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Archive 1 |
This anonymous person has repeatedly vandalized the page, even after being politely asked to "talk" about disagreements on this talk page. What can be done about this? Can we ban an IP address from this particular page? JonathanFreed 06:43, 18 August 2005 (UTC)
IMO the most likely scenario for the Oak Island pit is this.
The comments made above are as valid and no more pertinent then the assertations they refute.
198.93.113.49 13:38, 8 April 2005 (UTC)
If anybody knows the street address or similar information, then we could find the value of Oak Island according to the provincial government of Nova Scotia: http://www.nsassessmentonline.ca/
There is a fairly good picture of the island on page 25 (35) of a pdf ( http://www.oakislandsociety.ca/feasibility.pdf). The picture appears to have lot or parcel numbers. However, if you enter them into the "Assessment Account Number" (AAN) search page, you will get no results.
Page 14 (22) of the pdf has detailed information about the lot owners (as of the pdf's Jan-2005 publication): "Triton owns ... 23 of the 32 lots, and another two lots are owned privately by the two directors of the company, David Tobias and Dan Blankenship. (Mr. Blankenship’s lot has been divided, with his son David owning the other piece.) ... Fred Nolan ... owns five lots on the north side of the island; lots 9 – 12 and 14. ... Robert Young owns lot 5 to the northwest, while David and Christine Johnston own lot 13 to the northeast."
_The Globe and Mail_ purportedly said the following about ownership and value: "In Nova Scotia, two septuagenarians own most of Oak Island ... Last month, they said they would give up their treasure hunt if they found a suitable taker ... (The asking price) of Oak Island: $7 million. But island resident and co-owner Dan Blankenship, who began searching for buried treasure in 1965, said the property is worth $50 million if the buried booty ... is taken into account..." --Unsigned editorial in The Globe & Mail, 11 January 2003 (from http://www.littletechshoppe.com/ns1625/quotes.html on 1-May-2005)
Does anybody have any information from his June 2004 presentation? Does anybody want to grab his picture for this article? see http://www.ideacityonline.com/2004presenters.asp, http://www.ideacityonline.com/2004presenters/dan_blankenship.html, and http://www.ideacityonline.com/2004presenters/images/dan_blankenship.jpg
Blankenship wrote the following note at the conference in response to the prompt, "AN IDEA THAT COULD CHANGE THE WORLD:"
THE FOLLOWING TEXT MAY BE GOOD FOR THE IMAGE'S DESCRIPTION PAGE:
Daniel C. Blankenship (born circa 1924), is a resident of Oak Island, Nova Scotia, and is a director of Triton Alliance, Ltd. Triton, Blankenship, and David Tobias, another director, own most of Oak Island, site of the "Money Pit". Blankship was one of about fifty presenters at ideaCity 2004 in Toronto (June 20-22, 2004). The event's promotional materials described Blankenship as a "Treasure Hunter":
This picture is from the online version of the ideaCity 2004's promotional materials.
It is unclear which, if any, of the following applies, because a web address of the picture is known as of 5-May-2005, but the original photographer (aka the original "source") is not known.
{{ Promophoto}}
{{ Fairuseunsure}}
{{ fairuseunknownsource}}
{{ Promotional}}
A variety of sources on the web, including the recent pdf at http://www.oakislandsociety.ca/feasibility.pdf, have alluded to some sort of legal battle between David Tobias and Dan Blankenship. If this is true, then where has the case or cases been filed? What is the case number? Court records are frequently available to the public. Can somebody get the records and put them on WikiSource or something?
Is Triton a corporation? If yes, then where was it incorporated? What documents are available and where? Stock certificates? Annual Reports?
There's a discrepancy in the artcile.
In one place it says:
And almost immediately after that:
Was the first published account in 1862, or do accounts go back to 1857?-- 198.93.113.49 14:26, 20 May 2005 (UTC)
I've found a list of source on the Critical Enquiry page. These are the 19th century ones
So it looks like 1857 is the earliest.-- 198.93.113.49 15:16, 20 May 2005 (UTC)
The following quote attributed to Dunfield was added at some point:
I've left it in the article for now, but I think it needs a source. I cannot confirm it.-- 198.93.113.49 17:47, 23 May 2005 (UTC)
I'd like a source for this claim as well:
It's from the same editor as the above quote I questioned. I may go ahead and delete them and then put them back if and when there's a source.-- 198.93.113.49 17:55, 23 May 2005 (UTC)
For the former, the quote appears to be from this thread: http://forum.oakislandtreasure.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=69&start=15 (the original posts seems to have been removed, so the quoted text only appears in followups)
For the latter, see http://www.criticalenquiry.org/oakisland/whoi.htm which refers to Aubrey and Gallo at the Woods Hole institute (both can be found via the WHOI site; Gallo is Director of Special Projects)
I've tagged this article with NPOV because 192.197.71.189 says this article has a slant and has repeatedly added his own disclaimer saying so. I left a message on his talk page asking that he stop by to clarify what it is that he has a problem with and how it could be corrected. -- NormanEinstein 18:46, 30 May 2005 (UTC)
Hello,
I run the CriticalEnquiry site and wanted to comment about a few things.
1) the 1857-1862 article dispute: it's true the first article we know of that mentions the Pit is from 1857, but it contains significantly less detail than later versions. Thus it may be more accurate to say that 1857 is the first public mention of the topic in a newspaper, but 1861-2 is when the first detailed account of the alleged early works was published. I'm presently in the process of data entering the entirety of the first detailed article for inclusion on the CriticalEnquiry Web site.
2) The Dunfield "we resolved the water problem..." quote was originally posted on an Oak Island discussion forum by Dunfield's son sometime in 2004. It generated a storm of outrage from the Believers, who claimed it was out of context and inaccurate. The quote came directly from Dunfield's diaries, circa 1966, and I believe it was written after he'd completed a great deal of his excavation work. It was not out of context. However, the quote apparently has been removed from the Forum site by persons unknown.
3) the "interviews conducted with the scientists reveal they were unconvinced of the existence of the fabled "flood tunnel" citation can be found at http://www.criticalenquiry.org/oakisland/whoi.htm -- I interviewed several of the scientists and provided a synopsis of their report.
4) the person responsible for the angry notes claiming the present article is "slanted" is a proponent of the treasure theory who consistently derides all dissenting viewpoints. He and others claim there is a great deal of "unpublished evidence in private hands" that confirm the existence of treasure on the island, but refuse to disclose the nature of any of this evidence to those they see as enemies.
(Update 11/14/05)
I removed the reference to the offender's name as requested (that was inappropriate, sorry) but disagree with his assertions below. Many Oak Island "believers" make the assertion that "a great deal of unpublished material exists" to support the treasure story and veracity of the usual "boys finding treasure" legend, but refuse to divulge this material. Thus, it is unavailable for study and should not be thrown up as "proof" that articles that do not support the usual legend are inaccurate or incomplete. The evidence must be produced, or claims of its existence cannot be used to belittle the efforts of those who wish to create a balanced POV for this story.
Regarding the claim that more material lies in the NS Public Archives: I have been in touch with these people repeatedly, and they claim the earliest articles are those from the 1857-1862 period. If the plaintiff below can provide exact references, I'll be happy to obtain and review them.
Hi,
I am the party (angry guy) who has been besmirched in a "comment" (above)on this web page. I wish to firstly state that, I would like very much for the author of that comment, as an act of decent conduct, to remove it as it is slanderous and incorrect. While I may be fairly categorized as a "proponent" of Oak Island history, I am not now, nor have I ever been "involved with Triton”, among other unsubstantiated claims.
I have read the information posted here regarding the Oak Island treasure hunt and I judge it to be a fair appraisal for the average reader who may then want to go elsewhere and discover the full details to make up their own mind as to the veracity of this story. It is however, not without a skeptically biased view point thus making the credibility of the information questionable.
Yes, there is a lot of unpublished Oak Island information, volumes of it, that pertain to the treasure hunt and some of it is from prior to the much toted 1857 newspaper article. Some of it is in the Nova Scotia Public Archives, Dalhousie University Library, many other libraries and in the hands of private collectors all over North America. That it is not available for one and all to view on the internet is most regrettable. Those are however, the facts of life regarding Oak Island material.
While a reference to a posting from Dunfield's son was added here refuting the belief in the existence of the flood tunnel from Smith's Cove, (taken totally out of context by the way), it is interesting to note that he (Dunfield Sr.) has equally been quoted in a Halifax Nova Scotia newspaper as believing in the existence of the reported South Shore flood tunnel. There is plenty of evidence to suggest the contrary on both counts. To take a small portion of a larger letter and hold it up as not being taken out of context, certainly is just that. Any "outrage" was in support of the guiding principles of fair play.
The "Scientists" who have been interviewed by the gentleman who runs the CriticalEnquiry web site either forgot one crucial feature to their examination of Oak Island, or it was omitted on purpose to create a lop sided viewpoint. Their scientific evaluation of Oak Island was not completed. The funding for their study ran out, and their evaluation was never finished, hardly good science to make claims from. These scientists were not the only body of scientific rigor that has been applied to Oak Island either, just so you dear reader fully understand that there is much information to the contrary.
One should always be prepared to operate under reasonable guidelines and never name names in an accusatory fashion on a public site like this. It is a shameful display of poor taste. 24.222.219.23 08:51, 10 September 2005 (UTC)
Wyss, thank you for your learned posting. Very clever from a fellow who has done so much research to draw such a conclusion......you have done some research on this,...correct??? 24.222.219.23 20:40, 11 September 2005 (UTC)
Please sign your posts with four tildes and please try to be civil (that would include avoiding uncalled for sarcasm). Thanks. Wyss 00:46, 12 September 2005 (UTC)
Its obvious that Wikipedia (which is a stupid sounding name and sounds like baby formula) is slanted and only allows those who speculate against Oak Island and not allowing those who speculate for Oak Island, calling it a learned opinion. Oak Island is under enough controversey without so called authorities adding insult to injury. If you allow one speculated opinion you have to allow the other.
I added a reference to the thrilling novel Riptide which was based partly on the Oak Island mystery. Kit 02:42:09, 2005-08-02 (UTC)
–Removed one reference to the novel. It is included by name in first part of the "popular culture" section ("Several works of fiction...") and an additional reference seems redundant. It had more information about the book, but nothing that couldn't be found on the book's own linked article. I considered adding the same information about the other works mentioned, and remove the "Several works...," part, but decided that the short list works fine for these purposes, as further information can be found by following the links (for those works which have them). Noble 19:28, 10 October 2007 (UTC)
This article was in need of much syntax and flow editing, which I have done. I remember reading about this when I was little (nothing seems to have happened since then, except the Woods Hole survey). I tend to think that the kids who first found it either mistook a natural sinkhole (most likely) for something else, or they ran across an abandoned site that had been used for some sort of construction or other work. The site has been so obliterated that it may never be possible to determine what they originally found. I don't know of any proper archaeological records. Wyss 22:20, 27 August 2005 (UTC)
I've added a number of citations, and integrated those that were simply listed at the end, in the interests of WP:STYLE. More to come, too. I've also performed some cleanup. Nobody of consequence 04:30, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
In the "early history" section I removed the reference to a cryptographer (changed it to the more generic "researcher" since there's no evidence any cryptographic analysis was actually performed). Evidence seems to suggest that author and literary figure James DeMille, who was a professor at Dalhousie College in Nova Scotia during the 1860s, is responsible for this translation.
I also added detail about A.T. Kempton and E.R. Snow, their relationship to the symbols, and the fact that the currently known set of symbols only appeared circa 1951 in Snow's book. bloodylance ( talk) 21:30, 25 January 2008 (UTC)
bloodylance ( talk) 00:58, 26 February 2008 (UTC) I don't recall ever seeing a link to that site before. When was it deleted?
Probably Henry Every, a.k.a. Long Ben Avery. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.25.10.86 ( talk) 07:08, 11 July 2008 (UTC)
I've been adding a number of original documents to the Oak Island Treasure archive section - http://www.oakislandtreasure.co.uk/content/view/156/137/ This includes the original coconut fibre carbon dating reports.
Would it be worth adding these actual documents as the primary sources in the article, rather than the secondary sources which currently exist?
Numerous Oak Island documents dating to 1753 are available at http://www.oakislandtheories.com with Public Archives of NS Ref Number, etc. Original grant of 1753 made by Governor Lawrence to John Gifford and Richard Smith of New York for fishing (from this Smith it derived the name Smith’s Island until ~1764) , original survey and description of 1764, property deeds and 'lot draws' dating to 1765; Poll Tax records of 1791,92,93,94 showing people living on the island; a property deed showing McGinnis’ first lot purchase of March 1788 and Ball's first purchase during Nov 1788; a first edition History of Lunenburg County which identifies different participants; much family information on the participants, before, during, and after discovery…and much more. This site is pleased to offer the most comprehensive collection of Oak Island documents to be found online, many for the first time in public view)and also provides great insight into the local community of period times.
Through the above documents of unquestionable provenance, we now understand the version and timeline as told by Anthony Vaughan Jr. to be unfounded, and the 1893 Prospectus tale/legend of discovery involving three boys rowing out to an uninhabited island as fantasy. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.7.228.85 ( talk) 02:39, 15 August 2008 (UTC)
There are suppose to be 13 Crystal Skulls and only 5 have been found I'm thinking one is on the moon in Shorty Crater and I'm thinking one is on the money pit on Oak Island. I have heard some think the world will come to a end in 2012 and we as humans must bring the 13 skulls together to figure out the secrets to stopping the End of the world.
Mcboo ( talk) 01:14, 16 November 2008 (UTC) Conrad
"The five box drains made from flat stones did exist and were identified and recorded by the Restalls.[14]Oak Island stone triangle formation related to the nearby Birch Island triangle, theorized by First Nations Keith Ranville." The article doesn't mention the drains elsewhere, so the sentence is oddly written. As for the triangles, I'm not sure what that sentence fragment is about at all? Шизомби ( talk) 21:59, 14 January 2009 (UTC)
Notably absent from recent history is the account of the informal organization calling themselves TROUVER (pronounced tru-vey, the French word for “to find”). The group formed in 1967 consisted of three young men; Carl Merz, Eric Hensen and Terry Scheid. They were granted written permission for access and excavation to the site for a brief period of time. In July of 1967 Carl and Eric (both from Deer Park, NY) visited and examined the pit site and the previous dig. A radically different plan for excavation and recovery was devised by them, circumventing the flooding issues. It required a fair investment to implement. The money was never raised and the rights passed back to holder at the time, soon after. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.169.39.231 ( talk) 17:48, 20 May 2009 (UTC)
The article makes it sound as though the boys were exploring some previously unknown location. The island had been platted and the parents of Anthony Vaughan owned 7 lots covered with trees on the island including the one directly adjacent to the pit location. The Vaughan family were ship builders and operated a lumber mill. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.192.132.65 ( talk) 03:27, 15 August 2009 (UTC)
This article states that the island is underlain by water filled limestone cavities (anhydrite). Limestone is predominately Calcium carbonate(CaCO3), or Dolomite (Mg,Ca(CO3)2). Anhydrite(CaSO4) is an evaporite mineral closely related to gypsum. Calling anhydrite a limestone is like saying salt is sugar. These form in separate environments, and are not the same. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.123.79.218 ( talk) 06:36, 15 September 2009 (UTC)
The In Search of... Oak Island episode said the wood in the platforms was later C-14 dated to 1575. Given C-14 dates are a range rather than an exact date does anyone know who did the dating and what the range was?-- BruceGrubb ( talk) 09:58, 10 May 2010 (UTC)
This is the first comment I've ever heard regarding additional C14 dating on the island's artifacts. However, since all the platforms (if they existed) had long vanished prior to the advent of carbon dating, I find this assertion unlikely. Djoltes ( talk) 00:54 29 Sep 2010. —Preceding undated comment added 04:58, 30 September 2010 (UTC).
While Barry Fell may be the author of disputed works, calling him a 'crank' does not adhere to WP:NPOV. I suggest the following:
Can we agree on that change? Tgeairn ( talk) 22:52, 1 May 2011 (UTC)
Oak Island is referenced in "The Jeffereson Key" by Steve Berry, published 2011. 150.198.1.212 ( talk) 16:11, 26 January 2014 (UTC)
Currently, this "documentary" is cited for the claim that there is evidence that the Ark of the Covenant lies buried in the Money Pit. Is this really appropriate? Besides the History Channel's own credibility, that particular part of the documentary also suggested that the Ark contained a mysterious artifact left by ancient astronauts/aliens, which gave the Philistines radiation poisoning when they opened the Ark. I'm hesitant to just remove it, as I couldn't find a policy regarding dealing with cites from sources that put out documentaries of lies in addition to regular documentaries. 96.60.50.30 ( talk) 18:08, 8 August 2010 (UTC)
PT Barnum was right!!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.67.221.24 ( talk) 05:12, 3 February 2014 (UTC) My name is Melissa Lynn Conquest. I enjoy watching the curse of Oak Island
So on the History show, it said the island used to contain a lot of oak trees (hence the island's name, I assume), which are not native to the area (and thus another oddity about the island). This is probably worth including (as the source of the island's name), if we can find a cite for it. Noel (talk) 22:26, 13 January 2014 (UTC)
Melissa Lynn Conquest Millersburg PA
Often repeated in the popular literature, but seems to be fabricated. Certainly, a Globe and Mail article is not by any means acceptable as WP:RS here.
All the details suggest the claims are fraudulent or fabricated:
In a nutshell, the way the Smithsonian/carbon-dating/coconut "facts" are presented (not only in the source given, but in all sources I have seen to date) strongly suggest the are complete fabrications. I have added verification tags at the relevant places. Clearly, a secondary source of scientific merit is needed here, not a tertiary news blurb hacked together from whatever outrageous claims the writer had at their hands. The source that would actually be demanded by these outrageously "precise" (except where it matters - the hard data) claims would be the Smithsonian's in-house report (and whatever institution did the carbon dating - in the 1960s, there weren't very many of them around). If this research actually happened, such reports would be on file there and can be accessed by the public (though they won't be openly accessible - one would need to contact the custodian of records). This report would be citable as a source by the file number on record; since it may be somewhat hard to verify for non-US citizens, if the reports do exist, some data might be given here. Dysmorodrepanis ( talk) 17:42, 7 May 2014 (UTC)
All the pre-1857 history of the "money pit" derives from information provided by J.B. McCully. There are no other sources aside from a permit to dig on the Island issued in 1849. The so-called "conflicting" accounts are usually later attempts at fixing up or changing McCully's story. McCully is the source for almost everything about oak island from the stone with symbols to the gold chain to the oak platforms, flagstones at the top and the idea that there were water tunnels from the shore. He is also the original source for the idea that there was 2 million in treasure in the pit which years later was reflected back in the supposed stone inscription translation. All of the early accounts of the pit were also tied to Captain Kidd's "treasure" and stories supposedly told by one of the Kidd's former crew. 75.106.146.89 ( talk) 23:51, 4 November 2014 (UTC)
"In 1795, 18-year-old Daniel McGinnis, after observing lights coming from the island, discovered a circular depression in a clearing on the southeastern end of the island. Adjacent to the clearing was a tree with a tackle block on one of its overhanging branches.[4] McGinnis, with the help of friends John Smith (in early accounts, Samuel Ball) and Anthony Vaughan, excavated the depression and discovered a layer of flagstones a few feet below. On the pit walls there were visible markings from a pick. As they dug down they discovered layers of logs at about every 10 feet (3.0 m). They abandoned the excavation at 30 feet (9.1 m).[4]"
The Citation provided does not mention any of the details provided in the paragraph. 75.106.146.89 ( talk) 22:48, 3 November 2014 (UTC)
Those 19th C. citations might not be journalistically accurate. My great grandfather wrote numerous stories for his local newspaper describing thrilling events with young persons exploring Indian caves by torchlight and finding skeletons and lost treasure. They were of course very tongue-in-cheek. I believe it was customary filler for that time. Lynxx2 ( talk) 07:27, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
How reliable is the History Channel's coverage? I understand that they over-dramatize it, but there are several discoveries being made. Would news coverage of any findings count? Its a frustrating truth that there is a substantial lack of any real scientific research into treasure-hunting. DaltonCastle ( talk) 22:02, 10 November 2015 (UTC)
S02E01 0:07:51 Regarding the authentication of this coin, he made the figurative observation, "Do you remember, Charles, the statement of 'a 1000 piece puzzle with 400 pieces missing'? Now there's only 399."
. That illustrates their perspective on the multidisciplinary difficulty of the job, and the extreme extent of their actual efforts and dedication. That is if it's given in the context of a brief summary of the nature of their efforts to date—just to scan, dive, and dredge a swamp in one corner of the island, just to find a single coin, and to consider this to be a milestone victory. Then they also cite two other famous quotes illustratively such as S02E06 0:37:00 citing Edison's quote about the value of failure, about finding countless ways to fail
and then a similar later quote; so citing other people is not compelling. Actually, the text I've written here may be somewhat usable, if I was more familiar with the article's content. As for what exactly happened on the show that may be notably original, I dunno, I guess the life and legacy of Dan Blankenship would be intertwined with the long history of the island. He certainly does retell and relive it in the show to a degree that's worth a brief mention or update. I hope time will tell more! —
Smuckola
(talk)
10:11, 14 November 2015 (UTC)
'...currently the subject of...' should be changed to '...the subject of a (months) 2015...' now (rather than waiting for someone putting a dates query 'some time hence'). Jackiespeel ( talk) 10:29, 18 November 2015 (UTC)
@ Jjsanchis: You have done amazing work on the article and I wanted to recognize that here for everyone. That research looks rather tough and extensive. Thank you very much and I am happy to help if I can, and I did by copy editing and formatting. I would like to call your attention to the {{clarify}} tag that I had to put on one indecipherable paragraph in this section. I read it a dozen times and I don't know what it means. Please rewrite that carefully with punctuation and grammar. Thank you very much and keep it up. Let me know if I can help. — Smuckola (talk) 10:37, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
@ Smuckola: thank you! it does takes a lot of time finding citations online. I'll try to finish the stone work when i have more time on the weekend, and work on a few more areas of interest. appreciate the review! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jjsanchis ( talk • contribs) 08:53, 25 November 2015 UTC)
The Palace of Versailles was not stormed by revolutionaries in 1789. It was never stormed. Royalcourtier ( talk) 23:31, 25 December 2015 (UTC)
Intriguing that the dates for the disappearance of the Crown Jewels, the fall of Versailles, and alleged activity on the Island loosely correlate. Doing "too much too soon" would no doubt be an appropriate conclusion for the area! If there was a fanciful construction of a booby-trapped pit, French engineers would be among those who would know how to accomplish it. ( John G. Lewis ( talk) 00:38, 31 December 2015 (UTC))
The show takes its name from the local legend that Canadian folklorist Helen Creighton included in her book Folklore of Lunenburg County, Nova Scotia about how seven people must die before the treasure will be found.
There is no such mention in this publication of a curse associated with Oak Island.
In Chapter I, in the first paragraph, Oak Island is mentioned in passing, and then never again.
"From Yarmouth to Cape North, there is a succession of bay and inlets, but none of these could have been more tempting to a pirate than Mahone Bay with its 365 islands. one for every day of the year. Oak Island is the best known; it has attracted international interest and many thousands of dollars have been spent in excavations over a long period of years. The mystery of the man-made supports that were found under the ground has never been solved, but their presence stimulates the general belief in the reality of the buried treasure."
____ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.192.94.141 ( talk) 03:26, 8 December 2015 (UTC)
The mention of the show ", and is the subject of the History Channel's series The Curse of Oak Island." seems inappropriate in the introduction. The show should be mentioned further down the article. It seems like advertising to mention it at the very start of the article.
The next section is even more troublesome. It not only mentioned the TV series again, it throws up every conspiracy theory in the book in a way that seems very related to the show rather than the history of Oak Island. If all that junk needs to be in the article, it should be far down the article after the confirmed history of the Island is presented.
The section on the television show should just describe the TV show in brief. The "teasers" for the supposed "discoveries" at the end of the first and second seasons should not be mentioned. 64.134.168.10 ( talk) 06:28, 30 December 2015 (UTC)
Agreed that the TV series doesn't belong in the introduction so I made the edit. It does belong in the pop culture section, although the claims should be presented in a more balanced and less POV manner. Dan Conlin ( talk) 22:52, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
Two of the article's details seem contradictory, or at least the combination seems highly improbable. If bedrock starts at 45 meters below the surface, then folks from the 18th century would have found it staggeringly difficult to construct a "subterranean chamber" at a depth of 60 meters below the surface. Catsmoke ( talk) 14:06, 17 June 2015 (UTC)
First, this isn't a news article and we shouldn't be responding immediately to newspaper stories, which often in any case either get things wrong or give incomplete coverage - their role is to sell papers, not to publish scientific findings, remmber. The sword stuff is just nonsense, there are similar swords available elsewhere, eg on ebay.
[5] The Roman shield boss seems just dishonest as it was discovered in 1792 in England.
[6] Of all the Oak Island claims, this has less credibility than most and at least at the moment I don't think it belongs. See also
[7]and
[8].
Doug Weller
talk
I've found what seems possibly to be the source of the "seven must die" curse story. Its in the Dalhousie Review, Volume 57, Number 4, 1978. The story is written by Joan Clark and I think it was intended as fiction. Its told by a woman who lived near Oak Island in childhood. She claims she heard the story of the curse from an adult neighbor (Mrs. Nauss) in the early 1960s. The story is about a woman having "premonition" abilities and recounts being able to find the body of a missing person for the police. She also claims that she had a premonition dream predicting the "Restall" deaths in the 1960s. Then she tells a story about some woman seeing visions of where the treasure actually is and then dying on the Island. The central character predicts that death in the story as well. I have yet to find any account of the curse older than this one. It was also published just a year before the "in search of" TV show episode which also talks about "seven must die". I'm leaving this for reference purposes on the talk page. 75.17.126.6 ( talk) 05:20, 24 January 2016 (UTC)
Joltes writes about this. [15] He calls the inscription an egregious fraud and says "there are no known descriptions of the "original" Money Pit stone -- if indeed such a stone ever existed in the first place." Doug Weller talk 10:16, 27 January 2016 (UTC)
The mention of the show ", and is the subject of the History Channel's series The Curse of Oak Island." seems inappropriate in the introduction. The show should be mentioned further down the article. It seems like advertising to mention it at the very start of the article.
The next section is even more troublesome. It not only mentioned the TV series again, it throws up every conspiracy theory in the book in a way that seems very related to the show rather than the history of Oak Island. If all that junk needs to be in the article, it should be far down the article after the confirmed history of the Island is presented.
The section on the television show should just describe the TV show in brief. The "teasers" for the supposed "discoveries" at the end of the first and second seasons should not be mentioned. 64.134.168.10 ( talk) 06:28, 30 December 2015 (UTC)
Agreed that the TV series doesn't belong in the introduction so I made the edit. It does belong in the pop culture section, although the claims should be presented in a more balanced and less POV manner. Dan Conlin ( talk) 22:52, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
With regard to the early history of the money pit, it is important to note that there is no history or sources prior to the 1850s. Further, that many of the pre-1890's sources tell different or even conflicting stories. It is important, however it is done, that the voice of Wikipedia NOT be used to make authoritative statements with regard to the early history of the money pit. The article can say that the sources conflict with each other, the article can cite what specific sources have said in the past. But the article should be careful not to draw conclusions or to suggest that a particular statement is true. Its better to err on the side of neutrality rather than claiming that particular undocumented early accounts are true or false. 12.12.144.130 ( talk) 19:28, 7 April 2016 (UTC)
This article should be split into two seperate articles, one which talks about the Island in general, and one that focuses solely on the mystery/alleged treasure. If there are no objections, I plan on creating Oak Island mystery or Oak Island treasure to focus on this aspect. - Knowledgekid87 ( talk) 17:29, 23 February 2017 (UTC)
I think there needs to another image for the location, specifically of North America-Canada region to show readers exactly where in the world that the current image is located. Govvy ( talk) 09:44, 14 July 2018 (UTC)
Fred is best known for hos role with Oak Island, beyond that there isn't really enough notability for a stand alone article. For this reason I am proposing that the article be merged here. - Knowledgekid87 ( talk) 22:44, 6 March 2017 (UTC)
The drains on Oak Islands were built by British engineers. The used the Chain which was 66 feet as the 1836 article mentioned. I was trained as a BC Land Surveyor and this unit was used all across Canada.
Ken Murray Silverton BC — Preceding unsigned comment added by 104.160.220.15 ( talk) 02:15, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
This article is inaccurate in content, speaking as a Daniel McGinnis descendent! RMorholt ( talk) 19:36, 24 August 2019 (UTC)
This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 |
This anonymous person has repeatedly vandalized the page, even after being politely asked to "talk" about disagreements on this talk page. What can be done about this? Can we ban an IP address from this particular page? JonathanFreed 06:43, 18 August 2005 (UTC)
IMO the most likely scenario for the Oak Island pit is this.
The comments made above are as valid and no more pertinent then the assertations they refute.
198.93.113.49 13:38, 8 April 2005 (UTC)
If anybody knows the street address or similar information, then we could find the value of Oak Island according to the provincial government of Nova Scotia: http://www.nsassessmentonline.ca/
There is a fairly good picture of the island on page 25 (35) of a pdf ( http://www.oakislandsociety.ca/feasibility.pdf). The picture appears to have lot or parcel numbers. However, if you enter them into the "Assessment Account Number" (AAN) search page, you will get no results.
Page 14 (22) of the pdf has detailed information about the lot owners (as of the pdf's Jan-2005 publication): "Triton owns ... 23 of the 32 lots, and another two lots are owned privately by the two directors of the company, David Tobias and Dan Blankenship. (Mr. Blankenship’s lot has been divided, with his son David owning the other piece.) ... Fred Nolan ... owns five lots on the north side of the island; lots 9 – 12 and 14. ... Robert Young owns lot 5 to the northwest, while David and Christine Johnston own lot 13 to the northeast."
_The Globe and Mail_ purportedly said the following about ownership and value: "In Nova Scotia, two septuagenarians own most of Oak Island ... Last month, they said they would give up their treasure hunt if they found a suitable taker ... (The asking price) of Oak Island: $7 million. But island resident and co-owner Dan Blankenship, who began searching for buried treasure in 1965, said the property is worth $50 million if the buried booty ... is taken into account..." --Unsigned editorial in The Globe & Mail, 11 January 2003 (from http://www.littletechshoppe.com/ns1625/quotes.html on 1-May-2005)
Does anybody have any information from his June 2004 presentation? Does anybody want to grab his picture for this article? see http://www.ideacityonline.com/2004presenters.asp, http://www.ideacityonline.com/2004presenters/dan_blankenship.html, and http://www.ideacityonline.com/2004presenters/images/dan_blankenship.jpg
Blankenship wrote the following note at the conference in response to the prompt, "AN IDEA THAT COULD CHANGE THE WORLD:"
THE FOLLOWING TEXT MAY BE GOOD FOR THE IMAGE'S DESCRIPTION PAGE:
Daniel C. Blankenship (born circa 1924), is a resident of Oak Island, Nova Scotia, and is a director of Triton Alliance, Ltd. Triton, Blankenship, and David Tobias, another director, own most of Oak Island, site of the "Money Pit". Blankship was one of about fifty presenters at ideaCity 2004 in Toronto (June 20-22, 2004). The event's promotional materials described Blankenship as a "Treasure Hunter":
This picture is from the online version of the ideaCity 2004's promotional materials.
It is unclear which, if any, of the following applies, because a web address of the picture is known as of 5-May-2005, but the original photographer (aka the original "source") is not known.
{{ Promophoto}}
{{ Fairuseunsure}}
{{ fairuseunknownsource}}
{{ Promotional}}
A variety of sources on the web, including the recent pdf at http://www.oakislandsociety.ca/feasibility.pdf, have alluded to some sort of legal battle between David Tobias and Dan Blankenship. If this is true, then where has the case or cases been filed? What is the case number? Court records are frequently available to the public. Can somebody get the records and put them on WikiSource or something?
Is Triton a corporation? If yes, then where was it incorporated? What documents are available and where? Stock certificates? Annual Reports?
There's a discrepancy in the artcile.
In one place it says:
And almost immediately after that:
Was the first published account in 1862, or do accounts go back to 1857?-- 198.93.113.49 14:26, 20 May 2005 (UTC)
I've found a list of source on the Critical Enquiry page. These are the 19th century ones
So it looks like 1857 is the earliest.-- 198.93.113.49 15:16, 20 May 2005 (UTC)
The following quote attributed to Dunfield was added at some point:
I've left it in the article for now, but I think it needs a source. I cannot confirm it.-- 198.93.113.49 17:47, 23 May 2005 (UTC)
I'd like a source for this claim as well:
It's from the same editor as the above quote I questioned. I may go ahead and delete them and then put them back if and when there's a source.-- 198.93.113.49 17:55, 23 May 2005 (UTC)
For the former, the quote appears to be from this thread: http://forum.oakislandtreasure.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=69&start=15 (the original posts seems to have been removed, so the quoted text only appears in followups)
For the latter, see http://www.criticalenquiry.org/oakisland/whoi.htm which refers to Aubrey and Gallo at the Woods Hole institute (both can be found via the WHOI site; Gallo is Director of Special Projects)
I've tagged this article with NPOV because 192.197.71.189 says this article has a slant and has repeatedly added his own disclaimer saying so. I left a message on his talk page asking that he stop by to clarify what it is that he has a problem with and how it could be corrected. -- NormanEinstein 18:46, 30 May 2005 (UTC)
Hello,
I run the CriticalEnquiry site and wanted to comment about a few things.
1) the 1857-1862 article dispute: it's true the first article we know of that mentions the Pit is from 1857, but it contains significantly less detail than later versions. Thus it may be more accurate to say that 1857 is the first public mention of the topic in a newspaper, but 1861-2 is when the first detailed account of the alleged early works was published. I'm presently in the process of data entering the entirety of the first detailed article for inclusion on the CriticalEnquiry Web site.
2) The Dunfield "we resolved the water problem..." quote was originally posted on an Oak Island discussion forum by Dunfield's son sometime in 2004. It generated a storm of outrage from the Believers, who claimed it was out of context and inaccurate. The quote came directly from Dunfield's diaries, circa 1966, and I believe it was written after he'd completed a great deal of his excavation work. It was not out of context. However, the quote apparently has been removed from the Forum site by persons unknown.
3) the "interviews conducted with the scientists reveal they were unconvinced of the existence of the fabled "flood tunnel" citation can be found at http://www.criticalenquiry.org/oakisland/whoi.htm -- I interviewed several of the scientists and provided a synopsis of their report.
4) the person responsible for the angry notes claiming the present article is "slanted" is a proponent of the treasure theory who consistently derides all dissenting viewpoints. He and others claim there is a great deal of "unpublished evidence in private hands" that confirm the existence of treasure on the island, but refuse to disclose the nature of any of this evidence to those they see as enemies.
(Update 11/14/05)
I removed the reference to the offender's name as requested (that was inappropriate, sorry) but disagree with his assertions below. Many Oak Island "believers" make the assertion that "a great deal of unpublished material exists" to support the treasure story and veracity of the usual "boys finding treasure" legend, but refuse to divulge this material. Thus, it is unavailable for study and should not be thrown up as "proof" that articles that do not support the usual legend are inaccurate or incomplete. The evidence must be produced, or claims of its existence cannot be used to belittle the efforts of those who wish to create a balanced POV for this story.
Regarding the claim that more material lies in the NS Public Archives: I have been in touch with these people repeatedly, and they claim the earliest articles are those from the 1857-1862 period. If the plaintiff below can provide exact references, I'll be happy to obtain and review them.
Hi,
I am the party (angry guy) who has been besmirched in a "comment" (above)on this web page. I wish to firstly state that, I would like very much for the author of that comment, as an act of decent conduct, to remove it as it is slanderous and incorrect. While I may be fairly categorized as a "proponent" of Oak Island history, I am not now, nor have I ever been "involved with Triton”, among other unsubstantiated claims.
I have read the information posted here regarding the Oak Island treasure hunt and I judge it to be a fair appraisal for the average reader who may then want to go elsewhere and discover the full details to make up their own mind as to the veracity of this story. It is however, not without a skeptically biased view point thus making the credibility of the information questionable.
Yes, there is a lot of unpublished Oak Island information, volumes of it, that pertain to the treasure hunt and some of it is from prior to the much toted 1857 newspaper article. Some of it is in the Nova Scotia Public Archives, Dalhousie University Library, many other libraries and in the hands of private collectors all over North America. That it is not available for one and all to view on the internet is most regrettable. Those are however, the facts of life regarding Oak Island material.
While a reference to a posting from Dunfield's son was added here refuting the belief in the existence of the flood tunnel from Smith's Cove, (taken totally out of context by the way), it is interesting to note that he (Dunfield Sr.) has equally been quoted in a Halifax Nova Scotia newspaper as believing in the existence of the reported South Shore flood tunnel. There is plenty of evidence to suggest the contrary on both counts. To take a small portion of a larger letter and hold it up as not being taken out of context, certainly is just that. Any "outrage" was in support of the guiding principles of fair play.
The "Scientists" who have been interviewed by the gentleman who runs the CriticalEnquiry web site either forgot one crucial feature to their examination of Oak Island, or it was omitted on purpose to create a lop sided viewpoint. Their scientific evaluation of Oak Island was not completed. The funding for their study ran out, and their evaluation was never finished, hardly good science to make claims from. These scientists were not the only body of scientific rigor that has been applied to Oak Island either, just so you dear reader fully understand that there is much information to the contrary.
One should always be prepared to operate under reasonable guidelines and never name names in an accusatory fashion on a public site like this. It is a shameful display of poor taste. 24.222.219.23 08:51, 10 September 2005 (UTC)
Wyss, thank you for your learned posting. Very clever from a fellow who has done so much research to draw such a conclusion......you have done some research on this,...correct??? 24.222.219.23 20:40, 11 September 2005 (UTC)
Please sign your posts with four tildes and please try to be civil (that would include avoiding uncalled for sarcasm). Thanks. Wyss 00:46, 12 September 2005 (UTC)
Its obvious that Wikipedia (which is a stupid sounding name and sounds like baby formula) is slanted and only allows those who speculate against Oak Island and not allowing those who speculate for Oak Island, calling it a learned opinion. Oak Island is under enough controversey without so called authorities adding insult to injury. If you allow one speculated opinion you have to allow the other.
I added a reference to the thrilling novel Riptide which was based partly on the Oak Island mystery. Kit 02:42:09, 2005-08-02 (UTC)
–Removed one reference to the novel. It is included by name in first part of the "popular culture" section ("Several works of fiction...") and an additional reference seems redundant. It had more information about the book, but nothing that couldn't be found on the book's own linked article. I considered adding the same information about the other works mentioned, and remove the "Several works...," part, but decided that the short list works fine for these purposes, as further information can be found by following the links (for those works which have them). Noble 19:28, 10 October 2007 (UTC)
This article was in need of much syntax and flow editing, which I have done. I remember reading about this when I was little (nothing seems to have happened since then, except the Woods Hole survey). I tend to think that the kids who first found it either mistook a natural sinkhole (most likely) for something else, or they ran across an abandoned site that had been used for some sort of construction or other work. The site has been so obliterated that it may never be possible to determine what they originally found. I don't know of any proper archaeological records. Wyss 22:20, 27 August 2005 (UTC)
I've added a number of citations, and integrated those that were simply listed at the end, in the interests of WP:STYLE. More to come, too. I've also performed some cleanup. Nobody of consequence 04:30, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
In the "early history" section I removed the reference to a cryptographer (changed it to the more generic "researcher" since there's no evidence any cryptographic analysis was actually performed). Evidence seems to suggest that author and literary figure James DeMille, who was a professor at Dalhousie College in Nova Scotia during the 1860s, is responsible for this translation.
I also added detail about A.T. Kempton and E.R. Snow, their relationship to the symbols, and the fact that the currently known set of symbols only appeared circa 1951 in Snow's book. bloodylance ( talk) 21:30, 25 January 2008 (UTC)
bloodylance ( talk) 00:58, 26 February 2008 (UTC) I don't recall ever seeing a link to that site before. When was it deleted?
Probably Henry Every, a.k.a. Long Ben Avery. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.25.10.86 ( talk) 07:08, 11 July 2008 (UTC)
I've been adding a number of original documents to the Oak Island Treasure archive section - http://www.oakislandtreasure.co.uk/content/view/156/137/ This includes the original coconut fibre carbon dating reports.
Would it be worth adding these actual documents as the primary sources in the article, rather than the secondary sources which currently exist?
Numerous Oak Island documents dating to 1753 are available at http://www.oakislandtheories.com with Public Archives of NS Ref Number, etc. Original grant of 1753 made by Governor Lawrence to John Gifford and Richard Smith of New York for fishing (from this Smith it derived the name Smith’s Island until ~1764) , original survey and description of 1764, property deeds and 'lot draws' dating to 1765; Poll Tax records of 1791,92,93,94 showing people living on the island; a property deed showing McGinnis’ first lot purchase of March 1788 and Ball's first purchase during Nov 1788; a first edition History of Lunenburg County which identifies different participants; much family information on the participants, before, during, and after discovery…and much more. This site is pleased to offer the most comprehensive collection of Oak Island documents to be found online, many for the first time in public view)and also provides great insight into the local community of period times.
Through the above documents of unquestionable provenance, we now understand the version and timeline as told by Anthony Vaughan Jr. to be unfounded, and the 1893 Prospectus tale/legend of discovery involving three boys rowing out to an uninhabited island as fantasy. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.7.228.85 ( talk) 02:39, 15 August 2008 (UTC)
There are suppose to be 13 Crystal Skulls and only 5 have been found I'm thinking one is on the moon in Shorty Crater and I'm thinking one is on the money pit on Oak Island. I have heard some think the world will come to a end in 2012 and we as humans must bring the 13 skulls together to figure out the secrets to stopping the End of the world.
Mcboo ( talk) 01:14, 16 November 2008 (UTC) Conrad
"The five box drains made from flat stones did exist and were identified and recorded by the Restalls.[14]Oak Island stone triangle formation related to the nearby Birch Island triangle, theorized by First Nations Keith Ranville." The article doesn't mention the drains elsewhere, so the sentence is oddly written. As for the triangles, I'm not sure what that sentence fragment is about at all? Шизомби ( talk) 21:59, 14 January 2009 (UTC)
Notably absent from recent history is the account of the informal organization calling themselves TROUVER (pronounced tru-vey, the French word for “to find”). The group formed in 1967 consisted of three young men; Carl Merz, Eric Hensen and Terry Scheid. They were granted written permission for access and excavation to the site for a brief period of time. In July of 1967 Carl and Eric (both from Deer Park, NY) visited and examined the pit site and the previous dig. A radically different plan for excavation and recovery was devised by them, circumventing the flooding issues. It required a fair investment to implement. The money was never raised and the rights passed back to holder at the time, soon after. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.169.39.231 ( talk) 17:48, 20 May 2009 (UTC)
The article makes it sound as though the boys were exploring some previously unknown location. The island had been platted and the parents of Anthony Vaughan owned 7 lots covered with trees on the island including the one directly adjacent to the pit location. The Vaughan family were ship builders and operated a lumber mill. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.192.132.65 ( talk) 03:27, 15 August 2009 (UTC)
This article states that the island is underlain by water filled limestone cavities (anhydrite). Limestone is predominately Calcium carbonate(CaCO3), or Dolomite (Mg,Ca(CO3)2). Anhydrite(CaSO4) is an evaporite mineral closely related to gypsum. Calling anhydrite a limestone is like saying salt is sugar. These form in separate environments, and are not the same. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.123.79.218 ( talk) 06:36, 15 September 2009 (UTC)
The In Search of... Oak Island episode said the wood in the platforms was later C-14 dated to 1575. Given C-14 dates are a range rather than an exact date does anyone know who did the dating and what the range was?-- BruceGrubb ( talk) 09:58, 10 May 2010 (UTC)
This is the first comment I've ever heard regarding additional C14 dating on the island's artifacts. However, since all the platforms (if they existed) had long vanished prior to the advent of carbon dating, I find this assertion unlikely. Djoltes ( talk) 00:54 29 Sep 2010. —Preceding undated comment added 04:58, 30 September 2010 (UTC).
While Barry Fell may be the author of disputed works, calling him a 'crank' does not adhere to WP:NPOV. I suggest the following:
Can we agree on that change? Tgeairn ( talk) 22:52, 1 May 2011 (UTC)
Oak Island is referenced in "The Jeffereson Key" by Steve Berry, published 2011. 150.198.1.212 ( talk) 16:11, 26 January 2014 (UTC)
Currently, this "documentary" is cited for the claim that there is evidence that the Ark of the Covenant lies buried in the Money Pit. Is this really appropriate? Besides the History Channel's own credibility, that particular part of the documentary also suggested that the Ark contained a mysterious artifact left by ancient astronauts/aliens, which gave the Philistines radiation poisoning when they opened the Ark. I'm hesitant to just remove it, as I couldn't find a policy regarding dealing with cites from sources that put out documentaries of lies in addition to regular documentaries. 96.60.50.30 ( talk) 18:08, 8 August 2010 (UTC)
PT Barnum was right!!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.67.221.24 ( talk) 05:12, 3 February 2014 (UTC) My name is Melissa Lynn Conquest. I enjoy watching the curse of Oak Island
So on the History show, it said the island used to contain a lot of oak trees (hence the island's name, I assume), which are not native to the area (and thus another oddity about the island). This is probably worth including (as the source of the island's name), if we can find a cite for it. Noel (talk) 22:26, 13 January 2014 (UTC)
Melissa Lynn Conquest Millersburg PA
Often repeated in the popular literature, but seems to be fabricated. Certainly, a Globe and Mail article is not by any means acceptable as WP:RS here.
All the details suggest the claims are fraudulent or fabricated:
In a nutshell, the way the Smithsonian/carbon-dating/coconut "facts" are presented (not only in the source given, but in all sources I have seen to date) strongly suggest the are complete fabrications. I have added verification tags at the relevant places. Clearly, a secondary source of scientific merit is needed here, not a tertiary news blurb hacked together from whatever outrageous claims the writer had at their hands. The source that would actually be demanded by these outrageously "precise" (except where it matters - the hard data) claims would be the Smithsonian's in-house report (and whatever institution did the carbon dating - in the 1960s, there weren't very many of them around). If this research actually happened, such reports would be on file there and can be accessed by the public (though they won't be openly accessible - one would need to contact the custodian of records). This report would be citable as a source by the file number on record; since it may be somewhat hard to verify for non-US citizens, if the reports do exist, some data might be given here. Dysmorodrepanis ( talk) 17:42, 7 May 2014 (UTC)
All the pre-1857 history of the "money pit" derives from information provided by J.B. McCully. There are no other sources aside from a permit to dig on the Island issued in 1849. The so-called "conflicting" accounts are usually later attempts at fixing up or changing McCully's story. McCully is the source for almost everything about oak island from the stone with symbols to the gold chain to the oak platforms, flagstones at the top and the idea that there were water tunnels from the shore. He is also the original source for the idea that there was 2 million in treasure in the pit which years later was reflected back in the supposed stone inscription translation. All of the early accounts of the pit were also tied to Captain Kidd's "treasure" and stories supposedly told by one of the Kidd's former crew. 75.106.146.89 ( talk) 23:51, 4 November 2014 (UTC)
"In 1795, 18-year-old Daniel McGinnis, after observing lights coming from the island, discovered a circular depression in a clearing on the southeastern end of the island. Adjacent to the clearing was a tree with a tackle block on one of its overhanging branches.[4] McGinnis, with the help of friends John Smith (in early accounts, Samuel Ball) and Anthony Vaughan, excavated the depression and discovered a layer of flagstones a few feet below. On the pit walls there were visible markings from a pick. As they dug down they discovered layers of logs at about every 10 feet (3.0 m). They abandoned the excavation at 30 feet (9.1 m).[4]"
The Citation provided does not mention any of the details provided in the paragraph. 75.106.146.89 ( talk) 22:48, 3 November 2014 (UTC)
Those 19th C. citations might not be journalistically accurate. My great grandfather wrote numerous stories for his local newspaper describing thrilling events with young persons exploring Indian caves by torchlight and finding skeletons and lost treasure. They were of course very tongue-in-cheek. I believe it was customary filler for that time. Lynxx2 ( talk) 07:27, 12 November 2014 (UTC)
How reliable is the History Channel's coverage? I understand that they over-dramatize it, but there are several discoveries being made. Would news coverage of any findings count? Its a frustrating truth that there is a substantial lack of any real scientific research into treasure-hunting. DaltonCastle ( talk) 22:02, 10 November 2015 (UTC)
S02E01 0:07:51 Regarding the authentication of this coin, he made the figurative observation, "Do you remember, Charles, the statement of 'a 1000 piece puzzle with 400 pieces missing'? Now there's only 399."
. That illustrates their perspective on the multidisciplinary difficulty of the job, and the extreme extent of their actual efforts and dedication. That is if it's given in the context of a brief summary of the nature of their efforts to date—just to scan, dive, and dredge a swamp in one corner of the island, just to find a single coin, and to consider this to be a milestone victory. Then they also cite two other famous quotes illustratively such as S02E06 0:37:00 citing Edison's quote about the value of failure, about finding countless ways to fail
and then a similar later quote; so citing other people is not compelling. Actually, the text I've written here may be somewhat usable, if I was more familiar with the article's content. As for what exactly happened on the show that may be notably original, I dunno, I guess the life and legacy of Dan Blankenship would be intertwined with the long history of the island. He certainly does retell and relive it in the show to a degree that's worth a brief mention or update. I hope time will tell more! —
Smuckola
(talk)
10:11, 14 November 2015 (UTC)
'...currently the subject of...' should be changed to '...the subject of a (months) 2015...' now (rather than waiting for someone putting a dates query 'some time hence'). Jackiespeel ( talk) 10:29, 18 November 2015 (UTC)
@ Jjsanchis: You have done amazing work on the article and I wanted to recognize that here for everyone. That research looks rather tough and extensive. Thank you very much and I am happy to help if I can, and I did by copy editing and formatting. I would like to call your attention to the {{clarify}} tag that I had to put on one indecipherable paragraph in this section. I read it a dozen times and I don't know what it means. Please rewrite that carefully with punctuation and grammar. Thank you very much and keep it up. Let me know if I can help. — Smuckola (talk) 10:37, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
@ Smuckola: thank you! it does takes a lot of time finding citations online. I'll try to finish the stone work when i have more time on the weekend, and work on a few more areas of interest. appreciate the review! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jjsanchis ( talk • contribs) 08:53, 25 November 2015 UTC)
The Palace of Versailles was not stormed by revolutionaries in 1789. It was never stormed. Royalcourtier ( talk) 23:31, 25 December 2015 (UTC)
Intriguing that the dates for the disappearance of the Crown Jewels, the fall of Versailles, and alleged activity on the Island loosely correlate. Doing "too much too soon" would no doubt be an appropriate conclusion for the area! If there was a fanciful construction of a booby-trapped pit, French engineers would be among those who would know how to accomplish it. ( John G. Lewis ( talk) 00:38, 31 December 2015 (UTC))
The show takes its name from the local legend that Canadian folklorist Helen Creighton included in her book Folklore of Lunenburg County, Nova Scotia about how seven people must die before the treasure will be found.
There is no such mention in this publication of a curse associated with Oak Island.
In Chapter I, in the first paragraph, Oak Island is mentioned in passing, and then never again.
"From Yarmouth to Cape North, there is a succession of bay and inlets, but none of these could have been more tempting to a pirate than Mahone Bay with its 365 islands. one for every day of the year. Oak Island is the best known; it has attracted international interest and many thousands of dollars have been spent in excavations over a long period of years. The mystery of the man-made supports that were found under the ground has never been solved, but their presence stimulates the general belief in the reality of the buried treasure."
____ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.192.94.141 ( talk) 03:26, 8 December 2015 (UTC)
The mention of the show ", and is the subject of the History Channel's series The Curse of Oak Island." seems inappropriate in the introduction. The show should be mentioned further down the article. It seems like advertising to mention it at the very start of the article.
The next section is even more troublesome. It not only mentioned the TV series again, it throws up every conspiracy theory in the book in a way that seems very related to the show rather than the history of Oak Island. If all that junk needs to be in the article, it should be far down the article after the confirmed history of the Island is presented.
The section on the television show should just describe the TV show in brief. The "teasers" for the supposed "discoveries" at the end of the first and second seasons should not be mentioned. 64.134.168.10 ( talk) 06:28, 30 December 2015 (UTC)
Agreed that the TV series doesn't belong in the introduction so I made the edit. It does belong in the pop culture section, although the claims should be presented in a more balanced and less POV manner. Dan Conlin ( talk) 22:52, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
Two of the article's details seem contradictory, or at least the combination seems highly improbable. If bedrock starts at 45 meters below the surface, then folks from the 18th century would have found it staggeringly difficult to construct a "subterranean chamber" at a depth of 60 meters below the surface. Catsmoke ( talk) 14:06, 17 June 2015 (UTC)
First, this isn't a news article and we shouldn't be responding immediately to newspaper stories, which often in any case either get things wrong or give incomplete coverage - their role is to sell papers, not to publish scientific findings, remmber. The sword stuff is just nonsense, there are similar swords available elsewhere, eg on ebay.
[5] The Roman shield boss seems just dishonest as it was discovered in 1792 in England.
[6] Of all the Oak Island claims, this has less credibility than most and at least at the moment I don't think it belongs. See also
[7]and
[8].
Doug Weller
talk
I've found what seems possibly to be the source of the "seven must die" curse story. Its in the Dalhousie Review, Volume 57, Number 4, 1978. The story is written by Joan Clark and I think it was intended as fiction. Its told by a woman who lived near Oak Island in childhood. She claims she heard the story of the curse from an adult neighbor (Mrs. Nauss) in the early 1960s. The story is about a woman having "premonition" abilities and recounts being able to find the body of a missing person for the police. She also claims that she had a premonition dream predicting the "Restall" deaths in the 1960s. Then she tells a story about some woman seeing visions of where the treasure actually is and then dying on the Island. The central character predicts that death in the story as well. I have yet to find any account of the curse older than this one. It was also published just a year before the "in search of" TV show episode which also talks about "seven must die". I'm leaving this for reference purposes on the talk page. 75.17.126.6 ( talk) 05:20, 24 January 2016 (UTC)
Joltes writes about this. [15] He calls the inscription an egregious fraud and says "there are no known descriptions of the "original" Money Pit stone -- if indeed such a stone ever existed in the first place." Doug Weller talk 10:16, 27 January 2016 (UTC)
The mention of the show ", and is the subject of the History Channel's series The Curse of Oak Island." seems inappropriate in the introduction. The show should be mentioned further down the article. It seems like advertising to mention it at the very start of the article.
The next section is even more troublesome. It not only mentioned the TV series again, it throws up every conspiracy theory in the book in a way that seems very related to the show rather than the history of Oak Island. If all that junk needs to be in the article, it should be far down the article after the confirmed history of the Island is presented.
The section on the television show should just describe the TV show in brief. The "teasers" for the supposed "discoveries" at the end of the first and second seasons should not be mentioned. 64.134.168.10 ( talk) 06:28, 30 December 2015 (UTC)
Agreed that the TV series doesn't belong in the introduction so I made the edit. It does belong in the pop culture section, although the claims should be presented in a more balanced and less POV manner. Dan Conlin ( talk) 22:52, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
With regard to the early history of the money pit, it is important to note that there is no history or sources prior to the 1850s. Further, that many of the pre-1890's sources tell different or even conflicting stories. It is important, however it is done, that the voice of Wikipedia NOT be used to make authoritative statements with regard to the early history of the money pit. The article can say that the sources conflict with each other, the article can cite what specific sources have said in the past. But the article should be careful not to draw conclusions or to suggest that a particular statement is true. Its better to err on the side of neutrality rather than claiming that particular undocumented early accounts are true or false. 12.12.144.130 ( talk) 19:28, 7 April 2016 (UTC)
This article should be split into two seperate articles, one which talks about the Island in general, and one that focuses solely on the mystery/alleged treasure. If there are no objections, I plan on creating Oak Island mystery or Oak Island treasure to focus on this aspect. - Knowledgekid87 ( talk) 17:29, 23 February 2017 (UTC)
I think there needs to another image for the location, specifically of North America-Canada region to show readers exactly where in the world that the current image is located. Govvy ( talk) 09:44, 14 July 2018 (UTC)
Fred is best known for hos role with Oak Island, beyond that there isn't really enough notability for a stand alone article. For this reason I am proposing that the article be merged here. - Knowledgekid87 ( talk) 22:44, 6 March 2017 (UTC)
The drains on Oak Islands were built by British engineers. The used the Chain which was 66 feet as the 1836 article mentioned. I was trained as a BC Land Surveyor and this unit was used all across Canada.
Ken Murray Silverton BC — Preceding unsigned comment added by 104.160.220.15 ( talk) 02:15, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
This article is inaccurate in content, speaking as a Daniel McGinnis descendent! RMorholt ( talk) 19:36, 24 August 2019 (UTC)