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This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 24 August 2020 and 16 October 2020. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): JulesWatters, Lush84. Peer reviewers: Sleepmags1, Jakefriend9.
Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT ( talk) 04:58, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
Why didn't we just assist the tribes with housing and education, as opposed to allowing them and others to turn our communities into gambling dens that breed crime, financial ruin, and child neglect? This was a no-brainer, but we are unfortunately governed by politicians such as California Senator Barbara Boxer, who voted to allow the building of such a casino on open space in Sonoma County, simply because her son had a financial interest in it.
Why is reservation shopping considered Political POV? It is currently being investigated by Congress with pending legislation to stop the practice.
The pending legislation would amend the Indian Gaming Regulatory Act to prevent non-indigenous tribes from locating casinos outside of their established lands. Further, it would bar newly recognized tribes from taking new lands into trust for the purpose of establishing gaming operations. If you are going to discuss other problems with Indian Gaming it is fair and appropriate to discuss reservation shopping as a national problem.
Regarding "reservation shopping", could we get a source for this comment? Additionally, the national expansion of Indian Gaming has led to a practice critics call reservation shopping.[18] This term describes tribes that, with the backing of casino investors, attempt to locate a casino out of their indigenous homeland, usually near a large urban center. However, although authorized by the Indian Gaming Regulatory Act, only three such "off-reservation" casinos have been built to date. The source cited is nothing more than an article form a local paper in CA discussing ideas for casinos that have been "floated". Where are these 3 off-reservation casinos? Heck, we have three in Tulsa, OK, right here in the city, and none are on Indian "reservations". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.185.216.18 ( talk) 12:35, 16 August 2010 (UTC)
Bill Merchant, noted Indian broadcaster used to say, "Just say Indian. It reminds us that Columbus was wrong about a lot of things, and that there's no going back."
And just say Indian casino. "Native American Gaming Enterprises" is PC Gone Wild. Do a search for Indian & casino, and you'll get many results from gambling tribes that refer to their operations as Indian casinos.
Las Vegas moneymen are fueling Indian casinos, which are increasingly moving into towns and cities.
I got to this article by redirect from an "indian gaming" link here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cocopah
As you can see the proper name of this article is "native american gambling" not "indian gambling". The article should be altered to reflect this, with every instance of "indiam gambling" in it changed to "native american gambling". Bubuntu 21:59, 26 May 2007 (UTC)
It seems to me that this is a bit focused on gaming and its possible exploits and crimes. I'm curious if others think this scope is too narrow and borders on being aneutral for being too negative. Austin 19:34, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
Hello I am a student at UNC Chapel Hill and I will be editing and doing research on Indian Gaming and specifically the court cases that led up to IGRA and the first Class 1 and Class 2 lotteries and bingos on an Indian reservation. Kumar.2d ( talk) 19:32, 2 October 2008 (UTC)
Hello, I am also a student at The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, and I will be editing and doing research on Indian gaming. Specifically, I will be researching recent economic contributions of tribal gambling enterprises. Thank you very much.-- Brian Teague ( talk) 20:43, 2 October 2008 (UTC)
I've begun cleanup of this article - it really needs it. More to follow... —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bg860d ( talk • contribs) 07:55, 24 November 2009 (UTC)
I removed the following:
...which only had this as a citation: ref name="Law, Politics 2004" . For starters, that's not a citation. Furthermore, having worked for the NCAA, I can say with certainty that they never "support" any casino in any sense of the term. And stating that "other coastal communities blah blah blah" weighs heavily of OR. So, yeah, out it went. 98.232.51.88 ( talk) 02:08, 22 February 2010 (UTC)
No consensus to move. Vegaswikian ( talk) 02:36, 23 January 2011 (UTC)
Native American gaming enterprises → Indian casinos—If a particular name is commonly used, it overrides the neutrality rule. See Wikipedia:Neutral_point_of_view#Naming and Wikipedia:Article_titles#Non-neutral_but_common_names. Chris3145 ( talk) 02:31, 16 January 2011 (UTC)
Further notes about naming on Wikipedia, from Wikipedia:Article_titles: "Article titles are often proper nouns, such as the subject's name. Wikipedia does not necessarily use the subject's "official" name as an article title; it instead uses the name which is most frequently used to refer to the subject in English-language reliable sources. This includes usage in the sources used as references for the article. Article titles should be neither vulgar nor pedantic. The term most typically used in reliable sources is preferred to technically correct but rarer forms, whether the official name, the scientific name, the birth name, the original name or the trademarked name. Other encyclopedias may be helpful in deciding what titles are in an encyclopedic register as well as what name is most frequently used (see below)."
I still disagree with the title of this article being "Native American gaming enterprises". Almost any feasible change to the article title would be an improvement. I took the advice given here about using a search engine to see what terms are commonly used. I searched with each phrase in quotes, and excluded results that included the word "Wikipedia".
search term / number of results
"indian casino" -wikipedia / 3,960,000 results
"native american casino" -wikipedia / 440,000 results
"tribal casino" -wikipedia / 395,000 results
"native american gaming" -wikipedia / 62,500 results
"native american gaming enterprise" -wikipedia / 9 results
The current title yields 9 hits. "Indian casino" is by far the most popular term, with about 9 times as many hits as the second place contender of "native american casino."
"Indian casino" is the norm by far. "Native American gaming enterprise" is clearly a term that isn't used by anybody. (Okay, slight exaggeration, but compare 9 hits to about 4 million.) While "Native American" is more correct than "Indian", "Indian" is the word that gets used in conjunction with "casino". I also refuse to accept the notion that "gaming enterprise" is more correct than "casino" because casinos or only a subset of gaming enterprises. What kind other kind of gaming enterprises do Native Americans run?
Any feasible title would be better than the current one, but there is a correct choice here that I feel is pretty clear. Flying squirrels and flying fish don't actually fly, but that's what people call them, so that's what their article titles are on Wikipedia. Chris3145 ( talk) 07:14, 29 January 2011 (UTC)
Might this article benefit from a section on the entertainment these establishments offer? They seem to have provided venues for the stars and groups of yesteryear, which strikes me as a bit of a phenomenon. LorenzoB ( talk) 19:40, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
This article doesn't explain why Native Americans operate gambling establishments rather than, say, movie theaters or amusement parks. Why is it that Indian casinos are more famous? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.163.222.67 ( talk) 04:15, 17 June 2011 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Not moved Mike Cline ( talk) 13:08, 18 June 2012 (UTC)
Native American gaming → Indian gaming – "Indian gaming" is by far the dominant term used by the industry (see the National Indian Gaming Association), government (see National Indian Gaming Commission), the press, and academia. Searching for "indian gaming is", "tribal gaming is", and "native american gaming is" (with the extra "is" to avoid counting hits for the aforementioned NIGC and NIGA), "Indian" typically outnumbers "tribal" by a factor of 4, and outnumbers "Native American" by factors ranging from 20 to 20,000. (Searches included Google, Google News Archives, Google Books, Google Scholar, NewsBank, and HighBeam). The current title is nothing but a POV euphemism. Some commenters in the previous RM argued that "Indian gaming" is ambiguous. That may be true in some parallel universe where India has a thriving video game industry, but it is not true in this universe. Out of the first 100 Google results, 100 are about Native American casinos. Toohool ( talk) 02:10, 9 June 2012 (UTC)
This article ostensibly covers "Native American gaming" or "Indian gaming", but it only focuses on the US. There are such issues in Canada, so this is highly biased, or the article is badly named. 70.24.251.208 ( talk) 06:08, 9 June 2012 (UTC)
I agree with the IP that the article's scope and/or name needs to be changed to deal with Indian casinos outside of the U.S. (i.e. in Canada), of which no mention is currently made. If the two topics can be dealt with together in the same article, so be it. If a separate article needs to be created ("SOMETITLE in Canada"), then this article should be renamed to "SOMETITLE in the United States".
I
♦
A
08:50, 10 June 2012 (UTC)
I'm not sure that Native American, Amerind and Amerindian are used much in Canada. By the way although the legal name is Indian Affairs it is more commonly known as Aboriginal Affairs and Northern Development Canada ( Aboriginal Affairs and Northern Development Canada). I really don't see this as a naming problem. CambridgeBayWeather ( talk) 19:27, 12 June 2012 (UTC)
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As far as I know, there is no article for First Nations casinos (in general). I'm not sure if they warrant a standalone article. Should they be incorporated into this article somehow? The Verified Cactus 100% 14:12, 18 March 2018 (UTC)
A discussion is taking place to address the redirect Indian gaming. The discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2021 September 4#Indian gaming until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. MB 19:23, 4 September 2021 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Native American gaming article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 24 August 2020 and 16 October 2020. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): JulesWatters, Lush84. Peer reviewers: Sleepmags1, Jakefriend9.
Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT ( talk) 04:58, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
Why didn't we just assist the tribes with housing and education, as opposed to allowing them and others to turn our communities into gambling dens that breed crime, financial ruin, and child neglect? This was a no-brainer, but we are unfortunately governed by politicians such as California Senator Barbara Boxer, who voted to allow the building of such a casino on open space in Sonoma County, simply because her son had a financial interest in it.
Why is reservation shopping considered Political POV? It is currently being investigated by Congress with pending legislation to stop the practice.
The pending legislation would amend the Indian Gaming Regulatory Act to prevent non-indigenous tribes from locating casinos outside of their established lands. Further, it would bar newly recognized tribes from taking new lands into trust for the purpose of establishing gaming operations. If you are going to discuss other problems with Indian Gaming it is fair and appropriate to discuss reservation shopping as a national problem.
Regarding "reservation shopping", could we get a source for this comment? Additionally, the national expansion of Indian Gaming has led to a practice critics call reservation shopping.[18] This term describes tribes that, with the backing of casino investors, attempt to locate a casino out of their indigenous homeland, usually near a large urban center. However, although authorized by the Indian Gaming Regulatory Act, only three such "off-reservation" casinos have been built to date. The source cited is nothing more than an article form a local paper in CA discussing ideas for casinos that have been "floated". Where are these 3 off-reservation casinos? Heck, we have three in Tulsa, OK, right here in the city, and none are on Indian "reservations". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.185.216.18 ( talk) 12:35, 16 August 2010 (UTC)
Bill Merchant, noted Indian broadcaster used to say, "Just say Indian. It reminds us that Columbus was wrong about a lot of things, and that there's no going back."
And just say Indian casino. "Native American Gaming Enterprises" is PC Gone Wild. Do a search for Indian & casino, and you'll get many results from gambling tribes that refer to their operations as Indian casinos.
Las Vegas moneymen are fueling Indian casinos, which are increasingly moving into towns and cities.
I got to this article by redirect from an "indian gaming" link here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cocopah
As you can see the proper name of this article is "native american gambling" not "indian gambling". The article should be altered to reflect this, with every instance of "indiam gambling" in it changed to "native american gambling". Bubuntu 21:59, 26 May 2007 (UTC)
It seems to me that this is a bit focused on gaming and its possible exploits and crimes. I'm curious if others think this scope is too narrow and borders on being aneutral for being too negative. Austin 19:34, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
Hello I am a student at UNC Chapel Hill and I will be editing and doing research on Indian Gaming and specifically the court cases that led up to IGRA and the first Class 1 and Class 2 lotteries and bingos on an Indian reservation. Kumar.2d ( talk) 19:32, 2 October 2008 (UTC)
Hello, I am also a student at The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, and I will be editing and doing research on Indian gaming. Specifically, I will be researching recent economic contributions of tribal gambling enterprises. Thank you very much.-- Brian Teague ( talk) 20:43, 2 October 2008 (UTC)
I've begun cleanup of this article - it really needs it. More to follow... —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bg860d ( talk • contribs) 07:55, 24 November 2009 (UTC)
I removed the following:
...which only had this as a citation: ref name="Law, Politics 2004" . For starters, that's not a citation. Furthermore, having worked for the NCAA, I can say with certainty that they never "support" any casino in any sense of the term. And stating that "other coastal communities blah blah blah" weighs heavily of OR. So, yeah, out it went. 98.232.51.88 ( talk) 02:08, 22 February 2010 (UTC)
No consensus to move. Vegaswikian ( talk) 02:36, 23 January 2011 (UTC)
Native American gaming enterprises → Indian casinos—If a particular name is commonly used, it overrides the neutrality rule. See Wikipedia:Neutral_point_of_view#Naming and Wikipedia:Article_titles#Non-neutral_but_common_names. Chris3145 ( talk) 02:31, 16 January 2011 (UTC)
Further notes about naming on Wikipedia, from Wikipedia:Article_titles: "Article titles are often proper nouns, such as the subject's name. Wikipedia does not necessarily use the subject's "official" name as an article title; it instead uses the name which is most frequently used to refer to the subject in English-language reliable sources. This includes usage in the sources used as references for the article. Article titles should be neither vulgar nor pedantic. The term most typically used in reliable sources is preferred to technically correct but rarer forms, whether the official name, the scientific name, the birth name, the original name or the trademarked name. Other encyclopedias may be helpful in deciding what titles are in an encyclopedic register as well as what name is most frequently used (see below)."
I still disagree with the title of this article being "Native American gaming enterprises". Almost any feasible change to the article title would be an improvement. I took the advice given here about using a search engine to see what terms are commonly used. I searched with each phrase in quotes, and excluded results that included the word "Wikipedia".
search term / number of results
"indian casino" -wikipedia / 3,960,000 results
"native american casino" -wikipedia / 440,000 results
"tribal casino" -wikipedia / 395,000 results
"native american gaming" -wikipedia / 62,500 results
"native american gaming enterprise" -wikipedia / 9 results
The current title yields 9 hits. "Indian casino" is by far the most popular term, with about 9 times as many hits as the second place contender of "native american casino."
"Indian casino" is the norm by far. "Native American gaming enterprise" is clearly a term that isn't used by anybody. (Okay, slight exaggeration, but compare 9 hits to about 4 million.) While "Native American" is more correct than "Indian", "Indian" is the word that gets used in conjunction with "casino". I also refuse to accept the notion that "gaming enterprise" is more correct than "casino" because casinos or only a subset of gaming enterprises. What kind other kind of gaming enterprises do Native Americans run?
Any feasible title would be better than the current one, but there is a correct choice here that I feel is pretty clear. Flying squirrels and flying fish don't actually fly, but that's what people call them, so that's what their article titles are on Wikipedia. Chris3145 ( talk) 07:14, 29 January 2011 (UTC)
Might this article benefit from a section on the entertainment these establishments offer? They seem to have provided venues for the stars and groups of yesteryear, which strikes me as a bit of a phenomenon. LorenzoB ( talk) 19:40, 16 March 2011 (UTC)
This article doesn't explain why Native Americans operate gambling establishments rather than, say, movie theaters or amusement parks. Why is it that Indian casinos are more famous? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.163.222.67 ( talk) 04:15, 17 June 2011 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: Not moved Mike Cline ( talk) 13:08, 18 June 2012 (UTC)
Native American gaming → Indian gaming – "Indian gaming" is by far the dominant term used by the industry (see the National Indian Gaming Association), government (see National Indian Gaming Commission), the press, and academia. Searching for "indian gaming is", "tribal gaming is", and "native american gaming is" (with the extra "is" to avoid counting hits for the aforementioned NIGC and NIGA), "Indian" typically outnumbers "tribal" by a factor of 4, and outnumbers "Native American" by factors ranging from 20 to 20,000. (Searches included Google, Google News Archives, Google Books, Google Scholar, NewsBank, and HighBeam). The current title is nothing but a POV euphemism. Some commenters in the previous RM argued that "Indian gaming" is ambiguous. That may be true in some parallel universe where India has a thriving video game industry, but it is not true in this universe. Out of the first 100 Google results, 100 are about Native American casinos. Toohool ( talk) 02:10, 9 June 2012 (UTC)
This article ostensibly covers "Native American gaming" or "Indian gaming", but it only focuses on the US. There are such issues in Canada, so this is highly biased, or the article is badly named. 70.24.251.208 ( talk) 06:08, 9 June 2012 (UTC)
I agree with the IP that the article's scope and/or name needs to be changed to deal with Indian casinos outside of the U.S. (i.e. in Canada), of which no mention is currently made. If the two topics can be dealt with together in the same article, so be it. If a separate article needs to be created ("SOMETITLE in Canada"), then this article should be renamed to "SOMETITLE in the United States".
I
♦
A
08:50, 10 June 2012 (UTC)
I'm not sure that Native American, Amerind and Amerindian are used much in Canada. By the way although the legal name is Indian Affairs it is more commonly known as Aboriginal Affairs and Northern Development Canada ( Aboriginal Affairs and Northern Development Canada). I really don't see this as a naming problem. CambridgeBayWeather ( talk) 19:27, 12 June 2012 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 2 external links on Native American gaming. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 14:13, 14 February 2018 (UTC)
As far as I know, there is no article for First Nations casinos (in general). I'm not sure if they warrant a standalone article. Should they be incorporated into this article somehow? The Verified Cactus 100% 14:12, 18 March 2018 (UTC)
A discussion is taking place to address the redirect Indian gaming. The discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2021 September 4#Indian gaming until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. MB 19:23, 4 September 2021 (UTC)