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Archive 1 |
The Tippett article says: "Tippett was regarded by many as an outsider in British music, a view that may have been related to ... his homosexuality. ... and for many years his music was considered ungratefully written for voices and instruments, and difficult to perform." Well, Britten was just as openly gay, and I'm not aware that he was regarded as an outsider - at least, not by anyone whose opinion counted for much. And the only Tippett work I'm very familiar with is "The vision of St Augustine," and I find it not only ungratefully, but at times hideously written for voices and fiendishly difficult to perform - and I'm not that averse to or unfamiliar with difficult vocal writing (e.g., Messiaen). Even so, I consider it a deeply moving and brilliant work. Ranthlee 15:31, 11 May 2006 (UTC)
I placed the {{ expandsect}} template on the biography section, because it is nearly all about his relationship with the LSSO. I may get around to expanding this myself one day, since Tippett is unquestionably a major figure, but any verifiable contributions will be gratefully received. -- RobertG ♬ talk 09:43, 15 May 2006 (UTC)
Many thanks to Andrew Lowe Watson for the recent major expansion. I have done a little restructuring of the headings - in particlular, I removed the "Biography" heading which in my opinion does not belong in a biographical article, and also has the advantage of allowing easier handling of the sub-headings. Some more work is still needed here, notably the "War years" heading - it looks very strange that the material under this heading begins in 1935!
-- NSH001 ( talk) 10:00, 19 October 2010 (UTC)
I have restructured the Biography section (now called Life) and added a good deal of stuff about his music. I would really appreciate views and comments as this is my first major project, admittedly on a subject I am familiar with. Andrew Lowe Watson ( talk) 19:51, 7 November 2010 (UTC)
The article says: "After admitting an affair with another boy, his parents removed him. " As written, that means that it was the parents who admitted to having an affair with another boy. 137.108.145.34 ( talk) 07:54, 26 May 2011 (UTC)
Brian et al., a few things I can't determine how to resolve:
Brian, I was unsure about the formatting of the names of works, and regularised them to X No. 1, etc. I've been too lazy to look up what the MOS (music) says about this. (I've finished editing for now.) Tony (talk) 11:09, 23 September 2013 (UTC)
However expresses a contradiction. Where is the contradiction in: After Britten's death in 1976, Tippett became widely regarded as the doyen of British music. However, critical opinion of his later works was by no means uniformly positive; after the first performance of the Triple Concerto in 1980, Driver wrote that "not since The Knot Garden has [he] produced anything worthy of his early masterpieces".?
That's a brilliant question; I am tempted to reply that " If you have to ask what good prose is, you'll never know, with apologies to Louis Armstrong. Luckily there are some rules-of-thumb, and one of mine is to minimise the use of "however". More seriously I hope you can accept that this series of edits takes the article towards it rather than away from it. It's looking really good now and I am almost ready to support. Curious to see where Tony's complaint will lead so I will hold off for now. -- John ( talk) 22:54, 29 October 2013 (UTC)
"Many of the minor works that Tippett wrote in the wake of King Priam reflect the musical style of the opera, in some cases quoting directly from it. Of the first purely instrumental post-Priam work, the Piano Sonata No. 2 (1962), Milner thought the new style worked better in the theatre than in the concert or recital hall. In the Concerto for Orchestra (1963), he found the music had matured into a form that fully justified the earlier experiments."
It is undue weight at the very least to make comparison with another composer in the lead. Tony (talk) 12:04, 29 October 2013 (UTC)
Just to clarify something FTR, an editor added middle names for the composer's parents via this edit, which was subsequently reverted in good faith by Bencherlite, partly on the grounds of the quality of the source mentioned in the earlier edit summary. I'm not fussed either way about the middle names appearing but I'll just note that I did check before promoting the article to FA yesterday that Kemp, the source of the entire paragraph in question, in fact mentions those middle names, so there's no issue with them being included without additional citation. Cheers, Ian Rose ( talk) 23:27, 11 November 2013 (UTC)
"settings for tenor of poems by Fry": I don't know what that means. Googling "tenor of poems" didn't help. That's my only question ... sorry I'm so late reading this. The flow is excellent. - Dank ( push to talk) 00:11, 2 January 2015 (UTC)
The second sentence in the lede is:
I don't understand the need to include "was considered to". I think "he ranked with his contemporary Benjamin Britten" is more concise. The ranking that took place was not a precise mathematical ranking, it was general informed public opinion, so "he ranked" is sufficiently precise and is, in fact, a perfect use of the verb. CorinneSD ( talk) 02:25, 2 January 2015 (UTC)
A finely-done piece of writing and research! Excellent work : ) OnBeyondZebrax • TALK 23:02, 2 January 2015 (UTC)
A great article, but lacking an infobox. I would prefer to have it. Serten II ( talk) 09:39, 3 January 2015 (UTC)
Does anyone know where Tippett's resting place is (assuming he's not been cremated and ashes scattered)? Find-a-Grave doesn't help. -- Deeday-UK ( talk) 12:45, 4 January 2015 (UTC)
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 |
The Tippett article says: "Tippett was regarded by many as an outsider in British music, a view that may have been related to ... his homosexuality. ... and for many years his music was considered ungratefully written for voices and instruments, and difficult to perform." Well, Britten was just as openly gay, and I'm not aware that he was regarded as an outsider - at least, not by anyone whose opinion counted for much. And the only Tippett work I'm very familiar with is "The vision of St Augustine," and I find it not only ungratefully, but at times hideously written for voices and fiendishly difficult to perform - and I'm not that averse to or unfamiliar with difficult vocal writing (e.g., Messiaen). Even so, I consider it a deeply moving and brilliant work. Ranthlee 15:31, 11 May 2006 (UTC)
I placed the {{ expandsect}} template on the biography section, because it is nearly all about his relationship with the LSSO. I may get around to expanding this myself one day, since Tippett is unquestionably a major figure, but any verifiable contributions will be gratefully received. -- RobertG ♬ talk 09:43, 15 May 2006 (UTC)
Many thanks to Andrew Lowe Watson for the recent major expansion. I have done a little restructuring of the headings - in particlular, I removed the "Biography" heading which in my opinion does not belong in a biographical article, and also has the advantage of allowing easier handling of the sub-headings. Some more work is still needed here, notably the "War years" heading - it looks very strange that the material under this heading begins in 1935!
-- NSH001 ( talk) 10:00, 19 October 2010 (UTC)
I have restructured the Biography section (now called Life) and added a good deal of stuff about his music. I would really appreciate views and comments as this is my first major project, admittedly on a subject I am familiar with. Andrew Lowe Watson ( talk) 19:51, 7 November 2010 (UTC)
The article says: "After admitting an affair with another boy, his parents removed him. " As written, that means that it was the parents who admitted to having an affair with another boy. 137.108.145.34 ( talk) 07:54, 26 May 2011 (UTC)
Brian et al., a few things I can't determine how to resolve:
Brian, I was unsure about the formatting of the names of works, and regularised them to X No. 1, etc. I've been too lazy to look up what the MOS (music) says about this. (I've finished editing for now.) Tony (talk) 11:09, 23 September 2013 (UTC)
However expresses a contradiction. Where is the contradiction in: After Britten's death in 1976, Tippett became widely regarded as the doyen of British music. However, critical opinion of his later works was by no means uniformly positive; after the first performance of the Triple Concerto in 1980, Driver wrote that "not since The Knot Garden has [he] produced anything worthy of his early masterpieces".?
That's a brilliant question; I am tempted to reply that " If you have to ask what good prose is, you'll never know, with apologies to Louis Armstrong. Luckily there are some rules-of-thumb, and one of mine is to minimise the use of "however". More seriously I hope you can accept that this series of edits takes the article towards it rather than away from it. It's looking really good now and I am almost ready to support. Curious to see where Tony's complaint will lead so I will hold off for now. -- John ( talk) 22:54, 29 October 2013 (UTC)
"Many of the minor works that Tippett wrote in the wake of King Priam reflect the musical style of the opera, in some cases quoting directly from it. Of the first purely instrumental post-Priam work, the Piano Sonata No. 2 (1962), Milner thought the new style worked better in the theatre than in the concert or recital hall. In the Concerto for Orchestra (1963), he found the music had matured into a form that fully justified the earlier experiments."
It is undue weight at the very least to make comparison with another composer in the lead. Tony (talk) 12:04, 29 October 2013 (UTC)
Just to clarify something FTR, an editor added middle names for the composer's parents via this edit, which was subsequently reverted in good faith by Bencherlite, partly on the grounds of the quality of the source mentioned in the earlier edit summary. I'm not fussed either way about the middle names appearing but I'll just note that I did check before promoting the article to FA yesterday that Kemp, the source of the entire paragraph in question, in fact mentions those middle names, so there's no issue with them being included without additional citation. Cheers, Ian Rose ( talk) 23:27, 11 November 2013 (UTC)
"settings for tenor of poems by Fry": I don't know what that means. Googling "tenor of poems" didn't help. That's my only question ... sorry I'm so late reading this. The flow is excellent. - Dank ( push to talk) 00:11, 2 January 2015 (UTC)
The second sentence in the lede is:
I don't understand the need to include "was considered to". I think "he ranked with his contemporary Benjamin Britten" is more concise. The ranking that took place was not a precise mathematical ranking, it was general informed public opinion, so "he ranked" is sufficiently precise and is, in fact, a perfect use of the verb. CorinneSD ( talk) 02:25, 2 January 2015 (UTC)
A finely-done piece of writing and research! Excellent work : ) OnBeyondZebrax • TALK 23:02, 2 January 2015 (UTC)
A great article, but lacking an infobox. I would prefer to have it. Serten II ( talk) 09:39, 3 January 2015 (UTC)
Does anyone know where Tippett's resting place is (assuming he's not been cremated and ashes scattered)? Find-a-Grave doesn't help. -- Deeday-UK ( talk) 12:45, 4 January 2015 (UTC)