This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||
|
The entire two sections on the Wells Outfit and Frederick Burnham have one glaring omission. If Wells and Burnham, by extension, were drawn into the feud, on whose side did they act? Both Grahams and Tewksburys were cattle ranchers, so the directive by the creditors to drive away the opposition's cattle does not clarify the issue. Who were the creditors? Grahams? Or Tewksburys? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 165.189.21.155 ( talk) 15:23, 19 October 2010 (UTC)
The tone of this article seems rather inappropriate for an encyclopedic article. It frequently engages in editorializing and subjective judgements. Nikkimaria ( talk) 16:39, 12 October 2013 (UTC)
Burnham's story is colorful and of the times, but is hardly the template upon which to frame this article. Eliminate it and his photo completely and offer his book as further reading. NO historians of this conflict have ever given it such prominence (this is the first I've ever seen of his face) and thus this article is not only off the track, but it is totally out of whack. More about Globe than Pleasant Valley. Globe was a hell hole, too. Politics and mining polluting the typical deadly fare of a rustling range war; see Clara Woody.
My own GGpa was on the Tewksbury's side; George Wilson, an orphaned minor. Ed Tewksbury worked for George's legal guardian/brother-in-law, George Newton, at Wilson's Ranch. This is called the "Middleton Ranch" made famous for the Apache raids that persuaded that family to sell to ours, and then this gunfight in 1887. Newton and JJ Vosburg hired Tom Horn to take care of the Flying V nearby after the shepherd got shot. The Grahams and those Blevins rustlers were clearing the valley for themselves after the Blevin's pa went missing (Tom Horn's work?) We'd already lost a breed mare to that crew and the court had proven itself useless. We stood our bloody ground. Forrest's "Arizona's Dark and Bloody Ground" was the most famous of the older books and leans on the Youngs and Hashknives to tell a Graham biased tale.
Don Dedera's book, "A Little War of Our Own," is the most comprehensive, but reads like a jumbled jewelry box for all its darling details. Perhaps Clara Woody's book with Milton Schwartz, "Globe, Arizona" is the best source as it's Part Two is titled "WAR IN PLEASANT VALLEY" and attempts chronology; however, she is a Tewksbury partisan. So am I.
But, whether a Graham, Blevins or a Tewksbury sider, NONE would say Burnham's is the story to lead the way. It's a box canyon with a fancy shmancy name like Remington's that deserves to get shot down. Dedera's book is the best for citations, and it's footnotes and bibliography are essential to any student of this war. Hanchett's books are good, but he's a Graham sider looking for conspiracies to excuse the Grahams and Blevins' wrong doings.
Take down that folly of a detour and restore the story to its established glory. It was a bloody hell that left your palms stained with spots if you got out alive. Burnham only WISHED he was involved, the blood sucking profiteer. He was just cashing in on the nationally recognized horror of it all. Participants kept their mouths shut for a reason.
68.228.220.88 ( talk) 14:50, 27 May 2014 (UTC)
Gordon or Wells, neither name means anything to me. The only folks arguing about those names must descend from their own families. JJ Vosburg was the agent for the Wells Fargo in Globe, but I've never read a word about these folks except for the wasted time spent researching that side canyon. The Pinal Mountains are way south of this action, Jackson. Maybe these scrabblers worked for Pringle south of Newton's drift fence, but Newton's range lay to the north on the reservation east of the Sierra Anchas. These licenses to graze the Apache ranges were VERY valuable, which is why some suggest Pringle was shot at Vosburg's, and Newton was to disappear later, if we can believe the papers.
I appreciate telling this story fairly is a multifaceted gem of a hard rock to crack, but to lay down as our foundation the worst sold side of this tale suggests a detail to protect the truly guilty. It makes the entire effort a waste of time to balance. I would do so if it were firmly biased (and this does come off very hard on the Tewksburys in the classic racist way of those times) but this is really beyond repair. No one even knows who he's talking about!! I may hang a Disputed on it one day, but I've learned to save my conflicts for better purposes. This is lacking in most of the finest characters and their details. Many statements are simply wrong, such as the assertion the Grahams showed the Tewksburys to Pleasant Valley. Errors such as these are so numerous, I can't even suggest a salvage. I would enjoy participating in a telling which takes in many PsOV as this conflict was a microcosm of most complex conflicts, economic, political, with tribes, bands, and clans clashing against others' interests as well. The star of the whole show is the Tonto. The land that drove men to murder many more times than these, just ask the Apaches.
"The conflict was commonly thought to be an Arizona sheep war". Since this is wrong, why not delete it? Why would it be necessary to include someone's ignorance about this subject in an Encyclopedia? Shouldn't the article just state the facts: that it was a territorial conflict between two families, over grazing land? Senor Cuete ( talk) 15:09, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
I have recently expanded half of the subsections and fixed the referenes. 112.198.64.48 ( talk) 18:38, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
There are other images available of participants in the war:
Fletcher Fairchild was a member of Mulvenon's posse and later the first sheriff of Coconino County.
and
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:The_Cow_Boy_1888.jpg#/media/File:Grabill_-_The_Cow_Boy.jpg
According to Arizona author Gladwell "Toney" Richardson, who wrote many historical articles and many dime novels and used pseudonyms like "Maurice Kildare" [1], "The Cow Boy" is an unknown member of w:en:Yavapai County Arizona Sheriff John Mulvenon's posse which was sent twice in 1887 to intervene in the w:en:Pleasant Valley War. This is in a magazine. I'll look it up if anyone's interested. Senor Cuete ( talk) 23:23, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
I have never heard a word about this man regarding the Tonto war, and I have three feet of references. If he came up, he was not found to be much of a source to those who really laid down the law men. Have you never read "A Little War of Our Own?" Ponderous, Little Joey, but exceedingly well cited. Wiki is not the space for details about outliers, outlaws. — Preceding unsigned comment added by TontoGal ( talk • contribs) 14:57, 29 December 2015 (UTC)
The caption under the images of the Flying V cabin state that John Tewksbury Sr. lived there with his two wives, but we never hear of that person again. Later, a John Tewksbury Jr gets murdered next to a cabin. It is unclear which of the two, if any, is the child of the original Ed Tewksbury listed at the beginning of the body of the article.
As for Ed, he had a child named Ed, and yet nowhere in the article is it ever specified if an action is performed by Ed Sr. or Jr. Since ONE Ed was the sole male survivor of the family, that means that the other was killed, meaning neither of the two is irrelevant to the story, meaning we can't just assume that all mentions of Ed are to be understood as meaning Ed Sr.
Some clarity is needed. 37.163.192.27 ( talk) 07:31, 30 December 2022 (UTC)
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||
|
The entire two sections on the Wells Outfit and Frederick Burnham have one glaring omission. If Wells and Burnham, by extension, were drawn into the feud, on whose side did they act? Both Grahams and Tewksburys were cattle ranchers, so the directive by the creditors to drive away the opposition's cattle does not clarify the issue. Who were the creditors? Grahams? Or Tewksburys? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 165.189.21.155 ( talk) 15:23, 19 October 2010 (UTC)
The tone of this article seems rather inappropriate for an encyclopedic article. It frequently engages in editorializing and subjective judgements. Nikkimaria ( talk) 16:39, 12 October 2013 (UTC)
Burnham's story is colorful and of the times, but is hardly the template upon which to frame this article. Eliminate it and his photo completely and offer his book as further reading. NO historians of this conflict have ever given it such prominence (this is the first I've ever seen of his face) and thus this article is not only off the track, but it is totally out of whack. More about Globe than Pleasant Valley. Globe was a hell hole, too. Politics and mining polluting the typical deadly fare of a rustling range war; see Clara Woody.
My own GGpa was on the Tewksbury's side; George Wilson, an orphaned minor. Ed Tewksbury worked for George's legal guardian/brother-in-law, George Newton, at Wilson's Ranch. This is called the "Middleton Ranch" made famous for the Apache raids that persuaded that family to sell to ours, and then this gunfight in 1887. Newton and JJ Vosburg hired Tom Horn to take care of the Flying V nearby after the shepherd got shot. The Grahams and those Blevins rustlers were clearing the valley for themselves after the Blevin's pa went missing (Tom Horn's work?) We'd already lost a breed mare to that crew and the court had proven itself useless. We stood our bloody ground. Forrest's "Arizona's Dark and Bloody Ground" was the most famous of the older books and leans on the Youngs and Hashknives to tell a Graham biased tale.
Don Dedera's book, "A Little War of Our Own," is the most comprehensive, but reads like a jumbled jewelry box for all its darling details. Perhaps Clara Woody's book with Milton Schwartz, "Globe, Arizona" is the best source as it's Part Two is titled "WAR IN PLEASANT VALLEY" and attempts chronology; however, she is a Tewksbury partisan. So am I.
But, whether a Graham, Blevins or a Tewksbury sider, NONE would say Burnham's is the story to lead the way. It's a box canyon with a fancy shmancy name like Remington's that deserves to get shot down. Dedera's book is the best for citations, and it's footnotes and bibliography are essential to any student of this war. Hanchett's books are good, but he's a Graham sider looking for conspiracies to excuse the Grahams and Blevins' wrong doings.
Take down that folly of a detour and restore the story to its established glory. It was a bloody hell that left your palms stained with spots if you got out alive. Burnham only WISHED he was involved, the blood sucking profiteer. He was just cashing in on the nationally recognized horror of it all. Participants kept their mouths shut for a reason.
68.228.220.88 ( talk) 14:50, 27 May 2014 (UTC)
Gordon or Wells, neither name means anything to me. The only folks arguing about those names must descend from their own families. JJ Vosburg was the agent for the Wells Fargo in Globe, but I've never read a word about these folks except for the wasted time spent researching that side canyon. The Pinal Mountains are way south of this action, Jackson. Maybe these scrabblers worked for Pringle south of Newton's drift fence, but Newton's range lay to the north on the reservation east of the Sierra Anchas. These licenses to graze the Apache ranges were VERY valuable, which is why some suggest Pringle was shot at Vosburg's, and Newton was to disappear later, if we can believe the papers.
I appreciate telling this story fairly is a multifaceted gem of a hard rock to crack, but to lay down as our foundation the worst sold side of this tale suggests a detail to protect the truly guilty. It makes the entire effort a waste of time to balance. I would do so if it were firmly biased (and this does come off very hard on the Tewksburys in the classic racist way of those times) but this is really beyond repair. No one even knows who he's talking about!! I may hang a Disputed on it one day, but I've learned to save my conflicts for better purposes. This is lacking in most of the finest characters and their details. Many statements are simply wrong, such as the assertion the Grahams showed the Tewksburys to Pleasant Valley. Errors such as these are so numerous, I can't even suggest a salvage. I would enjoy participating in a telling which takes in many PsOV as this conflict was a microcosm of most complex conflicts, economic, political, with tribes, bands, and clans clashing against others' interests as well. The star of the whole show is the Tonto. The land that drove men to murder many more times than these, just ask the Apaches.
"The conflict was commonly thought to be an Arizona sheep war". Since this is wrong, why not delete it? Why would it be necessary to include someone's ignorance about this subject in an Encyclopedia? Shouldn't the article just state the facts: that it was a territorial conflict between two families, over grazing land? Senor Cuete ( talk) 15:09, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
I have recently expanded half of the subsections and fixed the referenes. 112.198.64.48 ( talk) 18:38, 21 March 2015 (UTC)
There are other images available of participants in the war:
Fletcher Fairchild was a member of Mulvenon's posse and later the first sheriff of Coconino County.
and
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:The_Cow_Boy_1888.jpg#/media/File:Grabill_-_The_Cow_Boy.jpg
According to Arizona author Gladwell "Toney" Richardson, who wrote many historical articles and many dime novels and used pseudonyms like "Maurice Kildare" [1], "The Cow Boy" is an unknown member of w:en:Yavapai County Arizona Sheriff John Mulvenon's posse which was sent twice in 1887 to intervene in the w:en:Pleasant Valley War. This is in a magazine. I'll look it up if anyone's interested. Senor Cuete ( talk) 23:23, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
I have never heard a word about this man regarding the Tonto war, and I have three feet of references. If he came up, he was not found to be much of a source to those who really laid down the law men. Have you never read "A Little War of Our Own?" Ponderous, Little Joey, but exceedingly well cited. Wiki is not the space for details about outliers, outlaws. — Preceding unsigned comment added by TontoGal ( talk • contribs) 14:57, 29 December 2015 (UTC)
The caption under the images of the Flying V cabin state that John Tewksbury Sr. lived there with his two wives, but we never hear of that person again. Later, a John Tewksbury Jr gets murdered next to a cabin. It is unclear which of the two, if any, is the child of the original Ed Tewksbury listed at the beginning of the body of the article.
As for Ed, he had a child named Ed, and yet nowhere in the article is it ever specified if an action is performed by Ed Sr. or Jr. Since ONE Ed was the sole male survivor of the family, that means that the other was killed, meaning neither of the two is irrelevant to the story, meaning we can't just assume that all mentions of Ed are to be understood as meaning Ed Sr.
Some clarity is needed. 37.163.192.27 ( talk) 07:31, 30 December 2022 (UTC)