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On 14 July 2023, it was proposed that this article be moved from PP-19 Vityaz to PP-19-01 Vityaz. The result of the discussion was moved. |
The beginning of the article claims that the Vityaz-SN is the "standard submachine gun for all branches of Russian military", yet none of the references given support this. Anywhere else I search only mentions the Russian police using it. Grimwol ( talk) 15:15, 1 February 2016 (UTC) It is used by Spetsnaz units. Although, they prefer to use AK-74s, because as we all know, rifle calibers are more effective than pistol calibers. I have added the appropriate reference to the statement in question.-- RAF910 ( talk) 18:30, 1 February 2016 (UTC)
See manufacture website [1] the corrct name is Vityaz-SN.-- RAF910 ( talk) 21:55, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
STOP, changing the articles name. The Modern Firearms website notoriously unreliable and in this case it is flat-out wrong. Look at the manufactures website. Look at the photographs. Look at the 360 image. The charging handle is on the right side, not the left. If you change it again, I will file an ANI against you, or you can file an ANI against me, and we'll let the community decide which is correct the Manufacture or the blog/website.-- RAF910 ( talk) 18:58, 26 June 2017 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Not moved. ( non-admin closure) — Frayæ ( Talk/ Spjall) 15:18, 2 October 2018 (UTC)
Vityaz-SN → PP-19-01 Vityaz′ – As can be seen over on Russian Wikipedia's article and Kalashnikov Concern's Russian page for the Vityaz′, the current version is called the PP-19-01 isp.20 "Vityaz′-SN". As Russian Wikipedia states, this is a variant of the PP-19-01 isp.10 "Vityaz′". Whilst Modern Firearms (and Russian Wikipedia, because it uses MF as its source) is incorrect about the nonexistent left-side charging handle and left-side safety/selector lever on the isp.20, it is clearly not wrong about the addition of Picatinny rails, which seems to be the only thing differentiating the isp.10 "Vityaz′" and the isp.20 "Vityaz′-SN". As far as "Vityaz′", rather than "Vityaz" the soft sign is denoted by a prime, though if technical restrictions or convention don't allow, PP-19-01 Vityaz would work too. Thanks, RadiculousJ ( talk) 17:10, 29 August 2018 (UTC) --Relisting. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 20:56, 5 September 2018 (UTC) --Relisting. bd2412 T 00:54, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion:
You can see the reason for deletion at the file description page linked above. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 17:21, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved. Uncontested RM. The suggested name has been discussed in earlier RM's too. ( closed by non-admin page mover) ❯❯❯ Raydann (Talk) 08:08, 21 July 2023 (UTC)
PP-19 Vityaz → PP-19-01 Vityaz – Misspelled: Fixed tittle name. PP-19 refers to the PP-19 Bizon.
If you do a quick search, the "Vityaz" is the PP-19-01 variant. However the name (PP-19) refers to the Bizon.
Furthermore, the previous RM discussion to rename the page to Vityaz-SN was based on the Vityaz-SN (version 20) variant. But the article's scope is not merely about that variant specifically. It's the entirety of that submachine gun line. Which stems from the PP-19-01 "Vityaz".
According to Wikipedia:WikiProject Firearms#Variants, "Variants of a model of a firearm such as folding/telescoping stock variants, target versions, variants chambered in a new caliber, compact/carbine variants, models covered by the same factory-issued users manual generally should not receive their own article. Instead, use a section for the variant in the parent firearm's article or consolidate it into a table or the text."
The parent firearm to the Vityaz-SN is the PP-19-01 "Vityaz".
According to Rosoboronexport description, "9mm PP-19-01 submachine gun Vityaz-SN (ver. 20)".
KalashnikovGroup, the submachine gun's manufacturer also has the same description. "PP 19-01 «Vityaz-SN» submachine gun". JTC22 ( talk) 05:58, 14 July 2023 (UTC)
being capable of shooting 7N31 which has better range and penetration than regular 9x19mm qualifies this to be a pdw 88.128.92.54 ( talk) 20:25, 20 July 2023 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
PP-19-01 Vityaz article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
On 14 July 2023, it was proposed that this article be moved from PP-19 Vityaz to PP-19-01 Vityaz. The result of the discussion was moved. |
The beginning of the article claims that the Vityaz-SN is the "standard submachine gun for all branches of Russian military", yet none of the references given support this. Anywhere else I search only mentions the Russian police using it. Grimwol ( talk) 15:15, 1 February 2016 (UTC) It is used by Spetsnaz units. Although, they prefer to use AK-74s, because as we all know, rifle calibers are more effective than pistol calibers. I have added the appropriate reference to the statement in question.-- RAF910 ( talk) 18:30, 1 February 2016 (UTC)
See manufacture website [1] the corrct name is Vityaz-SN.-- RAF910 ( talk) 21:55, 21 October 2016 (UTC)
STOP, changing the articles name. The Modern Firearms website notoriously unreliable and in this case it is flat-out wrong. Look at the manufactures website. Look at the photographs. Look at the 360 image. The charging handle is on the right side, not the left. If you change it again, I will file an ANI against you, or you can file an ANI against me, and we'll let the community decide which is correct the Manufacture or the blog/website.-- RAF910 ( talk) 18:58, 26 June 2017 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Not moved. ( non-admin closure) — Frayæ ( Talk/ Spjall) 15:18, 2 October 2018 (UTC)
Vityaz-SN → PP-19-01 Vityaz′ – As can be seen over on Russian Wikipedia's article and Kalashnikov Concern's Russian page for the Vityaz′, the current version is called the PP-19-01 isp.20 "Vityaz′-SN". As Russian Wikipedia states, this is a variant of the PP-19-01 isp.10 "Vityaz′". Whilst Modern Firearms (and Russian Wikipedia, because it uses MF as its source) is incorrect about the nonexistent left-side charging handle and left-side safety/selector lever on the isp.20, it is clearly not wrong about the addition of Picatinny rails, which seems to be the only thing differentiating the isp.10 "Vityaz′" and the isp.20 "Vityaz′-SN". As far as "Vityaz′", rather than "Vityaz" the soft sign is denoted by a prime, though if technical restrictions or convention don't allow, PP-19-01 Vityaz would work too. Thanks, RadiculousJ ( talk) 17:10, 29 August 2018 (UTC) --Relisting. Dreamy Jazz 🎷 talk to me | my contributions 20:56, 5 September 2018 (UTC) --Relisting. bd2412 T 00:54, 19 September 2018 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion:
You can see the reason for deletion at the file description page linked above. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 17:21, 25 May 2022 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved. Uncontested RM. The suggested name has been discussed in earlier RM's too. ( closed by non-admin page mover) ❯❯❯ Raydann (Talk) 08:08, 21 July 2023 (UTC)
PP-19 Vityaz → PP-19-01 Vityaz – Misspelled: Fixed tittle name. PP-19 refers to the PP-19 Bizon.
If you do a quick search, the "Vityaz" is the PP-19-01 variant. However the name (PP-19) refers to the Bizon.
Furthermore, the previous RM discussion to rename the page to Vityaz-SN was based on the Vityaz-SN (version 20) variant. But the article's scope is not merely about that variant specifically. It's the entirety of that submachine gun line. Which stems from the PP-19-01 "Vityaz".
According to Wikipedia:WikiProject Firearms#Variants, "Variants of a model of a firearm such as folding/telescoping stock variants, target versions, variants chambered in a new caliber, compact/carbine variants, models covered by the same factory-issued users manual generally should not receive their own article. Instead, use a section for the variant in the parent firearm's article or consolidate it into a table or the text."
The parent firearm to the Vityaz-SN is the PP-19-01 "Vityaz".
According to Rosoboronexport description, "9mm PP-19-01 submachine gun Vityaz-SN (ver. 20)".
KalashnikovGroup, the submachine gun's manufacturer also has the same description. "PP 19-01 «Vityaz-SN» submachine gun". JTC22 ( talk) 05:58, 14 July 2023 (UTC)
being capable of shooting 7N31 which has better range and penetration than regular 9x19mm qualifies this to be a pdw 88.128.92.54 ( talk) 20:25, 20 July 2023 (UTC)