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Can someone cite a source for the Wayne Barlowe \ Dougal Dixon controversy? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.210.246.103 ( talk • contribs)
2012 Update : There's a few citations we can use at this point. [1] The rec.arts.sf.written posts have quite a bit. For example, Robert J. Sawyer confirms that Barlowe's complaint against Dixon was noted in the trade press at the time. This would serve as independent confirmation. Also, there's this website which contains scans of Barlowe's sketches. These can be compared to this, as an illustration of one of the purported plagiarized images. -- Dante Alighieri | Talk 19:19, 7 December 2012 (UTC)
I have removed the following under "Controversy":
"The question of why humans, as one of the most adaptable and evolutionarily successful species on the planet, would turn themselves into such highly specialized subspecies is not addressed in the book."
The obvious reasons for this deletion are twofold:
- Mainly, **this is not a controversy**. This is an editor's opinion, and I hope it will stay gone (as I see someone else tried to remove it awhile back, and it was re-inserted, presumably by the editor who *wrote* it to begin with).
- Secondly (and it is beside the main point that Wikipedia is meant to contain information citable from other sources), evolution takes millions of years. Genetic engineering is within mankind's grasp. Thus, it is believable that man would wish to attempt genetic engineering sooner than waiting 25-30 MILLION years for it.
Sheesh.
Image:Man after Man.JPG is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
BetacommandBot 08:24, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
Does anyone know if there have been german or french versions of this book, and how many exemplaries there were? I searched the whole net for more infos but wikipedia waxs the only source with more than two lines. There could be more illustrations, though. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.44.73.112 ( talk) 19:32, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
In conclusion, this article needs a slight rewrite. Rex Imperator ( talk) 15:05, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
There are a few things that could still be changed:
Rex Imperator ( talk) 22:20, 22 January 2008 (UTC)
This book is fantasy, the science in it is utter garbage. I'll say so in the article if I can find refs, but as yet I've only found BBS discussions. When I first found this book, I wondered if it was the work of a creationist trying to scare people away from evolution. Algr ( talk) 20:23, 7 January 2010 (UTC)
I'm not very knowledgeable about how copyright laws work, but i would assume it is. Although the book has been out of print for many years now, would that change anything? The links to the online versions of Dixon's other speculative biology books have been removed, should the same be done here? 50.195.51.9 ( talk) 18:12, 30 August 2013 (UTC)
It was already pointed out that the second paragraph sounds like a review. It states:
"It is satirical and gloriously Scotch in its character, in its wry irony combined with hidden humour. It is a poke at the complacency of humanity. Fiction with a sobering semblance of that which could be our future, if we continue in our arrogant exploitation of our planet."
Having recently read the book, I would not describe it as "gloriously Scotch", or even notably so. Its humor is not hidden. And it's the opposite of sobering.
The paragraph also asserts that humanity is complacent and arrogantly exploiting of "our" (whoever that is, it's not mine) planet, something of dubious factual accuracy.
That's my opinion, and it's no less valid then the above paragraph. My opinion doesn't belong in the article any more than this one does.
I think its important to note the satirical nature of the book in the opening, and have no strong feelings for what should replace this, but it's really jarring to read this glowing review at the head of whats supposed to be an encyclopedic article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2600:8800:5081:4E00:691B:8D9B:EF9D:DCAE ( talk) 06:12, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
GA toolbox |
---|
Reviewing |
Reviewer: Casliber ( talk · contribs) 04:15, 13 September 2019 (UTC)
Hi - I'll make copyedits as I go (please revert if I inadvertently change the meaning) and jot queries below:
Cas Liber (
talk ·
contribs)
04:15, 13 September 2019 (UTC)
NB: clear of copyvio
1. Well written?:
2. Factually accurate and verifiable?:
3. Broad in coverage?:
4. Reflects a neutral point of view?:
5. Reasonably stable?
6. Illustrated by images, when possible and appropriate?:
Overall:
Just going to note here for future reference that the idea that Man After Man plagiarized ideas for a similar book by Wayne Barlowe is an interesting detail that would be worth mentioning, but there are no WP:RS sources we can use to add this to the article - sources for this include Barlowe's own 1995 art book, which states that his designs were plagiarized by "another author", not mentioning a name, and internet forum threads, which do not count as reliable sources. It is also worth keeping in mind that Dixon himself does not like Man After Man, and the concept changed considerably from his original vision - there is no concrete information on what went on behind the scenes. Ichthyovenator ( talk) 10:37, 13 July 2021 (UTC)
![]() | Man After Man has been listed as one of the
Language and literature good articles under the
good article criteria. If you can improve it further,
please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can
reassess it. Review: September 14, 2019. ( Reviewed version). |
![]() | This article is rated GA-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||
|
Can someone cite a source for the Wayne Barlowe \ Dougal Dixon controversy? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.210.246.103 ( talk • contribs)
2012 Update : There's a few citations we can use at this point. [1] The rec.arts.sf.written posts have quite a bit. For example, Robert J. Sawyer confirms that Barlowe's complaint against Dixon was noted in the trade press at the time. This would serve as independent confirmation. Also, there's this website which contains scans of Barlowe's sketches. These can be compared to this, as an illustration of one of the purported plagiarized images. -- Dante Alighieri | Talk 19:19, 7 December 2012 (UTC)
I have removed the following under "Controversy":
"The question of why humans, as one of the most adaptable and evolutionarily successful species on the planet, would turn themselves into such highly specialized subspecies is not addressed in the book."
The obvious reasons for this deletion are twofold:
- Mainly, **this is not a controversy**. This is an editor's opinion, and I hope it will stay gone (as I see someone else tried to remove it awhile back, and it was re-inserted, presumably by the editor who *wrote* it to begin with).
- Secondly (and it is beside the main point that Wikipedia is meant to contain information citable from other sources), evolution takes millions of years. Genetic engineering is within mankind's grasp. Thus, it is believable that man would wish to attempt genetic engineering sooner than waiting 25-30 MILLION years for it.
Sheesh.
Image:Man after Man.JPG is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
BetacommandBot 08:24, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
Does anyone know if there have been german or french versions of this book, and how many exemplaries there were? I searched the whole net for more infos but wikipedia waxs the only source with more than two lines. There could be more illustrations, though. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.44.73.112 ( talk) 19:32, 4 November 2007 (UTC)
In conclusion, this article needs a slight rewrite. Rex Imperator ( talk) 15:05, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
There are a few things that could still be changed:
Rex Imperator ( talk) 22:20, 22 January 2008 (UTC)
This book is fantasy, the science in it is utter garbage. I'll say so in the article if I can find refs, but as yet I've only found BBS discussions. When I first found this book, I wondered if it was the work of a creationist trying to scare people away from evolution. Algr ( talk) 20:23, 7 January 2010 (UTC)
I'm not very knowledgeable about how copyright laws work, but i would assume it is. Although the book has been out of print for many years now, would that change anything? The links to the online versions of Dixon's other speculative biology books have been removed, should the same be done here? 50.195.51.9 ( talk) 18:12, 30 August 2013 (UTC)
It was already pointed out that the second paragraph sounds like a review. It states:
"It is satirical and gloriously Scotch in its character, in its wry irony combined with hidden humour. It is a poke at the complacency of humanity. Fiction with a sobering semblance of that which could be our future, if we continue in our arrogant exploitation of our planet."
Having recently read the book, I would not describe it as "gloriously Scotch", or even notably so. Its humor is not hidden. And it's the opposite of sobering.
The paragraph also asserts that humanity is complacent and arrogantly exploiting of "our" (whoever that is, it's not mine) planet, something of dubious factual accuracy.
That's my opinion, and it's no less valid then the above paragraph. My opinion doesn't belong in the article any more than this one does.
I think its important to note the satirical nature of the book in the opening, and have no strong feelings for what should replace this, but it's really jarring to read this glowing review at the head of whats supposed to be an encyclopedic article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2600:8800:5081:4E00:691B:8D9B:EF9D:DCAE ( talk) 06:12, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
GA toolbox |
---|
Reviewing |
Reviewer: Casliber ( talk · contribs) 04:15, 13 September 2019 (UTC)
Hi - I'll make copyedits as I go (please revert if I inadvertently change the meaning) and jot queries below:
Cas Liber (
talk ·
contribs)
04:15, 13 September 2019 (UTC)
NB: clear of copyvio
1. Well written?:
2. Factually accurate and verifiable?:
3. Broad in coverage?:
4. Reflects a neutral point of view?:
5. Reasonably stable?
6. Illustrated by images, when possible and appropriate?:
Overall:
Just going to note here for future reference that the idea that Man After Man plagiarized ideas for a similar book by Wayne Barlowe is an interesting detail that would be worth mentioning, but there are no WP:RS sources we can use to add this to the article - sources for this include Barlowe's own 1995 art book, which states that his designs were plagiarized by "another author", not mentioning a name, and internet forum threads, which do not count as reliable sources. It is also worth keeping in mind that Dixon himself does not like Man After Man, and the concept changed considerably from his original vision - there is no concrete information on what went on behind the scenes. Ichthyovenator ( talk) 10:37, 13 July 2021 (UTC)