![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 |
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Flag_of_the_Sovereign_Military_Order_of_Malta.svg
This flag should be mentioned in the section "Flags elsewhere that feature the Nordic Cross or similar design"
I am not sure if this flag is really a Nordic Cross flag. It really depends on how you interpret it, and of course what the "designer" wanted it to mean. It would be nice to find out more about the meaning and origin of this flag. According to an entry on the Flags of the World page it is supposed to be a Nordic Cross. Thats why I added it Inge 19:14, 31 October 2005 (UTC)
What about the Union Jack, and related flags? They sure contain a cross, anyway, and I guess they're somehow related to the scandinavian cross. Maybe deserves a mention on the page? 213.112.14.158 09:54, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
This flag was interesting. I emediately thought it was strange to have the Swedish flag used like this. Does anyone know if Wilmington has sought permission to do this? National flags are after all protected by all countries. Inge 22:15, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
The use of the Swedish flag is because of the original Swedish settlers of Wilmington/Ft. Christina. I am not aware of any treaty that requires a municipality to get permission from a country to use a similar flag design. Briangotts (Talk) (Contrib) 19:34, 10 May 2006 (UTC)
Not only is it a new and different flag, but I'm fairly certain it predates the United States in any case.
Briangotts
(Talk)
(Contrib)
17:53, 11 May 2006 (UTC)
I am not sure what the source of your statement "national flags are protected by all countries" is. Nothing in United law, to my knowledge, prevents a citizen from using or even desecrating a flag (including, incidentally, the United States flag - see Flag_burning#The_United_States). Even if the flag of Wilmington was a Swedish flag defaced with some defamatory statement about Swedes, I see little that any government body could do to force a change. -- Briangotts (Talk) (Contrib) 18:19, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
I have reverted the changes in alphabetical order by Leftist and Eddi, since I believe the collation rules of the English version of the Latin alphabet should be used here. Most people who are unfamiliar with the Scandinavian languages will look under a when searching for å, just like þ is generally seen as a variant form of t by those who are not aware of its proper place in the Icelandic alphabet. Hope you don't mind this! =] Regards // Big Adamsky • BA's talk page 13:56, 21 March 2006 (UTC)
Surely the flag listed is just the Danish flag because Schleswig-Holstein was once Danish-controlled. Are there any explanations to prove that suggestion wrong?
Schleswig-Holstein was technically an independent duchy in personal union with the Danish crown. That is, they had the same monarch, but S-H was not considered part of Denmark proper, but rather a possession of the Danish crown. The situation is similar to the period of the first three Georges of Great Britain, who were both Kings of Great Britain and Electors (later Kings) of Hanover. Hanover was not part of Great Britain; rather it was a separate possession of the reigning English monarch. Thus the flag of S-H, while identical to the Danish flag, was the flag of a separate state and deserves its own place. Briangotts (Talk) (Contrib) 19:31, 10 May 2006 (UTC)
The problem with these unofficial flags is that they are not used, not regognized, and -- in some instances -- were newly created by some random people. The Scanian flag I don't doubt, but the others would need a reference of actually being in use. This affects
The one claiming (today) to be for Västergötland was, in fact for West Sweden. The image name in the commons is unchanged, though. I changed that and added a reference. JöG 08:42, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
We should decide on what policy to follow here. Some of these flags are more notable than others. Some are oficial and some are not. Being official is not a good criteria for whether a flag should be included or not. I am for a quite liberal policy, where a flag should be included even if it is interesting only from a vexillological or design point of view. I don't think all of the flags have to be included, but as we see above some flags are unknown to some and notable to others. For one example the flag of Northern Norway is in my mind less notable than the flag of Norrland as the flag of Norrland has at least received som coincidental attention. But I think it is interesting that the two are so similar and I want to know more. Thats good enough for me. But the more duboius flags should be clearly marked so we don't give them notoriety ourselves. I am going to reinsert all the Swedish flags for now. Any views? Inge 15:47, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
These flags are highly questionable and were removed from the article page:
Inge 18:30, 27 July 2006 (UTC)
I have removed the Unofficial " Teutonic-Celtic" flag because it appears to have been designed by a Wikipedian for use in Template:User Teutonic-celtic origin; see Image talk:Nordic-celtic flag.svg. I have also removed the unsubstantiated reference to Gaelic heritage, and since there is no Irish dimension I replaced "British Isles" with "Great Britain". jnestorius( talk) 22:39, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
![]() ![]() and merchant flag for a United Ireland |
![]() ![]() and naval flag for a United Ireland |
for a United Ireland |
What is the reasoning behind Unofficial and Fictional flags in this article? How is the Flag of the Highlands of Scotland not fictional? Or the Vinland flag? It is misleading for an encyclopedia to lump real and historical flags with these "unofficial" things. At the least, a reorganization is needed.
And an article titled Nordic Cross Flag and about flags bearing a Nordic cross could probably do without the Nordic flags without the Nordic cross section. It doesn't add anything, just adds confusion.
I removed the flag and the article, since I redirected the article about to group to the FIAV article. I removed the image, since it was under a non-commercial license, which has been disallowed since May of 2005. User:Zscout370 (Return Fire) 21:35, 23 June 2006 (UTC)
What is the story with the flag of Verona in Italy? It looks like the Swedish flag, so I guess it should be on this page too. I would hava added it, but I didn't find it in Wikipedia articles (and I don't know the exact dimensions and colour codes). Here's the coat of arms: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/13/Verona-Stemma.png 213.243.180.4 18:55, 2 August 2006 (UTC)
I have created an SVG version of this image at Image:Flag of Iceland - 1914 Proposal.svg, but neither the English nor Italian versions of this page appear to be able to thumbnail it correctly, though as you can see, it seems to be specific to this page, possibly because it uses gallery. I have left it unchanged. Could somebody more knowledgeable fix this on both wikis please? nandhp 11:53, 31 August 2006 (UTC)
Before people start removing the unofficial flag of Barra I would like to list a variety of sites that have dissussed the authenticity of this flag, and a number of sites that actually produce it for sale. The flag is indeed in use. The flag is discussed in the flags of the world website
[1] Scott Hatton, on 6 October 2005 comments in a post on the Lewis flag discussion within the Western Isles community, "Barra and Lewis were generally deemed as authentic, South Uist slightly less so..." It should be noted that the flag of Barra is available from Mr Flag
[2] and A A Flags
[3].
JennieM 17:49, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
I believe the flag of Pärnu should be added under 'other nordic flags witht the nordic cross', due to it being the official flag of Pärnu, Estonia [4]
Why has the Vendsyssel flag been "whitened"?
It certainly has been in use.
I saw it twice in the 1990'ies, once flying nearby a Vendsyssel farm. "Not commonly known" must refer to Danes living outside Vendsyssel.
Cf.
http://www.fotw.net/flags/dk-vend.html.
Klauber Flag produces and sells this flag in all sizes on
http://www.klauber-flag.dk/flag.asp?cmd=details&flag=1167.
Bab
I agree totally. I've seen the flag in use several places in Vendsyssel and also on sale in Aalborg. The text should be changed.
What about Saint Piran's Flag, the flag of Cornwall? Shouldn't it be on the list?
It is not a Nordic cross. Briangotts (Talk) (Contrib) 18:47, 18 April 2007 (UTC)
I thought the style of this article would fit better on Commons, so I went ahead and copied the marjority of it to commons:Gallery of Nordic Cross flags. Now maybe the Wikipedia article could be restructured to look less like a gallery and more like an encylopedic article. -- Himasaram 06:14, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
This supposed "1871-1892" German flag which was posted here is spreading across wikipedia's flags pages. Almost all evidence available claims that Germany's flag from 1871-1918 was the black-white-red tricolour. This Nordic cross German flag has been added on the basis of Original Research, which is forbidden to be used on wikipedia articles. I am removing the information that states that this was the flag, and changing it to being that this flag is "claimed to be" the German flag from 1871-1892.-- R-41 20:42, 20 July 2007 (UTC)
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 |
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Flag_of_the_Sovereign_Military_Order_of_Malta.svg
This flag should be mentioned in the section "Flags elsewhere that feature the Nordic Cross or similar design"
I am not sure if this flag is really a Nordic Cross flag. It really depends on how you interpret it, and of course what the "designer" wanted it to mean. It would be nice to find out more about the meaning and origin of this flag. According to an entry on the Flags of the World page it is supposed to be a Nordic Cross. Thats why I added it Inge 19:14, 31 October 2005 (UTC)
What about the Union Jack, and related flags? They sure contain a cross, anyway, and I guess they're somehow related to the scandinavian cross. Maybe deserves a mention on the page? 213.112.14.158 09:54, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
This flag was interesting. I emediately thought it was strange to have the Swedish flag used like this. Does anyone know if Wilmington has sought permission to do this? National flags are after all protected by all countries. Inge 22:15, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
The use of the Swedish flag is because of the original Swedish settlers of Wilmington/Ft. Christina. I am not aware of any treaty that requires a municipality to get permission from a country to use a similar flag design. Briangotts (Talk) (Contrib) 19:34, 10 May 2006 (UTC)
Not only is it a new and different flag, but I'm fairly certain it predates the United States in any case.
Briangotts
(Talk)
(Contrib)
17:53, 11 May 2006 (UTC)
I am not sure what the source of your statement "national flags are protected by all countries" is. Nothing in United law, to my knowledge, prevents a citizen from using or even desecrating a flag (including, incidentally, the United States flag - see Flag_burning#The_United_States). Even if the flag of Wilmington was a Swedish flag defaced with some defamatory statement about Swedes, I see little that any government body could do to force a change. -- Briangotts (Talk) (Contrib) 18:19, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
I have reverted the changes in alphabetical order by Leftist and Eddi, since I believe the collation rules of the English version of the Latin alphabet should be used here. Most people who are unfamiliar with the Scandinavian languages will look under a when searching for å, just like þ is generally seen as a variant form of t by those who are not aware of its proper place in the Icelandic alphabet. Hope you don't mind this! =] Regards // Big Adamsky • BA's talk page 13:56, 21 March 2006 (UTC)
Surely the flag listed is just the Danish flag because Schleswig-Holstein was once Danish-controlled. Are there any explanations to prove that suggestion wrong?
Schleswig-Holstein was technically an independent duchy in personal union with the Danish crown. That is, they had the same monarch, but S-H was not considered part of Denmark proper, but rather a possession of the Danish crown. The situation is similar to the period of the first three Georges of Great Britain, who were both Kings of Great Britain and Electors (later Kings) of Hanover. Hanover was not part of Great Britain; rather it was a separate possession of the reigning English monarch. Thus the flag of S-H, while identical to the Danish flag, was the flag of a separate state and deserves its own place. Briangotts (Talk) (Contrib) 19:31, 10 May 2006 (UTC)
The problem with these unofficial flags is that they are not used, not regognized, and -- in some instances -- were newly created by some random people. The Scanian flag I don't doubt, but the others would need a reference of actually being in use. This affects
The one claiming (today) to be for Västergötland was, in fact for West Sweden. The image name in the commons is unchanged, though. I changed that and added a reference. JöG 08:42, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
We should decide on what policy to follow here. Some of these flags are more notable than others. Some are oficial and some are not. Being official is not a good criteria for whether a flag should be included or not. I am for a quite liberal policy, where a flag should be included even if it is interesting only from a vexillological or design point of view. I don't think all of the flags have to be included, but as we see above some flags are unknown to some and notable to others. For one example the flag of Northern Norway is in my mind less notable than the flag of Norrland as the flag of Norrland has at least received som coincidental attention. But I think it is interesting that the two are so similar and I want to know more. Thats good enough for me. But the more duboius flags should be clearly marked so we don't give them notoriety ourselves. I am going to reinsert all the Swedish flags for now. Any views? Inge 15:47, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
These flags are highly questionable and were removed from the article page:
Inge 18:30, 27 July 2006 (UTC)
I have removed the Unofficial " Teutonic-Celtic" flag because it appears to have been designed by a Wikipedian for use in Template:User Teutonic-celtic origin; see Image talk:Nordic-celtic flag.svg. I have also removed the unsubstantiated reference to Gaelic heritage, and since there is no Irish dimension I replaced "British Isles" with "Great Britain". jnestorius( talk) 22:39, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
![]() ![]() and merchant flag for a United Ireland |
![]() ![]() and naval flag for a United Ireland |
for a United Ireland |
What is the reasoning behind Unofficial and Fictional flags in this article? How is the Flag of the Highlands of Scotland not fictional? Or the Vinland flag? It is misleading for an encyclopedia to lump real and historical flags with these "unofficial" things. At the least, a reorganization is needed.
And an article titled Nordic Cross Flag and about flags bearing a Nordic cross could probably do without the Nordic flags without the Nordic cross section. It doesn't add anything, just adds confusion.
I removed the flag and the article, since I redirected the article about to group to the FIAV article. I removed the image, since it was under a non-commercial license, which has been disallowed since May of 2005. User:Zscout370 (Return Fire) 21:35, 23 June 2006 (UTC)
What is the story with the flag of Verona in Italy? It looks like the Swedish flag, so I guess it should be on this page too. I would hava added it, but I didn't find it in Wikipedia articles (and I don't know the exact dimensions and colour codes). Here's the coat of arms: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/13/Verona-Stemma.png 213.243.180.4 18:55, 2 August 2006 (UTC)
I have created an SVG version of this image at Image:Flag of Iceland - 1914 Proposal.svg, but neither the English nor Italian versions of this page appear to be able to thumbnail it correctly, though as you can see, it seems to be specific to this page, possibly because it uses gallery. I have left it unchanged. Could somebody more knowledgeable fix this on both wikis please? nandhp 11:53, 31 August 2006 (UTC)
Before people start removing the unofficial flag of Barra I would like to list a variety of sites that have dissussed the authenticity of this flag, and a number of sites that actually produce it for sale. The flag is indeed in use. The flag is discussed in the flags of the world website
[1] Scott Hatton, on 6 October 2005 comments in a post on the Lewis flag discussion within the Western Isles community, "Barra and Lewis were generally deemed as authentic, South Uist slightly less so..." It should be noted that the flag of Barra is available from Mr Flag
[2] and A A Flags
[3].
JennieM 17:49, 12 January 2007 (UTC)
I believe the flag of Pärnu should be added under 'other nordic flags witht the nordic cross', due to it being the official flag of Pärnu, Estonia [4]
Why has the Vendsyssel flag been "whitened"?
It certainly has been in use.
I saw it twice in the 1990'ies, once flying nearby a Vendsyssel farm. "Not commonly known" must refer to Danes living outside Vendsyssel.
Cf.
http://www.fotw.net/flags/dk-vend.html.
Klauber Flag produces and sells this flag in all sizes on
http://www.klauber-flag.dk/flag.asp?cmd=details&flag=1167.
Bab
I agree totally. I've seen the flag in use several places in Vendsyssel and also on sale in Aalborg. The text should be changed.
What about Saint Piran's Flag, the flag of Cornwall? Shouldn't it be on the list?
It is not a Nordic cross. Briangotts (Talk) (Contrib) 18:47, 18 April 2007 (UTC)
I thought the style of this article would fit better on Commons, so I went ahead and copied the marjority of it to commons:Gallery of Nordic Cross flags. Now maybe the Wikipedia article could be restructured to look less like a gallery and more like an encylopedic article. -- Himasaram 06:14, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
This supposed "1871-1892" German flag which was posted here is spreading across wikipedia's flags pages. Almost all evidence available claims that Germany's flag from 1871-1918 was the black-white-red tricolour. This Nordic cross German flag has been added on the basis of Original Research, which is forbidden to be used on wikipedia articles. I am removing the information that states that this was the flag, and changing it to being that this flag is "claimed to be" the German flag from 1871-1892.-- R-41 20:42, 20 July 2007 (UTC)