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The result of the move request was: not moved. ( closed by non-admin page mover) Lennart97 ( talk) 18:05, 9 July 2021 (UTC)
Niu-York → New York (Ukraine) – Reliable English language sources Reuters ( here) and Deutsche Welle ( here (although their article contains a falsehood/urban legend about its founding (settlement was not founded by Germans))) do specifically name the settlement "New York" and not "Niu-York". Although it is only 2 sources, I think that the common English name of the settlement is "New York" and thus this article should be renamed "New York (Ukraine)" per Wikipedia:Naming conventions (use English). But because I am not sure if 2 sources is enough, I am asking your opinion. Keep in mind that we are talking about a settlement in Ukraine of 10,000 people, so it is unlikely that a lot of English sources will be talking about it........ — Yulia Romero • Talk to me! 12:27, 2 July 2021 (UTC)
I just want to add that this is really bad propganda the settlements name is Novgorodskoye it was vast majority Russian speaking. The English verison of the name is Novgorodskoye. It was founded by Russians in the time of Katherine the great. This article is seemingly rewriting the actual situation with the town. It reads as incredibly bad propaganda. The name should be the actual name Novgorodskoye unless there is actual historical evidence the name was ever New York. I will tell you up front there is no way this was called New York in the Soviet era, and it was officially Novgorodskoye from 1951 to 2021 when it was rebuilt after WWII. It seems that people have taken a propaganda initiative to rewrite the town history and name.
At the entrance to the city are road signs "New York", not "Niu-York". Link: 1.-- Ffederal ( talk) 11:06, 13 November 2021 (UTC)
I still also prefer the article name to be New York (Ukraine) per my 2 July 2021 arguments and the new ones presented above. — Yulia Romero • Talk to me! 13:33, 16 November 2021 (UTC)
I am confused. I can see a discussion and a banner stating that "Niu-York" was NOT moved to "New York (Ukraine)". And yet the article is named "New York (Ukraine)". What happened? -- Amakuha ( talk) 08:06, 26 April 2022 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: page moved. Andrewa ( talk) 06:41, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
New York (Ukraine) → New York, Ukraine – Per WP:PLACEDAB, "With the names of cities, towns, villages and other settlements, the tag is normally preceded by a comma, as in Hel, Poland." HappyWithWhatYouHaveToBeHappyWith ( talk) 16:56, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
Closing comments: What a mess! See the target page history and discussions above. But hopefully this will bring stability. I think I should also note that WP:UAPLACE is an information page, not a policy or guideline, so the idea that it must govern this decision shows no understanding of the issues. In view of this I assess strong consensus here. Andrewa ( talk) 06:41, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
I have been asked to clarify my closing comment that this post shows no understanding of the issues.
At the risk of splitting hairs, I did not say that the contributor shows no understanding of the issues. I try to discuss the content not the contributor, and this is a case in point. But obviously I was not clear enough on that in this case, and I apologise for any offence this caused.
As closer, I regarded this post as a !vote although not a formal one, but discarded it and thought it helpful to say exactly why I had done this, not just to be transparent regarding my reasoning but also because I thought the post in question was both misguided and misleading.
Everyone makes mistakes. I regard the contributor in question as an excellent contributor and administrator. Andrewa ( talk) 02:57, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
Who has control of it. Solidarityandfreedom ( talk) 19:08, 3 June 2022 (UTC)
Demographics Russian 65.74% ; why is there no Russian name in the article? Bakhmutka ( talk) 20:34, 13 August 2022 (UTC)
https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1576991771120136192 General Staff: Ukrainian army repels Russian attacks near 5 settlements. According to the General Staff, Ukrainian troops repelled Russian attempts to advance near the settlements of Maiorsk, New York, Zaitseve, Nevelske, and Pobieda, Donetsk Oblast. -- Aphaia ( talk) 18:00, 3 October 2022 (UTC)
The corresponding German page differs in the explanation of the etymology, claiming the name of the settlement to have been an homage to the settlement Jork near Hamburg. I don't have access to the source cited there, so I can't verify, but Jork does exist, and "nju" is a quite common variation of "neu" in local German dialects, so it sounds plausible. The sources cited in this English article are secondary in nature, and therefore might well be reporting a wrong folk etymology. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Clipka ( talk • contribs) 09:18, 29 October 2022 (UTC)
The source for quotation of Scabeeva's line and hyperlink in the article that is used as a source ( https://riafan.ru/23310825-skabeeva_vismeyala_poyavlenie_n_yu_iorka_na_ukraine) does not state that Scabeeva promised to rename the place anywhere.
The article quoted as source is also posted in 2021 and does not connect to full-scale Russian invasion circa 2022.
However, according to quoted article, she does state that "Ukrainian New-York will become a creb apple for Ukrainian government that they will not only bite, but also gulp" (pun on "Big Apple" and a Ukrainian saying "що не з'їм так понадкушую").
Please either remove sources, remove the quotation or find better sources. Daverok ( talk) 21:14, 26 March 2023 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
New York, Ukraine article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||
|
![]() | This article has previously been nominated to be moved. Please review the prior discussions if you are considering re-nomination.
Discussions:
|
The result of the move request was: not moved. ( closed by non-admin page mover) Lennart97 ( talk) 18:05, 9 July 2021 (UTC)
Niu-York → New York (Ukraine) – Reliable English language sources Reuters ( here) and Deutsche Welle ( here (although their article contains a falsehood/urban legend about its founding (settlement was not founded by Germans))) do specifically name the settlement "New York" and not "Niu-York". Although it is only 2 sources, I think that the common English name of the settlement is "New York" and thus this article should be renamed "New York (Ukraine)" per Wikipedia:Naming conventions (use English). But because I am not sure if 2 sources is enough, I am asking your opinion. Keep in mind that we are talking about a settlement in Ukraine of 10,000 people, so it is unlikely that a lot of English sources will be talking about it........ — Yulia Romero • Talk to me! 12:27, 2 July 2021 (UTC)
I just want to add that this is really bad propganda the settlements name is Novgorodskoye it was vast majority Russian speaking. The English verison of the name is Novgorodskoye. It was founded by Russians in the time of Katherine the great. This article is seemingly rewriting the actual situation with the town. It reads as incredibly bad propaganda. The name should be the actual name Novgorodskoye unless there is actual historical evidence the name was ever New York. I will tell you up front there is no way this was called New York in the Soviet era, and it was officially Novgorodskoye from 1951 to 2021 when it was rebuilt after WWII. It seems that people have taken a propaganda initiative to rewrite the town history and name.
At the entrance to the city are road signs "New York", not "Niu-York". Link: 1.-- Ffederal ( talk) 11:06, 13 November 2021 (UTC)
I still also prefer the article name to be New York (Ukraine) per my 2 July 2021 arguments and the new ones presented above. — Yulia Romero • Talk to me! 13:33, 16 November 2021 (UTC)
I am confused. I can see a discussion and a banner stating that "Niu-York" was NOT moved to "New York (Ukraine)". And yet the article is named "New York (Ukraine)". What happened? -- Amakuha ( talk) 08:06, 26 April 2022 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: page moved. Andrewa ( talk) 06:41, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
New York (Ukraine) → New York, Ukraine – Per WP:PLACEDAB, "With the names of cities, towns, villages and other settlements, the tag is normally preceded by a comma, as in Hel, Poland." HappyWithWhatYouHaveToBeHappyWith ( talk) 16:56, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
Closing comments: What a mess! See the target page history and discussions above. But hopefully this will bring stability. I think I should also note that WP:UAPLACE is an information page, not a policy or guideline, so the idea that it must govern this decision shows no understanding of the issues. In view of this I assess strong consensus here. Andrewa ( talk) 06:41, 1 June 2022 (UTC)
I have been asked to clarify my closing comment that this post shows no understanding of the issues.
At the risk of splitting hairs, I did not say that the contributor shows no understanding of the issues. I try to discuss the content not the contributor, and this is a case in point. But obviously I was not clear enough on that in this case, and I apologise for any offence this caused.
As closer, I regarded this post as a !vote although not a formal one, but discarded it and thought it helpful to say exactly why I had done this, not just to be transparent regarding my reasoning but also because I thought the post in question was both misguided and misleading.
Everyone makes mistakes. I regard the contributor in question as an excellent contributor and administrator. Andrewa ( talk) 02:57, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
Who has control of it. Solidarityandfreedom ( talk) 19:08, 3 June 2022 (UTC)
Demographics Russian 65.74% ; why is there no Russian name in the article? Bakhmutka ( talk) 20:34, 13 August 2022 (UTC)
https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1576991771120136192 General Staff: Ukrainian army repels Russian attacks near 5 settlements. According to the General Staff, Ukrainian troops repelled Russian attempts to advance near the settlements of Maiorsk, New York, Zaitseve, Nevelske, and Pobieda, Donetsk Oblast. -- Aphaia ( talk) 18:00, 3 October 2022 (UTC)
The corresponding German page differs in the explanation of the etymology, claiming the name of the settlement to have been an homage to the settlement Jork near Hamburg. I don't have access to the source cited there, so I can't verify, but Jork does exist, and "nju" is a quite common variation of "neu" in local German dialects, so it sounds plausible. The sources cited in this English article are secondary in nature, and therefore might well be reporting a wrong folk etymology. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Clipka ( talk • contribs) 09:18, 29 October 2022 (UTC)
The source for quotation of Scabeeva's line and hyperlink in the article that is used as a source ( https://riafan.ru/23310825-skabeeva_vismeyala_poyavlenie_n_yu_iorka_na_ukraine) does not state that Scabeeva promised to rename the place anywhere.
The article quoted as source is also posted in 2021 and does not connect to full-scale Russian invasion circa 2022.
However, according to quoted article, she does state that "Ukrainian New-York will become a creb apple for Ukrainian government that they will not only bite, but also gulp" (pun on "Big Apple" and a Ukrainian saying "що не з'їм так понадкушую").
Please either remove sources, remove the quotation or find better sources. Daverok ( talk) 21:14, 26 March 2023 (UTC)