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Outlands was nominated for deletion. The discussion was closed on 16 April 2016 with a consensus to merge. Its contents were merged into Planescape. The original page is now a redirect to this page. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected article, please see its history; for its talk page, see here. |
This page needs major rewrites. If anyone stumbles upon this page please help me out here. 204.210.16.56
Also: You're missing the Audio CD and it's accompanying Accessory (The Player's Primer to the Outlands [2610]) 75.92.217.27 ( talk) 01:28, 22 May 2013 (UTC)
Ok people who actually edit this page, there needs to be some kind of precedent for the Outer Plane pages. What's going to be the precedent here? (Outer Plane)? (fictional land)? disambig. pages? response requested. Shoecream 07:28, Mar 28, 2004 (UTC)
This isn't the current state of the PS campaign setting, at least w/r/t the factions, but most people play in pre-FW PS. Should this be updated? taion 09:38, 9 Aug 2004 (UTC)
I'd like to make some sort of box for the Planescape articles, see History of the United States and Boldog for examples. What do you guys think? Should I do a footer box (like the boldog one) or vertical box? Should I even make one? Sepearate ones for the Outer Planes? I'd appreciate all kinds of discussion about this topic here. — Shoecream 04:02, Feb 10, 2005 (UTC)
The article says the Planescape setting "encompasses all of the other Dungeons and Dragons worlds", which was true when the setting came out, but isn't any more (Krynn and Toril have entirely different cosmologies in 3rd edition, which possibly link through the Plane of Shadow). Does this need clarified?
The following information from page 13 and 14 of the Spelljammer book "The Complete Spacefarer's Handbook" may help with any comments about Athas and Ravenloft.
This suggests that spacefarers don't know how to get to Athas and no Athasians know how to get into wildspace, but doesn't say that it is impossible. Similar logic must apply to Planescape - Athas would probably be a place that you can't easily find. Dark Sun must be mentioned somewhere. You need to hunt for a reference in one of its products. Why not try to Planescape mailing list? They might be able to help.
This means that all of the (prime) material plane (except the phlogiston) can be connected to Ravenloft. I can see how upper and lower planes might have special relationships which block or aid into Ravenloft, but can't see why the transitive planes would block travel. Again the Planescape mailing list may help you find a reference in one of your books. Any travel into Ravenloft would be one way travel, so I wouldn't expect planewalkers to have much knowledge of the plane.
As for Spelljammer and Planescape, you might want to refer to the Pirates of Gith. These creatures live on the Astral Plane and make raids into the wildspace of the (prime) material plane. They are always eager to steal the living ships of the Elven Navy as they have the ability to planeshift the entire ship into the astral plane. Spelljammer also features organisations called Planar Churches (which would seem to be Planewalker friendly), however as Spelljammer predates Planescape no proper connection with Planewalking organisations on those planes was made in a SJ product. You might be able to find references to the Planar Churches in Planescape documents.
Good luck! Big Mac 22:31, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
Just editing out some links that just redirect to this page. Kind of pointless to have them redirect to themselves. Whispering 02:54, 6 December 2005 (UTC)
Does anyone know where there is any information on the Cant? It's a pretty essential part of the setting.-- 69.166.45.32 23:37, 27 December 2005 (UTC)
Yes, I posted Cant definitions here: http://swiftbow.comicgenesis.com/About.html#Cant Should this be merged onto the main Planescape page? Swiftbow 06:26, 4 February 2006 (UTC)
Maybe a picture of the Planescape universe should be added?
I have a picture, but it is a scan from the 2nd edition AD&D DMG. Does that violate wikipedia copyright restrictions, even if it is properly credited? Swiftbow 06:33, 4 February 2006 (UTC)
I have the picture as well, I think it should be added. -- Karimi 18:50, 4 February 2006 (UTC)
OK, I went ahead and uploaded it. Not sure I entered the licensing correctly... if not, fixing is good ;) Swiftbow 05:06, 17 February 2006 (UTC)
Great pic, the only problem with it is that Sigil isn't there.-- Karimi 06:26, 17 February 2006 (UTC)
Hm... does yours have Sigil? Maybe we should post that too/instead. Swiftbow 22:23, 17 February 2006 (UTC)
Sorry I took so long to reply , been busy. Anyway, I have a poster that looks exactly like the one at this site : http://reicher.neostrada.pl/download/maps/Outlands.jpg I think its a better pic, more detailed and has Sigil.-- Karimi 02:34, 6 March 2006 (UTC)
This seems like a horrible idea - they are an entire seperate thought, though derived from this universe.
Just for clarification. The concept of the Multiverse in D&D is different to the fictional concept of Parallel Universes. The intention behind a multiverse in D&D is that each DM can have his own universe, allowing him to have any aspect desired in there without infringing upon the worlds of someone else. In this context they are not necessarily "Parallel" to each other (ie they dont have to be similar at all) while it is not excluded. A prime example of this is the Dark Sun setting which is said to be in a different universe to the Forgotten Realms. If the term "multiverse" was described using the Parallel Universes theory then it would indicate that a "similar" world such as Athas would exist in the Forgotten Realms setting. This is not the case and neither universe is known to overlap at all. Enigmatical 05:02, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
Either way, it is still correct to use the term Multiverse and not Parallel Universes as in no D&D literature at all is it stated that all universes are a copy of the others with slight variations. Instead thy are all considered extremely distinct and different, thus allowing each DM to make his own universe the way he sees fit. Enigmatical 22:49, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
The majority of the external links on here are to fan sites or resource portals. Could someone go through the list and reduce it (to a max of about four)? Chris Cunningham 15:32, 5 July 2006 (UTC)
Below are "geocities" pages. The way they are served up it's hard to tell if the pages are technically "abandoned" as the last modified date is not accurate. If you believe these sites contain quality content wikipedia-worthy then please put your reasoning here and move the link back into the main article.
Breno 17:19, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
(*
Planescape Survival Guide, ongoing online webcomic
This site is not down. It has two URLs, the above, and http://swiftbow.comicgenesis.com, which the first redirects to. I know, because it is my comic.
You also gave no justification for removing the official Wizards/TSR comic (* Unity of the Rings Online Planescape Comic) which is very indicative of the setting, and very useful to new players, or anyone curious about Planescape in general. Swiftbow 06:54, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
the planescape sects page has been deleted, it should have been merged here if nothing else
Is it worth noting that Baldur's Gate II and its expansion have some references to the Planescape setting?
"As its name suggests, [...], as originally developed in the Manual of the Planes by Jeff Grubb." Planescape existed during D&D 2e, well before the Manual of the Plane (unless the first edition of the book is refered, which should be mentionned, then, because the links is to the a page that only mentions briefly a previous Manual of the Planes.). This statement strikes me as a little odd.
Lunargent 16:26, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
Should the article mention this petition with 3K signatures?
http://www.petition online.com/ps35esns/petition.html
Mathiastck 22:27, 29 August 2007 (UTC)
This article feels like it's missing some things.
-- Daeval ( talk) 21:34, 10 January 2008 (UTC)
I think the most glaring omission is a failure to disclose what platforms the game was available for. -Anon —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
66.100.224.95 (
talk) 01:12, 26 July 2009 (UTC)
i had to edit another posters post about a petition above to get this page to save. it seems the site in question if blocked from being added to pages and prevents pages from being edited with it in them. i didn't delete the link entirely, but changed it. shadzar- talk 15:37, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
There are no reliable source cited as evidence of notability.Please resotre the notability cleanup tempate.-- Gavin Collins ( talk) 00:26, 21 April 2008 (UTC)
Okay, so a couple editors are complaining about self-promotion and COI (conflict of interest?). As far as an edit war, the revisions past the first weren't from my computer. I do believe the link is relevant in any case, as one of the edits said, it is the only active Planescape related comic, with support from a large number of Planescape fans, niche market though they may be. I am well aware of the notability, no collection of links, etc. issues on wikipedia, but I don't think they apply in this case. I haven't wantonly posted it on the webcomic list page, for example, even though I think it is very close to meeting the notability guidelines.
In any case, I think the justification lies heavily in the fact that people navigating to this page are looking for information on the Planescape topic, which can be rather limited at best. Do not external links exist expressly for the purpose of providing further reading to users beyond the scope of wikipedia? Hell, a previous user even trimmed the Unity of Rings comic (a one-shot story), a completely official publication of TSR.
Anyway, I'm going to leave the external links alone while I wait for a response, but I think the rampant trimming of the external links needs just as much justification as me wanting it there, author of the comic or no. Swiftbow ( talk) 06:16, 23 January 2009 (UTC)
"Published material" section states that the setting "has since been updated in the 3rd Edition Manual of the Planes, the 3.5 Edition Dungeon Master's Guide, and the Planar Handbook in 2004". It's only partially true. The new materials were not a part of the Planescape line, which no longer existed at this point. It's writing style was also different and some concepts (like relations between the Etheral Plane and the Inner Planes) were changed. It probably should be considered as derivative work, not as a part of the setting. -- 79.189.158.98 ( talk) 23:00, 24 December 2010 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Planescape. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||
|
Outlands was nominated for deletion. The discussion was closed on 16 April 2016 with a consensus to merge. Its contents were merged into Planescape. The original page is now a redirect to this page. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected article, please see its history; for its talk page, see here. |
This page needs major rewrites. If anyone stumbles upon this page please help me out here. 204.210.16.56
Also: You're missing the Audio CD and it's accompanying Accessory (The Player's Primer to the Outlands [2610]) 75.92.217.27 ( talk) 01:28, 22 May 2013 (UTC)
Ok people who actually edit this page, there needs to be some kind of precedent for the Outer Plane pages. What's going to be the precedent here? (Outer Plane)? (fictional land)? disambig. pages? response requested. Shoecream 07:28, Mar 28, 2004 (UTC)
This isn't the current state of the PS campaign setting, at least w/r/t the factions, but most people play in pre-FW PS. Should this be updated? taion 09:38, 9 Aug 2004 (UTC)
I'd like to make some sort of box for the Planescape articles, see History of the United States and Boldog for examples. What do you guys think? Should I do a footer box (like the boldog one) or vertical box? Should I even make one? Sepearate ones for the Outer Planes? I'd appreciate all kinds of discussion about this topic here. — Shoecream 04:02, Feb 10, 2005 (UTC)
The article says the Planescape setting "encompasses all of the other Dungeons and Dragons worlds", which was true when the setting came out, but isn't any more (Krynn and Toril have entirely different cosmologies in 3rd edition, which possibly link through the Plane of Shadow). Does this need clarified?
The following information from page 13 and 14 of the Spelljammer book "The Complete Spacefarer's Handbook" may help with any comments about Athas and Ravenloft.
This suggests that spacefarers don't know how to get to Athas and no Athasians know how to get into wildspace, but doesn't say that it is impossible. Similar logic must apply to Planescape - Athas would probably be a place that you can't easily find. Dark Sun must be mentioned somewhere. You need to hunt for a reference in one of its products. Why not try to Planescape mailing list? They might be able to help.
This means that all of the (prime) material plane (except the phlogiston) can be connected to Ravenloft. I can see how upper and lower planes might have special relationships which block or aid into Ravenloft, but can't see why the transitive planes would block travel. Again the Planescape mailing list may help you find a reference in one of your books. Any travel into Ravenloft would be one way travel, so I wouldn't expect planewalkers to have much knowledge of the plane.
As for Spelljammer and Planescape, you might want to refer to the Pirates of Gith. These creatures live on the Astral Plane and make raids into the wildspace of the (prime) material plane. They are always eager to steal the living ships of the Elven Navy as they have the ability to planeshift the entire ship into the astral plane. Spelljammer also features organisations called Planar Churches (which would seem to be Planewalker friendly), however as Spelljammer predates Planescape no proper connection with Planewalking organisations on those planes was made in a SJ product. You might be able to find references to the Planar Churches in Planescape documents.
Good luck! Big Mac 22:31, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
Just editing out some links that just redirect to this page. Kind of pointless to have them redirect to themselves. Whispering 02:54, 6 December 2005 (UTC)
Does anyone know where there is any information on the Cant? It's a pretty essential part of the setting.-- 69.166.45.32 23:37, 27 December 2005 (UTC)
Yes, I posted Cant definitions here: http://swiftbow.comicgenesis.com/About.html#Cant Should this be merged onto the main Planescape page? Swiftbow 06:26, 4 February 2006 (UTC)
Maybe a picture of the Planescape universe should be added?
I have a picture, but it is a scan from the 2nd edition AD&D DMG. Does that violate wikipedia copyright restrictions, even if it is properly credited? Swiftbow 06:33, 4 February 2006 (UTC)
I have the picture as well, I think it should be added. -- Karimi 18:50, 4 February 2006 (UTC)
OK, I went ahead and uploaded it. Not sure I entered the licensing correctly... if not, fixing is good ;) Swiftbow 05:06, 17 February 2006 (UTC)
Great pic, the only problem with it is that Sigil isn't there.-- Karimi 06:26, 17 February 2006 (UTC)
Hm... does yours have Sigil? Maybe we should post that too/instead. Swiftbow 22:23, 17 February 2006 (UTC)
Sorry I took so long to reply , been busy. Anyway, I have a poster that looks exactly like the one at this site : http://reicher.neostrada.pl/download/maps/Outlands.jpg I think its a better pic, more detailed and has Sigil.-- Karimi 02:34, 6 March 2006 (UTC)
This seems like a horrible idea - they are an entire seperate thought, though derived from this universe.
Just for clarification. The concept of the Multiverse in D&D is different to the fictional concept of Parallel Universes. The intention behind a multiverse in D&D is that each DM can have his own universe, allowing him to have any aspect desired in there without infringing upon the worlds of someone else. In this context they are not necessarily "Parallel" to each other (ie they dont have to be similar at all) while it is not excluded. A prime example of this is the Dark Sun setting which is said to be in a different universe to the Forgotten Realms. If the term "multiverse" was described using the Parallel Universes theory then it would indicate that a "similar" world such as Athas would exist in the Forgotten Realms setting. This is not the case and neither universe is known to overlap at all. Enigmatical 05:02, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
Either way, it is still correct to use the term Multiverse and not Parallel Universes as in no D&D literature at all is it stated that all universes are a copy of the others with slight variations. Instead thy are all considered extremely distinct and different, thus allowing each DM to make his own universe the way he sees fit. Enigmatical 22:49, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
The majority of the external links on here are to fan sites or resource portals. Could someone go through the list and reduce it (to a max of about four)? Chris Cunningham 15:32, 5 July 2006 (UTC)
Below are "geocities" pages. The way they are served up it's hard to tell if the pages are technically "abandoned" as the last modified date is not accurate. If you believe these sites contain quality content wikipedia-worthy then please put your reasoning here and move the link back into the main article.
Breno 17:19, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
(*
Planescape Survival Guide, ongoing online webcomic
This site is not down. It has two URLs, the above, and http://swiftbow.comicgenesis.com, which the first redirects to. I know, because it is my comic.
You also gave no justification for removing the official Wizards/TSR comic (* Unity of the Rings Online Planescape Comic) which is very indicative of the setting, and very useful to new players, or anyone curious about Planescape in general. Swiftbow 06:54, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
the planescape sects page has been deleted, it should have been merged here if nothing else
Is it worth noting that Baldur's Gate II and its expansion have some references to the Planescape setting?
"As its name suggests, [...], as originally developed in the Manual of the Planes by Jeff Grubb." Planescape existed during D&D 2e, well before the Manual of the Plane (unless the first edition of the book is refered, which should be mentionned, then, because the links is to the a page that only mentions briefly a previous Manual of the Planes.). This statement strikes me as a little odd.
Lunargent 16:26, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
Should the article mention this petition with 3K signatures?
http://www.petition online.com/ps35esns/petition.html
Mathiastck 22:27, 29 August 2007 (UTC)
This article feels like it's missing some things.
-- Daeval ( talk) 21:34, 10 January 2008 (UTC)
I think the most glaring omission is a failure to disclose what platforms the game was available for. -Anon —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
66.100.224.95 (
talk) 01:12, 26 July 2009 (UTC)
i had to edit another posters post about a petition above to get this page to save. it seems the site in question if blocked from being added to pages and prevents pages from being edited with it in them. i didn't delete the link entirely, but changed it. shadzar- talk 15:37, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
There are no reliable source cited as evidence of notability.Please resotre the notability cleanup tempate.-- Gavin Collins ( talk) 00:26, 21 April 2008 (UTC)
Okay, so a couple editors are complaining about self-promotion and COI (conflict of interest?). As far as an edit war, the revisions past the first weren't from my computer. I do believe the link is relevant in any case, as one of the edits said, it is the only active Planescape related comic, with support from a large number of Planescape fans, niche market though they may be. I am well aware of the notability, no collection of links, etc. issues on wikipedia, but I don't think they apply in this case. I haven't wantonly posted it on the webcomic list page, for example, even though I think it is very close to meeting the notability guidelines.
In any case, I think the justification lies heavily in the fact that people navigating to this page are looking for information on the Planescape topic, which can be rather limited at best. Do not external links exist expressly for the purpose of providing further reading to users beyond the scope of wikipedia? Hell, a previous user even trimmed the Unity of Rings comic (a one-shot story), a completely official publication of TSR.
Anyway, I'm going to leave the external links alone while I wait for a response, but I think the rampant trimming of the external links needs just as much justification as me wanting it there, author of the comic or no. Swiftbow ( talk) 06:16, 23 January 2009 (UTC)
"Published material" section states that the setting "has since been updated in the 3rd Edition Manual of the Planes, the 3.5 Edition Dungeon Master's Guide, and the Planar Handbook in 2004". It's only partially true. The new materials were not a part of the Planescape line, which no longer existed at this point. It's writing style was also different and some concepts (like relations between the Etheral Plane and the Inner Planes) were changed. It probably should be considered as derivative work, not as a part of the setting. -- 79.189.158.98 ( talk) 23:00, 24 December 2010 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Planescape. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
An editor has reviewed this edit and fixed any errors that were found.
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 10:05, 3 December 2017 (UTC)