![]() | This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
This page and others are currently undergoing repeated attacks from IP addresses belonging to TV Cable S.A. An ongoing Abuse Report on this can be found at WP:AbRep - Please report all vandal attacks from IP addresses starting 200.x.x.x and especially either 200.118.x.x or 200.74.x.x on my talk page User talk:Heligoland. If you leave a vandalism warning, please also consider adding {{ISP|TV Cable S.A.}} to try and deter further vandalism and/or checking other contributions from that IP address for other vandalism. Heligoland 20:57, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
I often hear Malcolm in his hustling days referred to as a "pimp", but never found any reference to him doing any pimping in his autobiography; indeed, he suggests he wouldn't be any good at it. One of his best friends was a pimp, but I wouldn't really call that being "involved" with pimping. Also, what made him a "racketeer"? Was it the numbers game? - furrykef ( Talk at me) 15:21, 18 August 2005 (UTC)
It ain't easy, but it's necessary.
I'm sure many Americans must be sick of hearing this question asked of virtually every other famous American, but ... is it true that Malcolm was of Irish descent somewhere along the line (like Ali)? Thank you. Fergananim 17:34, 6 October 2005 (UTC)
one of his grandfathers was white, maybe he was irish? Colorfulharp233 03:12, 6 July 2006 (UTC)
LOL! are you guys idiots? His hair is redish because he relaxed his hair so much as a youth. Relaxing your hair can turn your hair many shades lighter over time. And its known that he did it many times as a youth.
^^^He did in fact relax his hair a lot as a youth, but his hair was reddish as his grandfather was white (and had red hair). If anything, the relaxer "brought out" the reddish color more.
-- Mik 17:10, 3 September 2006 (UTC)
I know I am about to be bombarded with flames/death threats/whatever for saying this, but why is there no mention on this page of Malcolm X's publicly stated, profound racist views? Considering the language he used when referring to the "wicked race of devils" (ref: [1], [2], [3]), among other things. While it may be true that these positions had changed by the end of his life, I do not see why this aspect of his rhetoric, to which he returned repeatedly, and held as a core belief, is omitted from the article. He stated publicly that it was his belief that the Black Nation descended from God, but not the white population, and thus they were inherently evil, and incapable of acting as a force of good (as history shows, which is his claim). I believe that Wikipedia is fundamentally about being "factually correct" not "politically correct." NPOV dictates that whatever personal feelings one may have (even for a figure held in high regard by many) that it is important to bring objective truth. I am not saying that Wikipedia should attempt in any way to paint Malcolm X in a bad light, however if, as it seems, the notion of people without color being fundamentally and unredeemingly evil is pervasive throughout his public speaking, etc, then this should be included in the article, as it is highly relevant to his attacks against racism in the white community. Maybe there is a reason for this that I have overlooked, if so this is why it is on the discussion page, and feel free to enlighten me. - 19:35, 9 November 2005 (UTC)
Malcolm X had red hair when he was young - that seems to be well documented. But did the red hair change color or did he dye it? It seems I read in a biography that he dyed it. So my questions are:
I think this would be interesting for the Malcolm X article but maybe only to me. So I am asking these questions for an article about red-haired people where it is relevent. Thanks. -- cda 01:37, 15 January 2006 (UTC)
His hair was always reddish. Although he did "conk" his hair, there's nothing about him actually using dye to colour his hair. In his autobiography, he attributes his red hair and light skin to the fact that his grandmother was raped by a white man. In his autobiography, he also talks about how he hated the white blood in his veins. Hope that helps. Antihostile 20:27, 7 February 2006 (UTC)
Someone put the "current" tag on the article. What current event is it referring to? -- jpgordon ∇∆∇∆ 01:53, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
I don't see anything in the article that's a current event. Iwalters 02:57, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
Yes I don't either. -- a.n.o.n.y.m t 20:02, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
This was probably tagged current because it is referenced on the Main Page because today is the anniversary of Malcolm X's assasination. Edwin Stearns | Talk 21:01, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
Upon listening to the interview with herman blake in 11 oct 1963, found on the article, I have noticed that the current view of Muslims throughout the west is not much differnt when compared to that which is accounted by Malcom X towards the end of the clip. What's your view? Jackpot Den 20:25, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
".. But whites, speak of Muslims synonomously with violence, whenever Muslims are mentioned by them, violence is brought up, but it is not connected with any other group. This is the sort of problem, again the tactic, or what I would call "Psychological warfare" to, in some way make the image of Muslims in the country to have a violent image rather than a religous image" - Malcom X,interview with herman blake in 11 oct 1963
The view I mean is the view of the west on Muslims and the Islamic community. I believe that the quote by Malcom X, from over 40 years ago is still applicable to the western view on Muslims now. Jackpot Den 22:23, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
Correct me if I'm wrong, but it doesn't appear that this article is part of any categories like "Black Americans" or "Civil Rights Leaders" or what have you. It doesn't seem to be contained in any categories at all. Is it an orphan?
I think the article might benefit from a short discussion of the competing theories as who who "really" done it. I've rarely seen an article about Malcolm X that accepted the convictions of Hayer, Norman 3X Butler, and Thomas 15X Johnson as the final word. There ought to be some discussion of whether or not the NOI had ordered the killings and, if so, if these were their assassins. Were law enforcement agencies involved (Malcolm X himself thought they might be setting him up)? Uucp 12:11, 2 March 2006 (UTC)
In the first few lines, it says "he brushed the rummors aside" and "He talked to the secretary." Was that Malcolm or Ellih that did these things? I would fix it myself, but I don't know who it was. Minnesota1 05:11, 13 April 2006 (UTC)
The comment about Malcolm saying "Chickens coming home to roost never made me sad in fact it only made me glad" is false. I have a documentary with Malcolm denying he ever made any comment saying that. Plus, The Nation of Islam never allowed camara's OR audio tapes in at this point due Elljah Muhammad rejection of the media. So it's not any factual proof of Malcolm making that comment.
Does anybody else consider the rampant usage of "citation needed" in between every other word in this article a little passive aggressive? Or is it just me? - mixvio 15:06, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
He's listed as someone opposed to gay rights; can anyone source this? Ohyeahmormons 18:11, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
I am concerned that this entry relies almost entirely for its content on the Autobiography of Malcolm X, as told to Alex Haley. This book is, in my opinion, very well written and insightful. However, it is also biased, discussing only those aspects of Malcolm's past that he wanted to discuss, presenting only those explanations for his behavior that he wanted on record, and mythologizing his own past and that of his family in some respects.
I would like to see this entry become much better footnoted, so that people can see where each claim comes from. I plan to start inserting material from sources other than the Autobiography as well. I hope that others will join me in this.
Uucp 11:28, 18 July 2006 (UTC)
A quick Google search did yield this; beyond that, I'd defer to an expert on the subject, relating to the quote, "If Christianity had asserted itself in Germany, six million Jews would have lived." -- Emufarmers( T/ C) 11:51, 7 August 2006 (UTC)
i'm not sure about the wikipedia policy on this, but what's the point of having all those quotes if there's already a wikiquote page? Yiyun 04:17, 12 August 2006 (UTC)
If anyone can help me pin down the source of this quote, I would be very appreciative:
-- 1000Faces 22:29, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
It seems to me like someone who is strongly against the FBI wrote the section Nation of Islam. Please I'm new to wikipedia, so tell me if I did this right. Snoopl3s 00:56, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
The last two sentences in the intro need rewording/or a strong citation:
I am no expert on the man but I have checked several reliable sources (E.g. "Malcolm X" Encyclopedia Britannica. 1990 Ed.) and they don't say anything about a government role. I am not saying that the viewpoint is untenable, but I don't think 'widely believed' is correct.
If someone more knowledgeable on the subject doesn't do it in the next day or so then I will (I am hesitant to leap in as I imagine that this article can be controversial).
Also, it's spelt Assassination (unless us Aussies are out of step with the rest of the world on that one – happens occasionally.)
Joaq99 16:13, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
Its been fixed, but I noticed someone defaced the page making it sound like he was the founder of the KKK. Here is a quote. "Malcolm X, born Malcolm Little, also known as Black Evil and El Hajj Malik El-Shabazz (Omaha, Nebraska, May 19, 1925 – February 21, 1965 in New York City) was a Muslim Minister and National Spokesman for the Nation of Islam. He was also founder of the UAZ and the KKK." Please report further incidents so we can keep track of it. Keithg 20:15, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
Midway down the article there is a "neutrality questioned" flag, saying somebody has nominated it as needing attention in this regard. There is a link to this talk page, where whoever placed the notice should have given some justification for throwing doubt on the legitimacy of the article. But I see no mention of "neutrality" in any of the stuff above.
I think the article could be improved, but a quick reading reveals no hint of intentional bias to me. I do think, however, that the article is less than objective in the sense that it does not give due recognition to this individual's highest qualities and greatest contributions to American life.
So, whoever put up the notice, let's have some specifics. P0M 08:04, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
![]() | This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
This page and others are currently undergoing repeated attacks from IP addresses belonging to TV Cable S.A. An ongoing Abuse Report on this can be found at WP:AbRep - Please report all vandal attacks from IP addresses starting 200.x.x.x and especially either 200.118.x.x or 200.74.x.x on my talk page User talk:Heligoland. If you leave a vandalism warning, please also consider adding {{ISP|TV Cable S.A.}} to try and deter further vandalism and/or checking other contributions from that IP address for other vandalism. Heligoland 20:57, 2 November 2006 (UTC)
I often hear Malcolm in his hustling days referred to as a "pimp", but never found any reference to him doing any pimping in his autobiography; indeed, he suggests he wouldn't be any good at it. One of his best friends was a pimp, but I wouldn't really call that being "involved" with pimping. Also, what made him a "racketeer"? Was it the numbers game? - furrykef ( Talk at me) 15:21, 18 August 2005 (UTC)
It ain't easy, but it's necessary.
I'm sure many Americans must be sick of hearing this question asked of virtually every other famous American, but ... is it true that Malcolm was of Irish descent somewhere along the line (like Ali)? Thank you. Fergananim 17:34, 6 October 2005 (UTC)
one of his grandfathers was white, maybe he was irish? Colorfulharp233 03:12, 6 July 2006 (UTC)
LOL! are you guys idiots? His hair is redish because he relaxed his hair so much as a youth. Relaxing your hair can turn your hair many shades lighter over time. And its known that he did it many times as a youth.
^^^He did in fact relax his hair a lot as a youth, but his hair was reddish as his grandfather was white (and had red hair). If anything, the relaxer "brought out" the reddish color more.
-- Mik 17:10, 3 September 2006 (UTC)
I know I am about to be bombarded with flames/death threats/whatever for saying this, but why is there no mention on this page of Malcolm X's publicly stated, profound racist views? Considering the language he used when referring to the "wicked race of devils" (ref: [1], [2], [3]), among other things. While it may be true that these positions had changed by the end of his life, I do not see why this aspect of his rhetoric, to which he returned repeatedly, and held as a core belief, is omitted from the article. He stated publicly that it was his belief that the Black Nation descended from God, but not the white population, and thus they were inherently evil, and incapable of acting as a force of good (as history shows, which is his claim). I believe that Wikipedia is fundamentally about being "factually correct" not "politically correct." NPOV dictates that whatever personal feelings one may have (even for a figure held in high regard by many) that it is important to bring objective truth. I am not saying that Wikipedia should attempt in any way to paint Malcolm X in a bad light, however if, as it seems, the notion of people without color being fundamentally and unredeemingly evil is pervasive throughout his public speaking, etc, then this should be included in the article, as it is highly relevant to his attacks against racism in the white community. Maybe there is a reason for this that I have overlooked, if so this is why it is on the discussion page, and feel free to enlighten me. - 19:35, 9 November 2005 (UTC)
Malcolm X had red hair when he was young - that seems to be well documented. But did the red hair change color or did he dye it? It seems I read in a biography that he dyed it. So my questions are:
I think this would be interesting for the Malcolm X article but maybe only to me. So I am asking these questions for an article about red-haired people where it is relevent. Thanks. -- cda 01:37, 15 January 2006 (UTC)
His hair was always reddish. Although he did "conk" his hair, there's nothing about him actually using dye to colour his hair. In his autobiography, he attributes his red hair and light skin to the fact that his grandmother was raped by a white man. In his autobiography, he also talks about how he hated the white blood in his veins. Hope that helps. Antihostile 20:27, 7 February 2006 (UTC)
Someone put the "current" tag on the article. What current event is it referring to? -- jpgordon ∇∆∇∆ 01:53, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
I don't see anything in the article that's a current event. Iwalters 02:57, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
Yes I don't either. -- a.n.o.n.y.m t 20:02, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
This was probably tagged current because it is referenced on the Main Page because today is the anniversary of Malcolm X's assasination. Edwin Stearns | Talk 21:01, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
Upon listening to the interview with herman blake in 11 oct 1963, found on the article, I have noticed that the current view of Muslims throughout the west is not much differnt when compared to that which is accounted by Malcom X towards the end of the clip. What's your view? Jackpot Den 20:25, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
".. But whites, speak of Muslims synonomously with violence, whenever Muslims are mentioned by them, violence is brought up, but it is not connected with any other group. This is the sort of problem, again the tactic, or what I would call "Psychological warfare" to, in some way make the image of Muslims in the country to have a violent image rather than a religous image" - Malcom X,interview with herman blake in 11 oct 1963
The view I mean is the view of the west on Muslims and the Islamic community. I believe that the quote by Malcom X, from over 40 years ago is still applicable to the western view on Muslims now. Jackpot Den 22:23, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
Correct me if I'm wrong, but it doesn't appear that this article is part of any categories like "Black Americans" or "Civil Rights Leaders" or what have you. It doesn't seem to be contained in any categories at all. Is it an orphan?
I think the article might benefit from a short discussion of the competing theories as who who "really" done it. I've rarely seen an article about Malcolm X that accepted the convictions of Hayer, Norman 3X Butler, and Thomas 15X Johnson as the final word. There ought to be some discussion of whether or not the NOI had ordered the killings and, if so, if these were their assassins. Were law enforcement agencies involved (Malcolm X himself thought they might be setting him up)? Uucp 12:11, 2 March 2006 (UTC)
In the first few lines, it says "he brushed the rummors aside" and "He talked to the secretary." Was that Malcolm or Ellih that did these things? I would fix it myself, but I don't know who it was. Minnesota1 05:11, 13 April 2006 (UTC)
The comment about Malcolm saying "Chickens coming home to roost never made me sad in fact it only made me glad" is false. I have a documentary with Malcolm denying he ever made any comment saying that. Plus, The Nation of Islam never allowed camara's OR audio tapes in at this point due Elljah Muhammad rejection of the media. So it's not any factual proof of Malcolm making that comment.
Does anybody else consider the rampant usage of "citation needed" in between every other word in this article a little passive aggressive? Or is it just me? - mixvio 15:06, 7 July 2006 (UTC)
He's listed as someone opposed to gay rights; can anyone source this? Ohyeahmormons 18:11, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
I am concerned that this entry relies almost entirely for its content on the Autobiography of Malcolm X, as told to Alex Haley. This book is, in my opinion, very well written and insightful. However, it is also biased, discussing only those aspects of Malcolm's past that he wanted to discuss, presenting only those explanations for his behavior that he wanted on record, and mythologizing his own past and that of his family in some respects.
I would like to see this entry become much better footnoted, so that people can see where each claim comes from. I plan to start inserting material from sources other than the Autobiography as well. I hope that others will join me in this.
Uucp 11:28, 18 July 2006 (UTC)
A quick Google search did yield this; beyond that, I'd defer to an expert on the subject, relating to the quote, "If Christianity had asserted itself in Germany, six million Jews would have lived." -- Emufarmers( T/ C) 11:51, 7 August 2006 (UTC)
i'm not sure about the wikipedia policy on this, but what's the point of having all those quotes if there's already a wikiquote page? Yiyun 04:17, 12 August 2006 (UTC)
If anyone can help me pin down the source of this quote, I would be very appreciative:
-- 1000Faces 22:29, 28 October 2006 (UTC)
It seems to me like someone who is strongly against the FBI wrote the section Nation of Islam. Please I'm new to wikipedia, so tell me if I did this right. Snoopl3s 00:56, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
The last two sentences in the intro need rewording/or a strong citation:
I am no expert on the man but I have checked several reliable sources (E.g. "Malcolm X" Encyclopedia Britannica. 1990 Ed.) and they don't say anything about a government role. I am not saying that the viewpoint is untenable, but I don't think 'widely believed' is correct.
If someone more knowledgeable on the subject doesn't do it in the next day or so then I will (I am hesitant to leap in as I imagine that this article can be controversial).
Also, it's spelt Assassination (unless us Aussies are out of step with the rest of the world on that one – happens occasionally.)
Joaq99 16:13, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
Its been fixed, but I noticed someone defaced the page making it sound like he was the founder of the KKK. Here is a quote. "Malcolm X, born Malcolm Little, also known as Black Evil and El Hajj Malik El-Shabazz (Omaha, Nebraska, May 19, 1925 – February 21, 1965 in New York City) was a Muslim Minister and National Spokesman for the Nation of Islam. He was also founder of the UAZ and the KKK." Please report further incidents so we can keep track of it. Keithg 20:15, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
Midway down the article there is a "neutrality questioned" flag, saying somebody has nominated it as needing attention in this regard. There is a link to this talk page, where whoever placed the notice should have given some justification for throwing doubt on the legitimacy of the article. But I see no mention of "neutrality" in any of the stuff above.
I think the article could be improved, but a quick reading reveals no hint of intentional bias to me. I do think, however, that the article is less than objective in the sense that it does not give due recognition to this individual's highest qualities and greatest contributions to American life.
So, whoever put up the notice, let's have some specifics. P0M 08:04, 3 November 2006 (UTC)