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So, what are the codes for "lacking evidence", "personal opinion" and "not enough good references"?
This is a terrible scientific article. Sources and references need to be provided.
Controversial; yes. Unproven; yes. License to promote any old opinion; not really.
Can someone append tags to this article to indicate its tenuous nature? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 27.33.88.180 ( talk) 12:08, 19 March 2013 (UTC)
The statement "Some researchers believe nanobe-like organisms might be implicated in a number of diseases. They might be responsible for the formation of some types of renal stones. They might even explain mysterious calcification of teeth in the human mouth, and thus actually be a useful or necessary symbiont (like Acidophilus)." is, I feel, absurd to mention unless it has some sources directly mentioned. In point of fact, the article mentioned says that "*Biomineralization* could result in the formation of bones, shells, teeth, and kidney stones, and arterial plaque.", so the paraphrase is very far from the written article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.93.65.51 ( talk) 22:24, 5 April 2008 (UTC)
How can something be ten times SMALLER than something else? It's impossible. If it's even 1 time smaller it becomes non-existent.. What exactly did the contributor mean by "ten times smaller"? 1/10 the size? That's what I'm going to assume and change the article to reflect, because having it read "ten times smaller" is simply ludicrous and makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.
Please note, Nanobes are not nanobacteria. So far no mention has been made (on the web) equating nanobacteria and nanobes. They two shouldn't be confused.
Recently there has been much published about NANOBACTERIA and the human body. I have not read anything saying that NANOBES were discovered in the human body, if there is such a discovery... please add the link to the page or the discussion page.
For more about this merge (that probably won't happen) goto Talk:Nanobacterium
Why is it being merged? Some researchers say they have live nanobacteria. Nanobes are clearly not alive, even if they once were. 132.205.45.110 16:37, 25 Nov 2004 (UTC)
No evidence exists equating Nanobes and Nanobacteria. It's easy to relate the two because of overlapping information. This does not mean that they are the same, as particularly nothing has been published on the discoverer's website (Philippa Uwins [3] ( http://www.microscopy-uk.org.uk/nanobes/nanobes.html)) that suggests that Nanobes are the same. I don't believe it should be merged unless actual evidence is found that they are. I invite you to prove me wrong about this, perhaps there's some literature out there describing nanobe taxonomy or otherwise equate nanobes and nanobacteria. Sp00n17 14:41, 12 Dec 2004 (UTC)
According to a issue of Discover Magazine, The person who coined the term "Nanobe" did so to rename nanobacteria so that they weren't so easily confused with bacteria.
First google result for nanobe & nanobacteria search: http://serc.carleton.edu/microbelife/topics/nanobes/index.html - "While nanobes and nanobacteria are sometimes used as distinct terms, they are often used interchangably. These terms will be used interchangably in this web page.". For that matter, the local science mag grouped nanobes and nanobacteria as more or less synonumous concepts as does this NASA link: http://serc.carleton.edu/microbelife/topics/nanobes/index.html - G3, 11:58, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
Nanobe is obviously a contraction of Nanobacteria. If it's not the case, this unusual, contraction-like variation in terminology requires notation, surely? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 27.33.88.180 ( talk) 11:42, 19 March 2013 (UTC)
A quick check reveals no new publications by Philippa Uwins related to nanobes for at least the last four years, and I cannot find much useful information in this article either. The last I heard was that the DNA traces found in the nanobes are similar to bacterial DNA and could be contamination. Are there any recent developments or agreements on what this is, or is the field dead. If someone has new information I'd appreciate an update of the main article.
A completely unrelated thought: in a way this has similarities to the ideas of Cairns-Smith on the origin of life, according to which evolution got started in competing clay crystals which used amino acids as a structure templates, but that these amino acids took over and got rid of the crystal scaffolding as they got better at replicating. The suggested properties of nanobes with organic parts (including DNA-like matter) in clay materials seems similar. Has this been proposed in any published article.
The last I heard was that a plastic eating bacteria had contaminated supposed samples (leading to interest in the bacteria discovered, incidentally). A symposium on the topic settled on the argument that the proposed Nanobe would be too small to include DNA, RNA or any kind of information complex enough to define life. Regardless of phosphorus or other elements, carbon based information needs to be able to replicate itself, which Nanobes appear to be much too small to do.
No news that I've heard. Having just re-read the paper for the first time in several years, and being a geologist working in the oil industry (which Phillipa never was - I knew her in her PhD time at Aberdeen), the prospects that I perceive for the 'nanobes' described being a contaminant in the rock samples is very high. My suspicion is that Phillipa et al have realised this and moved onto their next project. Crucially, though they describe that they had samples from several wells and across a 1700m (vertical, implied) depth range and temperature ranges of 117 to 170°C (bottom-hole stabilised temperature, implied), they describe NO differences in the behaviour of 'nanobes' from the different samples. That's a pretty major difference in implied environment, for no observed differences in behaviour. (That the paper cites sample depths as being below sea bed is an indicator of the author's unfamiliarity with oilfield work. You cite either measured depth, or true vertical depth sub-sea, but not an unqualified depth below seabed. But I see that mistake made every week by people in the industry.)
Full disclosure - I remember Phillipa from when I was a BSc student and she was doing her PhD. I'd really like this report to have been good science ; unfortunately the team seem to have spent their time on the microscopy and biochemical assaying, and not looked at their sampling protocol. That's not good. Looks like a surface-living contaminant to me. A weird bug for sure.
A Karley ( talk) 05:03, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
Should the article mention the lack of new developments? I think it's very relevant information to say the work was done by one group around 1999-2000, that did not disclose where they got their samples, and that there haven't been any developments (confirmations) in 20 years. I read this article as an undergraduate in 2011 convinced this was a real thing, lacking the sense to look at the talk section on Wikipedia.
The third paragraph in the article says that nanobes are 20nm in diameter, while the third point under 'Claims' says that they are 20nm in length. From the provided photos, it is clear that those can't both be true. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.11.77.89 ( talk) 17:12, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
Mabye this article should review and take into account new evidence not supporting nanobes as living, please see physorg article or references below:
Article http://www.physorg.com/news128167633.html
Referenced in Article Martel, Jan, and Ding-E Young, John. “Purported nanobacteria in human blood as calcium carbonate nanoparticles.” Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences. April 8, 2008. vol. 105, no. 14, 5549-5554.
98.216.106.148 ( talk) 01:14, 27 April 2008 (UTC)
FYI: The article also mentions that they also are called nanobes 98.216.106.148 ( talk) 01:16, 27 April 2008 (UTC)
I'm not sure why this article focuses so much on the "life or not" question. I would like to know how prevalent nanobes are (say, in my immediate environment, or on or in my body) and what their behavior consists of (growth rate, favored substrates, effects on air/water/minerals). What advance in scientific instrumentation led to their observation? Same tools as have allowed the pursuit of nanotech? I cannot find any information on this. My sense is they are more common than microbial life, coating the world around us and being present in tissues of biotic organisms. Anyone know?
Big A 71.61.18.244 ( talk) 04:01, 29 December 2009 (UTC)
I find the * Color photo of a nanobe colony link in the links section at least improper. It has someone's face (probably the hoaxer's) imposed in the background, an artificial colouring and lens-flare. If you have to see something by electron scanning microscope, it does not have colours. As far as I know of course. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.75.108.135 ( talk) 16:15, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
I am not previously familiar with the subject, but I do not feel nanobes are well described here. The text calls them "filaments," and the illustrations show something that looks like electron microscopy. But of what substance? Are they inorganic silicates, or nucleic acids, proteins, or sugars? Are they structures containing several of these elements? Surely there's been some chemical analysis? Thanks. 63.227.124.126 ( talk) 19:00, 14 January 2012 (UTC) Agreed.
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Recent studies suggest nanobes are the smallest form of living organisms measuring in at 20nm to 1.0 mu m. Nanobes have shown positive reaction to DNA strains ( DAPI, Acridine Orange, and Fuelgen) which are indications of the idea that nanobes in fact have DNA themselves. Nanobes possess a strikingly similar shape and size to nanobacteria found in the Martian Metoerite ALH84001.
References
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So, what are the codes for "lacking evidence", "personal opinion" and "not enough good references"?
This is a terrible scientific article. Sources and references need to be provided.
Controversial; yes. Unproven; yes. License to promote any old opinion; not really.
Can someone append tags to this article to indicate its tenuous nature? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 27.33.88.180 ( talk) 12:08, 19 March 2013 (UTC)
The statement "Some researchers believe nanobe-like organisms might be implicated in a number of diseases. They might be responsible for the formation of some types of renal stones. They might even explain mysterious calcification of teeth in the human mouth, and thus actually be a useful or necessary symbiont (like Acidophilus)." is, I feel, absurd to mention unless it has some sources directly mentioned. In point of fact, the article mentioned says that "*Biomineralization* could result in the formation of bones, shells, teeth, and kidney stones, and arterial plaque.", so the paraphrase is very far from the written article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.93.65.51 ( talk) 22:24, 5 April 2008 (UTC)
How can something be ten times SMALLER than something else? It's impossible. If it's even 1 time smaller it becomes non-existent.. What exactly did the contributor mean by "ten times smaller"? 1/10 the size? That's what I'm going to assume and change the article to reflect, because having it read "ten times smaller" is simply ludicrous and makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.
Please note, Nanobes are not nanobacteria. So far no mention has been made (on the web) equating nanobacteria and nanobes. They two shouldn't be confused.
Recently there has been much published about NANOBACTERIA and the human body. I have not read anything saying that NANOBES were discovered in the human body, if there is such a discovery... please add the link to the page or the discussion page.
For more about this merge (that probably won't happen) goto Talk:Nanobacterium
Why is it being merged? Some researchers say they have live nanobacteria. Nanobes are clearly not alive, even if they once were. 132.205.45.110 16:37, 25 Nov 2004 (UTC)
No evidence exists equating Nanobes and Nanobacteria. It's easy to relate the two because of overlapping information. This does not mean that they are the same, as particularly nothing has been published on the discoverer's website (Philippa Uwins [3] ( http://www.microscopy-uk.org.uk/nanobes/nanobes.html)) that suggests that Nanobes are the same. I don't believe it should be merged unless actual evidence is found that they are. I invite you to prove me wrong about this, perhaps there's some literature out there describing nanobe taxonomy or otherwise equate nanobes and nanobacteria. Sp00n17 14:41, 12 Dec 2004 (UTC)
According to a issue of Discover Magazine, The person who coined the term "Nanobe" did so to rename nanobacteria so that they weren't so easily confused with bacteria.
First google result for nanobe & nanobacteria search: http://serc.carleton.edu/microbelife/topics/nanobes/index.html - "While nanobes and nanobacteria are sometimes used as distinct terms, they are often used interchangably. These terms will be used interchangably in this web page.". For that matter, the local science mag grouped nanobes and nanobacteria as more or less synonumous concepts as does this NASA link: http://serc.carleton.edu/microbelife/topics/nanobes/index.html - G3, 11:58, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
Nanobe is obviously a contraction of Nanobacteria. If it's not the case, this unusual, contraction-like variation in terminology requires notation, surely? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 27.33.88.180 ( talk) 11:42, 19 March 2013 (UTC)
A quick check reveals no new publications by Philippa Uwins related to nanobes for at least the last four years, and I cannot find much useful information in this article either. The last I heard was that the DNA traces found in the nanobes are similar to bacterial DNA and could be contamination. Are there any recent developments or agreements on what this is, or is the field dead. If someone has new information I'd appreciate an update of the main article.
A completely unrelated thought: in a way this has similarities to the ideas of Cairns-Smith on the origin of life, according to which evolution got started in competing clay crystals which used amino acids as a structure templates, but that these amino acids took over and got rid of the crystal scaffolding as they got better at replicating. The suggested properties of nanobes with organic parts (including DNA-like matter) in clay materials seems similar. Has this been proposed in any published article.
The last I heard was that a plastic eating bacteria had contaminated supposed samples (leading to interest in the bacteria discovered, incidentally). A symposium on the topic settled on the argument that the proposed Nanobe would be too small to include DNA, RNA or any kind of information complex enough to define life. Regardless of phosphorus or other elements, carbon based information needs to be able to replicate itself, which Nanobes appear to be much too small to do.
No news that I've heard. Having just re-read the paper for the first time in several years, and being a geologist working in the oil industry (which Phillipa never was - I knew her in her PhD time at Aberdeen), the prospects that I perceive for the 'nanobes' described being a contaminant in the rock samples is very high. My suspicion is that Phillipa et al have realised this and moved onto their next project. Crucially, though they describe that they had samples from several wells and across a 1700m (vertical, implied) depth range and temperature ranges of 117 to 170°C (bottom-hole stabilised temperature, implied), they describe NO differences in the behaviour of 'nanobes' from the different samples. That's a pretty major difference in implied environment, for no observed differences in behaviour. (That the paper cites sample depths as being below sea bed is an indicator of the author's unfamiliarity with oilfield work. You cite either measured depth, or true vertical depth sub-sea, but not an unqualified depth below seabed. But I see that mistake made every week by people in the industry.)
Full disclosure - I remember Phillipa from when I was a BSc student and she was doing her PhD. I'd really like this report to have been good science ; unfortunately the team seem to have spent their time on the microscopy and biochemical assaying, and not looked at their sampling protocol. That's not good. Looks like a surface-living contaminant to me. A weird bug for sure.
A Karley ( talk) 05:03, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
Should the article mention the lack of new developments? I think it's very relevant information to say the work was done by one group around 1999-2000, that did not disclose where they got their samples, and that there haven't been any developments (confirmations) in 20 years. I read this article as an undergraduate in 2011 convinced this was a real thing, lacking the sense to look at the talk section on Wikipedia.
The third paragraph in the article says that nanobes are 20nm in diameter, while the third point under 'Claims' says that they are 20nm in length. From the provided photos, it is clear that those can't both be true. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.11.77.89 ( talk) 17:12, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
Mabye this article should review and take into account new evidence not supporting nanobes as living, please see physorg article or references below:
Article http://www.physorg.com/news128167633.html
Referenced in Article Martel, Jan, and Ding-E Young, John. “Purported nanobacteria in human blood as calcium carbonate nanoparticles.” Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences. April 8, 2008. vol. 105, no. 14, 5549-5554.
98.216.106.148 ( talk) 01:14, 27 April 2008 (UTC)
FYI: The article also mentions that they also are called nanobes 98.216.106.148 ( talk) 01:16, 27 April 2008 (UTC)
I'm not sure why this article focuses so much on the "life or not" question. I would like to know how prevalent nanobes are (say, in my immediate environment, or on or in my body) and what their behavior consists of (growth rate, favored substrates, effects on air/water/minerals). What advance in scientific instrumentation led to their observation? Same tools as have allowed the pursuit of nanotech? I cannot find any information on this. My sense is they are more common than microbial life, coating the world around us and being present in tissues of biotic organisms. Anyone know?
Big A 71.61.18.244 ( talk) 04:01, 29 December 2009 (UTC)
I find the * Color photo of a nanobe colony link in the links section at least improper. It has someone's face (probably the hoaxer's) imposed in the background, an artificial colouring and lens-flare. If you have to see something by electron scanning microscope, it does not have colours. As far as I know of course. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.75.108.135 ( talk) 16:15, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
I am not previously familiar with the subject, but I do not feel nanobes are well described here. The text calls them "filaments," and the illustrations show something that looks like electron microscopy. But of what substance? Are they inorganic silicates, or nucleic acids, proteins, or sugars? Are they structures containing several of these elements? Surely there's been some chemical analysis? Thanks. 63.227.124.126 ( talk) 19:00, 14 January 2012 (UTC) Agreed.
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(last update: 5 June 2024).
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Recent studies suggest nanobes are the smallest form of living organisms measuring in at 20nm to 1.0 mu m. Nanobes have shown positive reaction to DNA strains ( DAPI, Acridine Orange, and Fuelgen) which are indications of the idea that nanobes in fact have DNA themselves. Nanobes possess a strikingly similar shape and size to nanobacteria found in the Martian Metoerite ALH84001.
References