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This article is so what can go wrong with Wikipedia.
It needs to be completely replaced:
1. Brief introduction describing Orion as a Greek divine figure of a certain type.
2. Section: "Etymology". A brief and scientific statement on possible etymologies, all of which are uncertain.
3. Section: "Mythology". A summary of each classical Orion myth, with the classical source cited.
4. Section: "Modern Mythography". A brief, coherent, and objective statement of each major modern "interpretation" of the Orion figure, with the modern author cited. It should not take the position that any of these theories are fact, and should clarify which are feminist interpretations, etc.
— Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.81.222.232 ( talk) 08:02, 16 January 2006 (UTC)
I would but I know nothing about Orion, hence I came here; and found some meandering speculative essay in poor English.
I agree with the writer above.
— Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.179.83.87 ( talk) 13:56, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
Orion ( Greek Ὠρίων),
a Titan
<ref>"His name was rightly associated with [[Otus|Otos]] and [[Ephialtes]], the Aloadai." (Kerenyi, 1951, p. 201, noting ''Odyssey'' 11.310. </ref>
provided the archetype of the primordial hunter in Greek culture.
<ref>""[[Heracles|Herakles]], if one wanted to emphasise the 'culture-hero' element in him, would become at most a hunting hero, an enemy of wild beasts, an Orion, though Orion too was something more than that." (Kerenyi 1959 p. 12).</ref>
Orion was beloved of Eos, the Dawn, and was slain by Artemis, who set him in the sky.
In modern interpretations Orion ("mountain man" if the name is truly Greek) exists on three mythic planes.
On the Neolithic level he is a shaman, the "master of the animals," an Aegean counterpart to Enkidu, the wild companion of Sumerian/Babylonian Gilgamesh.
On the Minoan level, he has been dedicated to the Great Goddess of Crete.
On the Classical level, he has become a threat to the reformed and Olympian Artemis and must be destroyed.
His myth survives only in fragmentary episodes and references
and its meanings were obscure to the patriarchal culture of classical Greece and need some explaining. Orion's journeys may be traced on a map.
—Preceding unsigned comment added by RandomCritic ( talk • contribs) 14:02, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
—Preceding unsigned comment added by Pmanderson ( talk • contribs) 02:54, 13 July 2007 (UTC)
Looking comparatively with another Indo-European language, in this case Romanian, we find a word similar to Orion: "uriaş" which means "giant" [4]. Interestingly, the word for giant is linked in a number of ways with hunger: in a substratum related language, Albanian ( Origin of the Albanians ) "uri" means "hunger" [5]; compare to the wikipedia entry for a Jotunn “glutton” giant, where we find the Old Norse term [Þu]“risi”, and the futhark rune Thurisaz Þ; this thematic link of giants (“rephaim” in Hebrew [6]) and hunger is also found in the Book of Enoch chapter XV. ... 11. “And the spirits of the giants ... cause trouble: they take no food, ⌈but nevertheless hunger⌉ and thirst, and cause offences.” [7]”; also the giant weilding his hammer/club/ass’ jawbone to bring rain and end hunger, such as "Urion" Orion (mythology) chasing the rainmaking Pleiades. Gabrieli 14:02, 2 November 2007 (UTC) The giant rainmaker drops his jaw-bone from the sky as a thunderbolt, just as the "bearded vulture" (Zagan in Romanian) - the eagle-like symbol of the "Zeus"-type giant drops the stone-age jaw-bone/sickle/falx. The jaw-bone with which he had also castrated the father bull Saturn/Taurus/Ata-uri-us, see also Hyginus' mention of Orion chasing Taurus. This ties in with the parent bull's hide birth theme and giant-birthing genital fluids (possibly from the castration) in the Orion myth. The death of Orion by the Scorpion is perhaps symbolical of the constellational attribution change of the bearded eagle (bearded Zeus/Odin/Orion weilding a [curved] weapon) symbology to the Scorpio constellation (with a curved 'tail'), note the opposite positions in the sky of Taurus from Scorpio, the opposition of the Father/Son; Saturn/Jupiter; Saturday/Wednesday; Uranus/Cronus or Cronus/Zeus [repetition of theme]. Again the rainmaking giant weilding a sickle theme ties in with fertility and harvests, and the sacrifice of the [celestial] bull (e.g. for honouring Zeus, who incidentally was hidden shortly afer his birth on the island of the bull-worshippers, to later defeat his father the 'horned god'). A parallel may be drawn with the giant Gilgamesh [Orion] slaying the Bull of Heaven [Taurus] which was a gift from 'Father' Anu [Saturn/Uranus "Ata-Uri-Anu"] to his daughter Inana [Ululu/El/Venus, subsequent ruler of Taurus, possibly due to precession of the equinoxes necessitating a change in the stories of the constellations]. Gabrieli ( talk) 10:48, 28 March 2008 (UTC)Studying the Taurus aspect, consider the aurochs (Bos ursus [1]) reported as being called "uri" by Julius Caesar in 6.28 of "De bello gallico" [2] see also Ur (rune). These uri were found throughout the Hercynian forest which stretches along the Ister (Danube) from the Helvetii to Dacia - (possibly related etymology of Dacia/ Deutsch/ Dutch). Cicero in Verr. iv.57 refers to a Jupiter Urius of the Greeks (therefore Zeus Urius) as "the sender of favourable wind" [3]. Gabrieli ( talk) 10:46, 31 March 2008 (UTC)
Thank-you for your feedback Septentrionalis. Unfortunately, much of the drawing together of ideas is my own, however the ass' jawbone is from the story of the giant Samson in the Bible's Old Testament in Judges Ch. 15, the parallel of Samson with Orion is Bruce Rimell's idea, published on one of his copyrighted & genial websites <:ref> [8]<:/ref> which analyses the story of the rain-making giant, amongst others. Another quotable source that mentions Julius Caesar on uri and much later Jupiter Urius, not tied to Orion however, is in 'Dacia Preistorica', by Nicolae Densusianu, published post mortem in 1913, a free English version: 'Prehistoric Dacia' translated by Alexandra Ioana Furdui is available <:ref>[www.pelasgians.org]<:ref> I hope this helps,{—Preceding unsigned comment added by Gabrieli ( talk • contribs) Coincidentally, Uriaş is pronounced Uriash; Uriash = Ninhursag = Ki, as in topics Enki and Eridu. Gabrieli ( talk) 06:40, 12 August 2008 (UTC) Uriash/Ki/Gaia (snake-holder goddess later partly replaced by Ophiucus and 'snake-grasping-eagle Jupiter' of the adjacent constellation of Scorpius) sends her son Cronos to chase/castrate/sacrifice his bull-father/brother Uranus (son of Gaia) with the agricultural implement, ~ parallel to the farmer Cain (Enki) killing herder Abel (Abzu) scene. This would make Orion not Uriaş as at the start of the talk but fertilising Cronos/Ea/Aquarius. The mind boggles... Gabrieli ( talk) 08:50, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
i dont no what it is but it looks cool —Preceding unsigned comment added by 205.118.89.130 ( talk) 18:33, 4 May 2010 (UTC)
Looking for someone with the necessary expertise to help author a section on Greek mythology in the above article. Thanks. Itsmejudith ( talk) 14:15, 22 November 2011 (UTC)
The see also section currently contains only one entry "Telumehtar" which redirects to a page called "Telumehtar Umbardacil" about the 28th King of Gondor in Tolkien's Middle-Earth. Is that right? It doesn't seem right! 77.99.98.37 ( talk) 19:57, 20 March 2011 (UTC)
I was wondering if this article has been tampered with? Only I spotted an incongruity in the first line of the second paragraph of the section entitled "Cult and popular appreciation": The text reads "The Boeotian school of epic poetry was chiefly concerned with hey how r u?" What's that all about then? The second sentence reads "The genealogies of the gods and heroes; later writers elaborated this web."
I get the sense this should read "The Boeotian school of epic poetry was chiefly concerned with the genealogies of the gods and heroes; later writers elaborated this web."
MrGraphis ( talk) 23:45, 27 September 2010 (UTC)MrGraphis
What does this mean?
76.218.104.120 ( talk) 08:30, 30 June 2013 (UTC)
The editors overlooked Ovid's narration of the birth of Orion in his Fasti, book V if I remember correctly.10:28, 26 February 2016 (UTC)~ The system is out of order and I cannot sign. I am Aldrasto 11.
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![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 | Archive 3 | Archive 4 |
This article is so what can go wrong with Wikipedia.
It needs to be completely replaced:
1. Brief introduction describing Orion as a Greek divine figure of a certain type.
2. Section: "Etymology". A brief and scientific statement on possible etymologies, all of which are uncertain.
3. Section: "Mythology". A summary of each classical Orion myth, with the classical source cited.
4. Section: "Modern Mythography". A brief, coherent, and objective statement of each major modern "interpretation" of the Orion figure, with the modern author cited. It should not take the position that any of these theories are fact, and should clarify which are feminist interpretations, etc.
— Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.81.222.232 ( talk) 08:02, 16 January 2006 (UTC)
I would but I know nothing about Orion, hence I came here; and found some meandering speculative essay in poor English.
I agree with the writer above.
— Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.179.83.87 ( talk) 13:56, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
Orion ( Greek Ὠρίων),
a Titan
<ref>"His name was rightly associated with [[Otus|Otos]] and [[Ephialtes]], the Aloadai." (Kerenyi, 1951, p. 201, noting ''Odyssey'' 11.310. </ref>
provided the archetype of the primordial hunter in Greek culture.
<ref>""[[Heracles|Herakles]], if one wanted to emphasise the 'culture-hero' element in him, would become at most a hunting hero, an enemy of wild beasts, an Orion, though Orion too was something more than that." (Kerenyi 1959 p. 12).</ref>
Orion was beloved of Eos, the Dawn, and was slain by Artemis, who set him in the sky.
In modern interpretations Orion ("mountain man" if the name is truly Greek) exists on three mythic planes.
On the Neolithic level he is a shaman, the "master of the animals," an Aegean counterpart to Enkidu, the wild companion of Sumerian/Babylonian Gilgamesh.
On the Minoan level, he has been dedicated to the Great Goddess of Crete.
On the Classical level, he has become a threat to the reformed and Olympian Artemis and must be destroyed.
His myth survives only in fragmentary episodes and references
and its meanings were obscure to the patriarchal culture of classical Greece and need some explaining. Orion's journeys may be traced on a map.
—Preceding unsigned comment added by RandomCritic ( talk • contribs) 14:02, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
—Preceding unsigned comment added by Pmanderson ( talk • contribs) 02:54, 13 July 2007 (UTC)
Looking comparatively with another Indo-European language, in this case Romanian, we find a word similar to Orion: "uriaş" which means "giant" [4]. Interestingly, the word for giant is linked in a number of ways with hunger: in a substratum related language, Albanian ( Origin of the Albanians ) "uri" means "hunger" [5]; compare to the wikipedia entry for a Jotunn “glutton” giant, where we find the Old Norse term [Þu]“risi”, and the futhark rune Thurisaz Þ; this thematic link of giants (“rephaim” in Hebrew [6]) and hunger is also found in the Book of Enoch chapter XV. ... 11. “And the spirits of the giants ... cause trouble: they take no food, ⌈but nevertheless hunger⌉ and thirst, and cause offences.” [7]”; also the giant weilding his hammer/club/ass’ jawbone to bring rain and end hunger, such as "Urion" Orion (mythology) chasing the rainmaking Pleiades. Gabrieli 14:02, 2 November 2007 (UTC) The giant rainmaker drops his jaw-bone from the sky as a thunderbolt, just as the "bearded vulture" (Zagan in Romanian) - the eagle-like symbol of the "Zeus"-type giant drops the stone-age jaw-bone/sickle/falx. The jaw-bone with which he had also castrated the father bull Saturn/Taurus/Ata-uri-us, see also Hyginus' mention of Orion chasing Taurus. This ties in with the parent bull's hide birth theme and giant-birthing genital fluids (possibly from the castration) in the Orion myth. The death of Orion by the Scorpion is perhaps symbolical of the constellational attribution change of the bearded eagle (bearded Zeus/Odin/Orion weilding a [curved] weapon) symbology to the Scorpio constellation (with a curved 'tail'), note the opposite positions in the sky of Taurus from Scorpio, the opposition of the Father/Son; Saturn/Jupiter; Saturday/Wednesday; Uranus/Cronus or Cronus/Zeus [repetition of theme]. Again the rainmaking giant weilding a sickle theme ties in with fertility and harvests, and the sacrifice of the [celestial] bull (e.g. for honouring Zeus, who incidentally was hidden shortly afer his birth on the island of the bull-worshippers, to later defeat his father the 'horned god'). A parallel may be drawn with the giant Gilgamesh [Orion] slaying the Bull of Heaven [Taurus] which was a gift from 'Father' Anu [Saturn/Uranus "Ata-Uri-Anu"] to his daughter Inana [Ululu/El/Venus, subsequent ruler of Taurus, possibly due to precession of the equinoxes necessitating a change in the stories of the constellations]. Gabrieli ( talk) 10:48, 28 March 2008 (UTC)Studying the Taurus aspect, consider the aurochs (Bos ursus [1]) reported as being called "uri" by Julius Caesar in 6.28 of "De bello gallico" [2] see also Ur (rune). These uri were found throughout the Hercynian forest which stretches along the Ister (Danube) from the Helvetii to Dacia - (possibly related etymology of Dacia/ Deutsch/ Dutch). Cicero in Verr. iv.57 refers to a Jupiter Urius of the Greeks (therefore Zeus Urius) as "the sender of favourable wind" [3]. Gabrieli ( talk) 10:46, 31 March 2008 (UTC)
Thank-you for your feedback Septentrionalis. Unfortunately, much of the drawing together of ideas is my own, however the ass' jawbone is from the story of the giant Samson in the Bible's Old Testament in Judges Ch. 15, the parallel of Samson with Orion is Bruce Rimell's idea, published on one of his copyrighted & genial websites <:ref> [8]<:/ref> which analyses the story of the rain-making giant, amongst others. Another quotable source that mentions Julius Caesar on uri and much later Jupiter Urius, not tied to Orion however, is in 'Dacia Preistorica', by Nicolae Densusianu, published post mortem in 1913, a free English version: 'Prehistoric Dacia' translated by Alexandra Ioana Furdui is available <:ref>[www.pelasgians.org]<:ref> I hope this helps,{—Preceding unsigned comment added by Gabrieli ( talk • contribs) Coincidentally, Uriaş is pronounced Uriash; Uriash = Ninhursag = Ki, as in topics Enki and Eridu. Gabrieli ( talk) 06:40, 12 August 2008 (UTC) Uriash/Ki/Gaia (snake-holder goddess later partly replaced by Ophiucus and 'snake-grasping-eagle Jupiter' of the adjacent constellation of Scorpius) sends her son Cronos to chase/castrate/sacrifice his bull-father/brother Uranus (son of Gaia) with the agricultural implement, ~ parallel to the farmer Cain (Enki) killing herder Abel (Abzu) scene. This would make Orion not Uriaş as at the start of the talk but fertilising Cronos/Ea/Aquarius. The mind boggles... Gabrieli ( talk) 08:50, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
i dont no what it is but it looks cool —Preceding unsigned comment added by 205.118.89.130 ( talk) 18:33, 4 May 2010 (UTC)
Looking for someone with the necessary expertise to help author a section on Greek mythology in the above article. Thanks. Itsmejudith ( talk) 14:15, 22 November 2011 (UTC)
The see also section currently contains only one entry "Telumehtar" which redirects to a page called "Telumehtar Umbardacil" about the 28th King of Gondor in Tolkien's Middle-Earth. Is that right? It doesn't seem right! 77.99.98.37 ( talk) 19:57, 20 March 2011 (UTC)
I was wondering if this article has been tampered with? Only I spotted an incongruity in the first line of the second paragraph of the section entitled "Cult and popular appreciation": The text reads "The Boeotian school of epic poetry was chiefly concerned with hey how r u?" What's that all about then? The second sentence reads "The genealogies of the gods and heroes; later writers elaborated this web."
I get the sense this should read "The Boeotian school of epic poetry was chiefly concerned with the genealogies of the gods and heroes; later writers elaborated this web."
MrGraphis ( talk) 23:45, 27 September 2010 (UTC)MrGraphis
What does this mean?
76.218.104.120 ( talk) 08:30, 30 June 2013 (UTC)
The editors overlooked Ovid's narration of the birth of Orion in his Fasti, book V if I remember correctly.10:28, 26 February 2016 (UTC)~ The system is out of order and I cannot sign. I am Aldrasto 11.
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Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 16:39, 16 July 2016 (UTC)
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I have just modified 4 external links on Orion (mythology). Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 04:48, 29 September 2017 (UTC)