Point Walter has been listed as one of the
Geography and places good articles under the
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please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can
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Is the photo really from Mosman Park?? The spit and jetty look too close - more like the view from the path along Blackwall Reach.
Point Walter had major Aboriginal significance - does anyone have the information to put in at least the name, maybe some of the story?
There's also really interesting European history - using the spit to land cargo (I think Walter Padbury was here??), and the picnics from Fremantle.
Callophylla 11:01, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
the best Battye title so far is
Author Turner, Ric. Title Point Walter : a history from 1827 to 1986 / by Ric Turner for Ministry of Sport and Recreation. Published Perth, W.A. : Ministry of Sport and Recreation, 1990. ISBN 0730939510 Note First published as: Point Walter : a history from corroboree to cup. 1986. Subject Parks -- Western Australia -- Bicton -- History. Point Walter Reserve (Bicton, W.A.) -- History.
oh well that one anyway SatuSuro 13:42, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
MY FAMILY LIVED AT PT WALTER AFTER ARRIVING IN AUSTRALIA IN 1842. SAMUEL CAPORN. hIS SONS DUG THROUGH THE BANK TO TAKE 2 MILE OFF THEIR TRIP TO FREO. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.7.70.121 ( talk) 12:12, 16 March 2010 (UTC)
Yes my sixth great grandfather Samuel Caporn lived at point Walter. The caporns ran the first ferry service to perth and to fremantle. The Caporn boys tried exploding their way through the sand bar but the up keep was too hard so they soon gave up. I don't see why the name of Point Walter can't be petitioned to be changed to reflect on the Caporn family and the impact they had on the area, rather then naming it after a useless favourite brother. No one would even be able to tell you why it is called Point Walter. Happy days :-) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gavinjamescaporn ( talk • contribs) 12:35, 8 May 2013 (UTC)
I've added a reference for the YAC It Up concert, but this 2009 page on the City of Melville website suggest that the concert is no longer held. Specifically (I've added the emphasis here):
The one-off funding has been made available this year in a bid to support a series of smaller, grass-roots community projects instead of the once-yearly YAC It Up outdoor concert at Point Walter.
I can't find any more recent reference to the concert, either indicating that it still happens every year, or that it does not. Mitch Ames ( talk) 08:20, 26 October 2013 (UTC)
GA toolbox |
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Reviewing |
Reviewer: Barkeep49 ( talk · contribs) 21:53, 18 May 2018 (UTC)
So I did some clean-up in the lead but large sections of this article reads awkwardly to me. Not grammatically incorrect, just awkwardly. Having done GAs for articles written in both Candian and British English (in addition to my own American English) and having spent some time in Australia I don't think it's that it's a different kind of English. A more experienced/better copy editor would likely have more insightful comments.
Point Walter was named in honour of Sir James Stirling's brother, Walter Stirling, in 1827 during his survey of suitable spots for settlement along the Swan River.I might try cleaning that up to something like
During his survey of suitable spots along the Swan River, Sir James Stirling named Point Walter after his brother, Walter Stirling.
I don' think it's "reasonably well-written" (criteria 1a) right now. Fixing more of article would be beyond what I'm willing to do as part of a GA. I know you waited about 6 months for this review so I'm hesitant to ask you to wait longer for someone at WP:GCE to do a pass, though they would probably do the best. What I can do is offer you the sentences which read awkwardly and let you have a go at improving. If this is OK I'll make a list of such sentences. Let me know which option you'd prefer (waiting for GCE or doing it yourself).
*Both here, in the first sentence even, and later on it says that this place is notable for the sandbar, but in neither place is there a reference for this assertion. One isn't needed here, but it does need to be referenced somewhere.
*I did an attempt at some editing for clarity in the second paragraph of the LEAD. Thoughts are welcome.
... initially removed by Mitch Ames, I have reinstated it ...— Could you include links to the initial removal and reinstatement. Mitch Ames ( talk) 03:16, 27 May 2018 (UTC)
Through a series of events, the point suffered a drop in patronage from the late 19th century to World War II.", but "a series of events" here is so vague as to be meaningless. What events? " Teasers ... that ... omit crucial details ... should never be used on Wikipedia.". I suggest deleting "Through a series of events, ". Mitch Ames ( talk) 03:31, 27 May 2018 (UTC)
*Source for
It was a place traditionally for women and children, but when
through the end of the paragraph?
*When did Lionel Lukin and Alfred Waylen acquire the land?
*Source(s) for
Point Walter was named in honour of Sir James Stirling's brother, Walter Stirling, in 1827 during his survey of suitable spots for settlement along the Swan River. The land was then acquired by the settlers Lionel Lukin and Alfred Waylen. After acquiring the land, Waylen developed it by building a villa in 1830 which later burnt down, and in 1831 his land was extended 700 more acres to include part of the suburb to which he is the namesake, Alfred Cove. During his time at Point Walter Waylen constructed an inn known as "The Halfway House" due to its location between Perth and Fremantle, and a canal through the sandbar for ease of access for boats.
?
*The source seems to be unsure about whether it was Class A reserve in 1905 or 1907. This should be reflected in the article
*Probably worth clarifying that the controller in
George Randell, then controller of river traffic
was because of his being in-charge/owning rather than as some some of official position (in other words paraphrase the source more)
*
By 1915, a tramway had been constructed between Canning Road and Point Walter, which was not considered a success as it rarely ran at a profit except during summer months, and closed down soon after the 1950s. Further troubles came from the Depression of the 1930s
The tram shut down in the 1950s, right? So how is that further troubles of the depression in the 1930s?
*
to the point where in 1950 the matter had to be addressed in The West Australian
What does this mean?
*Not sure why these are two sections as they feel pretty connected. If kept seperate order should be flipped so it goes from the general (Geography) to the specific (Sandbar).
*You might want to alternate some of your pictures to the left side
*The panoramic picture is such that you might not also want the bird life picture so close to it.
*Thanks for going and taking several of the photographs yourself.
*Most of the Melville City links are dead. Guessing they've just been renamed?
http://wcit.wa.edu.au/WCIT/media/WCIT-Media-library/Images/About%20Us/Mooro-Boodjar.pdf is also showing dead
Can JoshMuirWikipedia or other interested editor confirm they are interested in going through the GA review process? Best, Barkeep49 ( talk) 21:53, 18 May 2018 (UTC)
@ JoshMuirWikipedia: Think the stuff beyond the quality of writing has all been addressed except for one point in History. Thanks for your work on that. I will go through sometime today or tomorrow to identify passages whose writing could be improved. Best, Barkeep49 ( talk) 18:57, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
The lack of signing in the review comments and answers - difficult to quickly appraise who is saying what - if it is a reviewer and the main editor - then a signature could help. Even if it is not usual practice JarrahTree 03:33, 25 May 2018 (UTC
JarrahTree I'm not sure how much familiarity you have with GA review but is designed to be a "lightweight" process, conducted by a single reviewer and as many editors of the article as are interested. I think I already fall on the more demanding side of GA reviews as compared to some other reviews I've seen (which is not a criticism, just a note of the varying styles). All that said, I appreciate our (yours, mine, Josh's) commitment to making this the best article possible. I believe my concerns have all been addressed. If there are things which concern you I would encourage you to make the changes directly and note them as I think this article is close to being ready, in my mind, to passing. Best, Barkeep49 ( talk) 21:47, 25 May 2018 (UTC)
I came to pass this and starting to read it over decided I would feel more comfortable if another reviewer weighed in on criteria 1a before passing. I worry that I have just become too close to the text to evaluate it at this point. Best, Barkeep49 ( talk) 15:34, 26 May 2018 (UTC)
@ Gog the Mild: I was hoping for another person with review experience so yes I'd welcome your second opinion. Best, Barkeep49 ( talk) 13:33, 2 June 2018 (UTC)
Thanks Gog the Mild for your work and the pinging of JoshMuirWikipedia and Jorrah Tree. I have wanted to wait an appropriate length of time, however my general feeling has been that given the second opinion offered by Gog on the prose, that this GA is ready to close as a pass. My thought is to continue to wait a couple more days before passing if there is no explicit confirmation that everyone is pleased. Best, Best, Barkeep49 ( talk) 20:36, 7 June 2018 (UTC)
Point Walter has been listed as one of the
Geography and places good articles under the
good article criteria. If you can improve it further,
please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can
reassess it. Review: June 9, 2018. ( Reviewed version). |
This article is rated GA-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Is the photo really from Mosman Park?? The spit and jetty look too close - more like the view from the path along Blackwall Reach.
Point Walter had major Aboriginal significance - does anyone have the information to put in at least the name, maybe some of the story?
There's also really interesting European history - using the spit to land cargo (I think Walter Padbury was here??), and the picnics from Fremantle.
Callophylla 11:01, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
the best Battye title so far is
Author Turner, Ric. Title Point Walter : a history from 1827 to 1986 / by Ric Turner for Ministry of Sport and Recreation. Published Perth, W.A. : Ministry of Sport and Recreation, 1990. ISBN 0730939510 Note First published as: Point Walter : a history from corroboree to cup. 1986. Subject Parks -- Western Australia -- Bicton -- History. Point Walter Reserve (Bicton, W.A.) -- History.
oh well that one anyway SatuSuro 13:42, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
MY FAMILY LIVED AT PT WALTER AFTER ARRIVING IN AUSTRALIA IN 1842. SAMUEL CAPORN. hIS SONS DUG THROUGH THE BANK TO TAKE 2 MILE OFF THEIR TRIP TO FREO. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.7.70.121 ( talk) 12:12, 16 March 2010 (UTC)
Yes my sixth great grandfather Samuel Caporn lived at point Walter. The caporns ran the first ferry service to perth and to fremantle. The Caporn boys tried exploding their way through the sand bar but the up keep was too hard so they soon gave up. I don't see why the name of Point Walter can't be petitioned to be changed to reflect on the Caporn family and the impact they had on the area, rather then naming it after a useless favourite brother. No one would even be able to tell you why it is called Point Walter. Happy days :-) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gavinjamescaporn ( talk • contribs) 12:35, 8 May 2013 (UTC)
I've added a reference for the YAC It Up concert, but this 2009 page on the City of Melville website suggest that the concert is no longer held. Specifically (I've added the emphasis here):
The one-off funding has been made available this year in a bid to support a series of smaller, grass-roots community projects instead of the once-yearly YAC It Up outdoor concert at Point Walter.
I can't find any more recent reference to the concert, either indicating that it still happens every year, or that it does not. Mitch Ames ( talk) 08:20, 26 October 2013 (UTC)
GA toolbox |
---|
Reviewing |
Reviewer: Barkeep49 ( talk · contribs) 21:53, 18 May 2018 (UTC)
So I did some clean-up in the lead but large sections of this article reads awkwardly to me. Not grammatically incorrect, just awkwardly. Having done GAs for articles written in both Candian and British English (in addition to my own American English) and having spent some time in Australia I don't think it's that it's a different kind of English. A more experienced/better copy editor would likely have more insightful comments.
Point Walter was named in honour of Sir James Stirling's brother, Walter Stirling, in 1827 during his survey of suitable spots for settlement along the Swan River.I might try cleaning that up to something like
During his survey of suitable spots along the Swan River, Sir James Stirling named Point Walter after his brother, Walter Stirling.
I don' think it's "reasonably well-written" (criteria 1a) right now. Fixing more of article would be beyond what I'm willing to do as part of a GA. I know you waited about 6 months for this review so I'm hesitant to ask you to wait longer for someone at WP:GCE to do a pass, though they would probably do the best. What I can do is offer you the sentences which read awkwardly and let you have a go at improving. If this is OK I'll make a list of such sentences. Let me know which option you'd prefer (waiting for GCE or doing it yourself).
*Both here, in the first sentence even, and later on it says that this place is notable for the sandbar, but in neither place is there a reference for this assertion. One isn't needed here, but it does need to be referenced somewhere.
*I did an attempt at some editing for clarity in the second paragraph of the LEAD. Thoughts are welcome.
... initially removed by Mitch Ames, I have reinstated it ...— Could you include links to the initial removal and reinstatement. Mitch Ames ( talk) 03:16, 27 May 2018 (UTC)
Through a series of events, the point suffered a drop in patronage from the late 19th century to World War II.", but "a series of events" here is so vague as to be meaningless. What events? " Teasers ... that ... omit crucial details ... should never be used on Wikipedia.". I suggest deleting "Through a series of events, ". Mitch Ames ( talk) 03:31, 27 May 2018 (UTC)
*Source for
It was a place traditionally for women and children, but when
through the end of the paragraph?
*When did Lionel Lukin and Alfred Waylen acquire the land?
*Source(s) for
Point Walter was named in honour of Sir James Stirling's brother, Walter Stirling, in 1827 during his survey of suitable spots for settlement along the Swan River. The land was then acquired by the settlers Lionel Lukin and Alfred Waylen. After acquiring the land, Waylen developed it by building a villa in 1830 which later burnt down, and in 1831 his land was extended 700 more acres to include part of the suburb to which he is the namesake, Alfred Cove. During his time at Point Walter Waylen constructed an inn known as "The Halfway House" due to its location between Perth and Fremantle, and a canal through the sandbar for ease of access for boats.
?
*The source seems to be unsure about whether it was Class A reserve in 1905 or 1907. This should be reflected in the article
*Probably worth clarifying that the controller in
George Randell, then controller of river traffic
was because of his being in-charge/owning rather than as some some of official position (in other words paraphrase the source more)
*
By 1915, a tramway had been constructed between Canning Road and Point Walter, which was not considered a success as it rarely ran at a profit except during summer months, and closed down soon after the 1950s. Further troubles came from the Depression of the 1930s
The tram shut down in the 1950s, right? So how is that further troubles of the depression in the 1930s?
*
to the point where in 1950 the matter had to be addressed in The West Australian
What does this mean?
*Not sure why these are two sections as they feel pretty connected. If kept seperate order should be flipped so it goes from the general (Geography) to the specific (Sandbar).
*You might want to alternate some of your pictures to the left side
*The panoramic picture is such that you might not also want the bird life picture so close to it.
*Thanks for going and taking several of the photographs yourself.
*Most of the Melville City links are dead. Guessing they've just been renamed?
http://wcit.wa.edu.au/WCIT/media/WCIT-Media-library/Images/About%20Us/Mooro-Boodjar.pdf is also showing dead
Can JoshMuirWikipedia or other interested editor confirm they are interested in going through the GA review process? Best, Barkeep49 ( talk) 21:53, 18 May 2018 (UTC)
@ JoshMuirWikipedia: Think the stuff beyond the quality of writing has all been addressed except for one point in History. Thanks for your work on that. I will go through sometime today or tomorrow to identify passages whose writing could be improved. Best, Barkeep49 ( talk) 18:57, 24 May 2018 (UTC)
The lack of signing in the review comments and answers - difficult to quickly appraise who is saying what - if it is a reviewer and the main editor - then a signature could help. Even if it is not usual practice JarrahTree 03:33, 25 May 2018 (UTC
JarrahTree I'm not sure how much familiarity you have with GA review but is designed to be a "lightweight" process, conducted by a single reviewer and as many editors of the article as are interested. I think I already fall on the more demanding side of GA reviews as compared to some other reviews I've seen (which is not a criticism, just a note of the varying styles). All that said, I appreciate our (yours, mine, Josh's) commitment to making this the best article possible. I believe my concerns have all been addressed. If there are things which concern you I would encourage you to make the changes directly and note them as I think this article is close to being ready, in my mind, to passing. Best, Barkeep49 ( talk) 21:47, 25 May 2018 (UTC)
I came to pass this and starting to read it over decided I would feel more comfortable if another reviewer weighed in on criteria 1a before passing. I worry that I have just become too close to the text to evaluate it at this point. Best, Barkeep49 ( talk) 15:34, 26 May 2018 (UTC)
@ Gog the Mild: I was hoping for another person with review experience so yes I'd welcome your second opinion. Best, Barkeep49 ( talk) 13:33, 2 June 2018 (UTC)
Thanks Gog the Mild for your work and the pinging of JoshMuirWikipedia and Jorrah Tree. I have wanted to wait an appropriate length of time, however my general feeling has been that given the second opinion offered by Gog on the prose, that this GA is ready to close as a pass. My thought is to continue to wait a couple more days before passing if there is no explicit confirmation that everyone is pleased. Best, Best, Barkeep49 ( talk) 20:36, 7 June 2018 (UTC)