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10 September 2006 Rednblu Asks:(Can you cite to a political analyst or historian saying this?) These are historical facts as both were the case as formed by the military members only in 1960 and 1980 with no civilians, lasting until return to civilian government and were never NSC. The history (the proper one) with citation has been posted to the NSC-Turkey several times but been reverted by BertilVidet every time. One more attempt was made today. -- 172.164.28.199 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.164.28.199 ( talk) 05:47, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
Thank you for your constructive questions and assistance. This entry you are asking clarification is pertinent to the commentary by Bertilvidet under "the role of the military in Turkey" that he seems to percieve as the NSC function where it is not. For example after 1980 coup, the committee that run the country for couple of years called itself "Milli Guvenlik Konseyi" where the word "konsey" ironically meant council but had nothing to do with the "Milli Guvenlik Kurulu" which actually is tranlated as the Board of National Security verbatim but is the analogus body to the US NSC like National Security Council of Turkey that has been in existence in Turkey as a democratic and civilian - military mixed think-tank organization with advisory role since 1933 continuously. I tried to post the correct history of NSC at the pertinent article but it was obsessively deleted and reverted by bertilvidet, misleading the readers. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.128.84.84 ( talk) 18:28, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
I reorganized the article to reflect it's more category-like status. I hope that it will be expanded upon as a directory of sorts for NSCs in various countries. As for the supposed controversy in China, we definitely need some more background with verifiable information. Thanks. Alcarillo 18:18, 17 October 2006 (UTC)
This article seems a bit odd. The different states' NSCs do surely deserve their respective articles. But I don't see the point of this article. How about converting it into a disamb. page? Bertilvidet 19:19, 17 October 2006 (UTC)
The following is what has been removed without the consent of the originial contributor (who was not me) :"There have been instances of national security councils exerting political influence, sometimes in violation of a state's laws or constitution. The most notable in recent U.S. history was during the Iran-Contra Affair when several staffers on the U.S. National Security Council contravened U.S. law and may have conducted policy without presidential approval." I think, at least in respect to the contributor, this point should still be in the talk page. By the way, the next better step would be to start integrating the above contribution at the top of the page to the NSC Turkey page by someone (guess who!) instead of throwing tantrums with 'personal attack' (!) blues. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.144.218.21 ( talk) 01:32, 21 October 2006 (UTC)
I dont mean to be insensitive and stubborn here and it is taking too long to explain the same thing but please see my note in the articles in the log history which goes (As you can see my edit history, I am trying to re-establish some good contributions at some very polarized articles and this si the same posting inviting a more open approach. Not so sure what is happening here with seemingly good suggestions being deleted back and forth. I find these changes useful and I believe they should be available to users. I guess that would be the fair thing to do. I think if the mentioned individuals believe that the log history given is inaccurrate, they should rather clarify it here rather than reversing everything. At least, I agree with the suggestions in the main block of the text as worthwhile and they are now my contributions. Hope to see some consensus here.) Perhaps, and quite rightfully, the sentences where any personal attack is percieved can be cleaned out rather than wholesale deletes. Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 160.79.139.10 ( talk) 16:53, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
Not so sure what is happening here with seemingly good suggestions being deleted back and forth. I find these changes useful and I believe they should be available to users. I guess that would be the fair thing to do. I think if the mentioned individuals believe that the log history given is inaccurrate, they should rather clarify it here rather than reversing everything. At least, I agree with the suggestions in the main block of the text as worthwhile and they are now my contributions. Hope to see some consensus here. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 160.79.139.10 ( talk) 16:53, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
The below legitimate edits to the National Security Council (Turkey) page by various authors have been vandalized and reverted with no discussion or agreement by the following acts by the users: 07:06, 16 August 2006 Bertilvidet, 17:34, 19 August 2006 Bertilvidet , 22:19, 20 August 2006 Khoikhoi
The National Security Council (Milli Güvenlik Kurulu (MGK) in Turkish) is a powerful body that unites the top civilian and military leaders, and issues state recommendations with the democratic government upon all matters deemed pertinent to the policies of the Turkish Republic. The creation of the MGK was an outcome of the reformation of The National Defense Supreme Council that had been in service since 1949 which was originally formed as The Supreme Defense Assembly in 1933 and was formally re-established in December 1962 under the organizational structure and name of The National Security Council in accordance with the 1961 Constitution. The National Security Council, composed of the Prime Minister, Chief of the General Staff, Deputy Prime Minister, Ministers of National Defence, Internal Affairs, Foreign Affairs, Finance, Transportation and Labor as well as Chief of Staff and Commanders of the Army, Navy, Air Forces and Gendarmarie under the chairmanship of the President of the Republic, assists the cabinet of Council of Ministers in decision making process related to national security issues and providing necessary coordination. The Council takes its decisions with majority vote. Decisions for recommendations made by voting have no binding power. In the absence of the President, the council would meet under the chairmanship of the Prime Minister. Depending on the agenda, Ministers and experts from various institutions would attend to the meetings of the Council upon Prime Minister’s invitation. Duties of the National Security Council were listed in the law under main headings on the issues of the advisory decisions pertaining to the formulation, establishment and implementation of the national security policy and ensuring the necessary coordination in order to preserve the existence and independence of the State, the integrity and indivisibility of the country and the peace and the security of society. Duties of MGK — Preceding unsigned comment added by 160.79.139.10 ( talk) 16:53, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
The most immediate attention required appears to be at the NSC Turkey site; if people feel that this NSC disambiguation page requires attention, please feel free to re-add the tag, but say what and which part needs attention Buckshot06 06:01, 21 November 2006 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved as proposed. A substantial number of editors feel that this article should be made into a disambiguation page; feel free to do that boldly or, if necessary, to continue discussing the matter. ( closed by non-admin page mover) Extraordinary Writ ( talk) 06:28, 20 December 2021 (UTC)
National Security Council →
National security council – Since this is an article about similar organizations in several dozen different countries, the article name is not a proper noun, and thus ought not be capitalized. For instance, we have the article "
Board of directors" with a lower-case "d". Let's discuss as needed, and thanks to all for their contributions to WP.
KConWiki (
talk)
02:15, 13 December 2021 (UTC)
![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
10 September 2006 Rednblu Asks:(Can you cite to a political analyst or historian saying this?) These are historical facts as both were the case as formed by the military members only in 1960 and 1980 with no civilians, lasting until return to civilian government and were never NSC. The history (the proper one) with citation has been posted to the NSC-Turkey several times but been reverted by BertilVidet every time. One more attempt was made today. -- 172.164.28.199 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.164.28.199 ( talk) 05:47, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
Thank you for your constructive questions and assistance. This entry you are asking clarification is pertinent to the commentary by Bertilvidet under "the role of the military in Turkey" that he seems to percieve as the NSC function where it is not. For example after 1980 coup, the committee that run the country for couple of years called itself "Milli Guvenlik Konseyi" where the word "konsey" ironically meant council but had nothing to do with the "Milli Guvenlik Kurulu" which actually is tranlated as the Board of National Security verbatim but is the analogus body to the US NSC like National Security Council of Turkey that has been in existence in Turkey as a democratic and civilian - military mixed think-tank organization with advisory role since 1933 continuously. I tried to post the correct history of NSC at the pertinent article but it was obsessively deleted and reverted by bertilvidet, misleading the readers. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.128.84.84 ( talk) 18:28, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
I reorganized the article to reflect it's more category-like status. I hope that it will be expanded upon as a directory of sorts for NSCs in various countries. As for the supposed controversy in China, we definitely need some more background with verifiable information. Thanks. Alcarillo 18:18, 17 October 2006 (UTC)
This article seems a bit odd. The different states' NSCs do surely deserve their respective articles. But I don't see the point of this article. How about converting it into a disamb. page? Bertilvidet 19:19, 17 October 2006 (UTC)
The following is what has been removed without the consent of the originial contributor (who was not me) :"There have been instances of national security councils exerting political influence, sometimes in violation of a state's laws or constitution. The most notable in recent U.S. history was during the Iran-Contra Affair when several staffers on the U.S. National Security Council contravened U.S. law and may have conducted policy without presidential approval." I think, at least in respect to the contributor, this point should still be in the talk page. By the way, the next better step would be to start integrating the above contribution at the top of the page to the NSC Turkey page by someone (guess who!) instead of throwing tantrums with 'personal attack' (!) blues. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.144.218.21 ( talk) 01:32, 21 October 2006 (UTC)
I dont mean to be insensitive and stubborn here and it is taking too long to explain the same thing but please see my note in the articles in the log history which goes (As you can see my edit history, I am trying to re-establish some good contributions at some very polarized articles and this si the same posting inviting a more open approach. Not so sure what is happening here with seemingly good suggestions being deleted back and forth. I find these changes useful and I believe they should be available to users. I guess that would be the fair thing to do. I think if the mentioned individuals believe that the log history given is inaccurrate, they should rather clarify it here rather than reversing everything. At least, I agree with the suggestions in the main block of the text as worthwhile and they are now my contributions. Hope to see some consensus here.) Perhaps, and quite rightfully, the sentences where any personal attack is percieved can be cleaned out rather than wholesale deletes. Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 160.79.139.10 ( talk) 16:53, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
Not so sure what is happening here with seemingly good suggestions being deleted back and forth. I find these changes useful and I believe they should be available to users. I guess that would be the fair thing to do. I think if the mentioned individuals believe that the log history given is inaccurrate, they should rather clarify it here rather than reversing everything. At least, I agree with the suggestions in the main block of the text as worthwhile and they are now my contributions. Hope to see some consensus here. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 160.79.139.10 ( talk) 16:53, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
The below legitimate edits to the National Security Council (Turkey) page by various authors have been vandalized and reverted with no discussion or agreement by the following acts by the users: 07:06, 16 August 2006 Bertilvidet, 17:34, 19 August 2006 Bertilvidet , 22:19, 20 August 2006 Khoikhoi
The National Security Council (Milli Güvenlik Kurulu (MGK) in Turkish) is a powerful body that unites the top civilian and military leaders, and issues state recommendations with the democratic government upon all matters deemed pertinent to the policies of the Turkish Republic. The creation of the MGK was an outcome of the reformation of The National Defense Supreme Council that had been in service since 1949 which was originally formed as The Supreme Defense Assembly in 1933 and was formally re-established in December 1962 under the organizational structure and name of The National Security Council in accordance with the 1961 Constitution. The National Security Council, composed of the Prime Minister, Chief of the General Staff, Deputy Prime Minister, Ministers of National Defence, Internal Affairs, Foreign Affairs, Finance, Transportation and Labor as well as Chief of Staff and Commanders of the Army, Navy, Air Forces and Gendarmarie under the chairmanship of the President of the Republic, assists the cabinet of Council of Ministers in decision making process related to national security issues and providing necessary coordination. The Council takes its decisions with majority vote. Decisions for recommendations made by voting have no binding power. In the absence of the President, the council would meet under the chairmanship of the Prime Minister. Depending on the agenda, Ministers and experts from various institutions would attend to the meetings of the Council upon Prime Minister’s invitation. Duties of the National Security Council were listed in the law under main headings on the issues of the advisory decisions pertaining to the formulation, establishment and implementation of the national security policy and ensuring the necessary coordination in order to preserve the existence and independence of the State, the integrity and indivisibility of the country and the peace and the security of society. Duties of MGK — Preceding unsigned comment added by 160.79.139.10 ( talk) 16:53, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
The most immediate attention required appears to be at the NSC Turkey site; if people feel that this NSC disambiguation page requires attention, please feel free to re-add the tag, but say what and which part needs attention Buckshot06 06:01, 21 November 2006 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved as proposed. A substantial number of editors feel that this article should be made into a disambiguation page; feel free to do that boldly or, if necessary, to continue discussing the matter. ( closed by non-admin page mover) Extraordinary Writ ( talk) 06:28, 20 December 2021 (UTC)
National Security Council →
National security council – Since this is an article about similar organizations in several dozen different countries, the article name is not a proper noun, and thus ought not be capitalized. For instance, we have the article "
Board of directors" with a lower-case "d". Let's discuss as needed, and thanks to all for their contributions to WP.
KConWiki (
talk)
02:15, 13 December 2021 (UTC)