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I've added some material here that will at least sketch out Mike's life a bit. It's much better than the previous stub. Too bad the book he cowrote, On the Outside Looking In, isn't in print - it's only available used. It has much valuable information. 209.221.221.213 17:51, 8 Jun 2004 (UTC) avnative
The show is 3 hrs long (6-9pm EST) on the Radio America Network. -btbd
But the first part of the sentence (before the comma) cannot be true, since the 90 percent tax bracket certainly did not start at $0. (Unless you're Ronald Reagan's kid, obviously.) That the second part is not true is pretty obvious.
I'd say his father fed him bunk, but that would be OR. GregorB 22:24, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
How did he come to be adopted? -- Y not? 15:17, 11 September 2007 (UTC)
I have added Tough Love, reminisces of MR's childhood and his mother Asteriks 10:18, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
The Mark Dice Death Threat has been broken on mainstream media. It was mentioned and played on KFI Los Angeles Bill Handel's 8:45 AM Morning show and is available on podcast. This is the citation that should allow the Mark Dice information to stay on the page. [1] —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.42.239.130 ( talk) 19:44, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
I've removed the material about Mark Dice. Dice is a notorious culture jammer who has repeatedly tried to use Wikipedia to promote himself. This incident has not been mentioned in any reliable, 3rd-party source that I can find. Until it has been there's no reason to beleive it is notable enough to mention. Talk show hosts say all kinds of things on their shows. Unless a comment has generated enough controversy to be mentioned in 3rd-party sources we don't need to cover it here. We certainly don't need to reference every time Dice gets someone pissed-off at him. ·:· Will Beback ·:· 19:30, 14 June 2008 (UTC)
Mark Dice was issued a death threat by this man. Other talk show hosts got in trouble for saying lesser things like Imus. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.239.248.222 ( talk) 16:40, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
There is a link to the actual man saying he would pay for the bullets if someone were to shoot Mark Dice in the external links. Say what you want Will Beback, he specifically called for the murder of an individual on a national talk show, a violation of the laws of most states in the United States where this was broadcast, as well and violation of the broadcast license issued by the FCC for the stations that carried the show. This isn't something that should be pulled off the article, as it is historical (I cannot find a single reference of a national broadcaster, even in jest, calling for the murder of an individual) and even if it will be covered by third parties it doesn't need to be buried because you don't like Mark Dice. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.193.237.22 ( talk) 22:05, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
This is insane. Your 'proof' is right here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdJO-kUINMs&eurl=http://www.nujij.nl/michael-reagan-9-11-truther-moet-dood.2800363.lynkx
How can you deny what has happened here WIll Beback? Exactly what don't you understand about CALLING FOR MURDER, THRICE? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.30.88.83 ( talk) 22:12, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
I have added the content back to the article without a specific reference to Mark Dice. Will, you may not want people who read about Mr. Reagan to know that he was the first national talk show how to contract murder over the airwaves, but there is no valid reason to remove the entry. ·:· Bonked ·:· 22:24, 14 June 2008 (UTC)
If the man's own words from a recording of the show on the exact date isn't a "Reliable Source" then none of Wikiepedia is a reliable source, because you cannot get a more reliable source than the "horses' mouth." You are showing a tremendous bias against Mark Dice and the other 11-33% (Depending on the poll) of American's that he called for capital murder of. ·:· Bonked ·:· 22:24, 14 June 2008 (UTC)
The reliable source is Reagans own show its all over the web. I wonder if Will beback can cite any other talk show hosts who call for political murders?
As in Naomi Wolfes book "The end of America" political death threats from the media is the last of 10 steps towards a fascist state. Read her book Will and get educated. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Motherfunky ( talk • contribs) 22:41, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
Yeah, it really is unbelievable. 'We don't add ewvery outrageous quip that radio talk show hosts make'.
I don't think Will Beback even knows what he's saying here. Every outrageous quip? The man is putting a contract on a man. He calls for his murder THRICE. He calls him by name. He says he will pay for the bullet. He says 'Let it rip, don't be gentle on him'. And all this in a day and age where everybody can google a person's address.
Yeah, that really compares to a racial quip from Imus. Just another 'outrageous quip'. And it's really 'not important'. Until the man DIES.
Unbelievable. Sickening and unbelievable. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.30.88.83 ( talk) 22:44, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
Relax, and lay off the personal attacks guys. I'm with Will on this one. What we are asking for is a reliable source that has covered this. Wikipedia works off citing reliable sources. If no reliable sources cover something, then we cannot include mention of it. If the adopted son of Ronald Reagan has actually called for the murder of a political activist, then it will be covered by reliable sources, and we can include it. There's no deadline, so it doesn't matter if we have to wait a couple of days. I personally don't like either of the guys, from what I've read and heard, but we must follow Wikipedia guidelines, especially on biographies of living people such as this. And besides, that YouTube video, I imagine, has been uploaded without the radio station's permission, which makes it a copyright violation, and Wikipedia cannot link to copyright violations, per WP:EL. Dreaded Walrus t c 22:48, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
There's no deadline? Yeah, it's not your life on the line. Real easy to say that.
Oh, and that it has been posted without the radio station's permission is more important than the fact that the radio show host is calling for murder?
I'm done with this site. Remind me when it's being run by sane admins again. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.30.88.83 ( talk • contribs)
Wiki is a sham lol. Very good for reading about sports teams and celebs etc. but when it comes down to anything political about insane neocon supporters openly asking for a guy to be shot it gets pulled. What a complete joke Wiki is. My guess is that most of the sad bastards moderating Wikipedia for free haven't got a clue how stupid they are for doing this, and how what they are doing is wrong because they are suppressing facts. The guy (Reagan) openly said it to millions of listeners on his radio show, what more proof do you stupid Muppet's need lol. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.46.75.87 ( talk) 02:17, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
Guys, the deck is stacked against you. "reliable sources" is what keeps the Global Warming page on Wikipedia and many others from getting updated with 'reliable' information- even as more scientists are saying 'heck no' to the so-called 'concensus' as well. It's the sites that only cover stories that are favorable to the 'establishment' which get published. So, naturally 'they' are the 'reliable source' you must get into. If Michael Reagan was indicted on conspiracy to commit murder and resigned for "family reasons", even though he was in legal hotwater, but that wasn't published in 'reliable sources', then you'd play heck trying to get it on wikipedia. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.252.221.191 ( talk) 06:32, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
Michael Reagan To Apologize For Death Threat Comments Tomorrow www.prisonplanet.com/articles/june2008/150608_a_apologize.htm Femacamper ( talk) 06:52, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
It's been covered on the Daily Kos: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/6/15/12649/4669/510/530382
Not exactly MSNBC or CNN, but still a third-party source. 71.31.170.161 ( talk) 07:40, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
I do understand some of the new folks who don't yet understand how Wikipedia works. You should direct your frustrations and concerns at the mainstream media and request they investigate this matter. Wikipedia, by design, reflects reliable sources and is not the place for initiating notability. You may dislike that design but there are a multitude of other outlets that allow you to include information that is not from reliable sources. If you want Wikipedia to change, then go to the talk pages of WP:RS and argue for a change. ∴ Therefore | talk 17:21, 16 June 2008 (UTC)Self-published sources should never be used as third-party sources about living persons, even if the author is a well-known professional researcher or writer.
HOW IS PRIMARY STRAIGHT FROM THE HORSES MOUTH SOURCES UNRELIABLE???? Primary sources seem of greater value than a paid journalist report. Person makes threat, threat is published, recording is sourced. You can't get any closer to a primary source than that. Once something is said over the airwaves (the same airwaves the news uses) how is that not already a third party source? AND besides that, there IS a third party who reported on it, OTHER TALK SHOW HOSTS. You can't make something unhappen just because it wasn't in the news. Anyway, can someone explain what, besides news reports, would be considered a valid source? Especially considering that Reagan is a public person and everything a public person says is potentially notable. Would a copy of the FBI complaints and FCC complaints against him qualify? —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
24.254.246.101 (
talk)
18:29, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
This is ridiculous. Does anyone have any reason to believe that the Raw Story article on the death threat against Mark Dice is inaccurate? Is there any reason to believe that the son of Ronald Reagan calling for someone to be shot dead live on air for thousands of Americans to hear is not a notable event? The idea that this is not a notable event is ridiculous excuse, for heavens sakes, we have information here on hundreds of different Pokemon, and all the Kardashian sisters have their own Wikipedia article. It should be mentioned here, it's a confirmed undisputed fact, and whoever keeps deleting this obviously edits Wikipedia with a political agenda. Frankly, I'm sick of this and I'm just going to keep adding this until it remains here. Counteraction ( talk) 20:30, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
The Mark Dice information is valid. Michael Reagan did give a death threat and has apoligized for it to Dice. Why can't this be reported on Wikipedia in an article about Michael Reagan? I have seen SEVERAL valid link given about what happened. Wikideia is about fact, not feelings. Your personal objection to Mark Dice is irelevant because a factual act was commited and you're commiting censorship. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.11.231.66 ( talk) 20:43, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
Mike Reagan Talk Show Host Calls for Murder http://youtube.com/watch?v=OsEK3kyKfeA
It's wrong to call for people's murder. If Mark Dice and other 9/11 activists are criminal suspects then they should be brought before a court of law.
There's nothing wrong with adding a small section to M. Reagan's article about this. Look at how much talk there is in the discussion section here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.99.12.77 ( talk) 00:27, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
"He said he was sorry for his comments, that he apologized, and that he shouldn't have said it and confirmed that he will have Mark Dice on his show Monday. He explained that when he made the comments, he had recently given a speech and just got off the USS Ronald Reagan, he sees the troops and supports their work, and was upset, but that he acted wrong in making his comments. I said that many people are saying there should be criminal charges filed against him for his remarks, and asked him what he thought of that,. He said no comment on that but reiterated that he and Mark had a nice conversation and will discuss it on the show."
That's from: http://www.opednews.com/maxwrite/diarypage.php?did=7753 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.99.12.77 ( talk) 00:35, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
This censorship is bringing wikipedia into disrepute, the ultimate sin. As to reliable sources the show was recorded, it is not in doubt as to what happened and when. How can such behaviour be justified ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Evadinggrid ( talk • contribs)
Typical for the hive-like mentality exhibited by these Wikipedians: you don't understand how the 'system' works, therefore you don't have a right to reply.
They even admit they don't have to do research.
It's really simple: you're covering for Michael Reagan. You don't even mention on this page that he called for the assassination of Howard Dean. Or his 'solution' for 'peace' in the Middle East (go look it up. Go see if it's something you want to be associated with) Numerous mainstream news articles have been dedicated to those topics alone. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.30.88.83 ( talk) 17:40, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
Also, when you go to Will Beback's discussion page, you'll see this quote:
"Wow, talk about an embarrassing moment--I had no idea Dice was using Wikipedia to promote himself. Does he have any socks? If I'd known he'd had a history here, I'd have been a bit more wary about putting that in Michael Reagan."
So it's pretty simple. The REAL reason that Will Beback censored the section is exactly for the reason stated above, even though it is a FACT that Mike Reagan ordered for the death of Mark Dice.
Oh, and as for real 'newsstories', here's another one from Rawstory.
http://digg.com/politics/Radio_talk_host_calls_for_murder_of_9_11_Truth_activist?OTC-widget
The up-is-down-down-is-up and hive-like mentality of these Wikipedians is really something else. 84.30.88.83 ( talk) 17:44, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
Micheal Reagan's own words about paying the bullets to excute Mark Dice without due process are criminal and on the record. These should be posted on this site as they are a true record of the words uttered by Reagan and should stand for the record. This censorship is unconscionable in a modern world. This article shou;ld contain fact, and not opinion. It is a fact that Reagan has uttered words to incite murder.
Kiwifilm (
talk)
18:56, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
This man advocated the murder of an american citizen on air and said he would pay for it. He put a hit on Mark Dice and no matter how you try to censor wikipedia (which is losing my respect because of this very fact) the truth is out and it will be spread. He should be fired, sued and arrested in that order. Mark Dice is a patriot, not this 'man'—Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.43.132.51 ( talk • contribs)
SOURCE: Clearchannel's KFI Los Angeles Breaks Reagan Death Threat Story
Wiki editor, please consider that this is the 2nd most "listened to" talk-radio station in the country and Bill Handel covered the death threat issue in his news program (albeit in a biased way)"Handel on the News" from 8:46 am yesterday (6/16). I just listened to the podcast here: [Can be downloaded or streamed at http://www.kfi640.com/pages/podcasting/] Bill Handel (leftmost column) -> Handel on the News (6/16) Jump to time: 38:54. [ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.96.227.72 ( talk) 05:19, 17 June 2008 (UTC)
The show referred to this incident in a mocking manner. It has the reputation for neither fact-checking nor accuracy. Sorry, I realize how frustrating this can be when first faced with the criteria for inclusion in Wikipedia. ∴ Therefore | talk 05:35, 17 June 2008 (UTC)Articles should rely on reliable, third-party published sources with a reputation for fact-checking and accuracy.
Well you could go to RadioAmerica's own podcast, but they deleted Hour 2 for Jun 10th... Or you could go to Mark Dice's Youtube page, but his account was suspended... Wikipedia isn't a reliable source of information, because the truth is buried just like Youtube, Digg, and RadioAmerica —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.126.175.197 ( talk) 17:33, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
There is no source more reliable than the source, Reagan himself. How pitiful and disgraceful that Reagan's very words will not be allowed on Wikipedia, merely because Faux News or some other "reliable source" like that hasn't picked it up. "The mainstream media." What a dispicable definition of a "reliable source." 220.220.209.199 ( talk) 14:28, 10 July 2008 (UTC)
There's only so much time we can devote to trying to make anonymous editors realize how Wikipedia works. If you don't take the time to read the comments and learn the policies, and keep making the same argument over and over - that Wikipedia has some sort of onus to report this out of empathy, then I figure we'll just leave it at that. The above discussion is beating a dead horse, it appears. Tan | 39 18:49, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
Well, it's hard to convince you when you haven't taken the time to learn how Wikipedia works.
Are not exactly welcoming to new editors. Since this is a discussion page, it was important to chime in. ∴ Therefore | talk 19:09, 19 June 2008 (UTC)Wikipedia is not the Police Department. We are not the FBI. We are not a news source.
You are not going to get anything past the puppet admins. If some mainstream media outlet (controlled by governments and gloablists) does not pick up a CURRENT story the admins won't let it through. Although CNN, Fox, etc. were not around for the middle ages I guess it is more believable that knights on horses invaded Persia than Reagan made death threats even though plenty of RELIABLE sources have picked it up and broadcast it over the air and internet. The Truth is not popular when it interferes with globalist agendas and they have their lackeys in place to cover their butts for them so they can institute mind control unhindered. The only thing Free about Wikipedia is that you have the freedom to know you ARE NOT getting the real truth. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Unowen7 ( talk • contribs) 21:47, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
This whole Troll Festival is based on the arguement that relates to Secondary Evidence Sources, this is totaly irrelevant when you have a indesputable Primary Evidence Source... That is the accepted academic standard... —Preceding unsigned comment added by Evadinggrid ( talk • contribs) 14:26, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
More media coverage of the Mark Dice death threats. Could we please see a citation? [2] [3] [4]
—Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.113.119.168 ( talk • contribs) 15:50, June 20, 2008
So if Michael Reagan's death threats are not covered by mainstream sources than why are they included in Mark Dice's article? That is highly hypocritical. 65.188.219.75 ( talk) 18:22, 21 June 2008 (UTC)
Quasipalm added this:
Reagan caused controversy by advocating the killing of Palestinian babies whose parents named them Hezbollah. "You know what I'd get them for a first birthday? I'd put a grenade up their butts and light it. Happy birthday baby, bye bye." After being challenged by a listener, Reagan repeatedly advocated the killing of newborns. [5]
with the edit summary:
sourced, notable, and not a copyright violation
However, the only source given is a youtube clip of Reagan's show posted by the youtube user "hearthetruthamerica". I invite Quasipalm to explain how hearthetruthamerica is a reliable source. Which part of WP:RS does he feel applies here or why this should be an exception? How is the clip not a copyright violation? Notability isn't determined by the fiat of an editor but instead by the use of reliable sources. Thoughts? ∴ Therefore | talk 14:52, 21 June 2008 (UTC)
"You need a source that indicates that this is a notable issue. What is your source for this notability?"
Are, You, Kidding me. So now, you not only need a reliable source (the person in question), someone needs to validate the actual source's words? In the end, the "main stream media," the 2nd hand conveyor, is the end-all, be-all of what is "reliable?" Give me, a break. "It has to be touted by the mainstream media" is a HORRIBLE definition for a "reliable source." Especially since the mainstream media has been on record for continuously being FULL OF CRAP. Reagan has called for the assassination of an American citizen based on his political views. These are his words, he must own them, and not rely on Fox News, CNN or some other "main stream source" who are all mysteriously mum about this, to own his words for him. Fact is based on FACT, not on whether or not the media decides to pick it up. Reagan is on record, on tape, on his own show uttering these words. What a disgrace that Wikipedia is allowing him to disown his own words like that. SHAME on you, editors, SHAME on you. Have you no shred of integrity or decency to let the truth about a man be heard? Even when it comes from his OWN MOUTH? Hillary Clinton. 220.220.209.199 ( talk) 14:47, 10 July 2008 (UTC)
Please explain what is Wiki's definition of reliable source? I would assume if Faux news tells tomorrow there are WMDs in Iran, that makes reliable news, huh. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.196.199.18 ( talk • contribs) 00:37, June 22, 2008
Well, Fox is not a MSM outlet known for fact checking. Did they check if there were WMDs in Iraq when Bush was singing his song for war in Iraq? Your definition of fact checking is soo ridiculous simply because most if not all media outlets dont do any fact checking of any kind especially with regards to foreign affairs. Alll they do is repeat what the government wants people to know. That is not fact, that is opinion. However, in this case, people know what the fact is. People know this Michael Reagan made a death threat to Mark Dice. Its 100 percent fact. Then why not put it? Or are you disagreeing that it is not a fact. You yourself admitted that the point of a MSM outlet is for fact checking. But here, the fact is in front of you. Are you saying it did not happen? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.196.199.18 ( talk) 17:13, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
You can't get any more reliable of a source than hearing words coming out of someone's own mouth. YouTube has been used as a source on Wiki before without any problems. It would seem to me that Therefore has a bias for Michael Reagan and he/she should no longer be allowed to contribute to this page. In Therefore's world, if something hasn't been written about, it didn't happen. Even if there is video to prove that it did. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.90.233.194 ( talk) 12:09, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
June 27, 2008 - There is a new source that brings notability for the death threat comments. It comes from Fair & Accuracy In Reporting (fair.org). Is this source credible enough? It even mentions and lends notability to his comments that he would like to blow up babies with grenades. Does this qualify? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Informancy ( talk • contribs) 16:56, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
Thoughts? ∴ Therefore | talk 17:37, 27 June 2008 (UTC)The liberal media watch dog group Fairness and Accuracy In Reporting characterized statements by Reagan as "death threats" when he criticized individuals who sent letters and DVDs to U.S. troops in Iraq blaming the government for 9/11. Reagan said, for instance, "We ought to find the people who are doing this, take them out and shoot them. Really. You take them out, they are traitors to this country, and shoot them." Reagan later apologized for these statements saying they were "stupid".
" We are not looking for proof he said this. We already know he did. We are looking for something showing the importance of the event."
This is the worst kind of scraping the bottom of the barrel I've ever heard. So first, it's about a "reliable source." And now it's about whether or not what this man said was "important?" In which case, you're STILL saying the only people who can validate what is on wikipedia is some sort of mainstream source. BOLONGA. Look at wikipedia. Look how many entries have ever been published on the Mainstream Media. If we were to strip Wikipedia of all of its entries that have been blessed by CNN and FOX, there'd be next to nothing left! There are entries for every video game out there. Entries for the usage of an apostrophe. Entries for "Russel's Teapot." I've never seen anything about Russel's Teapot anywhere on television. Yet, here it is, in Wikipedia. You're going to sit there and tell me the importance of everything on here needs to be "validated" by some "mainstream news source?" Gobbledygook. Self-serving gobbledygook to keep a crooked man from owning his words. What a disgrace on Wikipedia's part. In the end, another unreliable source, filled with biased information that our dear Ministry of Truth doth bless. Pathetic. 220.220.209.199 ( talk) 14:56, 10 July 2008 (UTC)
90.240.137.122 wants to expand "individuals" to " Mark Dice, the leader of a far right fundamentalist Christian group". I disagree. The source states, "Reagan had learned that political activists had reportedly ...." True that Reagan did go on and single out Dice but that doesn't mean Dice was the only participant. Secondly, what exactly does this add to the statement? How is it relevant who these individuals were? Finally, I'm concerned that such an expansion increases the weight of the statement beyond what it is due. Let the interested reader go to the source for such details. Thoughts? ∴ Therefore | talk 16:47, 2 July 2008 (UTC)
(unindent) You missed Will's point: the characterizations of Dice et. al. are not in the source. Per WP:V, "The threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth." The issue here is we are relying on the FAIR source and the FAIR source, in relation to this issue, neither refers to Dice as "far right" nor "fundamentalist Christian". Therefore, the onus is on you to find a reliable source (mainstream publication known for fact checking) that refers to Dice and Reagan's comments that characterizes Dice in the manner you would like to add. We are not under any obligation to characterize every proper noun. Should we add in "unpopular" because we referred to the Iraq war? Should we add in "universally discredited" to the 9/11 truth issue? No, because all of these are irrelevant to the matter at hand. Find a source that uses your characterizations that also discusses Reagan's comments, and it may be added. For now, the consensus of the page is that such characterizations do not add to the article. ∴ Therefore | talk 22:19, 2 July 2008 (UTC)
User:Lapinmies has made an edit to the page. This one includes mention of Mark Dice, while avoiding all the malarkey about what to use to describe the other people. I quite like this version, personally. How does everyone else feel about it? Dreaded Walrus t c 11:34, 4 July 2008 (UTC)
This article has a large gap in his life story. A frequent topic of Reagan's writings and his radio shows is the sexual abuse of children. He describes in his book Twice Adopted how he was molested at the age of eight by a camp counselor [8]. Any chance of getting that incorporated? StreamingRadioGuide ( talk) 19:42, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
Why not find a way to rename the section or merge the statements throughout the article? WhisperToMe ( talk) 14:05, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
We're told that "Reagan . . . expressed his support for McCain's running mate, Alaska Governor Sarah Palin, comparing her favorably to his father." Having looked at the quoted reference, I don't think that you can really mean to say this. It suggests that Reagan indicated that he thought Palin was actually a superior politician to his father, when all he was really doing was likening her to Reagan senior. 87.84.248.99 ( talk) 12:33, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
I suggest that the FAIR-sourced statement in the article be deleted per this inasmuch as FAIR should not be used for contentious statements in BLPs.-- Epeefleche ( talk) 03:21, 11 May 2010 (UTC)
I have something to add.
Ronald Reagan -- More of a Friend to Blacks Than Obama? (Posted on Martin Luther King day)
-- Craigboy ( talk) 18:56, 17 January 2011 (UTC)
He cannot be said to be "post media" since he has been publishing for FoxNews.com, see= http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2011/04/20/michael-reagan-proof-reaganomics-defeats-keynesianomics-aka-obamanomics-time/, and he recently gave out an NRA award, see= http://www2.tricities.com/news/2011/may/05/gregory-receives-nra-award-ar-1017609/ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.120.177.8 ( talk) 18:45, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
The main page states: During the 2012 elections, Michael Reagan left the Republican Party, switched sides and endorsed and actively campaigned [3] for Democratic congressman Brad Sherman a pro-choice Congressman [4] who is considered a liberal member of Congress.[5] [6]
This is at best incorrect and at worst a lie. Michael did NOT leave the Republican party and "switch sides." And the source used to support the statement in fact says the exact opposite. The only mention of Reagan in the piece says that he's hosting a fundraiser for Republican candidate Mak Reed. In a radio debate on “Which Way L.A.?” with Berman and Sherman earlier this month, Republican candidate Mark Reed said he had raised about $15,000 for his campaign so far. Reed is scheduled to appear at a $1,000 per person fundraiser in Malibu hosted by Michael Reagan on April 10.
This is at a point in the campaign when multiple candidates were still seeking the election. In the California election system, however, the number of candidates for the final election is pared down to two and party is no factor, so in this election the two final candidates for the ballot were both Democrat (big suprise for the San Fernando Valley). So, taking a page from both his father's and Bill Buckley's play book he did EXACTLY what all good conservatives do: he endorsed the MOST conservative candidate who could win. There was no Republican on the final ticket, so no Republican could win. His campaign letter (which is what should actually be cited with his ACTUAL rationale for endorsing Sherman reads as follows (and makes it quite clear he in NOT happy about endorsing Sherman NOR is he leaving the Republican party):
Dear Friend,
You know me as a conservative Republican leader dedicated to the legacy and philosophy of my father. You may also know that for decades I have lived in the San Fernando Valley and been active in the Valley community.
Prior to June 5, I endorsed a Republican candidate to represent our district in the United States Congress. Under California's new system, however, on the November ballot there will only be two candidates, both Democrats.
For the first time that I can remember I will be voting for a Democrat for the United States Congress.
My father always stood for stopping unnecessary spending. He always believed that the President of the United States should have a line item veto so he could block pork barrel projects and cut waste in government. Brad Sherman cosponsored and voted for the Line Item Veto to stop unnecessary spending. His opponent voted against it.
The $700 billion TARP bailout of Wall Street was an intrusion of the federal government in the private market. Brad Sherman led the fight against the Wall Street bailout, and forced changes that saved America hundreds of billions of dollars.
Trust me, Brad Sherman and I certainly do not agree on all issues. However, Brad Sherman is dedicated to the San Fernando Valley. He works personally every day to help Valley residents unsnarl problems with the federal bureaucracy. He and his staff are unmatched in their service to our communities and they have helped thousands of Valley residents.
Brad Sherman has held over 160 town halls in the San Fernando Valley, where he listens not only to Democrats but also to us Republicans. That is why, on November 6, I'm voting for Congressman Brad Sherman.
Yours truly,
Michael Reagan
It is clearly untrue that Michael Reagan left the Republican party and "switched sides" as claimed in the main article. This needs to be fixed by the editors of this page.--
157.185.95.27 (
talk)
18:38, 12 February 2014 (UTC)mjd
http://townhall.com/columnists/michaelreagan/ http://www.michaelereagan.com/ - 72.204.66.161 ( talk) 21:23, 19 April 2014 (UTC)
With regard to the information about Reagan being represented by a disbarred lawyer, I suppose that is in theory interesting information to include, but if the only source for this information is a 2-graf post (in which the term "co-counsel" is misspelled) at something called reaganemail.com, that's not really good enough. Wiki policy on sourcing states that
It explains that "articles should be based on reliable, third-party, published sources with a reputation for fact-checking and accuracy." That's not reaganemail.com. It just looks like a place to buy an @reaganemail.com email address, not a publication with a reputation for fact-checking and accuracy. It's possible Reagan IS represented by a disbarred attorney, but the core sourcing policy of Wikipedia is that "the threshold for inclusion is verifiability, not truth" means that in order to include this, at the very least, we've got to have better sourcing. Flyte35 ( talk) 03:02, 18 August 2014 (UTC)
I think you are deleting content that it is relevant and I have the feeling that you are trying to protect the subject's reputation. The Court documents cited on the article are public records. Articles about the trial are relevant and current. Let's keep the information accurate and objective. It is what it is.
Other people are being sued. Cover page of law suit (complaint). The names are clearly mentioned there. These folks have common names (Tim Kelly, Jay Hoffman). I am not implying any conclusions, just giving the facts and properly sourcing. On the article about the trial, only the information that relates to the subject is posted. Can't omit important facts.
I reviewed the page and the sources. Subjects Jay Hoffman and Anthony Saliba, are members of the board of the Reagan Legacy Foundation.
http://www.reaganlegacyfoundation.org/board It is not a conclusion it is a FACT. Jay Hoffman and Tim Kelly are named on the legal procedures. That is a FACT. Anthony Saliba purchased the business. That is a FACT. Please stop vandalizing the page. I understand that you may be getting paid to manage these people's reputation and that is a violation of Wikipedia.
Please stop your
disruptive editing. If you continue to
vandalize Wikipedia, you may be
blocked from editing. ). This is a WARNING LEVEL 3 to you.
You are violating all Wikipedia rules by deleting crucial, sourced and useful information about a living person. The facts are well sourced and documented.
You may be
blocked from editing without further warning the next time you
vandalize Wikipedia, as you did at
Michael Reagan. . It looks like you are a reputation management consultant. STOP Vandalizing page. Contribute, don't destroy hours of work. — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
Truthchecx (
talk •
contribs)
19:55, 2 December 2014 (UTC)
I have spent hours and hours reviewing your edits and they look bias and abusive. There is no "original research". It is all properly sourced and quoted from source. No conclusions are given. Citing subjects and people named on the article is proper, encouranged and acceptable. It is clear you are deleting information that may affect the reputation of Michael Reagan. I don't want to assume your intentions or motivation, but you need to stop.
You may be
blocked from editing without further warning the next time you
vandalize Wikipedia, as you did at
Michael Reagan. — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
Pablomorris (
talk •
contribs)
20:02, 2 December 2014 (UTC)
You are arbitrary deleting properly source content. It looks like your edits are vicious and done as part of a reputation management campaign. It is what it is.
This is your only warning; if you
vandalize Wikipedia again, as you did at
Michael Reagan, you may be
blocked from editing without further notice. — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
Truthchecx (
talk •
contribs)
20:32, 5 December 2014 (UTC)
I am OK with the proposed compromised, but all partners being sued need to be listed and links to external sources of their bios cited. Both names are common, Jay Hoffman and Tim Kelly. Leave all citations to Anthony Saliba and the attorneys. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pablomorris ( talk • contribs) 04:23, 6 December 2014 (UTC)
![]() | This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
I've added some material here that will at least sketch out Mike's life a bit. It's much better than the previous stub. Too bad the book he cowrote, On the Outside Looking In, isn't in print - it's only available used. It has much valuable information. 209.221.221.213 17:51, 8 Jun 2004 (UTC) avnative
The show is 3 hrs long (6-9pm EST) on the Radio America Network. -btbd
But the first part of the sentence (before the comma) cannot be true, since the 90 percent tax bracket certainly did not start at $0. (Unless you're Ronald Reagan's kid, obviously.) That the second part is not true is pretty obvious.
I'd say his father fed him bunk, but that would be OR. GregorB 22:24, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
How did he come to be adopted? -- Y not? 15:17, 11 September 2007 (UTC)
I have added Tough Love, reminisces of MR's childhood and his mother Asteriks 10:18, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
The Mark Dice Death Threat has been broken on mainstream media. It was mentioned and played on KFI Los Angeles Bill Handel's 8:45 AM Morning show and is available on podcast. This is the citation that should allow the Mark Dice information to stay on the page. [1] —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.42.239.130 ( talk) 19:44, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
I've removed the material about Mark Dice. Dice is a notorious culture jammer who has repeatedly tried to use Wikipedia to promote himself. This incident has not been mentioned in any reliable, 3rd-party source that I can find. Until it has been there's no reason to beleive it is notable enough to mention. Talk show hosts say all kinds of things on their shows. Unless a comment has generated enough controversy to be mentioned in 3rd-party sources we don't need to cover it here. We certainly don't need to reference every time Dice gets someone pissed-off at him. ·:· Will Beback ·:· 19:30, 14 June 2008 (UTC)
Mark Dice was issued a death threat by this man. Other talk show hosts got in trouble for saying lesser things like Imus. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.239.248.222 ( talk) 16:40, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
There is a link to the actual man saying he would pay for the bullets if someone were to shoot Mark Dice in the external links. Say what you want Will Beback, he specifically called for the murder of an individual on a national talk show, a violation of the laws of most states in the United States where this was broadcast, as well and violation of the broadcast license issued by the FCC for the stations that carried the show. This isn't something that should be pulled off the article, as it is historical (I cannot find a single reference of a national broadcaster, even in jest, calling for the murder of an individual) and even if it will be covered by third parties it doesn't need to be buried because you don't like Mark Dice. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.193.237.22 ( talk) 22:05, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
This is insane. Your 'proof' is right here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdJO-kUINMs&eurl=http://www.nujij.nl/michael-reagan-9-11-truther-moet-dood.2800363.lynkx
How can you deny what has happened here WIll Beback? Exactly what don't you understand about CALLING FOR MURDER, THRICE? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.30.88.83 ( talk) 22:12, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
I have added the content back to the article without a specific reference to Mark Dice. Will, you may not want people who read about Mr. Reagan to know that he was the first national talk show how to contract murder over the airwaves, but there is no valid reason to remove the entry. ·:· Bonked ·:· 22:24, 14 June 2008 (UTC)
If the man's own words from a recording of the show on the exact date isn't a "Reliable Source" then none of Wikiepedia is a reliable source, because you cannot get a more reliable source than the "horses' mouth." You are showing a tremendous bias against Mark Dice and the other 11-33% (Depending on the poll) of American's that he called for capital murder of. ·:· Bonked ·:· 22:24, 14 June 2008 (UTC)
The reliable source is Reagans own show its all over the web. I wonder if Will beback can cite any other talk show hosts who call for political murders?
As in Naomi Wolfes book "The end of America" political death threats from the media is the last of 10 steps towards a fascist state. Read her book Will and get educated. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Motherfunky ( talk • contribs) 22:41, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
Yeah, it really is unbelievable. 'We don't add ewvery outrageous quip that radio talk show hosts make'.
I don't think Will Beback even knows what he's saying here. Every outrageous quip? The man is putting a contract on a man. He calls for his murder THRICE. He calls him by name. He says he will pay for the bullet. He says 'Let it rip, don't be gentle on him'. And all this in a day and age where everybody can google a person's address.
Yeah, that really compares to a racial quip from Imus. Just another 'outrageous quip'. And it's really 'not important'. Until the man DIES.
Unbelievable. Sickening and unbelievable. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.30.88.83 ( talk) 22:44, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
Relax, and lay off the personal attacks guys. I'm with Will on this one. What we are asking for is a reliable source that has covered this. Wikipedia works off citing reliable sources. If no reliable sources cover something, then we cannot include mention of it. If the adopted son of Ronald Reagan has actually called for the murder of a political activist, then it will be covered by reliable sources, and we can include it. There's no deadline, so it doesn't matter if we have to wait a couple of days. I personally don't like either of the guys, from what I've read and heard, but we must follow Wikipedia guidelines, especially on biographies of living people such as this. And besides, that YouTube video, I imagine, has been uploaded without the radio station's permission, which makes it a copyright violation, and Wikipedia cannot link to copyright violations, per WP:EL. Dreaded Walrus t c 22:48, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
There's no deadline? Yeah, it's not your life on the line. Real easy to say that.
Oh, and that it has been posted without the radio station's permission is more important than the fact that the radio show host is calling for murder?
I'm done with this site. Remind me when it's being run by sane admins again. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.30.88.83 ( talk • contribs)
Wiki is a sham lol. Very good for reading about sports teams and celebs etc. but when it comes down to anything political about insane neocon supporters openly asking for a guy to be shot it gets pulled. What a complete joke Wiki is. My guess is that most of the sad bastards moderating Wikipedia for free haven't got a clue how stupid they are for doing this, and how what they are doing is wrong because they are suppressing facts. The guy (Reagan) openly said it to millions of listeners on his radio show, what more proof do you stupid Muppet's need lol. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.46.75.87 ( talk) 02:17, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
Guys, the deck is stacked against you. "reliable sources" is what keeps the Global Warming page on Wikipedia and many others from getting updated with 'reliable' information- even as more scientists are saying 'heck no' to the so-called 'concensus' as well. It's the sites that only cover stories that are favorable to the 'establishment' which get published. So, naturally 'they' are the 'reliable source' you must get into. If Michael Reagan was indicted on conspiracy to commit murder and resigned for "family reasons", even though he was in legal hotwater, but that wasn't published in 'reliable sources', then you'd play heck trying to get it on wikipedia. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.252.221.191 ( talk) 06:32, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
Michael Reagan To Apologize For Death Threat Comments Tomorrow www.prisonplanet.com/articles/june2008/150608_a_apologize.htm Femacamper ( talk) 06:52, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
It's been covered on the Daily Kos: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/6/15/12649/4669/510/530382
Not exactly MSNBC or CNN, but still a third-party source. 71.31.170.161 ( talk) 07:40, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
I do understand some of the new folks who don't yet understand how Wikipedia works. You should direct your frustrations and concerns at the mainstream media and request they investigate this matter. Wikipedia, by design, reflects reliable sources and is not the place for initiating notability. You may dislike that design but there are a multitude of other outlets that allow you to include information that is not from reliable sources. If you want Wikipedia to change, then go to the talk pages of WP:RS and argue for a change. ∴ Therefore | talk 17:21, 16 June 2008 (UTC)Self-published sources should never be used as third-party sources about living persons, even if the author is a well-known professional researcher or writer.
HOW IS PRIMARY STRAIGHT FROM THE HORSES MOUTH SOURCES UNRELIABLE???? Primary sources seem of greater value than a paid journalist report. Person makes threat, threat is published, recording is sourced. You can't get any closer to a primary source than that. Once something is said over the airwaves (the same airwaves the news uses) how is that not already a third party source? AND besides that, there IS a third party who reported on it, OTHER TALK SHOW HOSTS. You can't make something unhappen just because it wasn't in the news. Anyway, can someone explain what, besides news reports, would be considered a valid source? Especially considering that Reagan is a public person and everything a public person says is potentially notable. Would a copy of the FBI complaints and FCC complaints against him qualify? —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
24.254.246.101 (
talk)
18:29, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
This is ridiculous. Does anyone have any reason to believe that the Raw Story article on the death threat against Mark Dice is inaccurate? Is there any reason to believe that the son of Ronald Reagan calling for someone to be shot dead live on air for thousands of Americans to hear is not a notable event? The idea that this is not a notable event is ridiculous excuse, for heavens sakes, we have information here on hundreds of different Pokemon, and all the Kardashian sisters have their own Wikipedia article. It should be mentioned here, it's a confirmed undisputed fact, and whoever keeps deleting this obviously edits Wikipedia with a political agenda. Frankly, I'm sick of this and I'm just going to keep adding this until it remains here. Counteraction ( talk) 20:30, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
The Mark Dice information is valid. Michael Reagan did give a death threat and has apoligized for it to Dice. Why can't this be reported on Wikipedia in an article about Michael Reagan? I have seen SEVERAL valid link given about what happened. Wikideia is about fact, not feelings. Your personal objection to Mark Dice is irelevant because a factual act was commited and you're commiting censorship. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.11.231.66 ( talk) 20:43, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
Mike Reagan Talk Show Host Calls for Murder http://youtube.com/watch?v=OsEK3kyKfeA
It's wrong to call for people's murder. If Mark Dice and other 9/11 activists are criminal suspects then they should be brought before a court of law.
There's nothing wrong with adding a small section to M. Reagan's article about this. Look at how much talk there is in the discussion section here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.99.12.77 ( talk) 00:27, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
"He said he was sorry for his comments, that he apologized, and that he shouldn't have said it and confirmed that he will have Mark Dice on his show Monday. He explained that when he made the comments, he had recently given a speech and just got off the USS Ronald Reagan, he sees the troops and supports their work, and was upset, but that he acted wrong in making his comments. I said that many people are saying there should be criminal charges filed against him for his remarks, and asked him what he thought of that,. He said no comment on that but reiterated that he and Mark had a nice conversation and will discuss it on the show."
That's from: http://www.opednews.com/maxwrite/diarypage.php?did=7753 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.99.12.77 ( talk) 00:35, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
This censorship is bringing wikipedia into disrepute, the ultimate sin. As to reliable sources the show was recorded, it is not in doubt as to what happened and when. How can such behaviour be justified ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Evadinggrid ( talk • contribs)
Typical for the hive-like mentality exhibited by these Wikipedians: you don't understand how the 'system' works, therefore you don't have a right to reply.
They even admit they don't have to do research.
It's really simple: you're covering for Michael Reagan. You don't even mention on this page that he called for the assassination of Howard Dean. Or his 'solution' for 'peace' in the Middle East (go look it up. Go see if it's something you want to be associated with) Numerous mainstream news articles have been dedicated to those topics alone. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.30.88.83 ( talk) 17:40, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
Also, when you go to Will Beback's discussion page, you'll see this quote:
"Wow, talk about an embarrassing moment--I had no idea Dice was using Wikipedia to promote himself. Does he have any socks? If I'd known he'd had a history here, I'd have been a bit more wary about putting that in Michael Reagan."
So it's pretty simple. The REAL reason that Will Beback censored the section is exactly for the reason stated above, even though it is a FACT that Mike Reagan ordered for the death of Mark Dice.
Oh, and as for real 'newsstories', here's another one from Rawstory.
http://digg.com/politics/Radio_talk_host_calls_for_murder_of_9_11_Truth_activist?OTC-widget
The up-is-down-down-is-up and hive-like mentality of these Wikipedians is really something else. 84.30.88.83 ( talk) 17:44, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
Micheal Reagan's own words about paying the bullets to excute Mark Dice without due process are criminal and on the record. These should be posted on this site as they are a true record of the words uttered by Reagan and should stand for the record. This censorship is unconscionable in a modern world. This article shou;ld contain fact, and not opinion. It is a fact that Reagan has uttered words to incite murder.
Kiwifilm (
talk)
18:56, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
This man advocated the murder of an american citizen on air and said he would pay for it. He put a hit on Mark Dice and no matter how you try to censor wikipedia (which is losing my respect because of this very fact) the truth is out and it will be spread. He should be fired, sued and arrested in that order. Mark Dice is a patriot, not this 'man'—Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.43.132.51 ( talk • contribs)
SOURCE: Clearchannel's KFI Los Angeles Breaks Reagan Death Threat Story
Wiki editor, please consider that this is the 2nd most "listened to" talk-radio station in the country and Bill Handel covered the death threat issue in his news program (albeit in a biased way)"Handel on the News" from 8:46 am yesterday (6/16). I just listened to the podcast here: [Can be downloaded or streamed at http://www.kfi640.com/pages/podcasting/] Bill Handel (leftmost column) -> Handel on the News (6/16) Jump to time: 38:54. [ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.96.227.72 ( talk) 05:19, 17 June 2008 (UTC)
The show referred to this incident in a mocking manner. It has the reputation for neither fact-checking nor accuracy. Sorry, I realize how frustrating this can be when first faced with the criteria for inclusion in Wikipedia. ∴ Therefore | talk 05:35, 17 June 2008 (UTC)Articles should rely on reliable, third-party published sources with a reputation for fact-checking and accuracy.
Well you could go to RadioAmerica's own podcast, but they deleted Hour 2 for Jun 10th... Or you could go to Mark Dice's Youtube page, but his account was suspended... Wikipedia isn't a reliable source of information, because the truth is buried just like Youtube, Digg, and RadioAmerica —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.126.175.197 ( talk) 17:33, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
There is no source more reliable than the source, Reagan himself. How pitiful and disgraceful that Reagan's very words will not be allowed on Wikipedia, merely because Faux News or some other "reliable source" like that hasn't picked it up. "The mainstream media." What a dispicable definition of a "reliable source." 220.220.209.199 ( talk) 14:28, 10 July 2008 (UTC)
There's only so much time we can devote to trying to make anonymous editors realize how Wikipedia works. If you don't take the time to read the comments and learn the policies, and keep making the same argument over and over - that Wikipedia has some sort of onus to report this out of empathy, then I figure we'll just leave it at that. The above discussion is beating a dead horse, it appears. Tan | 39 18:49, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
Well, it's hard to convince you when you haven't taken the time to learn how Wikipedia works.
Are not exactly welcoming to new editors. Since this is a discussion page, it was important to chime in. ∴ Therefore | talk 19:09, 19 June 2008 (UTC)Wikipedia is not the Police Department. We are not the FBI. We are not a news source.
You are not going to get anything past the puppet admins. If some mainstream media outlet (controlled by governments and gloablists) does not pick up a CURRENT story the admins won't let it through. Although CNN, Fox, etc. were not around for the middle ages I guess it is more believable that knights on horses invaded Persia than Reagan made death threats even though plenty of RELIABLE sources have picked it up and broadcast it over the air and internet. The Truth is not popular when it interferes with globalist agendas and they have their lackeys in place to cover their butts for them so they can institute mind control unhindered. The only thing Free about Wikipedia is that you have the freedom to know you ARE NOT getting the real truth. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Unowen7 ( talk • contribs) 21:47, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
This whole Troll Festival is based on the arguement that relates to Secondary Evidence Sources, this is totaly irrelevant when you have a indesputable Primary Evidence Source... That is the accepted academic standard... —Preceding unsigned comment added by Evadinggrid ( talk • contribs) 14:26, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
More media coverage of the Mark Dice death threats. Could we please see a citation? [2] [3] [4]
—Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.113.119.168 ( talk • contribs) 15:50, June 20, 2008
So if Michael Reagan's death threats are not covered by mainstream sources than why are they included in Mark Dice's article? That is highly hypocritical. 65.188.219.75 ( talk) 18:22, 21 June 2008 (UTC)
Quasipalm added this:
Reagan caused controversy by advocating the killing of Palestinian babies whose parents named them Hezbollah. "You know what I'd get them for a first birthday? I'd put a grenade up their butts and light it. Happy birthday baby, bye bye." After being challenged by a listener, Reagan repeatedly advocated the killing of newborns. [5]
with the edit summary:
sourced, notable, and not a copyright violation
However, the only source given is a youtube clip of Reagan's show posted by the youtube user "hearthetruthamerica". I invite Quasipalm to explain how hearthetruthamerica is a reliable source. Which part of WP:RS does he feel applies here or why this should be an exception? How is the clip not a copyright violation? Notability isn't determined by the fiat of an editor but instead by the use of reliable sources. Thoughts? ∴ Therefore | talk 14:52, 21 June 2008 (UTC)
"You need a source that indicates that this is a notable issue. What is your source for this notability?"
Are, You, Kidding me. So now, you not only need a reliable source (the person in question), someone needs to validate the actual source's words? In the end, the "main stream media," the 2nd hand conveyor, is the end-all, be-all of what is "reliable?" Give me, a break. "It has to be touted by the mainstream media" is a HORRIBLE definition for a "reliable source." Especially since the mainstream media has been on record for continuously being FULL OF CRAP. Reagan has called for the assassination of an American citizen based on his political views. These are his words, he must own them, and not rely on Fox News, CNN or some other "main stream source" who are all mysteriously mum about this, to own his words for him. Fact is based on FACT, not on whether or not the media decides to pick it up. Reagan is on record, on tape, on his own show uttering these words. What a disgrace that Wikipedia is allowing him to disown his own words like that. SHAME on you, editors, SHAME on you. Have you no shred of integrity or decency to let the truth about a man be heard? Even when it comes from his OWN MOUTH? Hillary Clinton. 220.220.209.199 ( talk) 14:47, 10 July 2008 (UTC)
Please explain what is Wiki's definition of reliable source? I would assume if Faux news tells tomorrow there are WMDs in Iran, that makes reliable news, huh. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.196.199.18 ( talk • contribs) 00:37, June 22, 2008
Well, Fox is not a MSM outlet known for fact checking. Did they check if there were WMDs in Iraq when Bush was singing his song for war in Iraq? Your definition of fact checking is soo ridiculous simply because most if not all media outlets dont do any fact checking of any kind especially with regards to foreign affairs. Alll they do is repeat what the government wants people to know. That is not fact, that is opinion. However, in this case, people know what the fact is. People know this Michael Reagan made a death threat to Mark Dice. Its 100 percent fact. Then why not put it? Or are you disagreeing that it is not a fact. You yourself admitted that the point of a MSM outlet is for fact checking. But here, the fact is in front of you. Are you saying it did not happen? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.196.199.18 ( talk) 17:13, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
You can't get any more reliable of a source than hearing words coming out of someone's own mouth. YouTube has been used as a source on Wiki before without any problems. It would seem to me that Therefore has a bias for Michael Reagan and he/she should no longer be allowed to contribute to this page. In Therefore's world, if something hasn't been written about, it didn't happen. Even if there is video to prove that it did. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.90.233.194 ( talk) 12:09, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
June 27, 2008 - There is a new source that brings notability for the death threat comments. It comes from Fair & Accuracy In Reporting (fair.org). Is this source credible enough? It even mentions and lends notability to his comments that he would like to blow up babies with grenades. Does this qualify? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Informancy ( talk • contribs) 16:56, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
Thoughts? ∴ Therefore | talk 17:37, 27 June 2008 (UTC)The liberal media watch dog group Fairness and Accuracy In Reporting characterized statements by Reagan as "death threats" when he criticized individuals who sent letters and DVDs to U.S. troops in Iraq blaming the government for 9/11. Reagan said, for instance, "We ought to find the people who are doing this, take them out and shoot them. Really. You take them out, they are traitors to this country, and shoot them." Reagan later apologized for these statements saying they were "stupid".
" We are not looking for proof he said this. We already know he did. We are looking for something showing the importance of the event."
This is the worst kind of scraping the bottom of the barrel I've ever heard. So first, it's about a "reliable source." And now it's about whether or not what this man said was "important?" In which case, you're STILL saying the only people who can validate what is on wikipedia is some sort of mainstream source. BOLONGA. Look at wikipedia. Look how many entries have ever been published on the Mainstream Media. If we were to strip Wikipedia of all of its entries that have been blessed by CNN and FOX, there'd be next to nothing left! There are entries for every video game out there. Entries for the usage of an apostrophe. Entries for "Russel's Teapot." I've never seen anything about Russel's Teapot anywhere on television. Yet, here it is, in Wikipedia. You're going to sit there and tell me the importance of everything on here needs to be "validated" by some "mainstream news source?" Gobbledygook. Self-serving gobbledygook to keep a crooked man from owning his words. What a disgrace on Wikipedia's part. In the end, another unreliable source, filled with biased information that our dear Ministry of Truth doth bless. Pathetic. 220.220.209.199 ( talk) 14:56, 10 July 2008 (UTC)
90.240.137.122 wants to expand "individuals" to " Mark Dice, the leader of a far right fundamentalist Christian group". I disagree. The source states, "Reagan had learned that political activists had reportedly ...." True that Reagan did go on and single out Dice but that doesn't mean Dice was the only participant. Secondly, what exactly does this add to the statement? How is it relevant who these individuals were? Finally, I'm concerned that such an expansion increases the weight of the statement beyond what it is due. Let the interested reader go to the source for such details. Thoughts? ∴ Therefore | talk 16:47, 2 July 2008 (UTC)
(unindent) You missed Will's point: the characterizations of Dice et. al. are not in the source. Per WP:V, "The threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth." The issue here is we are relying on the FAIR source and the FAIR source, in relation to this issue, neither refers to Dice as "far right" nor "fundamentalist Christian". Therefore, the onus is on you to find a reliable source (mainstream publication known for fact checking) that refers to Dice and Reagan's comments that characterizes Dice in the manner you would like to add. We are not under any obligation to characterize every proper noun. Should we add in "unpopular" because we referred to the Iraq war? Should we add in "universally discredited" to the 9/11 truth issue? No, because all of these are irrelevant to the matter at hand. Find a source that uses your characterizations that also discusses Reagan's comments, and it may be added. For now, the consensus of the page is that such characterizations do not add to the article. ∴ Therefore | talk 22:19, 2 July 2008 (UTC)
User:Lapinmies has made an edit to the page. This one includes mention of Mark Dice, while avoiding all the malarkey about what to use to describe the other people. I quite like this version, personally. How does everyone else feel about it? Dreaded Walrus t c 11:34, 4 July 2008 (UTC)
This article has a large gap in his life story. A frequent topic of Reagan's writings and his radio shows is the sexual abuse of children. He describes in his book Twice Adopted how he was molested at the age of eight by a camp counselor [8]. Any chance of getting that incorporated? StreamingRadioGuide ( talk) 19:42, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
Why not find a way to rename the section or merge the statements throughout the article? WhisperToMe ( talk) 14:05, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
We're told that "Reagan . . . expressed his support for McCain's running mate, Alaska Governor Sarah Palin, comparing her favorably to his father." Having looked at the quoted reference, I don't think that you can really mean to say this. It suggests that Reagan indicated that he thought Palin was actually a superior politician to his father, when all he was really doing was likening her to Reagan senior. 87.84.248.99 ( talk) 12:33, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
I suggest that the FAIR-sourced statement in the article be deleted per this inasmuch as FAIR should not be used for contentious statements in BLPs.-- Epeefleche ( talk) 03:21, 11 May 2010 (UTC)
I have something to add.
Ronald Reagan -- More of a Friend to Blacks Than Obama? (Posted on Martin Luther King day)
-- Craigboy ( talk) 18:56, 17 January 2011 (UTC)
He cannot be said to be "post media" since he has been publishing for FoxNews.com, see= http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2011/04/20/michael-reagan-proof-reaganomics-defeats-keynesianomics-aka-obamanomics-time/, and he recently gave out an NRA award, see= http://www2.tricities.com/news/2011/may/05/gregory-receives-nra-award-ar-1017609/ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.120.177.8 ( talk) 18:45, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
The main page states: During the 2012 elections, Michael Reagan left the Republican Party, switched sides and endorsed and actively campaigned [3] for Democratic congressman Brad Sherman a pro-choice Congressman [4] who is considered a liberal member of Congress.[5] [6]
This is at best incorrect and at worst a lie. Michael did NOT leave the Republican party and "switch sides." And the source used to support the statement in fact says the exact opposite. The only mention of Reagan in the piece says that he's hosting a fundraiser for Republican candidate Mak Reed. In a radio debate on “Which Way L.A.?” with Berman and Sherman earlier this month, Republican candidate Mark Reed said he had raised about $15,000 for his campaign so far. Reed is scheduled to appear at a $1,000 per person fundraiser in Malibu hosted by Michael Reagan on April 10.
This is at a point in the campaign when multiple candidates were still seeking the election. In the California election system, however, the number of candidates for the final election is pared down to two and party is no factor, so in this election the two final candidates for the ballot were both Democrat (big suprise for the San Fernando Valley). So, taking a page from both his father's and Bill Buckley's play book he did EXACTLY what all good conservatives do: he endorsed the MOST conservative candidate who could win. There was no Republican on the final ticket, so no Republican could win. His campaign letter (which is what should actually be cited with his ACTUAL rationale for endorsing Sherman reads as follows (and makes it quite clear he in NOT happy about endorsing Sherman NOR is he leaving the Republican party):
Dear Friend,
You know me as a conservative Republican leader dedicated to the legacy and philosophy of my father. You may also know that for decades I have lived in the San Fernando Valley and been active in the Valley community.
Prior to June 5, I endorsed a Republican candidate to represent our district in the United States Congress. Under California's new system, however, on the November ballot there will only be two candidates, both Democrats.
For the first time that I can remember I will be voting for a Democrat for the United States Congress.
My father always stood for stopping unnecessary spending. He always believed that the President of the United States should have a line item veto so he could block pork barrel projects and cut waste in government. Brad Sherman cosponsored and voted for the Line Item Veto to stop unnecessary spending. His opponent voted against it.
The $700 billion TARP bailout of Wall Street was an intrusion of the federal government in the private market. Brad Sherman led the fight against the Wall Street bailout, and forced changes that saved America hundreds of billions of dollars.
Trust me, Brad Sherman and I certainly do not agree on all issues. However, Brad Sherman is dedicated to the San Fernando Valley. He works personally every day to help Valley residents unsnarl problems with the federal bureaucracy. He and his staff are unmatched in their service to our communities and they have helped thousands of Valley residents.
Brad Sherman has held over 160 town halls in the San Fernando Valley, where he listens not only to Democrats but also to us Republicans. That is why, on November 6, I'm voting for Congressman Brad Sherman.
Yours truly,
Michael Reagan
It is clearly untrue that Michael Reagan left the Republican party and "switched sides" as claimed in the main article. This needs to be fixed by the editors of this page.--
157.185.95.27 (
talk)
18:38, 12 February 2014 (UTC)mjd
http://townhall.com/columnists/michaelreagan/ http://www.michaelereagan.com/ - 72.204.66.161 ( talk) 21:23, 19 April 2014 (UTC)
With regard to the information about Reagan being represented by a disbarred lawyer, I suppose that is in theory interesting information to include, but if the only source for this information is a 2-graf post (in which the term "co-counsel" is misspelled) at something called reaganemail.com, that's not really good enough. Wiki policy on sourcing states that
It explains that "articles should be based on reliable, third-party, published sources with a reputation for fact-checking and accuracy." That's not reaganemail.com. It just looks like a place to buy an @reaganemail.com email address, not a publication with a reputation for fact-checking and accuracy. It's possible Reagan IS represented by a disbarred attorney, but the core sourcing policy of Wikipedia is that "the threshold for inclusion is verifiability, not truth" means that in order to include this, at the very least, we've got to have better sourcing. Flyte35 ( talk) 03:02, 18 August 2014 (UTC)
I think you are deleting content that it is relevant and I have the feeling that you are trying to protect the subject's reputation. The Court documents cited on the article are public records. Articles about the trial are relevant and current. Let's keep the information accurate and objective. It is what it is.
Other people are being sued. Cover page of law suit (complaint). The names are clearly mentioned there. These folks have common names (Tim Kelly, Jay Hoffman). I am not implying any conclusions, just giving the facts and properly sourcing. On the article about the trial, only the information that relates to the subject is posted. Can't omit important facts.
I reviewed the page and the sources. Subjects Jay Hoffman and Anthony Saliba, are members of the board of the Reagan Legacy Foundation.
http://www.reaganlegacyfoundation.org/board It is not a conclusion it is a FACT. Jay Hoffman and Tim Kelly are named on the legal procedures. That is a FACT. Anthony Saliba purchased the business. That is a FACT. Please stop vandalizing the page. I understand that you may be getting paid to manage these people's reputation and that is a violation of Wikipedia.
Please stop your
disruptive editing. If you continue to
vandalize Wikipedia, you may be
blocked from editing. ). This is a WARNING LEVEL 3 to you.
You are violating all Wikipedia rules by deleting crucial, sourced and useful information about a living person. The facts are well sourced and documented.
You may be
blocked from editing without further warning the next time you
vandalize Wikipedia, as you did at
Michael Reagan. . It looks like you are a reputation management consultant. STOP Vandalizing page. Contribute, don't destroy hours of work. — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
Truthchecx (
talk •
contribs)
19:55, 2 December 2014 (UTC)
I have spent hours and hours reviewing your edits and they look bias and abusive. There is no "original research". It is all properly sourced and quoted from source. No conclusions are given. Citing subjects and people named on the article is proper, encouranged and acceptable. It is clear you are deleting information that may affect the reputation of Michael Reagan. I don't want to assume your intentions or motivation, but you need to stop.
You may be
blocked from editing without further warning the next time you
vandalize Wikipedia, as you did at
Michael Reagan. — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
Pablomorris (
talk •
contribs)
20:02, 2 December 2014 (UTC)
You are arbitrary deleting properly source content. It looks like your edits are vicious and done as part of a reputation management campaign. It is what it is.
This is your only warning; if you
vandalize Wikipedia again, as you did at
Michael Reagan, you may be
blocked from editing without further notice. — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
Truthchecx (
talk •
contribs)
20:32, 5 December 2014 (UTC)
I am OK with the proposed compromised, but all partners being sued need to be listed and links to external sources of their bios cited. Both names are common, Jay Hoffman and Tim Kelly. Leave all citations to Anthony Saliba and the attorneys. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pablomorris ( talk • contribs) 04:23, 6 December 2014 (UTC)