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Members of the Facebook group Prog Snob have apparently heavily vandalized this article, can someone more familiar with the band go through the article and make sure I got all tge vandalism undone? I am on a phone and cannot revert back to the last good version.
I've added a top-importance tag because the band seems to be very important. Rolling Stone calls them "One of the ten most important hard and heavy bands" [1], Yahoo! Music includes them in their list of "the 25 performing outfits who have made heavy metal what it is" among bands like Black Sabbath, Led Zeppelin, AC/DC, Deep Purple, Metallica, Slayer, etc. [2]. Alternative Press: "most important band in metal" [3]; Exclaim!: one of the most acclaimed and distinctive acts in metal history [4]; and something here: [5] -- LYKANTROP ✉ 19:51, 26 June 2008 (UTC)
Instead of adding many, many genres to the infobox why not simply add Various genres (See musical style)? Unless this labeling of avant-garde was meant as a catch-all term. − ₪ÇɨгcaғucɨҲ₪ kaiden 22:05, 20 August 2008 (UTC)
Okay, I perfectly agree that the avant-garde/experimental tag suits Meshuggah, indeed my original removing of the tag was due to a misunderstanding of how the term was being used in that context. However, it seems some object to it reading "experimental metal" in the info box. Why is this? The opening line of this band page reads "experimental metal", and it would seem cleaner to have the two match up, and the avant-garde metal page itself notes that the terms are interchangable. So why refuse to have it? In addition, Garry Sharpe-Young's "Metal: The Definitive Guide" specifically calls them "experimental metal", not using the term "avant-garde", so this would, by wikipedia's rules, be more than enough reason to use that term rather than avant-garde. Prophaniti ( talk) 10:17, 21 August 2008 (UTC)
Djent could be considered a possible genre descriptor, as that is what they have supposedly founded, and its becoming a widespread phenomenon Alastairmctavish ( talk) 19:56, 5 December 2010 (UTC)
http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2011/mar/03/djent-metal-geeks a relable and verifiable source Syxxpackid420 ( talk) 13:46, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
Ok nice, you've got 1 reliable source finally, but please, proceed as i explained already before. Editing just the infobox is not acceptable and a source on some takpage is not relevant to an article. See Wikipedia:Citing sources.-- Der Golem ( talk) 11:54, 10 June 2011 (UTC)
okay i found this source http://askearache.blogspot.com/2011/03/how-meshuggah-invented-djent-and.html I think it's from earache records so should be reliable. I will ask a couple of lines based on this and the bad faith was intended for der golem whose vulgar tone use of bad language and threatening behaviour are reprehensible. He is trying to claim dictatorial authority of this article and preventing anyone from improving it Syxxpackid420 ( talk) 23:29, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
I made several "primitive edits" as you call them, and the problem was you wasted my time by deleting them all. Your edit is unacceptable, uses sloppy english and is not even close to what the source says. Also sorry i thought that source was straught from earache records. Well as neither of you think the guardian article is correct even though it says they are pioneers of the genre, Wikipedia is not a democracy therefore i will add it to the infobox. I teach english by the way and would be more than happy to help you with your sloppy (i.e. directly transposed with no regard for colloquation) language Syxxpackid420 ( talk) 23:02, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
djent is essentially a subgenre of tech/prog metal with mathcore. This is how meshuggah are pioneers they have invented a genre Syxxpackid420 ( talk) 15:13, 15 June 2011 (UTC)
That makes sense, so I removed the according to guardian bit as you suggested are adding in a note that they were the first band to play djent like black sabbath was the first metal band. I hope this helps. Syxxpackid420 ( talk) 21:47, 30 June 2011 (UTC)
I have a source that labels Meshuggah alt metal [6] but im not sure where to put it, since this article doesn't seem to list all the genres the band have categorized as in the musical style section, or elsewhere. I call the big one bitey 07:27, 10 March 2013 (UTC)
Btw after hearing their first album a while back (the album the source describes as alternative metal) i can say it doesn't sound too much like alternative metal, but more like thrash/groove metal, but i can understand why Allmusic categorizes the album and Meshuggah as such, since in it's description for the genre it describes the early bands as "too offbeat and their influences too eclectic to fit into the thrash underground". I call the big one bitey 10:53, 12 March 2013 (UTC)
Hi, I noticed the article mentions the meaning of Meshuggah as "Crazy" in the Yiddish language. I happen to be Israely and my mother tongue is Hebrew - so I can verify that "Meshuggah" does mean "crazy," but in Hebrew. I'm actually not familiar with Yiddish but I find it hard to beleive that it is the same word exactly.
I can understand the reason for confusion, as both Yiddish and Hebrew are Jewish Languages, but in reality those two languages are very distinct (and actually belong to seperate language groups, as Hebrew is a Semitic Language, unlike Yiddish which is a Germanic language written with hebrew alpha-bet).
So I think this issue needs a clarification. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bajoran Priest ( talk • contribs) 13:41, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
Lykantrop requested that this article be copy edited in preparation for FA status, so here I am. I will try to get through the article in the next week or so and will post improvement suggestions when I'm finished.
As I go through the sections, I may add inline tags to information that needs to be reworded/expanded for clarification, etc. I don't like mucking up articles, but I find that's one of the easiest ways to bring attention to things that need work. If you need to edit the article while I'm doing my thing, drop a note on my talk page, and I'll kindly excuse myself. mo talk 09:49, 10 November 2008 (UTC)
If you don't have more information on either of those subjects, I would suggest removing them, as they are awkward in their current forms. mo talk 06:36, 11 November 2008 (UTC)
That works well. mo talk 15:44, 11 November 2008 (UTC)
What do you think of "often with Hagström using a pitch shifter to play his guitar at an octave lower than usual."? mo talk 06:36, 11 November 2008 (UTC)
As promised, here are some suggestions for improving the article:
-- mo talk 20:11, 13 November 2008 (UTC)
Links to some online sources became dead sometimes, which sucks if an article is based on them. So I archived most of sources for this article on WebCite as of January 20, 2009. Below this text there is a hidden note with those links. To see the hidden note, edit this page and it will show up. Cheers.-- LYKANTROP ✉ 22:34, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
Yeah, pretty cool. I saw it one the home page a little bit ago. Congrats to all who contributed positively to this page. B T C 02:37, 24 February 2009 (UTC)
The floating participle has been fixed in the article, but is still on the front page - can something be done about that? -- 5telios ( talk) 08:45, 24 February 2009 (UTC)
I think this page could use a pronunciation key to show people how you pronounce the name (such as metallica's. 24.226.55.107 ( talk) 23:08, 8 January 2010 (UTC)
What are the musical and lyrical influences of Meshuggah? I know that the early work of Meshuggah is influenced mainly by Metallica, but and later?-- Canniba loki 05:06, 17 January 2010 (UTC)
I'm pretty sure that their later work is influenced by Gorguts. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.181.62.186 ( talk) 14:29, 15 February 2010 (UTC)
I remember seeing an interview with Thomas Haake, stating that they on more recent material deliberately try to avoid influence from other bands, instead focusing on the creative process of each other in the band. I'm not sure where i saw it though, if we find it, we could use it as a source. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.235.226.89 ( talk) 12:11, 26 September 2010 (UTC)
I've listened extensively to the songs by Meshuggah, especially from Destroy Erase Improve and onwards. Frankly I haven't been able to notice any signifigant tempo changes on their more conventional albums, like Chaosphere, Nothing and obZen.
"Fast tempo changes" is used in the article to describe the musical style of Meshuggah. However, tempo changes only seem to occur RARELY, as many of their songs seem to stay in the same tempo all the way through. If we are to keep the part about them changing tempos often, I would very much like som solid examples of this. If it occurs only once in several songs or only on a few albums, this should not really be one of the main ways of describing their sound.
"Fast tempo changes" seems to me like a sloppy, unspecific and misleading way of trying to describe the style of Meshuggah, which i understand can be difficult to comprehend on a deeper basis at first listen.
I would very much like to hear other opinions on this, and corrections if I'm wrong. //Ragnar —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
81.235.226.89 (
talk) 12:06, 26 September 2010 (UTC)
With the exception of I they're pretty consistent with keeping their tempos stable, they're more likely to change time signatures than they are tempo
Jnbek ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 21:37, 24 February 2012 (UTC).
Anyone think there should be an inclusion of information on the band's influence on the modern "djent" scene in this section? Don't get all elitist on me folks. 109.154.141.11 ( talk) 08:18, 21 August 2011 (UTC)
The article states that "the band has been through a number of bassists" I do not think two former bassists quite qualifies for 'a number' of bassists. Especially when comparing the number of bass players most other bands in the genre are notorious for going though, for instance Dismember have been through 5 bassists, and bands like Entombed, I propose this get corrected to read more specifically either "the band has been through 2 bass players with Dick Lovgren filling the position since 2004." instead of the current misleading text. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jnbek ( talk • contribs) 23:05, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
Maybe I've not read the article comprehensively enough, but I'm not sure this article is still FA standard. Especially, considering a new album has just been released, there doesn't seem to be much info on that. It's also been a very long time since this article's last review.
The Nuclear Blast website has a fair amount of information on the sales progress of Koloss, which ought to be incorporated into the article. Drumkid13 ( talk) 15:13, 13 April 2012 (UTC)
This article confuses polyrhythm and polymeter quite often. These are not the same things. Polymeter is "tactus-preserving polymeter," whereas polyrhythm is "measure preserving polymeter" (i.e., the former takes place within a pulse whereas the latter takes place within a measure). This is very problematic in the "genre and typical traits" subsection of the musical style section. Playing two different time signatures with two different instruments until they equal out is not a polyrhythm; it's a polymeter. I will go ahead and fix these. Starvinsky ( talk) 23:48, 24 August 2012 (UTC)
An editor added the vocals colour for Haake in the timeline here, but I'm not sure that doing a handful of songs on albums really qualifies as being a "vocalist" for the band, at least as far as showing it in the timeline is concerned. But, other thoughts? MrMoustacheMM ( talk) 22:15, 2 June 2014 (UTC)
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I want to add more info regarding Koloss and The Violent Sleep of Reason, some subsections about those records specifically. I noticed in the other sections that there are little sound bites of songs from other records. How would I go about finding/adding excerpts from Koloss and maybe even Contradictions Collapse (just to show their thrash influence better)? Tactical Fiend ( talk) 17:25, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
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Members of the Facebook group Prog Snob have apparently heavily vandalized this article, can someone more familiar with the band go through the article and make sure I got all tge vandalism undone? I am on a phone and cannot revert back to the last good version.
I've added a top-importance tag because the band seems to be very important. Rolling Stone calls them "One of the ten most important hard and heavy bands" [1], Yahoo! Music includes them in their list of "the 25 performing outfits who have made heavy metal what it is" among bands like Black Sabbath, Led Zeppelin, AC/DC, Deep Purple, Metallica, Slayer, etc. [2]. Alternative Press: "most important band in metal" [3]; Exclaim!: one of the most acclaimed and distinctive acts in metal history [4]; and something here: [5] -- LYKANTROP ✉ 19:51, 26 June 2008 (UTC)
Instead of adding many, many genres to the infobox why not simply add Various genres (See musical style)? Unless this labeling of avant-garde was meant as a catch-all term. − ₪ÇɨгcaғucɨҲ₪ kaiden 22:05, 20 August 2008 (UTC)
Okay, I perfectly agree that the avant-garde/experimental tag suits Meshuggah, indeed my original removing of the tag was due to a misunderstanding of how the term was being used in that context. However, it seems some object to it reading "experimental metal" in the info box. Why is this? The opening line of this band page reads "experimental metal", and it would seem cleaner to have the two match up, and the avant-garde metal page itself notes that the terms are interchangable. So why refuse to have it? In addition, Garry Sharpe-Young's "Metal: The Definitive Guide" specifically calls them "experimental metal", not using the term "avant-garde", so this would, by wikipedia's rules, be more than enough reason to use that term rather than avant-garde. Prophaniti ( talk) 10:17, 21 August 2008 (UTC)
Djent could be considered a possible genre descriptor, as that is what they have supposedly founded, and its becoming a widespread phenomenon Alastairmctavish ( talk) 19:56, 5 December 2010 (UTC)
http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2011/mar/03/djent-metal-geeks a relable and verifiable source Syxxpackid420 ( talk) 13:46, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
Ok nice, you've got 1 reliable source finally, but please, proceed as i explained already before. Editing just the infobox is not acceptable and a source on some takpage is not relevant to an article. See Wikipedia:Citing sources.-- Der Golem ( talk) 11:54, 10 June 2011 (UTC)
okay i found this source http://askearache.blogspot.com/2011/03/how-meshuggah-invented-djent-and.html I think it's from earache records so should be reliable. I will ask a couple of lines based on this and the bad faith was intended for der golem whose vulgar tone use of bad language and threatening behaviour are reprehensible. He is trying to claim dictatorial authority of this article and preventing anyone from improving it Syxxpackid420 ( talk) 23:29, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
I made several "primitive edits" as you call them, and the problem was you wasted my time by deleting them all. Your edit is unacceptable, uses sloppy english and is not even close to what the source says. Also sorry i thought that source was straught from earache records. Well as neither of you think the guardian article is correct even though it says they are pioneers of the genre, Wikipedia is not a democracy therefore i will add it to the infobox. I teach english by the way and would be more than happy to help you with your sloppy (i.e. directly transposed with no regard for colloquation) language Syxxpackid420 ( talk) 23:02, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
djent is essentially a subgenre of tech/prog metal with mathcore. This is how meshuggah are pioneers they have invented a genre Syxxpackid420 ( talk) 15:13, 15 June 2011 (UTC)
That makes sense, so I removed the according to guardian bit as you suggested are adding in a note that they were the first band to play djent like black sabbath was the first metal band. I hope this helps. Syxxpackid420 ( talk) 21:47, 30 June 2011 (UTC)
I have a source that labels Meshuggah alt metal [6] but im not sure where to put it, since this article doesn't seem to list all the genres the band have categorized as in the musical style section, or elsewhere. I call the big one bitey 07:27, 10 March 2013 (UTC)
Btw after hearing their first album a while back (the album the source describes as alternative metal) i can say it doesn't sound too much like alternative metal, but more like thrash/groove metal, but i can understand why Allmusic categorizes the album and Meshuggah as such, since in it's description for the genre it describes the early bands as "too offbeat and their influences too eclectic to fit into the thrash underground". I call the big one bitey 10:53, 12 March 2013 (UTC)
Hi, I noticed the article mentions the meaning of Meshuggah as "Crazy" in the Yiddish language. I happen to be Israely and my mother tongue is Hebrew - so I can verify that "Meshuggah" does mean "crazy," but in Hebrew. I'm actually not familiar with Yiddish but I find it hard to beleive that it is the same word exactly.
I can understand the reason for confusion, as both Yiddish and Hebrew are Jewish Languages, but in reality those two languages are very distinct (and actually belong to seperate language groups, as Hebrew is a Semitic Language, unlike Yiddish which is a Germanic language written with hebrew alpha-bet).
So I think this issue needs a clarification. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bajoran Priest ( talk • contribs) 13:41, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
Lykantrop requested that this article be copy edited in preparation for FA status, so here I am. I will try to get through the article in the next week or so and will post improvement suggestions when I'm finished.
As I go through the sections, I may add inline tags to information that needs to be reworded/expanded for clarification, etc. I don't like mucking up articles, but I find that's one of the easiest ways to bring attention to things that need work. If you need to edit the article while I'm doing my thing, drop a note on my talk page, and I'll kindly excuse myself. mo talk 09:49, 10 November 2008 (UTC)
If you don't have more information on either of those subjects, I would suggest removing them, as they are awkward in their current forms. mo talk 06:36, 11 November 2008 (UTC)
That works well. mo talk 15:44, 11 November 2008 (UTC)
What do you think of "often with Hagström using a pitch shifter to play his guitar at an octave lower than usual."? mo talk 06:36, 11 November 2008 (UTC)
As promised, here are some suggestions for improving the article:
-- mo talk 20:11, 13 November 2008 (UTC)
Links to some online sources became dead sometimes, which sucks if an article is based on them. So I archived most of sources for this article on WebCite as of January 20, 2009. Below this text there is a hidden note with those links. To see the hidden note, edit this page and it will show up. Cheers.-- LYKANTROP ✉ 22:34, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
Yeah, pretty cool. I saw it one the home page a little bit ago. Congrats to all who contributed positively to this page. B T C 02:37, 24 February 2009 (UTC)
The floating participle has been fixed in the article, but is still on the front page - can something be done about that? -- 5telios ( talk) 08:45, 24 February 2009 (UTC)
I think this page could use a pronunciation key to show people how you pronounce the name (such as metallica's. 24.226.55.107 ( talk) 23:08, 8 January 2010 (UTC)
What are the musical and lyrical influences of Meshuggah? I know that the early work of Meshuggah is influenced mainly by Metallica, but and later?-- Canniba loki 05:06, 17 January 2010 (UTC)
I'm pretty sure that their later work is influenced by Gorguts. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.181.62.186 ( talk) 14:29, 15 February 2010 (UTC)
I remember seeing an interview with Thomas Haake, stating that they on more recent material deliberately try to avoid influence from other bands, instead focusing on the creative process of each other in the band. I'm not sure where i saw it though, if we find it, we could use it as a source. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.235.226.89 ( talk) 12:11, 26 September 2010 (UTC)
I've listened extensively to the songs by Meshuggah, especially from Destroy Erase Improve and onwards. Frankly I haven't been able to notice any signifigant tempo changes on their more conventional albums, like Chaosphere, Nothing and obZen.
"Fast tempo changes" is used in the article to describe the musical style of Meshuggah. However, tempo changes only seem to occur RARELY, as many of their songs seem to stay in the same tempo all the way through. If we are to keep the part about them changing tempos often, I would very much like som solid examples of this. If it occurs only once in several songs or only on a few albums, this should not really be one of the main ways of describing their sound.
"Fast tempo changes" seems to me like a sloppy, unspecific and misleading way of trying to describe the style of Meshuggah, which i understand can be difficult to comprehend on a deeper basis at first listen.
I would very much like to hear other opinions on this, and corrections if I'm wrong. //Ragnar —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
81.235.226.89 (
talk) 12:06, 26 September 2010 (UTC)
With the exception of I they're pretty consistent with keeping their tempos stable, they're more likely to change time signatures than they are tempo
Jnbek ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 21:37, 24 February 2012 (UTC).
Anyone think there should be an inclusion of information on the band's influence on the modern "djent" scene in this section? Don't get all elitist on me folks. 109.154.141.11 ( talk) 08:18, 21 August 2011 (UTC)
The article states that "the band has been through a number of bassists" I do not think two former bassists quite qualifies for 'a number' of bassists. Especially when comparing the number of bass players most other bands in the genre are notorious for going though, for instance Dismember have been through 5 bassists, and bands like Entombed, I propose this get corrected to read more specifically either "the band has been through 2 bass players with Dick Lovgren filling the position since 2004." instead of the current misleading text. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jnbek ( talk • contribs) 23:05, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
Maybe I've not read the article comprehensively enough, but I'm not sure this article is still FA standard. Especially, considering a new album has just been released, there doesn't seem to be much info on that. It's also been a very long time since this article's last review.
The Nuclear Blast website has a fair amount of information on the sales progress of Koloss, which ought to be incorporated into the article. Drumkid13 ( talk) 15:13, 13 April 2012 (UTC)
This article confuses polyrhythm and polymeter quite often. These are not the same things. Polymeter is "tactus-preserving polymeter," whereas polyrhythm is "measure preserving polymeter" (i.e., the former takes place within a pulse whereas the latter takes place within a measure). This is very problematic in the "genre and typical traits" subsection of the musical style section. Playing two different time signatures with two different instruments until they equal out is not a polyrhythm; it's a polymeter. I will go ahead and fix these. Starvinsky ( talk) 23:48, 24 August 2012 (UTC)
An editor added the vocals colour for Haake in the timeline here, but I'm not sure that doing a handful of songs on albums really qualifies as being a "vocalist" for the band, at least as far as showing it in the timeline is concerned. But, other thoughts? MrMoustacheMM ( talk) 22:15, 2 June 2014 (UTC)
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I want to add more info regarding Koloss and The Violent Sleep of Reason, some subsections about those records specifically. I noticed in the other sections that there are little sound bites of songs from other records. How would I go about finding/adding excerpts from Koloss and maybe even Contradictions Collapse (just to show their thrash influence better)? Tactical Fiend ( talk) 17:25, 6 November 2018 (UTC)