This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 | Archive 3 | Archive 4 | Archive 5 |
I'm wondering why this talk page has the ((unsourced)) template and the main article does not. Any reason? Ufwuct 02:58, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
This article lacks critical content. Daphnekraus 20:23, 3 Sept 2007 (UTC)
The Eagles went to the superbowl on January 25, 1981. Does this still count as the city having all of it's teams play in a championship game in one calendar year? Even if it was in January, it was still 1981. Therefore, I'm not sure if it would be appropriate to say that all the professionsal sports teams played in a championship game in 1980. Because in 1980, the Eagles were not in the Superbowl. Anyone else have thoughts on this subject and if we should change the article or not?
Yeah, this counts. It was the 1980 season.-- Cms479 15:11, 31 July 2006 (UTC)
We really need to break out the sports section into its own article, since it simply takes up so much room. See Sports in Chicago, Illinois and Sports in New York City for models. Spikebrennan 19:29, 2 August 2006 (UTC)
Agreed - it would be the best place for all sports to be mentioned leaving the popular ones in the main section. (Braxiatel)
The sister cities section takes up a lot of space, probably out of proportion to the significance of this topic. I would suggest moving it to a separate article. Spikebrennan 21:33, 4 August 2006 (UTC)
I removed the Notable residents section, it was overly large and similar city articles do not have one. I moved missing entries into List of people from Philadelphia. In the end this is easier than saying who and who can’t be in that section, and it reduces the article size considerably.-- Medvedenko 20:06, 8 August 2006 (UTC)
In regards to Philadelphia and New York City the article states that the two cities are only around 80 miles apart from their downtowns (around 46 miles from their closest points), amongst the closest distances between two cities of over 1,000,000 population in the world, but Yokohama, a city of nearly 4 million, Kawasaki, a city of over 1 million and Tokyo, which has a population of over 8 million all border each other.
I believe that Phoenix has recently overtaken Philadelphia as the fifth largest US city. But I cannot cite a source.
The population of Philadelphia County is now 1,448,394. This is according to the US census county population estimates released on March 22nd ( http://www.census.gov/popest/counties/CO-EST2006-01.html). Since Philadelphia's county and city population are one and the same, Philly is now below the Phoenix city population for the same time period (1,461,575). If you still don't believe it, try checking out the Daily News ( http://www.philly.com/dailynews/local/20070322_Philly_drops_to_6th-largest_U_S__city.html) Vegas cat 09:27, 24 March 2007 (UTC)
{{ WikiProject Pennsylvania}} Thank you very much for your contributions, but in the future, could you please sign your messages with four tildes?-- BillFlis 00:35, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
I noticed the population of the city has fallen recently? I would be interested to know some of the reasons why this might be.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.40.25.148 ( talk • contribs) 03:13, 17 September 2006 (UTC)
Today, a utility malfunction has set off a fire in this city. It is all over the news. Several Office buildings had to be evacuated. Martial Law 21:04, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
First it was the Boston article trying to pull CT into it's sphere of influence and overstating Boston's importance to the northeast which includes trying to make Boston appear to be important to CT. Now I am reading the Philly article which is doing much of the same, except they seem to be continung the trend of trying to include themselves in the NYC market. I thought that Philly was a stand alone city? Meaning that it does not need to be associated with another city or state in order for people to know what that city is. You guys have your own metro area and a different style. Sure you are close to NYC for major cities being near each other, but you are not in the NYC area and I would almost question the milage.
It just occurs to me that people from Philly love their city, but almost ALWAYS say things along the lines of "Philly is only an 2 hours aways from NYC," as if you are asking the question of why you are not down with NYC. Mayve it's because you are right next to NJ? NJ is NJ. I see Philly and more related to DC and even Boston. I see Boston and Philly as similar colonial cities. The funny part is, Boston wants to pull CT away from NY and Philly wants pull itself out of Philly and into NYC. Very odd. I guess that the NYC is just too powerful and it makes those from other spectacular cities not want their cities.
I am no Philly guy, but upon reading the article I would ask myself (which I did. That is why I am writing this) "what has NYC's distance from Philly have to do with Philly?" I don't know. Maybe the author of the article could tell me. Maybe Philly is not as great as I would think of it if they desparately need to be seen as one with NYC. PA is not even on the east COAST you know. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.0.45.187 ( talk • contribs)
Boy, now PA wants to be "Wall Street West." Is PA THAT hard up on trying to be down with NYC? I mean, it is not in the area and NJ or CT fits the bill for any back up. You would think that Philly(I believe the governor was Philly's mayor) would be the priority instead of worrying about NYC. PA, a wannabe NYC suburb. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.177.167.146 ( talk • contribs)
Hi,
For the poster questioning the distances, use:
http://williams.best.vwh.net/gccalc.htm
to see the "straight line" distances between Philadelphia and New York (for both their closest points and their downtowns).
I believe we should say Philadelphia is the fifth largest city. Someone put a comment in the source code to not change this; so I won't; but as of the 2000 census we are the fifth largest city. I don't know how much faith we should put into the 2005 estimates; they could be wrong. I believe Phoenix or someone said that by their data Phoenix is still really the sixth largest city. I disagree with the way the Bureau tries to estimate.
Yeah, I had forgotten; even the 2005 population estimate shows Philadelphia ahead (slightly) of Phoenix. I am going to change the rank back to fifth. The reason is the census has released NOTHING stating Phoenix is ahead of Philadelphia, whether the census, population estimates, etc. You can not put Philadelphia at number #6 if even the census bureau never said that. Plus, these estimates could be wrong (they are based on things like number of houses sold, etc.), which leaves room for error, so perhaps Philadelphia is really #5 for a long time. Based on that we really don't know, plus the census has not released anything stating Phoenix is ahead of us; I believe we should put Philadelphia back to #5.
The result of the debate was move to Philadelphia. — Mets501 ( talk) 02:03, 15 October 2006 (UTC)
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania → Philadelphia — The latter currently redirects to the former, and there's a dab page. This is a common name (cf. Rome, Paris, Chicago, etc.) - Justin (koavf)· T· C· M 15:07, 10 October 2006 (UTC)
For the current Wikipedia conventions regarding U.S. place names, see Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (settlements). For a discussion of changing this convention generally (i.e., rather than making exceptions to the convention for particular U.S. cities, see Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (settlements)/U.S. convention change (August 2006). Spikebrennan 18:04, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
Add * '''Support''' or * '''Oppose''' on a new line followed by a brief explanation, then sign your opinion using ~~~~.
Add any additional comments:
Hroðulf points out above that there are "already thousands of incoming links to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania". When Chicago, Illinois was moved to Chicago, Chicago, Illinois was made into a redirect to Chicago. The same should happen here, therefore any link to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania will be redirected to Philadelphia. Then, with time, the [[Philadelphia, Pennsylvania|Philadelphia]] references can be fixed to point to Philadelphia, and the [[Philadelphia, Pennsylvania]] references can be changed to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania or just Philadelphia, as appropriate. But there is no hurry, since the existing references will not be broken. -- Serge 14:42, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
There is no need to "fix" redirects if they get you to the right place [2]. We do need to fix the 29 double redirects that will be created if this page is moved. -- Polaron | Talk 16:48, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
Will Beback claims in the Survey above that "no one has given a reason why this city should be an exception" (to the city, state convention). Yet all of the following reasons have been specified:
Just because one may believe these reasons do not justify Philadelphia being an exception, that's just a matter of opinion, and why there is a survey to resolve it. But to claim "no one has given a reason" is simply false. -- Serge 18:14, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
The only reason cited so far to not make this article be an exception to the convention is from Jonathunder who points out that doing so "will make it harder to predict where the article is". First, that's simply an argument that there should be no exceptions to the convention. Second, and more importantly, what he doesn't say is that it will make it harder for editors to predict where the article is, and, thus, this reason is irrelevant to article naming considerations since it violates the overall principle of Wikipedia's naming conventions as stated at WP:NC:
Avoiding this move because it would "make it harder [for editors] to predict where the article is" would be optimizing for editors over readers, and a violation of this overall principle. Exceptions to conventions is one thing, and are normal and expected, but violations of principles is something else again. -- Serge 18:14, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
Currently it is 14-4 in favor of the move. That seems like a fair degree of consensus. Should we go ahead and move it? john k 15:35, 14 October 2006 (UTC)
Now that the article has been moved, with time we should fix the links to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania to be to Philadelphia or to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. Click HERE to see a list of what still links to [[Philadelphia, Pennsylvania]].
It's a pity that the pictures in the article are so... brown and blah. Overcast skies, drab colors and grey buildings.
This picture is a step in the right direction, but it's grainy and has reflections and other flaws. It would be nice if we could get some pretty, clear, blue-sky-and-sunshine pictures. Spikebrennan 18:01, 20 October 2006 (UTC)
There is a survey in progress at Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (settlements) to determine if there is consensus on a proposed change to the U.S. city naming conventions to be consistent with other countries, in particular Canada. -- Serge 05:43, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
Of interest to Wikipedians in travel distance of West Philadelphia; there will be a Wikipedia Meetup on Saturday, 4 November 2006, and possibly on a regular basis if there is sufficient response. See the meetup page for details and to RSVP.
(I realize that this marginally inappropriate for an article talk page, but a meeting of Philadelphia wikipedians could stimulate article improvements) ike9898 02:21, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
The legend under the city flag in the infobox should be to Flag of Philadelphia, Pennsylvania but I don't know how to change it in the infobox. Spikebrennan 03:30, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
It struck me that there's no image of the Liberty Bell on the home page other than in the Philadelphia Portal box. I can't think of where it would appropriately go, without seeming crowded. Spikebrennan 03:43, 25 November 2006 (UTC)
I would like to see a list of the tallest buildings in Philadelphia. This is done for other cities in the U.S., why not Philly? Low and behold! On Thursday, Jan. 11th, 2007, The Philadelphia Inquirer did a story on the cover of section B on the Philadelphia skyline. Here is the list:
Now, what do I have to do to get this included in the article on Philadelphia?-- Buddmar 05:13, 12 January 2007 (UTC)buddmar
Someone has vandalized this page, please take care of it, Im not sure how to. Its Under Colonail History Tgcomicman 22:02, 5 February 2007 (UTC)
Alright, I'm not sure who flagged this as a "not formal tone" article, but since they didn't have the decency to at least address it on the talk page as to why, I'm removing it, simply because without just cause, it's unfounded. Give us a reason, and we'll definitely improve it. Until then, however, it's gone; it's just taking up space as-is. Eagles Fan In Tampa (formerly Jimbo) 13:09, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
The article states ( Philadelphia#Colonial) that "Philadelphia is one of the earliest examples of a planned city. Its rectilinear grid of streets [...] was its most noteworthy innovation.". I don't agree. Grid layouts are almost as old as urban history itself, and they were applied to (mostly colonial) cities through history. The best-known ancient example was greek Miletus (5th century BC): "Its gridlike layout, planned by Hippodamos, became the basic layout for Roman cities." ( Miletus#Historical_Period), though the concept is much older ("The streets of the city were laid out in perfect grid patterns." Mohenjo-Daro#History, 2600 BC). -- Magadan ?! 01:18, 25 February 2007 (UTC)
Why is this mentioned? 46 miles? I find that very hard to believe. If Philly were that close, it would be a part of the the NYC metro area! You guys in Philly, as well as Boston (I feel that you two have something in common, historically) need your own Identities. Philly needs to stop trying to put itself in with NYC just because it (Philly) is near NJ. NYC already has it's NY/NJ/CT region. Similarly, Boston needs to stop trying to force CT into it's New England region headed (self appointed of course) by itself. CT is not what you would like it to be. All of you stores (with Boston sports propaganda in them) cannot take it away from NYC. You two cities need to get a life and stop trying to leech off of cities that have nothing to do with you.-- 71.235.81.39 03:47, 7 March 2007 (UTC)
Wikipedia has too many rules. Try editing an article and everyone goes sick. Now you want people to stop talking about things here too?-- 71.235.81.39 01:27, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
You're welcome to talk about things germane and useful to the article. "stop trying to leech off of cities that have nothing to do with you" doesn't suggest anything constructive and also puts local residents and tireless contributors to the page on the defensive, insuring that the point won't be taken seriously.-- Loodog 03:06, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
If you say so, but I am still having a hard time figuring out what NYC has to do with Philly. NYC media does not even mention Philly at all. There are no road signs that point to Philly either. It just sounds as if Philly cannot stand on it's own. —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
71.235.81.39 (
talk •
contribs)
According to Google Earth, it is 80 miles or 130 km from Philadelphia's to New York's City Hall. This is a remarkably short distance and it definetely _is_ something worth to mention in this article. Philly is one of very few metro areas of the 5 million catgory being that close to an even larger metropolis. The only "couples" of cities on the planet i know being that large AND that close are Hong Kong/Canton (80mi/130km as well) and Beijing/Tianjin (70/100). So, the proximity to NYC is a unique geographic feature even on a global scale. -- Magadan ?! 10:37, 9 August 2007 (UTC)
I am taking out the list of named neighborhoods in that section of the article, not the link to the artice the list them. First of it is redundant with article list, also the seems to be no particluar reason why those are listed their, consdering that users just seems to come along and expand the list with their neighborhood of prefrence. If anything the section should not be a list. -- Boothy443 | trácht ar 01:20, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
Seventh or Eighth largest in the country? Sorry, no time to look up and fix this myself. Mdbrownmsw 13:56, 23 March 2007 (UTC)
"In exchange for locating a permanent capital on the banks of the Potomac, the congressmen agreed to support Hamilton's financial proposals." what were the Hamilton's financial proosal? 70.55.155.198 23:23, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
I live in PA. Last year, as morbid as it sounds, our class counted the murder rate. Approx 2.5 murders a day. 69.67.229.84 03:18, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
It's a bit current-eventsy, but my guess is that being the highest murder rate in the U.S. two years running (assuming nothing major changes in 2007) is going to have long-term ramifications on the city. Should probably be worth a mention. -- CKeelty 23:48, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
I've looked over the Shopping section and the tone does not really strike me as being written as an advertisement, though it probably could use some clean up anyway. The statement about the Gallery still needs a ref, and I can't seem to find one outside a promotional pub that lists "America’s largest indoor urban shopping center, the Gallery at Market East..." [6] or "one of the largest" [7]
I added a ref to the shopping section which was tagged regarding King of Prussia's rank as second largest mall in the US. I was surprised to notice that in terms of store space (leasable square footage) KoP is actually larger than Mall of America, making it the "largest" mall. Does that bear being mentioned, or is it bordering on being "peacocky"? Ar-wiki 12:06, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
Does anyone have any specific complaints or reasoning for the "advertisement" tag? i've gone over the section numerous times, and although it could be worked on and cleaned up a litte, i see no blatant use of advertising. it seems to me to be a decent description of the popular shopping locations for residents and tourists-- Klink05 15:26, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
The Philadelphia#Colonial section has a line at the end which after checking its reference, might bear being removed.
In the 18th century, it was one of the most important cities both before and after the American Revolution and was a center of style and culture.[ [8]
The ref is to a page about furniture, so the ref definitely needs to be changed (back) to a {{ Fact}} tag. Beyond that, the statement could probably just be removed. Thoughts? Ar-wiki 22:20, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
I think a section should be inserted to explain that it is considered the first capital if one goes by the Continental Congress (either First or Second), or Congress under the Articles of Confederation. However, if one goes by Congress under the Constitution, the first capital was New York City. See the following link for more: [9]. Lexicon (talk) 19:25, 12 April 2007 (UTC)
Removed from the Economy section:
This seemed too detailed to be noteworthy. -- Beland 22:41, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
The article offers a population based on the 2005 estimate, but ranking by the 2000 numbers. Doesn't the 2005 estimate (provided by the US Census Bureau) still put Philadelphia ahead of Phoenix? The footnote about being ranked fifth in 2000 shouldn't matter. That data isn't up to date. If that were the case we wouldn't offer the 2005 population estimates. San Antonio would be ranked ninth if we went with 2000 numbers. If the Census Bureau is willing to provide updated numbers lets make sure we use them. -- Longhornsguy07 12:55, 01 June 2007
I'm going to remove this sentence since it seems rather trivial, especially for the intro section. Vgranucci 19:11, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
I noticed that several times the hip-hop nickname "Illadelphia"/"Illadelph" was added (at various times to the infobox nickname list and to the article lead) but was reverted as "vandalism". Although I agree with removing it from the lead (because the lead isn't the place for a list of all nicknames), I don't see why it shouldn't stay in the infobox nickname list. Even if other editors don't think that it's notable enough, they should say that instead of saying that it's "vandalism". Clearly it was a good-faith edit, not vandalism. The person who added it felt that it belonged there. I also think that it's well known enough to be notable. — Lumbercutter 23:29, 10 June 2007 (UTC)
I'm starting to think that "Illadelph" is too well established within hip-hop to put the neo- in neologism, as it were. After all, it's been over a decade since The Roots' Illadelph Halflife made Billboard's Top 40. However, since "Illadelph" isn't well known among people who don't listen to hip-hop, it wouldn't make sense in the article lead or in the nickname field of the infobox, where it would be divorced of the hip-hop context. The appropriate way to mention it would be to develop the coverage of Philadelphia's influence on music in the "Culture" section (which is currently very sparse), and explain that in hip-hop subculture, Philadelphia is known affectionately as Illadelph, a play on the hip-hop sense of the adjective ill. I don't have the passion for this topic to spend time on doing that task (I already have two grades of to-do list with backlogs queued, one resigned to wishlist status due to scarcity of time to spend on Wikipedia). But I am suggesting it here for anyone who does have the passion about this topic. — Lumbercutter 00:54, 15 June 2007 (UTC)
This section is getting too long. I suggest that most of the content be moved to Media of Philadelphia. Spikebrennan 15:45, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
Why no mention of infamous WIBG radio? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.166.216.78 ( talk) 19:51, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
Camden was the 2004 AND 2005 winner of the Prestigous "Most Dangerous City in America" It's a shame too, used to be such a nice city years and years ago... =(
Over at the naming convention page, a discussion has been started about moving Philadelphia back to the city, state standard. All views and inputs are welcomed. Agne Cheese/ Wine 05:16, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
Most notably, the King of Prussia Mall, the second-largest mall in the United States[32], is thirty minutes away from Center City.
Using driving time to convey distance should be avoided. I'm guessing that it's not actually a 30-minute drive all the time, just when the roads are clear. How many miles away is it? Funnyhat 04:56, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
Google maps puts it 19.1 miles from City Hall (the basic geographic center of Center City). Do we need mileage? Isn't it sufficient just to say "located in the Philadelphia suburbs?" -- CKeelty 23:46, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
That mall is quite a driving distance from center city. If it's 19.1 miles it must definitely be as the crow flies. I would even argue that King of Prussia is not actually a "suburb" of Philadelphia. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.166.216.78 ( talk) 19:59, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
are available at my userpage. I have added some of these to appropriate articles. Spikebrennan 14:13, 23 July 2007 (UTC)
An anon removed the tourist brochure being called the "shopping" section, and was reverted. His point stands. Other cities do not have sections dedicated to their local malls. This information is more appropriate to wikitravel.-- Loodog 22:17, 11 September 2007 (UTC)
An editor just removed the sentence "It was arguably the second largest city, behind London, in the British Empire", with a comment in the edit summary that "it was about 13th". However, this page from the Smithsonian magazine says Philadelphia was the third-largest city in the British Empire, after London and Dublin. This page, fictional but apparently well-researched, says third behind London and Edinburgh. But National Geographic says second-largest. The state of Pennsylvania says second-largest English-speaking city in the world; were they then speaking Gaelic in Dublin and Edinburgh?-- BillFlis 12:58, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
The French-language version of this article, [10] is featured on the French wikipedia. Although I can't read French, I can see that the article has different images-- some of which can be appropriated for this article or other Philadelphia-related articles. Spikebrennan 15:22, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
Not sure where to put it, but G.N. Georgano, (Cars: Early and Vintage, 1886-1930. {London: Grange-Universal, 1985}). says Henry Morris & Pedro Salom built electric cars in Philiadelphia, beginning in 1894; built the 1895 Electrobat (!), which opereated as a taxi in New York, Boston, & elsewhere; formed Morris & Salom Electric Carriage and Wagon Company, which was sold in 1897 to Isaac L. Rice, & later became part of Pope's empire. Trekphiler 01:59, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/philadelphia_unattractive1_dc;_ylt=AlYNnGJZFW3l6AN2EEtmLfXtiBIF I think that the lead might be undue weight, but it is definitely worthy of inclusion.Die4Dixie 05:43, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
The article says that the highest point in Philadelphia is at the intersection of Germantown Road and Bethlehem Pike. I recall that Germantown Road rises for another half-mile (give or take) as the road goes northwest. Would someone please double-check the proper highest point in the city. 141.199.102.30 17:33, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 | Archive 3 | Archive 4 | Archive 5 |
I'm wondering why this talk page has the ((unsourced)) template and the main article does not. Any reason? Ufwuct 02:58, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
This article lacks critical content. Daphnekraus 20:23, 3 Sept 2007 (UTC)
The Eagles went to the superbowl on January 25, 1981. Does this still count as the city having all of it's teams play in a championship game in one calendar year? Even if it was in January, it was still 1981. Therefore, I'm not sure if it would be appropriate to say that all the professionsal sports teams played in a championship game in 1980. Because in 1980, the Eagles were not in the Superbowl. Anyone else have thoughts on this subject and if we should change the article or not?
Yeah, this counts. It was the 1980 season.-- Cms479 15:11, 31 July 2006 (UTC)
We really need to break out the sports section into its own article, since it simply takes up so much room. See Sports in Chicago, Illinois and Sports in New York City for models. Spikebrennan 19:29, 2 August 2006 (UTC)
Agreed - it would be the best place for all sports to be mentioned leaving the popular ones in the main section. (Braxiatel)
The sister cities section takes up a lot of space, probably out of proportion to the significance of this topic. I would suggest moving it to a separate article. Spikebrennan 21:33, 4 August 2006 (UTC)
I removed the Notable residents section, it was overly large and similar city articles do not have one. I moved missing entries into List of people from Philadelphia. In the end this is easier than saying who and who can’t be in that section, and it reduces the article size considerably.-- Medvedenko 20:06, 8 August 2006 (UTC)
In regards to Philadelphia and New York City the article states that the two cities are only around 80 miles apart from their downtowns (around 46 miles from their closest points), amongst the closest distances between two cities of over 1,000,000 population in the world, but Yokohama, a city of nearly 4 million, Kawasaki, a city of over 1 million and Tokyo, which has a population of over 8 million all border each other.
I believe that Phoenix has recently overtaken Philadelphia as the fifth largest US city. But I cannot cite a source.
The population of Philadelphia County is now 1,448,394. This is according to the US census county population estimates released on March 22nd ( http://www.census.gov/popest/counties/CO-EST2006-01.html). Since Philadelphia's county and city population are one and the same, Philly is now below the Phoenix city population for the same time period (1,461,575). If you still don't believe it, try checking out the Daily News ( http://www.philly.com/dailynews/local/20070322_Philly_drops_to_6th-largest_U_S__city.html) Vegas cat 09:27, 24 March 2007 (UTC)
{{ WikiProject Pennsylvania}} Thank you very much for your contributions, but in the future, could you please sign your messages with four tildes?-- BillFlis 00:35, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
I noticed the population of the city has fallen recently? I would be interested to know some of the reasons why this might be.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.40.25.148 ( talk • contribs) 03:13, 17 September 2006 (UTC)
Today, a utility malfunction has set off a fire in this city. It is all over the news. Several Office buildings had to be evacuated. Martial Law 21:04, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
First it was the Boston article trying to pull CT into it's sphere of influence and overstating Boston's importance to the northeast which includes trying to make Boston appear to be important to CT. Now I am reading the Philly article which is doing much of the same, except they seem to be continung the trend of trying to include themselves in the NYC market. I thought that Philly was a stand alone city? Meaning that it does not need to be associated with another city or state in order for people to know what that city is. You guys have your own metro area and a different style. Sure you are close to NYC for major cities being near each other, but you are not in the NYC area and I would almost question the milage.
It just occurs to me that people from Philly love their city, but almost ALWAYS say things along the lines of "Philly is only an 2 hours aways from NYC," as if you are asking the question of why you are not down with NYC. Mayve it's because you are right next to NJ? NJ is NJ. I see Philly and more related to DC and even Boston. I see Boston and Philly as similar colonial cities. The funny part is, Boston wants to pull CT away from NY and Philly wants pull itself out of Philly and into NYC. Very odd. I guess that the NYC is just too powerful and it makes those from other spectacular cities not want their cities.
I am no Philly guy, but upon reading the article I would ask myself (which I did. That is why I am writing this) "what has NYC's distance from Philly have to do with Philly?" I don't know. Maybe the author of the article could tell me. Maybe Philly is not as great as I would think of it if they desparately need to be seen as one with NYC. PA is not even on the east COAST you know. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.0.45.187 ( talk • contribs)
Boy, now PA wants to be "Wall Street West." Is PA THAT hard up on trying to be down with NYC? I mean, it is not in the area and NJ or CT fits the bill for any back up. You would think that Philly(I believe the governor was Philly's mayor) would be the priority instead of worrying about NYC. PA, a wannabe NYC suburb. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.177.167.146 ( talk • contribs)
Hi,
For the poster questioning the distances, use:
http://williams.best.vwh.net/gccalc.htm
to see the "straight line" distances between Philadelphia and New York (for both their closest points and their downtowns).
I believe we should say Philadelphia is the fifth largest city. Someone put a comment in the source code to not change this; so I won't; but as of the 2000 census we are the fifth largest city. I don't know how much faith we should put into the 2005 estimates; they could be wrong. I believe Phoenix or someone said that by their data Phoenix is still really the sixth largest city. I disagree with the way the Bureau tries to estimate.
Yeah, I had forgotten; even the 2005 population estimate shows Philadelphia ahead (slightly) of Phoenix. I am going to change the rank back to fifth. The reason is the census has released NOTHING stating Phoenix is ahead of Philadelphia, whether the census, population estimates, etc. You can not put Philadelphia at number #6 if even the census bureau never said that. Plus, these estimates could be wrong (they are based on things like number of houses sold, etc.), which leaves room for error, so perhaps Philadelphia is really #5 for a long time. Based on that we really don't know, plus the census has not released anything stating Phoenix is ahead of us; I believe we should put Philadelphia back to #5.
The result of the debate was move to Philadelphia. — Mets501 ( talk) 02:03, 15 October 2006 (UTC)
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania → Philadelphia — The latter currently redirects to the former, and there's a dab page. This is a common name (cf. Rome, Paris, Chicago, etc.) - Justin (koavf)· T· C· M 15:07, 10 October 2006 (UTC)
For the current Wikipedia conventions regarding U.S. place names, see Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (settlements). For a discussion of changing this convention generally (i.e., rather than making exceptions to the convention for particular U.S. cities, see Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (settlements)/U.S. convention change (August 2006). Spikebrennan 18:04, 12 October 2006 (UTC)
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Hroðulf points out above that there are "already thousands of incoming links to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania". When Chicago, Illinois was moved to Chicago, Chicago, Illinois was made into a redirect to Chicago. The same should happen here, therefore any link to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania will be redirected to Philadelphia. Then, with time, the [[Philadelphia, Pennsylvania|Philadelphia]] references can be fixed to point to Philadelphia, and the [[Philadelphia, Pennsylvania]] references can be changed to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania or just Philadelphia, as appropriate. But there is no hurry, since the existing references will not be broken. -- Serge 14:42, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
There is no need to "fix" redirects if they get you to the right place [2]. We do need to fix the 29 double redirects that will be created if this page is moved. -- Polaron | Talk 16:48, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
Will Beback claims in the Survey above that "no one has given a reason why this city should be an exception" (to the city, state convention). Yet all of the following reasons have been specified:
Just because one may believe these reasons do not justify Philadelphia being an exception, that's just a matter of opinion, and why there is a survey to resolve it. But to claim "no one has given a reason" is simply false. -- Serge 18:14, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
The only reason cited so far to not make this article be an exception to the convention is from Jonathunder who points out that doing so "will make it harder to predict where the article is". First, that's simply an argument that there should be no exceptions to the convention. Second, and more importantly, what he doesn't say is that it will make it harder for editors to predict where the article is, and, thus, this reason is irrelevant to article naming considerations since it violates the overall principle of Wikipedia's naming conventions as stated at WP:NC:
Avoiding this move because it would "make it harder [for editors] to predict where the article is" would be optimizing for editors over readers, and a violation of this overall principle. Exceptions to conventions is one thing, and are normal and expected, but violations of principles is something else again. -- Serge 18:14, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
Currently it is 14-4 in favor of the move. That seems like a fair degree of consensus. Should we go ahead and move it? john k 15:35, 14 October 2006 (UTC)
Now that the article has been moved, with time we should fix the links to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania to be to Philadelphia or to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. Click HERE to see a list of what still links to [[Philadelphia, Pennsylvania]].
It's a pity that the pictures in the article are so... brown and blah. Overcast skies, drab colors and grey buildings.
This picture is a step in the right direction, but it's grainy and has reflections and other flaws. It would be nice if we could get some pretty, clear, blue-sky-and-sunshine pictures. Spikebrennan 18:01, 20 October 2006 (UTC)
There is a survey in progress at Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (settlements) to determine if there is consensus on a proposed change to the U.S. city naming conventions to be consistent with other countries, in particular Canada. -- Serge 05:43, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
Of interest to Wikipedians in travel distance of West Philadelphia; there will be a Wikipedia Meetup on Saturday, 4 November 2006, and possibly on a regular basis if there is sufficient response. See the meetup page for details and to RSVP.
(I realize that this marginally inappropriate for an article talk page, but a meeting of Philadelphia wikipedians could stimulate article improvements) ike9898 02:21, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
The legend under the city flag in the infobox should be to Flag of Philadelphia, Pennsylvania but I don't know how to change it in the infobox. Spikebrennan 03:30, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
It struck me that there's no image of the Liberty Bell on the home page other than in the Philadelphia Portal box. I can't think of where it would appropriately go, without seeming crowded. Spikebrennan 03:43, 25 November 2006 (UTC)
I would like to see a list of the tallest buildings in Philadelphia. This is done for other cities in the U.S., why not Philly? Low and behold! On Thursday, Jan. 11th, 2007, The Philadelphia Inquirer did a story on the cover of section B on the Philadelphia skyline. Here is the list:
Now, what do I have to do to get this included in the article on Philadelphia?-- Buddmar 05:13, 12 January 2007 (UTC)buddmar
Someone has vandalized this page, please take care of it, Im not sure how to. Its Under Colonail History Tgcomicman 22:02, 5 February 2007 (UTC)
Alright, I'm not sure who flagged this as a "not formal tone" article, but since they didn't have the decency to at least address it on the talk page as to why, I'm removing it, simply because without just cause, it's unfounded. Give us a reason, and we'll definitely improve it. Until then, however, it's gone; it's just taking up space as-is. Eagles Fan In Tampa (formerly Jimbo) 13:09, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
The article states ( Philadelphia#Colonial) that "Philadelphia is one of the earliest examples of a planned city. Its rectilinear grid of streets [...] was its most noteworthy innovation.". I don't agree. Grid layouts are almost as old as urban history itself, and they were applied to (mostly colonial) cities through history. The best-known ancient example was greek Miletus (5th century BC): "Its gridlike layout, planned by Hippodamos, became the basic layout for Roman cities." ( Miletus#Historical_Period), though the concept is much older ("The streets of the city were laid out in perfect grid patterns." Mohenjo-Daro#History, 2600 BC). -- Magadan ?! 01:18, 25 February 2007 (UTC)
Why is this mentioned? 46 miles? I find that very hard to believe. If Philly were that close, it would be a part of the the NYC metro area! You guys in Philly, as well as Boston (I feel that you two have something in common, historically) need your own Identities. Philly needs to stop trying to put itself in with NYC just because it (Philly) is near NJ. NYC already has it's NY/NJ/CT region. Similarly, Boston needs to stop trying to force CT into it's New England region headed (self appointed of course) by itself. CT is not what you would like it to be. All of you stores (with Boston sports propaganda in them) cannot take it away from NYC. You two cities need to get a life and stop trying to leech off of cities that have nothing to do with you.-- 71.235.81.39 03:47, 7 March 2007 (UTC)
Wikipedia has too many rules. Try editing an article and everyone goes sick. Now you want people to stop talking about things here too?-- 71.235.81.39 01:27, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
You're welcome to talk about things germane and useful to the article. "stop trying to leech off of cities that have nothing to do with you" doesn't suggest anything constructive and also puts local residents and tireless contributors to the page on the defensive, insuring that the point won't be taken seriously.-- Loodog 03:06, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
If you say so, but I am still having a hard time figuring out what NYC has to do with Philly. NYC media does not even mention Philly at all. There are no road signs that point to Philly either. It just sounds as if Philly cannot stand on it's own. —Preceding
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According to Google Earth, it is 80 miles or 130 km from Philadelphia's to New York's City Hall. This is a remarkably short distance and it definetely _is_ something worth to mention in this article. Philly is one of very few metro areas of the 5 million catgory being that close to an even larger metropolis. The only "couples" of cities on the planet i know being that large AND that close are Hong Kong/Canton (80mi/130km as well) and Beijing/Tianjin (70/100). So, the proximity to NYC is a unique geographic feature even on a global scale. -- Magadan ?! 10:37, 9 August 2007 (UTC)
I am taking out the list of named neighborhoods in that section of the article, not the link to the artice the list them. First of it is redundant with article list, also the seems to be no particluar reason why those are listed their, consdering that users just seems to come along and expand the list with their neighborhood of prefrence. If anything the section should not be a list. -- Boothy443 | trácht ar 01:20, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
Seventh or Eighth largest in the country? Sorry, no time to look up and fix this myself. Mdbrownmsw 13:56, 23 March 2007 (UTC)
"In exchange for locating a permanent capital on the banks of the Potomac, the congressmen agreed to support Hamilton's financial proposals." what were the Hamilton's financial proosal? 70.55.155.198 23:23, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
I live in PA. Last year, as morbid as it sounds, our class counted the murder rate. Approx 2.5 murders a day. 69.67.229.84 03:18, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
It's a bit current-eventsy, but my guess is that being the highest murder rate in the U.S. two years running (assuming nothing major changes in 2007) is going to have long-term ramifications on the city. Should probably be worth a mention. -- CKeelty 23:48, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
I've looked over the Shopping section and the tone does not really strike me as being written as an advertisement, though it probably could use some clean up anyway. The statement about the Gallery still needs a ref, and I can't seem to find one outside a promotional pub that lists "America’s largest indoor urban shopping center, the Gallery at Market East..." [6] or "one of the largest" [7]
I added a ref to the shopping section which was tagged regarding King of Prussia's rank as second largest mall in the US. I was surprised to notice that in terms of store space (leasable square footage) KoP is actually larger than Mall of America, making it the "largest" mall. Does that bear being mentioned, or is it bordering on being "peacocky"? Ar-wiki 12:06, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
Does anyone have any specific complaints or reasoning for the "advertisement" tag? i've gone over the section numerous times, and although it could be worked on and cleaned up a litte, i see no blatant use of advertising. it seems to me to be a decent description of the popular shopping locations for residents and tourists-- Klink05 15:26, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
The Philadelphia#Colonial section has a line at the end which after checking its reference, might bear being removed.
In the 18th century, it was one of the most important cities both before and after the American Revolution and was a center of style and culture.[ [8]
The ref is to a page about furniture, so the ref definitely needs to be changed (back) to a {{ Fact}} tag. Beyond that, the statement could probably just be removed. Thoughts? Ar-wiki 22:20, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
I think a section should be inserted to explain that it is considered the first capital if one goes by the Continental Congress (either First or Second), or Congress under the Articles of Confederation. However, if one goes by Congress under the Constitution, the first capital was New York City. See the following link for more: [9]. Lexicon (talk) 19:25, 12 April 2007 (UTC)
Removed from the Economy section:
This seemed too detailed to be noteworthy. -- Beland 22:41, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
The article offers a population based on the 2005 estimate, but ranking by the 2000 numbers. Doesn't the 2005 estimate (provided by the US Census Bureau) still put Philadelphia ahead of Phoenix? The footnote about being ranked fifth in 2000 shouldn't matter. That data isn't up to date. If that were the case we wouldn't offer the 2005 population estimates. San Antonio would be ranked ninth if we went with 2000 numbers. If the Census Bureau is willing to provide updated numbers lets make sure we use them. -- Longhornsguy07 12:55, 01 June 2007
I'm going to remove this sentence since it seems rather trivial, especially for the intro section. Vgranucci 19:11, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
I noticed that several times the hip-hop nickname "Illadelphia"/"Illadelph" was added (at various times to the infobox nickname list and to the article lead) but was reverted as "vandalism". Although I agree with removing it from the lead (because the lead isn't the place for a list of all nicknames), I don't see why it shouldn't stay in the infobox nickname list. Even if other editors don't think that it's notable enough, they should say that instead of saying that it's "vandalism". Clearly it was a good-faith edit, not vandalism. The person who added it felt that it belonged there. I also think that it's well known enough to be notable. — Lumbercutter 23:29, 10 June 2007 (UTC)
I'm starting to think that "Illadelph" is too well established within hip-hop to put the neo- in neologism, as it were. After all, it's been over a decade since The Roots' Illadelph Halflife made Billboard's Top 40. However, since "Illadelph" isn't well known among people who don't listen to hip-hop, it wouldn't make sense in the article lead or in the nickname field of the infobox, where it would be divorced of the hip-hop context. The appropriate way to mention it would be to develop the coverage of Philadelphia's influence on music in the "Culture" section (which is currently very sparse), and explain that in hip-hop subculture, Philadelphia is known affectionately as Illadelph, a play on the hip-hop sense of the adjective ill. I don't have the passion for this topic to spend time on doing that task (I already have two grades of to-do list with backlogs queued, one resigned to wishlist status due to scarcity of time to spend on Wikipedia). But I am suggesting it here for anyone who does have the passion about this topic. — Lumbercutter 00:54, 15 June 2007 (UTC)
This section is getting too long. I suggest that most of the content be moved to Media of Philadelphia. Spikebrennan 15:45, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
Why no mention of infamous WIBG radio? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.166.216.78 ( talk) 19:51, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
Camden was the 2004 AND 2005 winner of the Prestigous "Most Dangerous City in America" It's a shame too, used to be such a nice city years and years ago... =(
Over at the naming convention page, a discussion has been started about moving Philadelphia back to the city, state standard. All views and inputs are welcomed. Agne Cheese/ Wine 05:16, 10 July 2007 (UTC)
Most notably, the King of Prussia Mall, the second-largest mall in the United States[32], is thirty minutes away from Center City.
Using driving time to convey distance should be avoided. I'm guessing that it's not actually a 30-minute drive all the time, just when the roads are clear. How many miles away is it? Funnyhat 04:56, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
Google maps puts it 19.1 miles from City Hall (the basic geographic center of Center City). Do we need mileage? Isn't it sufficient just to say "located in the Philadelphia suburbs?" -- CKeelty 23:46, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
That mall is quite a driving distance from center city. If it's 19.1 miles it must definitely be as the crow flies. I would even argue that King of Prussia is not actually a "suburb" of Philadelphia. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.166.216.78 ( talk) 19:59, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
are available at my userpage. I have added some of these to appropriate articles. Spikebrennan 14:13, 23 July 2007 (UTC)
An anon removed the tourist brochure being called the "shopping" section, and was reverted. His point stands. Other cities do not have sections dedicated to their local malls. This information is more appropriate to wikitravel.-- Loodog 22:17, 11 September 2007 (UTC)
An editor just removed the sentence "It was arguably the second largest city, behind London, in the British Empire", with a comment in the edit summary that "it was about 13th". However, this page from the Smithsonian magazine says Philadelphia was the third-largest city in the British Empire, after London and Dublin. This page, fictional but apparently well-researched, says third behind London and Edinburgh. But National Geographic says second-largest. The state of Pennsylvania says second-largest English-speaking city in the world; were they then speaking Gaelic in Dublin and Edinburgh?-- BillFlis 12:58, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
The French-language version of this article, [10] is featured on the French wikipedia. Although I can't read French, I can see that the article has different images-- some of which can be appropriated for this article or other Philadelphia-related articles. Spikebrennan 15:22, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
Not sure where to put it, but G.N. Georgano, (Cars: Early and Vintage, 1886-1930. {London: Grange-Universal, 1985}). says Henry Morris & Pedro Salom built electric cars in Philiadelphia, beginning in 1894; built the 1895 Electrobat (!), which opereated as a taxi in New York, Boston, & elsewhere; formed Morris & Salom Electric Carriage and Wagon Company, which was sold in 1897 to Isaac L. Rice, & later became part of Pope's empire. Trekphiler 01:59, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/philadelphia_unattractive1_dc;_ylt=AlYNnGJZFW3l6AN2EEtmLfXtiBIF I think that the lead might be undue weight, but it is definitely worthy of inclusion.Die4Dixie 05:43, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
The article says that the highest point in Philadelphia is at the intersection of Germantown Road and Bethlehem Pike. I recall that Germantown Road rises for another half-mile (give or take) as the road goes northwest. Would someone please double-check the proper highest point in the city. 141.199.102.30 17:33, 30 November 2007 (UTC)