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An example of this type appeared in the film
The Shoes of the Fisherman as the Pope's official aircraft. The film itself is the reference for this.
Roger (
talk) 07:08, 21 February 2011 (UTC)reply
See
WP:AIRPOP and
WP:MILPOP for guidelines on determining that. But unless the appearance is especially notable to the aircraft, which must be asserted by a reliable source (not the film itself) I don't see it being notable. -
BilCat (
talk) 09:01, 21 February 2011 (UTC)reply
That's how I read the guidelines too - thanks for the links. It's trivial unless a reliable source makes a big deal of it for whatever reason. So it stays out unless such a source is found - not that I'm going to search for one, I have bigger fish to fry. I just happened to see the movie last night and found this article after googling "Piaggio-Douglas" which was on the fuselage in quite big lettering in the movie. I didn't recognise the type - in the "long shots" it looked to me like a baby Sabreliner.
Roger (
talk) 10:58, 21 February 2011 (UTC)reply
It is a rare appearance of a rare aircraft, as only 24 were buitl, and 22 used by the Italian AIr Force. Are/were you able to get the aircraft registration number? That might help to track down who owned the aircraf tused in the film, be it the IAF or someone else. It's possible an aviation source wrote about it circa 1968, and some searching of online archives might turn up something. "Jack" (I don't remember his username, but I'll try to find it) has done some good work digging up old sources, and he might be able to help. -
BilCat (
talk) 11:08, 21 February 2011 (UTC)reply
Yes that image is definitely from the film. The Papal coat of arms is visible on the forward fuselage, though partly obscured by the wingtip fuel tank.
Roger (
talk) 15:53, 14 March 2011 (UTC)reply
Reliable source
I find it quite ridiculous that the film itself is not an acceptable source for something that appears in the film.
It is exactly analogous to asking for a reference to a quote from a book but prohibiting the use of the book itself as the cite.
If it is the consensus that this film appearance is notable because of the rarity of the aircraft then I don't see why there is a demand for a source outside of the film itself to verify the fact that the aircraft appears in the film.
Notability and verifiability are separate issues.
Roger (
talk) 16:39, 14 March 2011 (UTC)reply
Vespa Jet
Could you tell me where you find the name Vespa Jet in the source?
Franjklogos (
talk) 09:21, 4 March 2019 (UTC)reply
I did an online search and I didn't find any official source referring to Piaggio PD.808 as Vespa Jet... To be honest, I think it's just a nickname given by the editors of the magazine Flight International, or not?
Franjklogos (
talk) 14
05, 4 March 2019 (UTC)
Also appears in flight in 1962
https://www.flightglobal.com/FlightPDFArchive/1962/1962%20-%200367.PDF it is unlikely that Flight would make up names it has no need to. The article does make it clear it was the original name during the development which was presumably dropped and not used when the PD.808 went into production.
MilborneOne (
talk) 16:26, 4 March 2019 (UTC)reply
Who cares? If Flight makes up a nickname, it's likely to stick. BTW - Piaggio split the aircraft and scooter companies apart in 1966, which is well after this.
Andy Dingley (
talk) 17:07, 4 March 2019 (UTC)reply
This article is within the scope of the
Aviation WikiProject. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see lists of
open tasks and
task forces. To use this banner, please see the
full instructions.AviationWikipedia:WikiProject AviationTemplate:WikiProject Aviationaviation articles
This article has been checked against the following criteria for B-class status:
This article is within the scope of the Military history WikiProject. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a
list of open tasks. To use this banner, please see the
full instructions.Military historyWikipedia:WikiProject Military historyTemplate:WikiProject Military historymilitary history articles
This article has been checked against the following criteria for B-class status:
An example of this type appeared in the film
The Shoes of the Fisherman as the Pope's official aircraft. The film itself is the reference for this.
Roger (
talk) 07:08, 21 February 2011 (UTC)reply
See
WP:AIRPOP and
WP:MILPOP for guidelines on determining that. But unless the appearance is especially notable to the aircraft, which must be asserted by a reliable source (not the film itself) I don't see it being notable. -
BilCat (
talk) 09:01, 21 February 2011 (UTC)reply
That's how I read the guidelines too - thanks for the links. It's trivial unless a reliable source makes a big deal of it for whatever reason. So it stays out unless such a source is found - not that I'm going to search for one, I have bigger fish to fry. I just happened to see the movie last night and found this article after googling "Piaggio-Douglas" which was on the fuselage in quite big lettering in the movie. I didn't recognise the type - in the "long shots" it looked to me like a baby Sabreliner.
Roger (
talk) 10:58, 21 February 2011 (UTC)reply
It is a rare appearance of a rare aircraft, as only 24 were buitl, and 22 used by the Italian AIr Force. Are/were you able to get the aircraft registration number? That might help to track down who owned the aircraf tused in the film, be it the IAF or someone else. It's possible an aviation source wrote about it circa 1968, and some searching of online archives might turn up something. "Jack" (I don't remember his username, but I'll try to find it) has done some good work digging up old sources, and he might be able to help. -
BilCat (
talk) 11:08, 21 February 2011 (UTC)reply
Yes that image is definitely from the film. The Papal coat of arms is visible on the forward fuselage, though partly obscured by the wingtip fuel tank.
Roger (
talk) 15:53, 14 March 2011 (UTC)reply
Reliable source
I find it quite ridiculous that the film itself is not an acceptable source for something that appears in the film.
It is exactly analogous to asking for a reference to a quote from a book but prohibiting the use of the book itself as the cite.
If it is the consensus that this film appearance is notable because of the rarity of the aircraft then I don't see why there is a demand for a source outside of the film itself to verify the fact that the aircraft appears in the film.
Notability and verifiability are separate issues.
Roger (
talk) 16:39, 14 March 2011 (UTC)reply
Vespa Jet
Could you tell me where you find the name Vespa Jet in the source?
Franjklogos (
talk) 09:21, 4 March 2019 (UTC)reply
I did an online search and I didn't find any official source referring to Piaggio PD.808 as Vespa Jet... To be honest, I think it's just a nickname given by the editors of the magazine Flight International, or not?
Franjklogos (
talk) 14
05, 4 March 2019 (UTC)
Also appears in flight in 1962
https://www.flightglobal.com/FlightPDFArchive/1962/1962%20-%200367.PDF it is unlikely that Flight would make up names it has no need to. The article does make it clear it was the original name during the development which was presumably dropped and not used when the PD.808 went into production.
MilborneOne (
talk) 16:26, 4 March 2019 (UTC)reply
Who cares? If Flight makes up a nickname, it's likely to stick. BTW - Piaggio split the aircraft and scooter companies apart in 1966, which is well after this.
Andy Dingley (
talk) 17:07, 4 March 2019 (UTC)reply