This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
I'm currently reading the Silmarillion. It describes Feanor creating 7 stones that allow you to see great distances, just like Manwe does. Curious if this was talking about the Palantíri, I looked the the entry in the Appendix, which said that the word Palantír refers to any of the 7 stones created by Feanor. Why does this article present the origin of the stones ambiguously? It seems to me that it's fairly clear, but perhaps a contradicting source is the reason for the lack of clarity. Thanks,
3nails4you ( talk) 18:53, 8 August 2014 (UTC)
The similarity with the Persian mythology symbol, Jamshid's Cup, could be mentioned in the article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cup_of_Jamshid
{ .. the Cup were said to reveal deep truths. Sometimes, especially in popular depictions such as The Heroic Legend of Arslan, the cup has been visualized as a crystal ball. Helen Zimmern's English translation of the Shahnameh uses the term "crystal globe". }
91.184.95.215 ( talk) 21:10, 28 April 2012 (UTC)
There is some questionable information in this section. It says "many were made" - but I can't find any reference to more than the 8 usually referenced (the seven given to the Faithful, and the Master-stone). If there is a reference to 'many' being made, it should be cited. Also, Unfinished Tales distinctly says that the Stones themselves exerted no power over another will, until Sauron gained control of the Ithil-stone. The essay also explains 'shrouding' and aligning the stones for use, etc. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bflood ( talk • contribs) 00:07, 16 March 2010 (UTC)
I seem to recall from reading one of the books that to view a Palantir, one must look directly into it. The movie, however, has Saruman holding his clawed hand over it. This probably deserves mention in the 'Adaptation' section. (I don't remember where exactly I read it myself.)
Maybe there are different approaches on how to use the stone. The Orthanc Tower was built to watch over the land and see how the people fare. Saruman probably used its stone to have a glance on what the people are doing, wich is the only thing Sauron can see. Pippin would probably see exactly that - what everybody is doing. To figure out what's going on inside them (something that stone would immediately reveal, if it wasn't for Sauron) - something Saruman wouldn't be interested in - it would either take guesswork or a keen yet naive gaze.
—Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.119.84.143 ( talk) 12:35, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
Extensive information on the mechanics of using a Stone, are provided in
Unfinished Tales. I will update with that. One DOES need to look directly into it, and need to be looking in the direction one wants to see.
Might the palantir be the inspiration for Maerlyn's rainbow? PrometheusX303 01:01, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
The Elostirion stone - contradiction with the article on Cirdan. In the current article the Elostirion stone is "taken by Círdan back to Valinor" and "taken back to the West with the three Elven Rings". However, in the article on Cirdan, he does not travel to the West with the 3 rings. The rings travel with Frodo, whereas Cirdan waits for Sam and they travel together. I have NO clue which is canonical/correct, but thought I'd mention it. I will post the same comment on the Cirdan discussion.-- Smcgrother 20:59, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
This claim smacks of OR. It's not even completely accurate, Aragorn wasn't deceived in any way. It's an attempt to relate a number of different events with a single theory. Thu ( talk) 15:51, 22 November 2010 (UTC)
This is not about the topic of a Palantir, but the actual wiki page. The redirection at the top says "Palantir Solutions", but the raw wiki code says, correctly, Palantir Technologies. What gives? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.34.34.43 ( talk) 02:27, 11 August 2011 (UTC)
Regarding GimliDotNet restoring this article's rating to a B here. I suppose your project can rate articles any way you want, but I should tell you that your assessments are way off if you think this article is a B. I wouldn't even classify it as a C. I understand that you may think it is nearing completion because the article covers (seemingly) every appearance of these objects in the novels and adaptations, but the in-universe details are all it covers. The article does not contain anything asserting real-world notability (not even in the film section!). It has only a single secondary (non-Tolkien) source. In its present state, this article is actually prime for AfD or merging into a list as a subtopic not deserving of its own article. If WikiProject Middle-earth actively considers articles like this a B, you should really take another look at the {{ Grading scheme}} so that your dedicated participants are able to improve articles properly.— TAnthony Talk 14:44, 12 October 2015 (UTC)
This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
I'm currently reading the Silmarillion. It describes Feanor creating 7 stones that allow you to see great distances, just like Manwe does. Curious if this was talking about the Palantíri, I looked the the entry in the Appendix, which said that the word Palantír refers to any of the 7 stones created by Feanor. Why does this article present the origin of the stones ambiguously? It seems to me that it's fairly clear, but perhaps a contradicting source is the reason for the lack of clarity. Thanks,
3nails4you ( talk) 18:53, 8 August 2014 (UTC)
The similarity with the Persian mythology symbol, Jamshid's Cup, could be mentioned in the article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cup_of_Jamshid
{ .. the Cup were said to reveal deep truths. Sometimes, especially in popular depictions such as The Heroic Legend of Arslan, the cup has been visualized as a crystal ball. Helen Zimmern's English translation of the Shahnameh uses the term "crystal globe". }
91.184.95.215 ( talk) 21:10, 28 April 2012 (UTC)
There is some questionable information in this section. It says "many were made" - but I can't find any reference to more than the 8 usually referenced (the seven given to the Faithful, and the Master-stone). If there is a reference to 'many' being made, it should be cited. Also, Unfinished Tales distinctly says that the Stones themselves exerted no power over another will, until Sauron gained control of the Ithil-stone. The essay also explains 'shrouding' and aligning the stones for use, etc. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bflood ( talk • contribs) 00:07, 16 March 2010 (UTC)
I seem to recall from reading one of the books that to view a Palantir, one must look directly into it. The movie, however, has Saruman holding his clawed hand over it. This probably deserves mention in the 'Adaptation' section. (I don't remember where exactly I read it myself.)
Maybe there are different approaches on how to use the stone. The Orthanc Tower was built to watch over the land and see how the people fare. Saruman probably used its stone to have a glance on what the people are doing, wich is the only thing Sauron can see. Pippin would probably see exactly that - what everybody is doing. To figure out what's going on inside them (something that stone would immediately reveal, if it wasn't for Sauron) - something Saruman wouldn't be interested in - it would either take guesswork or a keen yet naive gaze.
—Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.119.84.143 ( talk) 12:35, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
Extensive information on the mechanics of using a Stone, are provided in
Unfinished Tales. I will update with that. One DOES need to look directly into it, and need to be looking in the direction one wants to see.
Might the palantir be the inspiration for Maerlyn's rainbow? PrometheusX303 01:01, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
The Elostirion stone - contradiction with the article on Cirdan. In the current article the Elostirion stone is "taken by Círdan back to Valinor" and "taken back to the West with the three Elven Rings". However, in the article on Cirdan, he does not travel to the West with the 3 rings. The rings travel with Frodo, whereas Cirdan waits for Sam and they travel together. I have NO clue which is canonical/correct, but thought I'd mention it. I will post the same comment on the Cirdan discussion.-- Smcgrother 20:59, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
This claim smacks of OR. It's not even completely accurate, Aragorn wasn't deceived in any way. It's an attempt to relate a number of different events with a single theory. Thu ( talk) 15:51, 22 November 2010 (UTC)
This is not about the topic of a Palantir, but the actual wiki page. The redirection at the top says "Palantir Solutions", but the raw wiki code says, correctly, Palantir Technologies. What gives? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.34.34.43 ( talk) 02:27, 11 August 2011 (UTC)
Regarding GimliDotNet restoring this article's rating to a B here. I suppose your project can rate articles any way you want, but I should tell you that your assessments are way off if you think this article is a B. I wouldn't even classify it as a C. I understand that you may think it is nearing completion because the article covers (seemingly) every appearance of these objects in the novels and adaptations, but the in-universe details are all it covers. The article does not contain anything asserting real-world notability (not even in the film section!). It has only a single secondary (non-Tolkien) source. In its present state, this article is actually prime for AfD or merging into a list as a subtopic not deserving of its own article. If WikiProject Middle-earth actively considers articles like this a B, you should really take another look at the {{ Grading scheme}} so that your dedicated participants are able to improve articles properly.— TAnthony Talk 14:44, 12 October 2015 (UTC)