![]() | This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
![]() | Additional info (sources & quotes) on this topic can be found at Nirvana (Buddhism) - research |
Hi Dorje108. Well done! One question: usually etymology comes first. And the Sutta Pitaka is the oldest scriptural part of Buddhism. I guess you choose this order of sections for better readability? Best regards, Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 19:06, 16 February 2014 (UTC)
Hi Dorje108. The Sutta Pitaka section definitiley contains original research. Quite some work to do there, when it is to be reliably sourced... I'll try to do some work there too. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 08:26, 17 February 2014 (UTC)
Of about a dozen sources I am consulting, only one mentioned the term "Moksha", that is in passing. It seems to be a general term for liberation. Regards, Dorje108 ( talk) 20:13, 17 February 2014 (UTC)
Hi everyone, just a heads up. I added a new section, Nirvana and nonexistence, based on an edit I reverted earlier for original research, which turned out to be just some problems with style after the editor who made the edits pointed it out. I'm not sure how clear the section is, but I'm sure you all will sort it out. FenixFeather ( talk) 07:10, 20 March 2014 (UTC)
According to Buswell and Lopez, nirvana is the most common term used to describe the Buddhist goal. May be so, but "vimutti" is also an often-used term.
I've moved the etymology-section upward; it's pretty common to start an article with the etymology-section. I've merged it with the "moksha"-section, since this term is almost used as a synonym. Better said: 'Nirvana is moksha'.
Joshua Jonathan -
Let's talk! 05:09, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
I've corrected the terminology here, and removed this miselading quote:
"He died" - "The Tathagata is deep etc"; where was the "he"? Let alone "he would not be reborn". To state that there is a person who's is reborn is regarded as a fallacy in most Buddhist traditions. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 08:03, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
Eventually ‘the remainder of life’ will be exhausted and, like all beings, such a person must die. But unlike other beings, who have not experienced ‘nirvāṇa’, he or she will not be reborn into some new life, the physical and mental constituents of being will not come together in some new existence, there will be no new being or person. Instead of being reborn, the person ‘parinirvāṇa-s’, meaning in this context that the five aggregates of physical and mental phenomena that constitute a being cease to occur. This is the condition of ‘nirvāṇa without remainder [of life]’ (nir-upadhiśeṣa-nirvāṇa/an-up ādisesa-nibbāna): nirvāṇa that comes from ending the occurrence of the aggregates (skandha/khandha) of physical and mental phenomena that constitute a being; or, for short, khandha-parinibbāna. Modern Buddhist usage tends to restrict ‘nirvāṇa’ to the awakening experience and reserve ‘parinirvāṇa’ for the death experience.
This text is unsourced, and problematic:
"the person's consciousness passes onto a new birth" - this statement definitely requires a source, as does "the person is reborn". A person who is reborn? Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 08:05, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
Who's going to experience the nirvana without remainder? Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 08:08, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
This whole section, plus the quotes from "Etymology", can be summarised as follows:
Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 09:13, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
After reworking several sections, I think that "Extinguishing the fires" and "End of rebirth" could be merged. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 19:47, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
I've merged them to the following, with two extensive notes with quotes:
The attainment of nirvana has also been given a more worldy interpretation, emphasising its effect in present life. [note 19]"
I think this should suffice. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 06:23, 20 December 2014 (UTC)
Funny, that exactly this info was removed, and replaced with four long quotes.
- Etymology
- Phonetics
Nirvāṇa is a composed of three phones ni and va and na:
- ni (nir, nis, nih): out, away from, without, a term that is used to negate
- va: blowing as in blowing of the wind and also as smelling [1]
- na: nor, never, do not, did not, should not [2]
Vana is forest in/of the forest/forests; composed of flowers and other items of the forest., [2] but vana has both phones van and va. Van has both an auspicious and ominous aspect:
- van: like, love; wish, desire; gain, procure; conquer, win; possess; prepare; [3]
- van:tree; forest; thicket, cluster, group; quantity; wood [3]
- va: blow (of wind); emit (an odor), be wafted or diffused [3]
- va: weave [3]
- Abhidharma
The abhidharma-mahāvibhāsa-sāstra, a sarvastivādin commentary, 3rd century BCE and later, describes [4] the possible etymological interpretations of the word nirvana. [note 1] [note 2]
Vana | +Nir | Nature of nirvana [5] |
---|---|---|
The path of rebirth | Leaving off | Being away from the path of rebirth permanently avoiding all paths of transmigration. |
Forest | Without | To be in a state which has got rid of, for ever, of the dense forest of the three fires of lust, malice and delusion |
Weaving | Being free | Freedom from the knot of the vexations of karmas and in which the texture of both birth and death is not to be woven |
Stench or stink | Without | Being without and free from all stench of karmas |
Each of the five aggregates is called a skandha, which means "tree trunk." Each skandha informs the study of one's every normal experience, but eventually leads away from nirvana. Skandha also means "heap" or "pile" or "mass," like an endless knot's path, or a forest.
References
nirvana is a compound of the prefix ni[r]- (ni, nis, nih) which means "out, away from, without", and the root vâ[na] (P. vâti) which can be translated as "blowing" as in "blowing of the wind", but also as "smelling, etc"
The sourcing is indeed not great, but the info is interesting, and worth a further investigation. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 06:14, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
This site has an interesting comment:
Edward Craig, "Routledge Encyclopedia of Philosophy: Index, lemma on nirvana, notes (p.9):
And here's an interesting analysis from "Pruning the Bodhi Tree", Paul swanson chapter 1:
In the next essay, on “Liberation and Nirvana: Some Non-Buddhist Ideas,” Matsumoto carries his critique a step further to argue that there is no greater misunderstanding than to say that the final goal of Buddhism is “liberation” (gedatsu; vimukti). The reason is that the idea of liberation (vimukti) is based on the non-Buddhist idea that there is a self („tmav„da) to be liberated, which is an anti-Buddhist idea. Not only liberation, but nirvana, a concentrated state of mind (jh„na, sam„dhi), and even “mind” (citta), are all based on the non-Buddhist idea of a self. In this essay Matsumoto sets aside the ideas of jh„na, sam„dhi, and citta in order to concentrate on liberation and nirvana. In short, he argues that the ideas of liberation and nirvana presuppose a “self” to be liberated, and is thus a dh„tu-v„da. He argues against the prevalent interpretation of nirvana as “extinction”—based on the etymology of nir√v„, to “blow out”—and instead argues for the etymology of nir√v£, to “uncover.” A painstaking textual study in support of his contention concludes with four points:
- The original meaning of “nirvana” was not “extinction” but “to uncover.”
- The basic idea of “nirvana” is “the liberation of the atman from what is not atman,” and is thus related to the idea of “liberation” as the goal of Buddhism. Thus both ideas of “nirvana” and “liberation” are based on the idea of an atman.
- The atman is often compared to “light” or said to give forth light. If one uncovers or takes away what is hindering the light, then the light can shine forth and illuminate the darkness. Thus the “extinction of light” cannot be the meaning of a liberation or “nirvana” of an atman.
- “The liberation of the atman from what is not atman” is the liberation of the “spirit” from the “body.” Thus, complete liberation is possible only by completely escaping the body, which is why this kind of liberation constitutes a “philosophy of death.”
Matsumoto has been criticised, but it's clear that the meaning of Nirvana is far from clear. This ambiguity should be reflected, instead of removed. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 06:14, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
Ah, and here's Buswell (2003), p.600:
Funny, isn't it? Again, not "what is it", but "what does it mean?" Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 06:18, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
Regarding the meaning "to weave", remember the kalachaktra tantra, and the loom which weaves time (or something like that). Which was somehow related to the image of a turning wheel, which is motionless in its centre. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 06:22, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
And Lindsay's encyclopedia of Religion', p.6629:
Lindtner, when writing on Schayer's research on earliest Buddhism and traces of brahmanical ideas, also writes about this meaning of "the farther shore", and the implication sof nirvana being some sort of other world. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 06:42, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
Looking for a reference for "(to) weave" I found this source: hwang, Soonil (2006), Metaphor and Literalism in Buddhism: The Doctrinal History of Nirvana, Routledge. Looks interesting. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 11:22, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
And here's another one: Steven Collins, Nirvana and Other Buddhist Felicities. A moderate 700 pages, on the development of the concept of nirvana. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 13:26, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
Eight or so quotes are given here to state that nirvana is the ultimate goal of Buddhism. anybody familiair with Buddhism knows that Mahayana has some different opinions here. I've already added some nuances, but let's look further:
- 1 Joseph Goldstein: "It is Nibbana that the Buddha declared to be the final goal of the spiritual journey." [1]
- 2 Smith and Novak: "Nirvana [is] the word the Buddha used to name life’s goal as he saw it. [...] Nirvana is the highest destiny of the human spirit and its literal meaning is “extinction,” but what is to be extinguished are the boundaries of the finite self [...]" [2]
- 3 Donald Lopez: "Nirvana is [...] the oldest and most common designation for the goal of the Buddhist path " [web 1]
This goal is still prevalent in contemporary Theravada-Buddhism:
- 4 Bhikkhu Bodhi: "Nibbana is the ultimate goal of the Buddha's path. The Buddha says 'Just as the water of a river plunges into the ocean and merges with the ocean, so the spiritual path, the Noble Eightfold Path, plunges into Nibbana and merges with Nibbana.'" [web 2]
- 5 Ajahn Pasano and Ajahn Amaro: "From the Buddhist viewpoint, the realization of Nibbana is the fulfillment of the highest human potential – a potential that exists in all of us, regardless of nationality or creed." [3]
- 6 Ajahn Sucitto states: "Nibbāna is held to be the ultimate goal in Buddhism. [...] It is the ending of sorrow and delusion, and it is supremely peaceful." [4]
- 7 Daniel Goleman states: "The fundamental goal of Buddhist practice is the achievement of nirvana." [5]
Despite the fact that Mahayana-Buddhism focuses on the Bodhisattva-ideal, and sees Buddhahood, which also aims at helping others, as the ultimate goal, nirvana is nevertheless generalized to be the ultimate goal of Buddhism in general:
- 8 Damien Keown states: "Nirvana is the summum bonum of Buddhism – the final and highest good. It is both a concept and an experience. As a concept it offers a particular vision of human fulfillment and gives contour and shape to the ideal life. As an experience it becomes incarnate over the course of time in the person who seeks it." [6]
- 9 The Dalai Lama states: "The ultimate aspiration of a practicing Buddhist is the attainment of nirvana. The emphasis is within oneself." [7]
- References
- ^ Goldstein 2011, pp. 158–159.
- ^ Smith & Novak 2009, pp. 51–52.
- ^ Ajahn Pasano & Ajahn Amaro 2008, p. 25.
- ^ Ajahn Sucitto 2010, pp. 162–163.
- ^ Goleman 2008, Kindle Locations 3538-3539.
- ^ Keown 2000, Kindle Locations 887-888.
- ^ Goleman 2008, Kindle Locations 5513-5517.
This looks like a collection of quotes which have been gathered uncritically, to "substantiate" a too general statement. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 17:17, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
The Dalai Lama also states:
I have removed the DL-quote; it's misleading. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 19:33, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
Seceral subsections could be gathered under a new section, discussing the "ontological status" of nirvana: is "it" an "it"? ('Is it a bird? Is it a plane? No, it's ...!') Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 16:15, 20 December 2014 (UTC)
I've copy-edited this section, to make it clearer. "Buddhahood" is the more commeon term, as far as I can see. "Non-abiding" is not so relevant as a term or a definition, but as a practice and attitude: back to the marketplace! See also Ten Bulls Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 17:17, 20 December 2014 (UTC)
The qualities of nirvana in this life are nice, but WP:UNDUE and WP:OVERQUOTE. I've retained them, but in notes. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 17:49, 20 December 2014 (UTC)
WP:UNDUE details, especially when it's not made clear why Buddhghosa difefred from the earlier teachings. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 17:54, 20 December 2014 (UTC)
I've worked these quotes into the rest of the article; they clarify some other sections, and stand-alone sectins with quotes are discouraged by Wiki-policy. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 05:59, 21 December 2014 (UTC)
I'll leave it there for the moment, although the problem has been solved. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 06:23, 21 December 2014 (UTC)
I've always found this a strange sentence:
It doesn't; it presents it as a"cooling down." I checked the source, and it's not what it says. It's about the Theravadin's understanding of nirvana, and the possibility of a vijnanavada-interpretation. I've corrected it diff:
Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 07:37, 21 December 2014 (UTC)
It's throwing date errors (see this and that) because of dates like 1995-B. I spend most of my time in a more technical world, so I'm unfamiliar with complex citation schemes like the one used by this page. Consequently, I'm not sure how to fix this.
Anyone else know how? -- Mathieu ottawa ( talk) 09:21, 22 February 2015 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to 2 external links on
Nirvana (Buddhism). Please take a moment to review
my edit. If necessary, add {{
cbignore}}
after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{
nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}}
to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— cyberbot II Talk to my owner:Online 12:18, 22 January 2016 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to 2 external links on
Nirvana (Buddhism). Please take a moment to review
my edit. If necessary, add {{
cbignore}}
after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{
nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}}
to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— cyberbot II Talk to my owner:Online 11:47, 23 February 2016 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Nirvana (Buddhism). Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit User:Cyberpower678/FaQs#InternetArchiveBot*this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at {{
Sourcecheck}}
).
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— cyberbot II Talk to my owner:Online 16:15, 14 June 2016 (UTC)
This article, NIRVANA has failed to give concise meaning of NIRVAN ( Sinhala-නිර්වාන ,නිවන ) in the first instance. The meaning of Nirvana is Imperturbable serenity of mind ,tranquility or stillness of mind which can never be excited or disturbed. The definition given by load Buddha is (අකුප්පා + චේතෝ + විමුක්ති, Akuppa +chetho+ wimikthi),it means Imperturbable serenity of mind . This article gives wrong impression about Nirvana. -- Rs Ekanayake 14:55, 17 August 2016 (UTC) the words blowing out,extinguishing,liberation does not give the meaning of NIRVANA.it is ridiculous. i am not going to find any reference but i know it is cpmpletly wrong. therefore i know wikipedia is wrong-- Rs Ekanayake 15:02, 17 August 2016 (UTC)
The article first says:
but later says:
Isn't this a contradiction? Bhikshu neeraj ( talk) 02:21, 15 June 2020 (UTC)
The adjective Soteriological makes ones stomach turn.
GigaGerard (
talk) 13:32, 21 August 2022 (UTC)
Cite error: There are <ref group=note>
tags on this page, but the references will not show without a {{reflist|group=note}}
template (see the
help page).
Cite error: There are <ref group=web>
tags on this page, but the references will not show without a {{reflist|group=web}}
template (see the
help page).
![]() | This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
![]() | Additional info (sources & quotes) on this topic can be found at Nirvana (Buddhism) - research |
Hi Dorje108. Well done! One question: usually etymology comes first. And the Sutta Pitaka is the oldest scriptural part of Buddhism. I guess you choose this order of sections for better readability? Best regards, Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 19:06, 16 February 2014 (UTC)
Hi Dorje108. The Sutta Pitaka section definitiley contains original research. Quite some work to do there, when it is to be reliably sourced... I'll try to do some work there too. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 08:26, 17 February 2014 (UTC)
Of about a dozen sources I am consulting, only one mentioned the term "Moksha", that is in passing. It seems to be a general term for liberation. Regards, Dorje108 ( talk) 20:13, 17 February 2014 (UTC)
Hi everyone, just a heads up. I added a new section, Nirvana and nonexistence, based on an edit I reverted earlier for original research, which turned out to be just some problems with style after the editor who made the edits pointed it out. I'm not sure how clear the section is, but I'm sure you all will sort it out. FenixFeather ( talk) 07:10, 20 March 2014 (UTC)
According to Buswell and Lopez, nirvana is the most common term used to describe the Buddhist goal. May be so, but "vimutti" is also an often-used term.
I've moved the etymology-section upward; it's pretty common to start an article with the etymology-section. I've merged it with the "moksha"-section, since this term is almost used as a synonym. Better said: 'Nirvana is moksha'.
Joshua Jonathan -
Let's talk! 05:09, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
I've corrected the terminology here, and removed this miselading quote:
"He died" - "The Tathagata is deep etc"; where was the "he"? Let alone "he would not be reborn". To state that there is a person who's is reborn is regarded as a fallacy in most Buddhist traditions. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 08:03, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
Eventually ‘the remainder of life’ will be exhausted and, like all beings, such a person must die. But unlike other beings, who have not experienced ‘nirvāṇa’, he or she will not be reborn into some new life, the physical and mental constituents of being will not come together in some new existence, there will be no new being or person. Instead of being reborn, the person ‘parinirvāṇa-s’, meaning in this context that the five aggregates of physical and mental phenomena that constitute a being cease to occur. This is the condition of ‘nirvāṇa without remainder [of life]’ (nir-upadhiśeṣa-nirvāṇa/an-up ādisesa-nibbāna): nirvāṇa that comes from ending the occurrence of the aggregates (skandha/khandha) of physical and mental phenomena that constitute a being; or, for short, khandha-parinibbāna. Modern Buddhist usage tends to restrict ‘nirvāṇa’ to the awakening experience and reserve ‘parinirvāṇa’ for the death experience.
This text is unsourced, and problematic:
"the person's consciousness passes onto a new birth" - this statement definitely requires a source, as does "the person is reborn". A person who is reborn? Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 08:05, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
Who's going to experience the nirvana without remainder? Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 08:08, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
This whole section, plus the quotes from "Etymology", can be summarised as follows:
Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 09:13, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
After reworking several sections, I think that "Extinguishing the fires" and "End of rebirth" could be merged. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 19:47, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
I've merged them to the following, with two extensive notes with quotes:
The attainment of nirvana has also been given a more worldy interpretation, emphasising its effect in present life. [note 19]"
I think this should suffice. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 06:23, 20 December 2014 (UTC)
Funny, that exactly this info was removed, and replaced with four long quotes.
- Etymology
- Phonetics
Nirvāṇa is a composed of three phones ni and va and na:
- ni (nir, nis, nih): out, away from, without, a term that is used to negate
- va: blowing as in blowing of the wind and also as smelling [1]
- na: nor, never, do not, did not, should not [2]
Vana is forest in/of the forest/forests; composed of flowers and other items of the forest., [2] but vana has both phones van and va. Van has both an auspicious and ominous aspect:
- van: like, love; wish, desire; gain, procure; conquer, win; possess; prepare; [3]
- van:tree; forest; thicket, cluster, group; quantity; wood [3]
- va: blow (of wind); emit (an odor), be wafted or diffused [3]
- va: weave [3]
- Abhidharma
The abhidharma-mahāvibhāsa-sāstra, a sarvastivādin commentary, 3rd century BCE and later, describes [4] the possible etymological interpretations of the word nirvana. [note 1] [note 2]
Vana | +Nir | Nature of nirvana [5] |
---|---|---|
The path of rebirth | Leaving off | Being away from the path of rebirth permanently avoiding all paths of transmigration. |
Forest | Without | To be in a state which has got rid of, for ever, of the dense forest of the three fires of lust, malice and delusion |
Weaving | Being free | Freedom from the knot of the vexations of karmas and in which the texture of both birth and death is not to be woven |
Stench or stink | Without | Being without and free from all stench of karmas |
Each of the five aggregates is called a skandha, which means "tree trunk." Each skandha informs the study of one's every normal experience, but eventually leads away from nirvana. Skandha also means "heap" or "pile" or "mass," like an endless knot's path, or a forest.
References
nirvana is a compound of the prefix ni[r]- (ni, nis, nih) which means "out, away from, without", and the root vâ[na] (P. vâti) which can be translated as "blowing" as in "blowing of the wind", but also as "smelling, etc"
The sourcing is indeed not great, but the info is interesting, and worth a further investigation. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 06:14, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
This site has an interesting comment:
Edward Craig, "Routledge Encyclopedia of Philosophy: Index, lemma on nirvana, notes (p.9):
And here's an interesting analysis from "Pruning the Bodhi Tree", Paul swanson chapter 1:
In the next essay, on “Liberation and Nirvana: Some Non-Buddhist Ideas,” Matsumoto carries his critique a step further to argue that there is no greater misunderstanding than to say that the final goal of Buddhism is “liberation” (gedatsu; vimukti). The reason is that the idea of liberation (vimukti) is based on the non-Buddhist idea that there is a self („tmav„da) to be liberated, which is an anti-Buddhist idea. Not only liberation, but nirvana, a concentrated state of mind (jh„na, sam„dhi), and even “mind” (citta), are all based on the non-Buddhist idea of a self. In this essay Matsumoto sets aside the ideas of jh„na, sam„dhi, and citta in order to concentrate on liberation and nirvana. In short, he argues that the ideas of liberation and nirvana presuppose a “self” to be liberated, and is thus a dh„tu-v„da. He argues against the prevalent interpretation of nirvana as “extinction”—based on the etymology of nir√v„, to “blow out”—and instead argues for the etymology of nir√v£, to “uncover.” A painstaking textual study in support of his contention concludes with four points:
- The original meaning of “nirvana” was not “extinction” but “to uncover.”
- The basic idea of “nirvana” is “the liberation of the atman from what is not atman,” and is thus related to the idea of “liberation” as the goal of Buddhism. Thus both ideas of “nirvana” and “liberation” are based on the idea of an atman.
- The atman is often compared to “light” or said to give forth light. If one uncovers or takes away what is hindering the light, then the light can shine forth and illuminate the darkness. Thus the “extinction of light” cannot be the meaning of a liberation or “nirvana” of an atman.
- “The liberation of the atman from what is not atman” is the liberation of the “spirit” from the “body.” Thus, complete liberation is possible only by completely escaping the body, which is why this kind of liberation constitutes a “philosophy of death.”
Matsumoto has been criticised, but it's clear that the meaning of Nirvana is far from clear. This ambiguity should be reflected, instead of removed. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 06:14, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
Ah, and here's Buswell (2003), p.600:
Funny, isn't it? Again, not "what is it", but "what does it mean?" Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 06:18, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
Regarding the meaning "to weave", remember the kalachaktra tantra, and the loom which weaves time (or something like that). Which was somehow related to the image of a turning wheel, which is motionless in its centre. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 06:22, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
And Lindsay's encyclopedia of Religion', p.6629:
Lindtner, when writing on Schayer's research on earliest Buddhism and traces of brahmanical ideas, also writes about this meaning of "the farther shore", and the implication sof nirvana being some sort of other world. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 06:42, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
Looking for a reference for "(to) weave" I found this source: hwang, Soonil (2006), Metaphor and Literalism in Buddhism: The Doctrinal History of Nirvana, Routledge. Looks interesting. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 11:22, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
And here's another one: Steven Collins, Nirvana and Other Buddhist Felicities. A moderate 700 pages, on the development of the concept of nirvana. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 13:26, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
Eight or so quotes are given here to state that nirvana is the ultimate goal of Buddhism. anybody familiair with Buddhism knows that Mahayana has some different opinions here. I've already added some nuances, but let's look further:
- 1 Joseph Goldstein: "It is Nibbana that the Buddha declared to be the final goal of the spiritual journey." [1]
- 2 Smith and Novak: "Nirvana [is] the word the Buddha used to name life’s goal as he saw it. [...] Nirvana is the highest destiny of the human spirit and its literal meaning is “extinction,” but what is to be extinguished are the boundaries of the finite self [...]" [2]
- 3 Donald Lopez: "Nirvana is [...] the oldest and most common designation for the goal of the Buddhist path " [web 1]
This goal is still prevalent in contemporary Theravada-Buddhism:
- 4 Bhikkhu Bodhi: "Nibbana is the ultimate goal of the Buddha's path. The Buddha says 'Just as the water of a river plunges into the ocean and merges with the ocean, so the spiritual path, the Noble Eightfold Path, plunges into Nibbana and merges with Nibbana.'" [web 2]
- 5 Ajahn Pasano and Ajahn Amaro: "From the Buddhist viewpoint, the realization of Nibbana is the fulfillment of the highest human potential – a potential that exists in all of us, regardless of nationality or creed." [3]
- 6 Ajahn Sucitto states: "Nibbāna is held to be the ultimate goal in Buddhism. [...] It is the ending of sorrow and delusion, and it is supremely peaceful." [4]
- 7 Daniel Goleman states: "The fundamental goal of Buddhist practice is the achievement of nirvana." [5]
Despite the fact that Mahayana-Buddhism focuses on the Bodhisattva-ideal, and sees Buddhahood, which also aims at helping others, as the ultimate goal, nirvana is nevertheless generalized to be the ultimate goal of Buddhism in general:
- 8 Damien Keown states: "Nirvana is the summum bonum of Buddhism – the final and highest good. It is both a concept and an experience. As a concept it offers a particular vision of human fulfillment and gives contour and shape to the ideal life. As an experience it becomes incarnate over the course of time in the person who seeks it." [6]
- 9 The Dalai Lama states: "The ultimate aspiration of a practicing Buddhist is the attainment of nirvana. The emphasis is within oneself." [7]
- References
- ^ Goldstein 2011, pp. 158–159.
- ^ Smith & Novak 2009, pp. 51–52.
- ^ Ajahn Pasano & Ajahn Amaro 2008, p. 25.
- ^ Ajahn Sucitto 2010, pp. 162–163.
- ^ Goleman 2008, Kindle Locations 3538-3539.
- ^ Keown 2000, Kindle Locations 887-888.
- ^ Goleman 2008, Kindle Locations 5513-5517.
This looks like a collection of quotes which have been gathered uncritically, to "substantiate" a too general statement. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 17:17, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
The Dalai Lama also states:
I have removed the DL-quote; it's misleading. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 19:33, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
Seceral subsections could be gathered under a new section, discussing the "ontological status" of nirvana: is "it" an "it"? ('Is it a bird? Is it a plane? No, it's ...!') Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 16:15, 20 December 2014 (UTC)
I've copy-edited this section, to make it clearer. "Buddhahood" is the more commeon term, as far as I can see. "Non-abiding" is not so relevant as a term or a definition, but as a practice and attitude: back to the marketplace! See also Ten Bulls Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 17:17, 20 December 2014 (UTC)
The qualities of nirvana in this life are nice, but WP:UNDUE and WP:OVERQUOTE. I've retained them, but in notes. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 17:49, 20 December 2014 (UTC)
WP:UNDUE details, especially when it's not made clear why Buddhghosa difefred from the earlier teachings. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 17:54, 20 December 2014 (UTC)
I've worked these quotes into the rest of the article; they clarify some other sections, and stand-alone sectins with quotes are discouraged by Wiki-policy. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 05:59, 21 December 2014 (UTC)
I'll leave it there for the moment, although the problem has been solved. Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 06:23, 21 December 2014 (UTC)
I've always found this a strange sentence:
It doesn't; it presents it as a"cooling down." I checked the source, and it's not what it says. It's about the Theravadin's understanding of nirvana, and the possibility of a vijnanavada-interpretation. I've corrected it diff:
Joshua Jonathan - Let's talk! 07:37, 21 December 2014 (UTC)
It's throwing date errors (see this and that) because of dates like 1995-B. I spend most of my time in a more technical world, so I'm unfamiliar with complex citation schemes like the one used by this page. Consequently, I'm not sure how to fix this.
Anyone else know how? -- Mathieu ottawa ( talk) 09:21, 22 February 2015 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to 2 external links on
Nirvana (Buddhism). Please take a moment to review
my edit. If necessary, add {{
cbignore}}
after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{
nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}}
to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— cyberbot II Talk to my owner:Online 12:18, 22 January 2016 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just added archive links to 2 external links on
Nirvana (Buddhism). Please take a moment to review
my edit. If necessary, add {{
cbignore}}
after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{
nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}}
to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— cyberbot II Talk to my owner:Online 11:47, 23 February 2016 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Nirvana (Buddhism). Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit User:Cyberpower678/FaQs#InternetArchiveBot*this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at {{
Sourcecheck}}
).
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— cyberbot II Talk to my owner:Online 16:15, 14 June 2016 (UTC)
This article, NIRVANA has failed to give concise meaning of NIRVAN ( Sinhala-නිර්වාන ,නිවන ) in the first instance. The meaning of Nirvana is Imperturbable serenity of mind ,tranquility or stillness of mind which can never be excited or disturbed. The definition given by load Buddha is (අකුප්පා + චේතෝ + විමුක්ති, Akuppa +chetho+ wimikthi),it means Imperturbable serenity of mind . This article gives wrong impression about Nirvana. -- Rs Ekanayake 14:55, 17 August 2016 (UTC) the words blowing out,extinguishing,liberation does not give the meaning of NIRVANA.it is ridiculous. i am not going to find any reference but i know it is cpmpletly wrong. therefore i know wikipedia is wrong-- Rs Ekanayake 15:02, 17 August 2016 (UTC)
The article first says:
but later says:
Isn't this a contradiction? Bhikshu neeraj ( talk) 02:21, 15 June 2020 (UTC)
The adjective Soteriological makes ones stomach turn.
GigaGerard (
talk) 13:32, 21 August 2022 (UTC)
Cite error: There are <ref group=note>
tags on this page, but the references will not show without a {{reflist|group=note}}
template (see the
help page).
Cite error: There are <ref group=web>
tags on this page, but the references will not show without a {{reflist|group=web}}
template (see the
help page).