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"Although even popular among Nationalists during the war". Which war? The Chinese Civil War? The last one that drove the KMT to Taiwan? -- Menchi 23:25 26 Jun 2003 (UTC)
I've added a link to "The March of the Volunteers". I've found it on one Chinese music portal. It was very hard for me, because my Chinese is really poor. May be you that reading this topic are Chinese and can offer a better link, may be even official source? Cmapm 03:02, 11 Dec 2004 (UTC)
The correct pronounciation for "xie3" is indeed "xie3" and not "xue4". This is not an oversight as the lyrics were meant to be colloquial and therefore accessible to the masses; "xie3" is preferred pronounciation used in Mandarin nowadays, while "xue4" is employed (usually) as a component of a highly-specific, polysyllabic unit. -- Taoster 17:34, 13 May 2005 (UTC)
Xie3rou4 (or xue4rou4) seems to be transcribed in the text as "xie4rou4". Is this an intentional attempt to mix the two pronunciations, or could it be a small slip-up? Rōnin 17:22, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
In the recording, "的" also sounds more like "di" than "de". Is it convention to transcribe it as "de" anyway, or is it sung as "de" today? The pronunciation "di" nonetheless seems to occur in other recordings as well, such as in a copy I have of the song "Woniu yu huangliniao". Rōnin 17:38, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
zhu2 or zhu4? Rōnin 22:06, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
I'm changing #1 and #3 temporarily. Feel free to correct them if you have other suggestions. Rōnin 22:41, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
The pinyin is not correct. The breves need to be replaced with carons like they are in the older version.
in his 1949 tour to Tchaikovsky Hall in Moscow. In Chinese AND English. Very cool. I've only listened to a partial sample, does anyone have a full recording? -- 我♥中國 07:17, 19 January 2007 (UTC)
I removed this statement from the opening paragraph: written in the midst of the Second Sino-Japanese War (1937-1945) - later text of the article clearly states it was written in 1934 and was used in a 1935 film, so it could not be written during a war that, according to the dates given, didn't start until 2 years after the film's release! -- Canuckguy 18:57, 26 August 2007 (UTC)
Altered lyrics (1978-1982) is not March of the Volunteers. It may be national anthem at that time. But it is not the idea of March of the Volunteers which call for people not willing to become slavery to wake up to fight for free. If you want to put the Altered lyrics (1978-1982) at a place, maybe you can create an article national anthem of PRC, and it can be listed as one of national anthems. But it's not March of the Volunteers itself. March of the Volunteers does not equal national anthem of PRC, and national anthem of PRC does not equal March of the Volunteers. Only when March of the Volunteers is legally adopted as national anthem, then it is national anthem. - 建港 ( talk) 19:05, 5 December 2008 (UTC)
'Zhong Hua Min Zu" clearly refers to "The Chinese Race/Ethnicity", not the Chinese Nation. 75.11.163.127 00:40, 21 January 2007 (UTC)
I know that there is an official English translation in PRC. Can anyone find it?
Based on s:Template:PD-CN, the official translation is probably in public domain.-- Jusjih 06:22, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
I hope you consider and accept my translation of the original (and current) Chinese anthem. This translation (in my opinion) better captures the feel of the song without deviating too far from it as in the previous translation of the fourth line.-- 141.213.198.142 02:23, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
[COPYRIGHT PROBLEM REMOVED]
A user removed it. What does the community think? It was moved to the main box with the official lyrics. I agree it doesn't belong there. But I think it does merit inclusion within the article, just in a different section.
[COPYRIGHT PROBLEM REMOVED]
-- Gary123 ( talk) 03:27, 15 October 2009 (UTC)
Updating the transcripts above with corrections according to my listening of Robeson’s Chee Lai on YouTube:
[COPYRIGHT PROBLEM REMOVED]
Majiaerhao ( talk) 21:40, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
Here's another unofficial version: [COPYRIGHT PROBLEM REMOVED] From Rob Chi's linked article. — LlywelynII 09:09, 23 January 2015 (UTC)
And another, with the best punctuation yet for the fourth line:
[COPYRIGHT PROBLEM REMOVED]
From Ch. 2 of Israel Epstein's History Should Not Be Forgotten. (Wuzhou Publishing (Beijing), 2005. ISBN 7508506944.) — LlywelynII 06:46, 30 January 2015 (UTC)
[COPYRIGHT PROBLEM REMOVED]
From the soundtrack albums on Spotify. Dragon Seed 16:40, 28 April 2017 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.224.77.66 ( talk)
Is it in public domain? Tian Han was dead in 1968, Nie Er in 1935. Considering that this song was created as a theme song for a film, it should be copyrighted by the authors or some company. The lyrics will go to public domain in 1968+50=2018.-- 刻意(Kèyì) 09:49, 18 February 2011 (UTC)
I do not understand why the English translation of Chinese National Anthem is "March of the Volunteers". Verbatim it should be "March of the troops of the righteous and brave". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.60.37.226 ( talk) 21:33, 25 August 2008 (UTC)
Is the "the" necessary? How is it normally translated? "The" does not appear in the Chinese language. -- Jia ng
I think it bears mentioning what dialect specifically is the anthem sung in? If I'd hazard a guess it would be Mandarin - I don't know Chinese but I'm well aware there are several, vastly different dialects of it. If that is the case is there also a Cantonese version? -- TheHande ( talk) 07:25, 27 April 2011 (UTC)
1) Regardless of whether the definite article is included in the page name (
although it eventually should be), the name of the song should be correctly formatted in the lead sentence: as a the title of a song, it needs its quote marks and, inside or outside the quotes, it needs its article as a point of grammar.
2) It is also officially known as the National Anthem of the People's Republic of China. In that use, it is a proper name and not a song title: that use should not include quote marks. If it were to become the name of the page, that use should not include the definite article.
3) I know it's common, but {{
zh}} remains a badly-done template that should be avoided where possible. Simplified and traditional Chinese are not separate languages; pinyin certainly isn't.
4) More to the point, per
WP:MOS-ZH, we should not include the Chinese in the lead sentence at all. It's given in the infobox immediately to the right and it's glossed thoroughly in the Chinese infobox below that. There is no good at all in cluttering the lead with a third (badly-formatted) repetition.
5) I'll fix this, but the Wade is badly done. The tone numbers aren't essential—people did generally leave them out—but there's no such word as iyungchün. It always included the dashes between the separate characters. —
LlywelynII
05:14, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
We can't just have the lyrics' columns set to the pixel and let everything textwrap at different places. That defeats the entire point of parallel translation. I've fixed that but I've done it by forcing the current columns, which means it's going to involve some potentially ugly/annoying scrolling for some readers. Solutions:
The last one is my preferred answer, though I don't know how important the current line breaks are to the Chinese. Is this considered poetry at the level where introducing new line breaks is "getting it wrong"? or is it fine when there are space considerations?
Once that's fixed and the lines are shorter, the formatting will automatically get much tighter. That will be a different kind of ugly. The solution isn't pixel-by-pixel width formatting (which is terrible for this) or even forced % of the page (which is better), but simply using some right and left margin padding to give the text a little room. — LlywelynII 17:52, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
Removed the non-working HK source claiming the image of the song's lyrics was from "the Canton Gazette": it was "the Diantong Bimonthly" or "Pictorial", the in-house publication of the guys who made the film. Also removing Laikwan Pang's Building a New China in Cinema: The Chinese Left-Wing Cinema Movement, 1932–1937 as a non-RS. It seems like it would be good place to look for sourcing and expansion but the cited page (3) had nothing relevant on it at all and, if the author can't even "The March of the Youth" (青年進行曲) separate from the song that became China's national anthem ( as here), it becomes questionable if he knows what he's talking about at all. — LlywelynII 22:01, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
This article by China Radio International has some excellent anecdotes and probably isn't responsible for most of them being demonstrably false, but we can't actually use it: one "renowned professor" says he heard Robeson sing it in 1939, which the article blandly reports along with the "fact" that Robeson was taught the song in 1941. (Both are wrong.) The VP of China's Society for People's Friendship Studies may have heard him perform it in Madison Square Garden at some point in the '40s; he may have performed it at some point in Moscow as well; but the VP also goes on to say that he performed it in Moscow for
Pushkin's 150th Anniversary... which occurred 11 years after Robeson's death. Let's not use it. —
LlywelynII
04:57, 23 January 2015 (UTC)
This article by China Today (dead but hosted at the Internet Archive) was also being used for Robeson's section. Liu Liangmo, who taught him the song and attended the 1940 concert, didn't note an encore to "stormy applause". It wasn't translated by the time of the concert, so it's impossible people leaving the concert were singing March on! "boisterously" or in any other fashion. He didn't record it in 1941 as "March On" but as "Chee Lai!" and even the English gloss is "Arise!", not "March On". (Cursory Googling suggest he never called it by that name afterwards either.) Neither this nor the other source supported the claim that Robeson's lyrics were changed to address "African-American" issues. — LlywelynII 05:27, 23 January 2015 (UTC)
Not fully dispositive but worth noting that, although Liu (2010) doesn't credit the Christian Liu Liangmo nearly as much as period sources did for the beginning of the mass singing movement in Shanghai, his party line inclusion of Nie Er as among the group's founders in May 1935 (p. 172) can't be taken at face value: Nie had fled to Japan at the time (as noted on p. 154). — LlywelynII 06:12, 23 January 2015 (UTC)
First, sorry for the wholesale revert: I'd already done several paragraphs and edits through the whole page. It was just easier to go back and restore yours. Some of them, however, were questionable: The current anthem may not be the only Republican anthem but it was the Republican anthem then and now and changing it to "Nationalist" is silly/borderline POV pushing. (The other historic anthems are linked.) Similarly, the infelicitous phrasing when we have an entire article about the Internationale’s status with the CCP. Rolling paper is linked for anyone now unfamiliar with what it is, but it is the common English name of the product and there's no reason to overstate it. You have a defensible point about some linking for common terms such as lyrics, although it seems appropriate for me to appear once at the top given the importance of the division of labor in the songwriting process here. There's much less of a reason for removing links to countries or POV use of terms such as Zhou's discussion of imperialism, which should be linked through for context. Just like rolling paper doesn't need to be overstated but should be linked, vinyl albums are odd enough now to need a link-through: not everyone would understand what discs were intended or that an "album" would include more than one but the middle of this article is the wrong place to go into a lengthy explanation of that. — LlywelynII 01:07, 24 January 2015 (UTC)
Hey, thanks for the source on the music! — LlywelynII 16:25, 28 January 2015 (UTC)
I think I've nailed down Nie's contributions, the orchestral adaptation, and the movie's premiere. Still not quite sure about Tian's lyrics. Liang Luo is alone in saying that the poem was composed in January 1935 rather than in 1934: a) that's quite specific to just be a mistake and b) she has pretty thorough treatment and sourcing generally. Perhaps Tian Han began work on it or finished the first drafts in 1934 and his last work was done in January of '35. (That still wouldn't be the final version of the lyrics, though, since another source has Nie Er slightly modifying the lyrics to fit his tune.)
Also not sure which edition of Denton Pictorial (《電通半月畫報》) the ad with the lyrics showed up in. I've seen sources claiming both. Is there a digitized copy of them up on the Chinese internet somewhere? (Also, according to Liang Luo, there was apparently a full-page ad in the Shanghai Shenbao in May. It seems to have been a different ad but I'm not sure.) — LlywelynII 07:01, 30 January 2015 (UTC)
This anthem is historic and should be respected, but people don't analyze history but senses. Eternal defiance is moronic. We should modernize our anthem because we may get that permanent defiance. Can defiance be a permanent national value? And if so are you certain that you will enjoy that defiance when it will come? You can study philosophy to understand that transient urge if standardized might cause future havoc.
"Everybody must roar defiance." Ok, but for how long? Are you certain that people aren't emotional? Most people are emotional and not analytical historians. Then it will be so late... — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
2A02:587:4105:DB00:C8DD:F971:F636:AB2F (
talk)
03:48, 2 March 2016 (UTC)
There is a discussion at Talk:Hong Kong#edit request July 8 discussing the copyright status of the US Navy Band recording used in this article. This has come up because Hong Kong is currently a featured article candidate. To page watchers, please comment there if you have anything to add. Thanks, Jc86035 ( talk) 07:07, 11 July 2018 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons files used on this page have been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. Community Tech bot ( talk) 09:06, 11 July 2018 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 05:22, 5 June 2020 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 00:22, 14 March 2022 (UTC)
About the lyrics that has been tagged with potential copyvio, I don't understand why. According to PRC's website, only the audio and musical score that are copyrighted, and the lyrics itself should be in public domain. FarhanSyafiqF ( talk) 00:22, 14 March 2022 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 08:37, 14 March 2022 (UTC)
Prior content in this article duplicated one or more previously published sources. Copied or closely paraphrased material has been rewritten or removed and must not be restored, unless it is duly released under a compatible license. (For more information, please see
"using copyrighted works from others" if you are not the copyright holder of this material, or
"donating copyrighted materials" if you are.)
For legal reasons, we cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or published material; such additions will be deleted. Contributors may use copyrighted publications as a source of information, and, if allowed under fair use, may copy sentences and phrases, provided they are included in quotation marks and referenced properly. The material may also be rewritten, providing it does not infringe on the copyright of the original or plagiarize from that source. Therefore, such paraphrased portions must provide their source. Please see our guideline on non-free text for how to properly implement limited quotations of copyrighted text. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously, and persistent violators will be blocked from editing. While we appreciate contributions, we must require all contributors to understand and comply with these policies. Thank you. MER-C 14:44, 23 March 2022 (UTC)
So as the Duonaut provided, despite some Commons discussions are still ongoing, it looks like we do have fair reasons not to remove lyrics, aren't we? -- Liuxinyu970226 ( talk) 00:35, 10 May 2022 (UTC)
Is the phrase "purged to death" sensical in the sentence "When Tian Han was purged to death during the Cultural Revolution in the 1960s, the song was briefly and unofficially replaced by "The East Is Red", and then reinstated but played without lyrics". It is not only confusing, but in combination with the lead of the linked article on purges, it gives the false impression that Tian was executed.
I would suggest a rewrite along the lines "In the 1960s, when Tian Han was denounced and imprisoned during the Cultural Revolution, the song was briefly ..." 2A0A:A546:70AB:0:27EE:D659:3B38:3EAA ( talk) 14:12, 19 April 2022 (UTC)
![]() | This ![]() It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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"Although even popular among Nationalists during the war". Which war? The Chinese Civil War? The last one that drove the KMT to Taiwan? -- Menchi 23:25 26 Jun 2003 (UTC)
I've added a link to "The March of the Volunteers". I've found it on one Chinese music portal. It was very hard for me, because my Chinese is really poor. May be you that reading this topic are Chinese and can offer a better link, may be even official source? Cmapm 03:02, 11 Dec 2004 (UTC)
The correct pronounciation for "xie3" is indeed "xie3" and not "xue4". This is not an oversight as the lyrics were meant to be colloquial and therefore accessible to the masses; "xie3" is preferred pronounciation used in Mandarin nowadays, while "xue4" is employed (usually) as a component of a highly-specific, polysyllabic unit. -- Taoster 17:34, 13 May 2005 (UTC)
Xie3rou4 (or xue4rou4) seems to be transcribed in the text as "xie4rou4". Is this an intentional attempt to mix the two pronunciations, or could it be a small slip-up? Rōnin 17:22, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
In the recording, "的" also sounds more like "di" than "de". Is it convention to transcribe it as "de" anyway, or is it sung as "de" today? The pronunciation "di" nonetheless seems to occur in other recordings as well, such as in a copy I have of the song "Woniu yu huangliniao". Rōnin 17:38, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
zhu2 or zhu4? Rōnin 22:06, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
I'm changing #1 and #3 temporarily. Feel free to correct them if you have other suggestions. Rōnin 22:41, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
The pinyin is not correct. The breves need to be replaced with carons like they are in the older version.
in his 1949 tour to Tchaikovsky Hall in Moscow. In Chinese AND English. Very cool. I've only listened to a partial sample, does anyone have a full recording? -- 我♥中國 07:17, 19 January 2007 (UTC)
I removed this statement from the opening paragraph: written in the midst of the Second Sino-Japanese War (1937-1945) - later text of the article clearly states it was written in 1934 and was used in a 1935 film, so it could not be written during a war that, according to the dates given, didn't start until 2 years after the film's release! -- Canuckguy 18:57, 26 August 2007 (UTC)
Altered lyrics (1978-1982) is not March of the Volunteers. It may be national anthem at that time. But it is not the idea of March of the Volunteers which call for people not willing to become slavery to wake up to fight for free. If you want to put the Altered lyrics (1978-1982) at a place, maybe you can create an article national anthem of PRC, and it can be listed as one of national anthems. But it's not March of the Volunteers itself. March of the Volunteers does not equal national anthem of PRC, and national anthem of PRC does not equal March of the Volunteers. Only when March of the Volunteers is legally adopted as national anthem, then it is national anthem. - 建港 ( talk) 19:05, 5 December 2008 (UTC)
'Zhong Hua Min Zu" clearly refers to "The Chinese Race/Ethnicity", not the Chinese Nation. 75.11.163.127 00:40, 21 January 2007 (UTC)
I know that there is an official English translation in PRC. Can anyone find it?
Based on s:Template:PD-CN, the official translation is probably in public domain.-- Jusjih 06:22, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
I hope you consider and accept my translation of the original (and current) Chinese anthem. This translation (in my opinion) better captures the feel of the song without deviating too far from it as in the previous translation of the fourth line.-- 141.213.198.142 02:23, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
[COPYRIGHT PROBLEM REMOVED]
A user removed it. What does the community think? It was moved to the main box with the official lyrics. I agree it doesn't belong there. But I think it does merit inclusion within the article, just in a different section.
[COPYRIGHT PROBLEM REMOVED]
-- Gary123 ( talk) 03:27, 15 October 2009 (UTC)
Updating the transcripts above with corrections according to my listening of Robeson’s Chee Lai on YouTube:
[COPYRIGHT PROBLEM REMOVED]
Majiaerhao ( talk) 21:40, 29 June 2019 (UTC)
Here's another unofficial version: [COPYRIGHT PROBLEM REMOVED] From Rob Chi's linked article. — LlywelynII 09:09, 23 January 2015 (UTC)
And another, with the best punctuation yet for the fourth line:
[COPYRIGHT PROBLEM REMOVED]
From Ch. 2 of Israel Epstein's History Should Not Be Forgotten. (Wuzhou Publishing (Beijing), 2005. ISBN 7508506944.) — LlywelynII 06:46, 30 January 2015 (UTC)
[COPYRIGHT PROBLEM REMOVED]
From the soundtrack albums on Spotify. Dragon Seed 16:40, 28 April 2017 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.224.77.66 ( talk)
Is it in public domain? Tian Han was dead in 1968, Nie Er in 1935. Considering that this song was created as a theme song for a film, it should be copyrighted by the authors or some company. The lyrics will go to public domain in 1968+50=2018.-- 刻意(Kèyì) 09:49, 18 February 2011 (UTC)
I do not understand why the English translation of Chinese National Anthem is "March of the Volunteers". Verbatim it should be "March of the troops of the righteous and brave". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.60.37.226 ( talk) 21:33, 25 August 2008 (UTC)
Is the "the" necessary? How is it normally translated? "The" does not appear in the Chinese language. -- Jia ng
I think it bears mentioning what dialect specifically is the anthem sung in? If I'd hazard a guess it would be Mandarin - I don't know Chinese but I'm well aware there are several, vastly different dialects of it. If that is the case is there also a Cantonese version? -- TheHande ( talk) 07:25, 27 April 2011 (UTC)
1) Regardless of whether the definite article is included in the page name (
although it eventually should be), the name of the song should be correctly formatted in the lead sentence: as a the title of a song, it needs its quote marks and, inside or outside the quotes, it needs its article as a point of grammar.
2) It is also officially known as the National Anthem of the People's Republic of China. In that use, it is a proper name and not a song title: that use should not include quote marks. If it were to become the name of the page, that use should not include the definite article.
3) I know it's common, but {{
zh}} remains a badly-done template that should be avoided where possible. Simplified and traditional Chinese are not separate languages; pinyin certainly isn't.
4) More to the point, per
WP:MOS-ZH, we should not include the Chinese in the lead sentence at all. It's given in the infobox immediately to the right and it's glossed thoroughly in the Chinese infobox below that. There is no good at all in cluttering the lead with a third (badly-formatted) repetition.
5) I'll fix this, but the Wade is badly done. The tone numbers aren't essential—people did generally leave them out—but there's no such word as iyungchün. It always included the dashes between the separate characters. —
LlywelynII
05:14, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
We can't just have the lyrics' columns set to the pixel and let everything textwrap at different places. That defeats the entire point of parallel translation. I've fixed that but I've done it by forcing the current columns, which means it's going to involve some potentially ugly/annoying scrolling for some readers. Solutions:
The last one is my preferred answer, though I don't know how important the current line breaks are to the Chinese. Is this considered poetry at the level where introducing new line breaks is "getting it wrong"? or is it fine when there are space considerations?
Once that's fixed and the lines are shorter, the formatting will automatically get much tighter. That will be a different kind of ugly. The solution isn't pixel-by-pixel width formatting (which is terrible for this) or even forced % of the page (which is better), but simply using some right and left margin padding to give the text a little room. — LlywelynII 17:52, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
Removed the non-working HK source claiming the image of the song's lyrics was from "the Canton Gazette": it was "the Diantong Bimonthly" or "Pictorial", the in-house publication of the guys who made the film. Also removing Laikwan Pang's Building a New China in Cinema: The Chinese Left-Wing Cinema Movement, 1932–1937 as a non-RS. It seems like it would be good place to look for sourcing and expansion but the cited page (3) had nothing relevant on it at all and, if the author can't even "The March of the Youth" (青年進行曲) separate from the song that became China's national anthem ( as here), it becomes questionable if he knows what he's talking about at all. — LlywelynII 22:01, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
This article by China Radio International has some excellent anecdotes and probably isn't responsible for most of them being demonstrably false, but we can't actually use it: one "renowned professor" says he heard Robeson sing it in 1939, which the article blandly reports along with the "fact" that Robeson was taught the song in 1941. (Both are wrong.) The VP of China's Society for People's Friendship Studies may have heard him perform it in Madison Square Garden at some point in the '40s; he may have performed it at some point in Moscow as well; but the VP also goes on to say that he performed it in Moscow for
Pushkin's 150th Anniversary... which occurred 11 years after Robeson's death. Let's not use it. —
LlywelynII
04:57, 23 January 2015 (UTC)
This article by China Today (dead but hosted at the Internet Archive) was also being used for Robeson's section. Liu Liangmo, who taught him the song and attended the 1940 concert, didn't note an encore to "stormy applause". It wasn't translated by the time of the concert, so it's impossible people leaving the concert were singing March on! "boisterously" or in any other fashion. He didn't record it in 1941 as "March On" but as "Chee Lai!" and even the English gloss is "Arise!", not "March On". (Cursory Googling suggest he never called it by that name afterwards either.) Neither this nor the other source supported the claim that Robeson's lyrics were changed to address "African-American" issues. — LlywelynII 05:27, 23 January 2015 (UTC)
Not fully dispositive but worth noting that, although Liu (2010) doesn't credit the Christian Liu Liangmo nearly as much as period sources did for the beginning of the mass singing movement in Shanghai, his party line inclusion of Nie Er as among the group's founders in May 1935 (p. 172) can't be taken at face value: Nie had fled to Japan at the time (as noted on p. 154). — LlywelynII 06:12, 23 January 2015 (UTC)
First, sorry for the wholesale revert: I'd already done several paragraphs and edits through the whole page. It was just easier to go back and restore yours. Some of them, however, were questionable: The current anthem may not be the only Republican anthem but it was the Republican anthem then and now and changing it to "Nationalist" is silly/borderline POV pushing. (The other historic anthems are linked.) Similarly, the infelicitous phrasing when we have an entire article about the Internationale’s status with the CCP. Rolling paper is linked for anyone now unfamiliar with what it is, but it is the common English name of the product and there's no reason to overstate it. You have a defensible point about some linking for common terms such as lyrics, although it seems appropriate for me to appear once at the top given the importance of the division of labor in the songwriting process here. There's much less of a reason for removing links to countries or POV use of terms such as Zhou's discussion of imperialism, which should be linked through for context. Just like rolling paper doesn't need to be overstated but should be linked, vinyl albums are odd enough now to need a link-through: not everyone would understand what discs were intended or that an "album" would include more than one but the middle of this article is the wrong place to go into a lengthy explanation of that. — LlywelynII 01:07, 24 January 2015 (UTC)
Hey, thanks for the source on the music! — LlywelynII 16:25, 28 January 2015 (UTC)
I think I've nailed down Nie's contributions, the orchestral adaptation, and the movie's premiere. Still not quite sure about Tian's lyrics. Liang Luo is alone in saying that the poem was composed in January 1935 rather than in 1934: a) that's quite specific to just be a mistake and b) she has pretty thorough treatment and sourcing generally. Perhaps Tian Han began work on it or finished the first drafts in 1934 and his last work was done in January of '35. (That still wouldn't be the final version of the lyrics, though, since another source has Nie Er slightly modifying the lyrics to fit his tune.)
Also not sure which edition of Denton Pictorial (《電通半月畫報》) the ad with the lyrics showed up in. I've seen sources claiming both. Is there a digitized copy of them up on the Chinese internet somewhere? (Also, according to Liang Luo, there was apparently a full-page ad in the Shanghai Shenbao in May. It seems to have been a different ad but I'm not sure.) — LlywelynII 07:01, 30 January 2015 (UTC)
This anthem is historic and should be respected, but people don't analyze history but senses. Eternal defiance is moronic. We should modernize our anthem because we may get that permanent defiance. Can defiance be a permanent national value? And if so are you certain that you will enjoy that defiance when it will come? You can study philosophy to understand that transient urge if standardized might cause future havoc.
"Everybody must roar defiance." Ok, but for how long? Are you certain that people aren't emotional? Most people are emotional and not analytical historians. Then it will be so late... — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
2A02:587:4105:DB00:C8DD:F971:F636:AB2F (
talk)
03:48, 2 March 2016 (UTC)
There is a discussion at Talk:Hong Kong#edit request July 8 discussing the copyright status of the US Navy Band recording used in this article. This has come up because Hong Kong is currently a featured article candidate. To page watchers, please comment there if you have anything to add. Thanks, Jc86035 ( talk) 07:07, 11 July 2018 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons files used on this page have been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. Community Tech bot ( talk) 09:06, 11 July 2018 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 05:22, 5 June 2020 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 00:22, 14 March 2022 (UTC)
About the lyrics that has been tagged with potential copyvio, I don't understand why. According to PRC's website, only the audio and musical score that are copyrighted, and the lyrics itself should be in public domain. FarhanSyafiqF ( talk) 00:22, 14 March 2022 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 08:37, 14 March 2022 (UTC)
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So as the Duonaut provided, despite some Commons discussions are still ongoing, it looks like we do have fair reasons not to remove lyrics, aren't we? -- Liuxinyu970226 ( talk) 00:35, 10 May 2022 (UTC)
Is the phrase "purged to death" sensical in the sentence "When Tian Han was purged to death during the Cultural Revolution in the 1960s, the song was briefly and unofficially replaced by "The East Is Red", and then reinstated but played without lyrics". It is not only confusing, but in combination with the lead of the linked article on purges, it gives the false impression that Tian was executed.
I would suggest a rewrite along the lines "In the 1960s, when Tian Han was denounced and imprisoned during the Cultural Revolution, the song was briefly ..." 2A0A:A546:70AB:0:27EE:D659:3B38:3EAA ( talk) 14:12, 19 April 2022 (UTC)