The contents of the Timothy Ballard page were merged into Operation Underground Railroad. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected page, please see its history; for the discussion at that location, see its talk page. |
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FMSky, and here you removed one clause of a compound sentence with the three sources for the entire compound sentence with the justification WP:ROLLINGSTONEPOLITICS, although the subject isn't politics and two of the three sources are not the Rolling Stone. Please, self-revert. Space4Time3Continuum2x (cowabunga) 16:19, 3 September 2023 (UTC)
According to a 2021 RfC discussion, there is unanimous consensus among editors that Rolling Stone is generally unreliable for politically and societally sensitive issues-- FMSky ( talk) 16:20, 3 September 2023 (UTC)
Since previous discussions didn't come to a conclusion I'm staring this RfC.
Can the following statement be included and presented as a fact: In July 2023, Ballard left his CEO position at O.U.R., after an internal investigation into claims made against him by multiple employees.
[1]
[2]
, when it is only sourced to Rollingstone and Vice, see
WP:ROLLINGSTONEPOLITICS and
WP:VICE --
FMSky (
talk) 07:20, 5 September 2023 (UTC)
“the circumstances around Ballard’s departure are somewhat unclear”, they don’t give a date and they’re just citing Vice for the split, so I’m not sure why it’s even needed for this sentence. The fact that they have split seems uncontroversial, at least according to this Salt Lake Tribune article, which also states:
“Vice reported the split stemmed from an internal investigation conducted into complaints about Ballard, but details are sparse”, and I think that we would be sensible to state the same here. Vice lacks a consensus according to the summary at WP:VICE, so I think an WP:INTEXT attribution is a sensible route. And of course we would be doing better work if we found higher quality sources to cite the same, even if they only attribute Vice. — HTGS ( talk) 19:21, 5 September 2023 (UTC)
According to a 2021 RfC discussion, there is unanimous consensus among editors that Rolling Stone is generally unreliable for politically and societally sensitive issues. An anti sex trafficking organization is exactly that -- FMSky ( talk) 04:11, 6 September 2023 (UTC)
Vice is know[n] as a biased far left outlet? voorts ( talk/ contributions) 13:19, 10 September 2023 (UTC)
Yes on exit, exclude or attribute reason - There’s no reason to doubt the veracity of the Vice News reporting which is backed by a statement from OUR itself, and it’s also been reported separately by the Washington Post. – dlthewave ☎ 01:37, 9 September 2023 (UTC)
"The former federal agent whose anti-trafficking exploits inspired a hotly debated film that became an unexpected box-office hit this month has parted ways with the controversial organization he founded. Ballard, a former Department of Homeland Security agent who has helped stage sting operations to catch child sex traffickers, left OUR before “Sound of Freedom” hit theaters, the organization said. Vice News first reported his exit earlier Thursday."Interpret this as you will, but I read it as a courtesy acknowledgement that Vice scooped the story first - I don't see any attribution language like "according to" or "as reported by". I'm confident that we're looking at WaPo's own reporting here and they also cite a statement from OUR itself. – dlthewave ☎ 23:24, 11 September 2023 (UTC)
Given that the Washington Post has now reported on the internal investigation, should this RfC be closed, the information incorporated into the article, and a new RfC opened regarding whether the fact of the internal investigation should be mentioned in the lead? Pinging @ FMSky, Horse Eye's Back, Jackinthebox9, Dlthewave, MaximusEditor, Random person no 362478479, Andrew Englehart, Fred Zepelin, Aquillion, Wuerzele, Pistongrinder, and HTGS (sorry if I missed anyone). voorts ( talk/ contributions) 15:46, 24 September 2023 (UTC)
"Ballard left O.U.R. in 2023 amid accusations of misconduct"in the lead with a slightly longer explanation in the body. – dlthewave ☎ 01:39, 25 September 2023 (UTC)
References
If there's any real problem with the film thematically, it's with Caviezel, who plays the real-life Ballard with a Dudley Do-Right posture. Given that Ballard is a Mormon in law enforcement, maybe there's not any darkness there. Though consider the fact he left the organization he founded — Operation Underground Railroad — just last month due to an internal investigation after complaints from employees and donors merged.
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
I'd like to open a discussion about FMSky's more or less open advocacy while editing this article. Every single edit they have made has been to either delete negative information about the organization and/or its founder, or to re-word existing text in order to lessen the impact of sentences they consider negative. Thoughts? Fred Zepelin ( talk) 18:47, 29 September 2023 (UTC)
Every single edit they have made has been to either add negative information about the organization and/or its founder, or to re-word existing text in order to lessen the impact of sentences they consider positive. Thoughts? -- FMSky ( talk) 04:36, 30 September 2023 (UTC)
This is no longer being reported by "just" Vice. See [2] Fred Zepelin ( talk) 21:49, 2 October 2023 (UTC)
I want to help overseas in search of anyone being ruined by human trafficking. I have many skills that I’ve acquired over the last 10 years. I want to help. When the right person sees this please reach out 309-208-1559. I’m interested in volunteering to be on the front lines asap. 207.179.214.222 ( talk) 06:59, 24 February 2024 (UTC)
The contents of the Timothy Ballard page were merged into Operation Underground Railroad. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected page, please see its history; for the discussion at that location, see its talk page. |
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Operation Underground Railroad article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: Index, 1Auto-archiving period: 90 days |
This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page. |
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Index
|
|
This page has archives. Sections older than 90 days may be automatically archived by ClueBot III when more than 5 sections are present. |
FMSky, and here you removed one clause of a compound sentence with the three sources for the entire compound sentence with the justification WP:ROLLINGSTONEPOLITICS, although the subject isn't politics and two of the three sources are not the Rolling Stone. Please, self-revert. Space4Time3Continuum2x (cowabunga) 16:19, 3 September 2023 (UTC)
According to a 2021 RfC discussion, there is unanimous consensus among editors that Rolling Stone is generally unreliable for politically and societally sensitive issues-- FMSky ( talk) 16:20, 3 September 2023 (UTC)
Since previous discussions didn't come to a conclusion I'm staring this RfC.
Can the following statement be included and presented as a fact: In July 2023, Ballard left his CEO position at O.U.R., after an internal investigation into claims made against him by multiple employees.
[1]
[2]
, when it is only sourced to Rollingstone and Vice, see
WP:ROLLINGSTONEPOLITICS and
WP:VICE --
FMSky (
talk) 07:20, 5 September 2023 (UTC)
“the circumstances around Ballard’s departure are somewhat unclear”, they don’t give a date and they’re just citing Vice for the split, so I’m not sure why it’s even needed for this sentence. The fact that they have split seems uncontroversial, at least according to this Salt Lake Tribune article, which also states:
“Vice reported the split stemmed from an internal investigation conducted into complaints about Ballard, but details are sparse”, and I think that we would be sensible to state the same here. Vice lacks a consensus according to the summary at WP:VICE, so I think an WP:INTEXT attribution is a sensible route. And of course we would be doing better work if we found higher quality sources to cite the same, even if they only attribute Vice. — HTGS ( talk) 19:21, 5 September 2023 (UTC)
According to a 2021 RfC discussion, there is unanimous consensus among editors that Rolling Stone is generally unreliable for politically and societally sensitive issues. An anti sex trafficking organization is exactly that -- FMSky ( talk) 04:11, 6 September 2023 (UTC)
Vice is know[n] as a biased far left outlet? voorts ( talk/ contributions) 13:19, 10 September 2023 (UTC)
Yes on exit, exclude or attribute reason - There’s no reason to doubt the veracity of the Vice News reporting which is backed by a statement from OUR itself, and it’s also been reported separately by the Washington Post. – dlthewave ☎ 01:37, 9 September 2023 (UTC)
"The former federal agent whose anti-trafficking exploits inspired a hotly debated film that became an unexpected box-office hit this month has parted ways with the controversial organization he founded. Ballard, a former Department of Homeland Security agent who has helped stage sting operations to catch child sex traffickers, left OUR before “Sound of Freedom” hit theaters, the organization said. Vice News first reported his exit earlier Thursday."Interpret this as you will, but I read it as a courtesy acknowledgement that Vice scooped the story first - I don't see any attribution language like "according to" or "as reported by". I'm confident that we're looking at WaPo's own reporting here and they also cite a statement from OUR itself. – dlthewave ☎ 23:24, 11 September 2023 (UTC)
Given that the Washington Post has now reported on the internal investigation, should this RfC be closed, the information incorporated into the article, and a new RfC opened regarding whether the fact of the internal investigation should be mentioned in the lead? Pinging @ FMSky, Horse Eye's Back, Jackinthebox9, Dlthewave, MaximusEditor, Random person no 362478479, Andrew Englehart, Fred Zepelin, Aquillion, Wuerzele, Pistongrinder, and HTGS (sorry if I missed anyone). voorts ( talk/ contributions) 15:46, 24 September 2023 (UTC)
"Ballard left O.U.R. in 2023 amid accusations of misconduct"in the lead with a slightly longer explanation in the body. – dlthewave ☎ 01:39, 25 September 2023 (UTC)
References
If there's any real problem with the film thematically, it's with Caviezel, who plays the real-life Ballard with a Dudley Do-Right posture. Given that Ballard is a Mormon in law enforcement, maybe there's not any darkness there. Though consider the fact he left the organization he founded — Operation Underground Railroad — just last month due to an internal investigation after complaints from employees and donors merged.
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
I'd like to open a discussion about FMSky's more or less open advocacy while editing this article. Every single edit they have made has been to either delete negative information about the organization and/or its founder, or to re-word existing text in order to lessen the impact of sentences they consider negative. Thoughts? Fred Zepelin ( talk) 18:47, 29 September 2023 (UTC)
Every single edit they have made has been to either add negative information about the organization and/or its founder, or to re-word existing text in order to lessen the impact of sentences they consider positive. Thoughts? -- FMSky ( talk) 04:36, 30 September 2023 (UTC)
This is no longer being reported by "just" Vice. See [2] Fred Zepelin ( talk) 21:49, 2 October 2023 (UTC)
I want to help overseas in search of anyone being ruined by human trafficking. I have many skills that I’ve acquired over the last 10 years. I want to help. When the right person sees this please reach out 309-208-1559. I’m interested in volunteering to be on the front lines asap. 207.179.214.222 ( talk) 06:59, 24 February 2024 (UTC)