferred.
Permissible: Siskel and Ebert called the film interesting. Unnecessary and may imply doubt: Siskel and Ebert called the film "interesting". Should be quoted: Siskel and Ebert called the film "interesting but heart-wrenching". BunnyyHop ( talk) 23:53, 7 December 2020 (UTC)
maintaining, according to the party, "vanguard role in the service of the class interests of the workers, of the process of social transformation, for the revolutionary overcoming of capitalism" is completely necessary and constitutes neutral editing. There's absolutely no problem with this, and the quotes are needed because otherwise you would be stating an opinion, which is against neutral editing. My version is the stable version - it was the version in place before you started the dispute. Moreover, your version has been reverted by another editor who claimed yours "introduced heavily pov". BunnyyHop ( talk) 01:22, 8 December 2020 (UTC)
sam1370 I don't think it constitutes "relatively small". 4th largest with 50.000 members in a near 11 million population where there's 50% of absentees? The current government would fall]] apart if it wasn't the support of this party in the parliament. 6% of a vote share isn't relatively small, unless you count every party to be relatively small compared to the one who got most votes. I have made a quick Google search, and "relatively small" appears to be used for the Catalonian Communist Party - when it had around 400 members. This List of political parties in Italy article defines major as "more than 4%". List of political parties in the United Kingdom defines minor parties as parties with no elected UK representation. Thus it shows the arbitrariness of using "relatively small compared to other parties". In fact, this is the only wikipedia page with the phrase "relatively small compared to other parties", Here. Because this violates WP:ASSERT -- BunnyyHop ( talk) 21:41, 9 December 2020 (UTC)
References
Response to third opinion request: |
Good evening, I am Springnuts. As far as I know I have neither previously edited this article, nor interacted with any of the editors involved. I am a Brit, and we have a soft spot for Portugal, our oldest ally and one of the 22 countries in the world we have never invaded. So I hope I may be able to help.
I would like to thank you for a very clearly expressed request for a 3O: “Whether «relatively small» should be stated or not”. May I first of all draw your attention to a discrepancy in the encyclopedia: according to Assembly of the Republic (Portugal) the Portuguese Communist Party has ten seats; according to this article it has twelve – likely due to participation in the Unitary Democratic Coalition, I assume. I don’t consider this difference significant to my opinion. I note membership figures of 54k (17% of those who are members of any party), compared to the 129k (40% of those who are members of any party) who are SD members. But I am unsure what weight you can give to such a comparison, because the figures are not necessarily comparing like with like; nor are they, from a quick scan of the articles and sources, official or externally audited figures. Number of votes in a national election seems a more reliable figure, and I note that in the election of 2019 the Unitary Democratic Coalition, which includes the PCP, gained around 5% of the vote. My opinion is that «relatively small» is used appropriately in the article. It seems to me that here we have an assembly; within which are two large parties, a couple of relatively small parties and a number of very small parties. Relatively here naturally refers to the size of the whole assembly, and to the size of this party relative to the largest party. My opinion is a linguistic one and not in any way a political one; and fwiw I do not see there being any moral or value judgment in the description, nor do I see the words as being in any way POV or weaselly. That is my 3O. With all respect, |
Great response, thank you for your time colleague Springnuts. -- BunnyyHop ( talk) 22:34, 18 December 2020 (UTC)
What is the rationale for keeping the «neutrality is disputed» template when the «dispute» has ended? This tag is not for a single editor to filibuster or complain about an article when they don't get their way. -- BunnyyHop ( talk) 01:05, 26 December 2020 (UTC)
BunnyyHop, JMagalhães, Eta Carinae, Young Brujah, just to name a few of the portuguese language users with deep sympathy towards the PCP have absolute rule over the portuguese language version of this page and have posted blatant disinformation and party propaganda as facts to the point that it is completly compromised. Under no circunstances should that page be used as a standart for the english language page, which although still slightly biased towards the PCP, it still is far more neutral than the portuguese language page will ever be. The extreme left-wing bias in the portuguese politics pages remains a stain in Wikipedia's reputation and integrity. TheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 18:58, 6 January 2023 (UTC)
Then why is there a warning that says: "This article may be expanded with text translated from the corresponding article in Portuguese"? TheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 21:50, 7 January 2023 (UTC)
Even you if can't read in portuguese, you can just read the other discussions about BunnyyHop ideologically motivated editing on the english language Wikipedia, then you can check that he is the main contributor for the portuguese language article and that will tell you everything you need to know about its neutrality. Most of the references are either from the party's website, the Avante newspaper or other media affiliated with the PCP. The portuguese language Wikipedia has insane left-wing bias from people that have barricated themselfs behind moderation roles and should NOT be used under any circumstances to improve english articles. TheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 15:56, 8 January 2023 (UTC)
It is so ridiculously lopsided that even though the last portuguese local elections were on the 26th of September 2021, the infobox still displayed the amount of mayors and councillors from the 2017 local elections. And the section about the party's reaction about the russian invasion of Ukraine is pure unfiltered party propaganda. TheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 11:57, 14 January 2023 (UTC)
@Use a neutral source to back up your argument. That's the only way you can convince us. 아키라 ( talk) 18:17, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
I understand that you are unable to see beyond your bias, but it is me who must challenge you to prove my sources, which include academic journals, aren't neutral. NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 11:14, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
As for your request for the pro-russian sentiment within the party:
https://www.portugal.com/news/pcp-will-not-be-present-for-president-zelenskys-speech/
https://www.portugalresident.com/cdu-refuses-to-condemn-russia/ NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 11:53, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
are you still at this? you've been obsessed with editing this page for the last month. none of those sources you keep trying to use are good enough for your claims, as 20 days ago myself and a few other editors had to keep reverting your vandalism. you've been warned to stop multiple times Castroonthemoon ( talk) 18:11, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
I'm sorry if you are unable to cope with facts. The sources stated are either from newspapers or academic journals, but I guess you would prefer more party propaganda. Your comrade was the one crying about the edits, to the point that he left me a mensage. NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 10:38, 22 January 2023 (UTC)
there's really no need to get uncivil here, it's wikipedia. You're the only one in these discussions getting emotionally involved in this Castroonthemoon ( talk) 21:08, 26 January 2023 (UTC)
You really should bother reading the whole discussion thread before making stuff up in your head. It would really improve the quality of your arguments, instead of complaining endlessly that academic peer review sources aren't valid. Either try to keep your bias away or refrain from editing this page. I am always open for civil discussions, but unfortunatly you and your comrades have failed to do that since the very beginning. NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 13:02, 27 January 2023 (UTC)
I recently found a non-neutral addition to this article. The sources accompanying the additions are uncomfortably biased, inconsistent with the text, and generally long written. Therefore, it is absurd that 'anti-reformism' and 'euroscepticism' were added to the ideology. I think there is a serious problem with the content, and it is necessary to delete it.---- 아키라 ( talk) 18:01, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
In addition, I think the user who added this content needs to know the exact meaning of 'anti-revisionism' and 'euroscepticism'. Finally, I think there needs to be a serious talk on this. 아키라 ( talk) 18:06, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
In particular, for sources added to anti-revisionism, one was written in 1990 and one in 2006. In the latter case, bias is serious, and the former does not contain the latest content. 아키라 ( talk) 18:11, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
The PCP is well known as an eurosceptic party. It is documented in the run up to the 2019 european elections, when the center-left Socialist Party accused it of having an "extremelly dangerous project", even when the PCP was giving parlimentary support to the minority PS government. As for anti-revisionist, the fact that the eurocommunists and pro-Perestroika faction that were purged in the 90s remain outside of the party speaks for itself. I do agree that more updated academic sources would be better, but there are not that much english sources to chose from. NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 11:23, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
Also if the Left Bloc, a soft-eurosceptic party, is described as such on Wikipedia, I would like for you to provide valid reasons for a hard-eurosceptic party to not be described as such. Again, it does seem that you have big ideological bias and have become quite emotional on this subject. NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 11:26, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
"Concerning the parliamentary representation, only the aforementioned PCP and BE contain Eurosceptic elements in their programs. The PCP is economically one of the most orthodox and conservative Communist parties in Europe"
Source: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41599-017-0062-8
Is this better for you? NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 11:59, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
"2. The main political parties seemed to agree upon their European perspectives. The decreasing politicization of Europe in Portuguese politics – when compared with what happened with the “hard” Eurosceptic position of the Communist Party or the “soft” Euroscepticism of the right-wing CDS-PP in the 90’s (until the demise of Manuel Monteiro’s leadership) – might explain the absence of a “European cleavage” in voting behaviour and, thus, a higher abstention rate."
source: https://dcubrexitinstitute.eu/2019/06/european-elections-the-silence-of-the-lambs-and-the-dangerous-political-resignation-in-portugal/#_ftn12 NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 12:02, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
Data are also limited to the '90s. Whose is the source? Attempts to link the conservative Communist Party to anti-revisionism are incomprehensible. Why is your point of view the standard of PCP? 아키라 ( talk) 05:31, 24 January 2023 (UTC)
You should read that again, it is pretty clear that 90s reference is about the CDS-PP and not about the PCP. In the early 90s the hardline wing of the party took over and started to have an eurosceptic outlook, to the point that it was kicked out the EPP. In the late 90s the establishment wing took over again under Paulo Portas, and the party returned to being pro-EU. It is quite clear you don't know much of anything about portuguese politics and should refrain from editing anything related to it. NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 18:51, 24 January 2023 (UTC)
I'm using the same standarts used for another ideologically similar party, the Communist Party of Greece (KKE). The anti-Perestroika sentiment is what defines the Syrian Communist Party (Bakdash) as anti-revisionist, but not the Syrian Communist Party (Unified). Several PCP members celebrated the death of Gorbachev and the party still has not reinstated the purged pro-Perestroika and eurocommunist factions. You cannot claim that the PCP, by far one of the most hardline communist parties in Europe, is not anti-revisionist, specially when compared to the PCF or the PCE. Are we done here? NotTheRealDiogoFaro ( talk) 19:01, 24 January 2023 (UTC)