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xfd quit narcing on everyone Im sure that paradox doenst rls for the Usenet or p2p. There is still a core of real sceners!
Is this an article or an advertisement?
Don't really know what to make of this article. Can someone please clarify? -- Dysepsion 05:20, 10 August 2005 (UTC)
At least now it makes sense. Jth299 01:21, 11 August 2005 (UTC)
This article seems extremely POV. We need some neutral documentation. -- Lhademmor 10:36, 10 November 2005 (UTC)
For having been a member of this group at its debuts, I must say the story here looks a little romanced. This page is like a copy/paste of an old history section from the website paradox.com, somewhat rewritten (might be retrived using archive.org). The original was also romanced, more like a self-advertisement written by Max himself. TwilighT 01:21, 01 December 2005 (GMT)
As far as I can tell the subject is valid but the article needs alot of work to wikify. Is there some one familiar with the topic that might be able to save some of it? It seems a waste to lose the entire article. Veritas Liberum 23:00, 06 December 2005 (GMT)
I was curious. Now I know. I think this article deserves it's place. Not that there isn't room for improvement, but when isn't there? Erik E. 23:56, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
Thank you for the link to the music. I've always loved the music from their 'software' and never thought there would be a site that archived it. Time to burn a CD :) -- 71.169.121.142 ( talk) 17:35, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
See Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/PARADOX (warez). Johnleemk | Talk 19:46, 11 December 2005 (UTC)
Well, the best i could do was upload PNG image of the softwares. I would like to expand more, but dont know mutch about the team. -- R2cyberpunk 18:28, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
Should there? Syberwolff 09:13, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
Below is the garbled mess that didn't belong on the article page. It looks like a cross between campaigning against the AFD, talk, and an AFD debate copied and pasted. I'm going to do a little more cleanup on the article and see what becomes of it. Pjbflynn 07:42, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
This article is being considered for deletion for the 2nd time in accordance with Wikipedia's deletion policy.
--- I'm very familiar to the topic and I know personally some of the people quoted in there. I can say that, even if not very elaborated, this article is now factual compared to its previous version several years ago, and properly references the course of the events. I have just added the following facts: . 1991-1993 period when the group collapsed and was reformed . Arrests of ex-Paradox members in 1991. Here is a link to an interview of Olivier where he briefly talks about his own arrests. As it is not an "official" source, I hesitated to quote it in the article: http://zakalwe.fi/~shd/texts/imr/a185oliv.htm . Then, two consecutive arrests of Maximilien, in 1993 (France, just before Christmas) and in 1994 (USA), with two references and links to press articles.
Keep. Title of Le Nouvel Observateur article may be translated in English into "The world leading network of software counterfeiters has been dismantled". Le Nouvel Observateur is one of the four serious weekly news magazines in France (along with L'Express, Le Point, and Marianne). Other articles were also published at that time. To the request for deletion, I would kindly respond there are sources to prove that it is not only a Web group with attitude.
I don't know what happened after 1994 and I am not familiar with any recent stories about warez, cracks, etc. so I can't be of help regarding this. In fact, it was not a Web group at all at the beginning, because nobody were using the Web in 1990.
Also, I think Max Louarn could deserve an article just for the story which led to his second arrest - the one about calling cards. 5 years and 7 months was a record sentence for a pirate at this time, plus he was French on a "business" trip to the US when he was busted, and it was the first time that a non-US hacker was arrested and jailed in the United States for such acts.
He has been ranked one of the five biggest pirates of all times in some charts several years ago, next to Kevin Mitnick and Kevin Poulsen. He was also a friend of Kim Schmitz (who himself has been a member of Paradox). All of them have their Wikipedia pages. One of the stories about Max was entitled "When Greed gets the Grifter" if someone knows where to find it. It was pretty accurate. These charts and related articles seem to have disappeared from the visible web.
At last, Paradox has been the transition group between two periods. It closed the old era started in the 70's-80's, when Olivier launched it in 1990 as a normal "crack" group mainly for fun, with little money connections. Then it became a large business enterprise with Maximilien. For instance, losses in the calling card affair have been estimated at around $50 millions. Tens of thousands of card numbers have been acquired by him who sold these to his contacts all around the world. And it was only one of the branches.
From "just for fun" pirates to "big business" mafias: that's how software piracy has evolved - ask police around the world - and Paradox has been the main architect of this terrible change. -- N00w ( talk) 00:40, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
--- what gives Wikipedia??????? this info everyone has the right to know this website is a encyclopedia so there should be NO Need for this to be removed. its called FREE SPEECH and if your going to remove it then you should not call this site a encyclopedia site. --- I completely agree, there is no reason to remove this information from the public. This is a wiki, lets treat it like one.
Frankly I think their relevence has just been proven by the Vista issue; which has been reported by several sources.
No assertion of notability per the guidelines. A couple of nfos and a short bio compiled by some unknown individual doesn't make an article. Needs some evidence of non-trivial coverage by a reliable source.-- Crossmr 04:04, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
The article serves it's purpose, it informs people who don't know what the warez group Paradox is as to what it is... I mean come on it's a warez group.. it can't really have much other than what it has it's not like their going to list the name and address of all of their members and what software they've cracked when etc. etc... Syberwolff 04:40, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
Wow, what the heck is the use of wikipedia if you can't get information on groups like Paradox? Crossmr, do your homework!—The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:REMOVED ( talk • contribs) 21:48, March 3, 2007.
Paradox is a pretty elaborate group. How exactly will anyone benefit from deleting this article? I think it'd be stupid not to have this article. I'll try to find some sources, so everybody wins. :) -- Vironex 04:55, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
Well, they are notable for producing a crack for Vista that verifies the copy as genuine, allowing one to receive automatic updates. No other group to date has accomplished this feat, and it may also be impossible to "fix" given the nature of the crack. The following article describes this process, but does not directly contain content that violates copyright law. Link to article is here: http://www.uploadcrap.com/?subaction=showcomments&id=1172962283&archive=&start_from=&ucat=&—The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:REMOVED ( talk • contribs) 22:00, March 3, 2007.
Keep. (see below) The article is gaining citations. As I previously stated, this is a very elaborate group and it makes sense to have a Wikipedia article about them. --
Vironex
05:07, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
Merge I would support merging it into the Warez article as a category(Is this right? Like I said: New) and having Paradox(warez) redirect there. Eventually if enough information is collected in that section then maybe give it it's own article Syberwolff 05:07, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
Keep. This team is noteworthy. They are one of the oldest cracking groups, and deserve recognition as such. This is a good historical text, and I would be disappointed to see it disappear. -- HaDAk 12:21, 4 March 2007 (EST)
I would like this page to stay - I found it useful. -Troels
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BetacommandBot ( talk) 15:58, 8 March 2008 (UTC)
Paradox never hacked no ps3. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.171.54.14 ( talk) 04:29, 23 November 2009 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved to Paradox (warez). Favonian ( talk) 11:56, 23 August 2011 (UTC)
PARADOX (warez) → Paradox (warez) – Firstly, proper disambiguation is " warez group" (entity that pirates), not " warez" (actual pirated material). Secondly, per MOS:TM and WP:TITLE, we don't stylize "Paradox" unless exclusively known by that stylization. However, I realize this is borderline WP:COMMONNAME, so taking to requested moves instead of moving myself. — HELLKNOWZ ▎ TALK 12:07, 15 August 2011 (UTC) See also Talk:CLASS_(warez)#Requested_move
Updated to Paradox (warez) per one of two WP:NCDAB alternatives which is closer to Category:Warez groups. — HELLKNOWZ ▎ TALK 08:12, 17 August 2011 (UTC)
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![]() | This article was nominated for deletion on 2007-03-05. The result of the discussion was No consensus. |
![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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xfd quit narcing on everyone Im sure that paradox doenst rls for the Usenet or p2p. There is still a core of real sceners!
Is this an article or an advertisement?
Don't really know what to make of this article. Can someone please clarify? -- Dysepsion 05:20, 10 August 2005 (UTC)
At least now it makes sense. Jth299 01:21, 11 August 2005 (UTC)
This article seems extremely POV. We need some neutral documentation. -- Lhademmor 10:36, 10 November 2005 (UTC)
For having been a member of this group at its debuts, I must say the story here looks a little romanced. This page is like a copy/paste of an old history section from the website paradox.com, somewhat rewritten (might be retrived using archive.org). The original was also romanced, more like a self-advertisement written by Max himself. TwilighT 01:21, 01 December 2005 (GMT)
As far as I can tell the subject is valid but the article needs alot of work to wikify. Is there some one familiar with the topic that might be able to save some of it? It seems a waste to lose the entire article. Veritas Liberum 23:00, 06 December 2005 (GMT)
I was curious. Now I know. I think this article deserves it's place. Not that there isn't room for improvement, but when isn't there? Erik E. 23:56, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
Thank you for the link to the music. I've always loved the music from their 'software' and never thought there would be a site that archived it. Time to burn a CD :) -- 71.169.121.142 ( talk) 17:35, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
See Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/PARADOX (warez). Johnleemk | Talk 19:46, 11 December 2005 (UTC)
Well, the best i could do was upload PNG image of the softwares. I would like to expand more, but dont know mutch about the team. -- R2cyberpunk 18:28, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
Should there? Syberwolff 09:13, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
Below is the garbled mess that didn't belong on the article page. It looks like a cross between campaigning against the AFD, talk, and an AFD debate copied and pasted. I'm going to do a little more cleanup on the article and see what becomes of it. Pjbflynn 07:42, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
This article is being considered for deletion for the 2nd time in accordance with Wikipedia's deletion policy.
--- I'm very familiar to the topic and I know personally some of the people quoted in there. I can say that, even if not very elaborated, this article is now factual compared to its previous version several years ago, and properly references the course of the events. I have just added the following facts: . 1991-1993 period when the group collapsed and was reformed . Arrests of ex-Paradox members in 1991. Here is a link to an interview of Olivier where he briefly talks about his own arrests. As it is not an "official" source, I hesitated to quote it in the article: http://zakalwe.fi/~shd/texts/imr/a185oliv.htm . Then, two consecutive arrests of Maximilien, in 1993 (France, just before Christmas) and in 1994 (USA), with two references and links to press articles.
Keep. Title of Le Nouvel Observateur article may be translated in English into "The world leading network of software counterfeiters has been dismantled". Le Nouvel Observateur is one of the four serious weekly news magazines in France (along with L'Express, Le Point, and Marianne). Other articles were also published at that time. To the request for deletion, I would kindly respond there are sources to prove that it is not only a Web group with attitude.
I don't know what happened after 1994 and I am not familiar with any recent stories about warez, cracks, etc. so I can't be of help regarding this. In fact, it was not a Web group at all at the beginning, because nobody were using the Web in 1990.
Also, I think Max Louarn could deserve an article just for the story which led to his second arrest - the one about calling cards. 5 years and 7 months was a record sentence for a pirate at this time, plus he was French on a "business" trip to the US when he was busted, and it was the first time that a non-US hacker was arrested and jailed in the United States for such acts.
He has been ranked one of the five biggest pirates of all times in some charts several years ago, next to Kevin Mitnick and Kevin Poulsen. He was also a friend of Kim Schmitz (who himself has been a member of Paradox). All of them have their Wikipedia pages. One of the stories about Max was entitled "When Greed gets the Grifter" if someone knows where to find it. It was pretty accurate. These charts and related articles seem to have disappeared from the visible web.
At last, Paradox has been the transition group between two periods. It closed the old era started in the 70's-80's, when Olivier launched it in 1990 as a normal "crack" group mainly for fun, with little money connections. Then it became a large business enterprise with Maximilien. For instance, losses in the calling card affair have been estimated at around $50 millions. Tens of thousands of card numbers have been acquired by him who sold these to his contacts all around the world. And it was only one of the branches.
From "just for fun" pirates to "big business" mafias: that's how software piracy has evolved - ask police around the world - and Paradox has been the main architect of this terrible change. -- N00w ( talk) 00:40, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
--- what gives Wikipedia??????? this info everyone has the right to know this website is a encyclopedia so there should be NO Need for this to be removed. its called FREE SPEECH and if your going to remove it then you should not call this site a encyclopedia site. --- I completely agree, there is no reason to remove this information from the public. This is a wiki, lets treat it like one.
Frankly I think their relevence has just been proven by the Vista issue; which has been reported by several sources.
No assertion of notability per the guidelines. A couple of nfos and a short bio compiled by some unknown individual doesn't make an article. Needs some evidence of non-trivial coverage by a reliable source.-- Crossmr 04:04, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
The article serves it's purpose, it informs people who don't know what the warez group Paradox is as to what it is... I mean come on it's a warez group.. it can't really have much other than what it has it's not like their going to list the name and address of all of their members and what software they've cracked when etc. etc... Syberwolff 04:40, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
Wow, what the heck is the use of wikipedia if you can't get information on groups like Paradox? Crossmr, do your homework!—The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:REMOVED ( talk • contribs) 21:48, March 3, 2007.
Paradox is a pretty elaborate group. How exactly will anyone benefit from deleting this article? I think it'd be stupid not to have this article. I'll try to find some sources, so everybody wins. :) -- Vironex 04:55, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
Well, they are notable for producing a crack for Vista that verifies the copy as genuine, allowing one to receive automatic updates. No other group to date has accomplished this feat, and it may also be impossible to "fix" given the nature of the crack. The following article describes this process, but does not directly contain content that violates copyright law. Link to article is here: http://www.uploadcrap.com/?subaction=showcomments&id=1172962283&archive=&start_from=&ucat=&—The preceding unsigned comment was added by User:REMOVED ( talk • contribs) 22:00, March 3, 2007.
Keep. (see below) The article is gaining citations. As I previously stated, this is a very elaborate group and it makes sense to have a Wikipedia article about them. --
Vironex
05:07, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
Merge I would support merging it into the Warez article as a category(Is this right? Like I said: New) and having Paradox(warez) redirect there. Eventually if enough information is collected in that section then maybe give it it's own article Syberwolff 05:07, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
Keep. This team is noteworthy. They are one of the oldest cracking groups, and deserve recognition as such. This is a good historical text, and I would be disappointed to see it disappear. -- HaDAk 12:21, 4 March 2007 (EST)
I would like this page to stay - I found it useful. -Troels
Image:Pdx herc.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to ensure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
BetacommandBot ( talk) 15:58, 8 March 2008 (UTC)
Paradox never hacked no ps3. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.171.54.14 ( talk) 04:29, 23 November 2009 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved to Paradox (warez). Favonian ( talk) 11:56, 23 August 2011 (UTC)
PARADOX (warez) → Paradox (warez) – Firstly, proper disambiguation is " warez group" (entity that pirates), not " warez" (actual pirated material). Secondly, per MOS:TM and WP:TITLE, we don't stylize "Paradox" unless exclusively known by that stylization. However, I realize this is borderline WP:COMMONNAME, so taking to requested moves instead of moving myself. — HELLKNOWZ ▎ TALK 12:07, 15 August 2011 (UTC) See also Talk:CLASS_(warez)#Requested_move
Updated to Paradox (warez) per one of two WP:NCDAB alternatives which is closer to Category:Warez groups. — HELLKNOWZ ▎ TALK 08:12, 17 August 2011 (UTC)
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