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Some ancient Greek authors, such as Strabo and Plutarch, write of Orpheus as having Thracian origins (through his father, Oeagrus). [1] [2] [3] Although these traditional accounts have been uncritically accepted by some historians, [1] they have been put into question by others, since it was only in the mid-/late 5th century that Orpheus acquired Thracian attributes. [4] [5] Additionally, as André Boulanger notes, "the most characteristic features of Orphism—consciousness of sin, need of purification and redemption, infernal punishments—have never been found among the Thracians". [1] It has also been observed that Pausanias tells us that on Polygnotus' mural in the Cnidian Lesche at Delphi (ca. 460 BCE) Orpheus was represented as a Greek. [4] This is also the case in early vase paintings, where his appearance is contrasted with that of the Thracian men, whom he enchants with his music. [4] Indeed, the introduction of the worship of the Muses in the times of Archelaos, the genealogies featuring Apollo, Pierus and Methone, Orpheus's tomb in Leibethra and the importance of this gesture as a part of the king’s cultural policy, makes the hypothesis of the Pierian, and so Macedonian, roots of Orpheus, highly probable. [6] [7] The testimonies referring to his death, grave and heroic worship, for example early attestations to the existence of a real, or fictitious, gravestone epigram of Orpheus, point most strongly to his Macedonian links. [6] Orpheus's links to Thrace seem to have been sporadic and not "ethnic": he was only "Thracian" when there was a need for him to be and when that part of his portrayal allowed a poet to express a meaning important for themselves and for their audiences. [7] In contrast, when presented as the originator of the Greek musical tradition, he was not viewed as a foreign Thracian, but rather as a Greek Pierian. [7] Jingiby ( talk) 17:39, 24 January 2023 (UTC)
References
The redirect
Father of songs has been listed at
redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the
redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 August 11 § Father of songs until a consensus is reached.
- car chasm (
talk)
00:02, 11 August 2023 (UTC)
The redirect
Father of song has been listed at
redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the
redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 August 11 § Father of song until a consensus is reached.
- car chasm (
talk)
00:02, 11 August 2023 (UTC)
The redirect
The father of songs has been listed at
redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the
redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 August 11 § The father of songs until a consensus is reached.
- car chasm (
talk)
00:02, 11 August 2023 (UTC)
The redirect
The father of song has been listed at
redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the
redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 August 11 § The father of song until a consensus is reached.
- car chasm (
talk)
00:03, 11 August 2023 (UTC)
Orpheus is described as having Apollo and Calliope as parents, but is not a god. At most, he is described as a demigod, but is mainly presented as mortal. I'm just curious about this, and a bit confused, if anyone can explain, please do. Fysri ( talk) 17:25, 6 February 2024 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Orpheus article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: 1 |
![]() | This article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Some ancient Greek authors, such as Strabo and Plutarch, write of Orpheus as having Thracian origins (through his father, Oeagrus). [1] [2] [3] Although these traditional accounts have been uncritically accepted by some historians, [1] they have been put into question by others, since it was only in the mid-/late 5th century that Orpheus acquired Thracian attributes. [4] [5] Additionally, as André Boulanger notes, "the most characteristic features of Orphism—consciousness of sin, need of purification and redemption, infernal punishments—have never been found among the Thracians". [1] It has also been observed that Pausanias tells us that on Polygnotus' mural in the Cnidian Lesche at Delphi (ca. 460 BCE) Orpheus was represented as a Greek. [4] This is also the case in early vase paintings, where his appearance is contrasted with that of the Thracian men, whom he enchants with his music. [4] Indeed, the introduction of the worship of the Muses in the times of Archelaos, the genealogies featuring Apollo, Pierus and Methone, Orpheus's tomb in Leibethra and the importance of this gesture as a part of the king’s cultural policy, makes the hypothesis of the Pierian, and so Macedonian, roots of Orpheus, highly probable. [6] [7] The testimonies referring to his death, grave and heroic worship, for example early attestations to the existence of a real, or fictitious, gravestone epigram of Orpheus, point most strongly to his Macedonian links. [6] Orpheus's links to Thrace seem to have been sporadic and not "ethnic": he was only "Thracian" when there was a need for him to be and when that part of his portrayal allowed a poet to express a meaning important for themselves and for their audiences. [7] In contrast, when presented as the originator of the Greek musical tradition, he was not viewed as a foreign Thracian, but rather as a Greek Pierian. [7] Jingiby ( talk) 17:39, 24 January 2023 (UTC)
References
The redirect
Father of songs has been listed at
redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the
redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 August 11 § Father of songs until a consensus is reached.
- car chasm (
talk)
00:02, 11 August 2023 (UTC)
The redirect
Father of song has been listed at
redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the
redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 August 11 § Father of song until a consensus is reached.
- car chasm (
talk)
00:02, 11 August 2023 (UTC)
The redirect
The father of songs has been listed at
redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the
redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 August 11 § The father of songs until a consensus is reached.
- car chasm (
talk)
00:02, 11 August 2023 (UTC)
The redirect
The father of song has been listed at
redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the
redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at
Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 August 11 § The father of song until a consensus is reached.
- car chasm (
talk)
00:03, 11 August 2023 (UTC)
Orpheus is described as having Apollo and Calliope as parents, but is not a god. At most, he is described as a demigod, but is mainly presented as mortal. I'm just curious about this, and a bit confused, if anyone can explain, please do. Fysri ( talk) 17:25, 6 February 2024 (UTC)