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Madame Montour article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
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A fact from Madame Montour appeared on Wikipedia's
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Did you know column on 13 March 2007. The text of the entry was as follows:
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I have been watching this article for awhile and have a couple of comments. I think the flow of the article would be better served if some of the sub headings were rethought. Example: First marriage/second marriage sections seem to be arbitrary; there are no certain records of any formal marriages available but there are recorded comments regarding a number of "marriages of custom". I might add an edit as follows " It is also recorded that from late 1706 for a period, she was the companion of Étienne de Veniard, Sieur de Bourgmont and may have had one child in this relationship." but, where to add it? Secondly, I think that the reference section needs to be cleaned up and placed in the more editable situation in its own section rather than intersperced in the text. Having said all this; it is a good article on its way to becoming better. Cheers! -- Stormbay 00:09, 22 April 2007 (UTC)
The article is currently organized semi-chronologically, but there are other ways it could be organized. Maybe Intro, Childhood and Early Life, Career (her services as a translator seem well documented and pretty much agreed on), Family (the latter could include her mates and offspring), and Legacy. Maybe give the best attested or most plausible thing first in each section, then the alternatives (all cited of course). How does this sound? Ruhrfisch 00:38, 22 April 2007 (UTC)
This article was automatically assessed because at least one article was rated and this bot brought all the other ratings up to at least that level. BetacommandBot 11:27, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
Page: Elizabeth Catherine Montour
Should be: Elisabeth Couc aka Madame Montour
I did some editing to fix errors and omissions in genealogical and familial information about this person and her family. This family is very well known in New France and Quebec history. Some of the corrections come the Biographical Dictionnary of Canada, while others come from official genealogical publications and ressources (records).
BUT, I cannot correct the title, which gives he name incorrectly, because who ever started it was not working with primary sources and probably did not had access to official records here in Quebec.
I there is someone with the necessary access to do the appropriate correction.
P.S.: Elisabeth (is French) and Elizabeth (is English), that person was born in the French colonies and baptised in a French catholic church. And though her baptism has not been found yet, her confirmation was found, as well as most of her siblings baptisms, her first marriage and baptism of at least 2 of her oldest children, all in French catholic churches. The fact that American historians changed her name in various old publications should not matter. But if it is possible to use the English spelling as an alternative for the search engine, that would probably be a good idea. She is also known as Isabelle Couc, Isabelle and Elisabeth being interchangeable in French.
Would probably be a good idea to make a French version for this page, but I am not familiar enough your website and the various functions to do it for the moment. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Petitefleur qc ( talk • contribs) 04:55, 17 August 2008 (UTC)
Two & a half years ago, Dincher asked me to take a look at this article. Better late than never! I hope there are still some people watching this.
The article has some problems, due to the use of some unreliable sources, from both the web and old books. I know the contributors were having trouble finding sources at the time. Google Books has greatly expanded in the last couple of years, of course, which has enabled me to at least glimpse some modern scholarly sources. That brief review leads me to the following observations:
I'll be happy to make some revisions and add some notes & sources to the article, once it's moved to "Madame Montour". Cheers! — Kevin Myers 05:55, 27 October 2009 (UTC)
Not all marriages and children are shown. The names in green are possibly
Madame Montour.
Pierre Couc dit Lafleur (1627–1690) | Marie Miteçamegçkçe (1631–1699) | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Madeleine | Louis Couc Montour (c. 1659–1709) | Elizabeth Couc (b. 1667) | Marguerite Couc (b. 1664) | Jean Baptiste Couc (b. 1673) | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Daughter (b. c. 1685) | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Andrew Montour | "French Margaret" | "Queen Esther" | Michael Montour | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
John Montour | Nicholas Montour | "Queen Catharine" | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
This is preliminary. I have a couple of sources to consult before this can be added to any articles. But please comment if it doesn't look right or doesn't make sense. The chart is supposed to convey something potentially confusing: that there are two candidates for "Madame Montour", and thus two candidates for Andrew Montour's mother, as well as three possible candidates for the mother of French Margaret. Make sense? If not, maybe the article text, when updated soon, will help. Another approach would be to have two (or three) different trees, one for each interpretation. Comments? — Kevin Myers 07:43, 30 October 2009 (UTC)
You've made some sense out of some pretty confusing family history. Very good work. Dincher ( talk) 20:33, 30 October 2009 (UTC)
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This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Madame Montour article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
A fact from Madame Montour appeared on Wikipedia's
Main Page in the
Did you know column on 13 March 2007. The text of the entry was as follows:
|
This article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
I have been watching this article for awhile and have a couple of comments. I think the flow of the article would be better served if some of the sub headings were rethought. Example: First marriage/second marriage sections seem to be arbitrary; there are no certain records of any formal marriages available but there are recorded comments regarding a number of "marriages of custom". I might add an edit as follows " It is also recorded that from late 1706 for a period, she was the companion of Étienne de Veniard, Sieur de Bourgmont and may have had one child in this relationship." but, where to add it? Secondly, I think that the reference section needs to be cleaned up and placed in the more editable situation in its own section rather than intersperced in the text. Having said all this; it is a good article on its way to becoming better. Cheers! -- Stormbay 00:09, 22 April 2007 (UTC)
The article is currently organized semi-chronologically, but there are other ways it could be organized. Maybe Intro, Childhood and Early Life, Career (her services as a translator seem well documented and pretty much agreed on), Family (the latter could include her mates and offspring), and Legacy. Maybe give the best attested or most plausible thing first in each section, then the alternatives (all cited of course). How does this sound? Ruhrfisch 00:38, 22 April 2007 (UTC)
This article was automatically assessed because at least one article was rated and this bot brought all the other ratings up to at least that level. BetacommandBot 11:27, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
Page: Elizabeth Catherine Montour
Should be: Elisabeth Couc aka Madame Montour
I did some editing to fix errors and omissions in genealogical and familial information about this person and her family. This family is very well known in New France and Quebec history. Some of the corrections come the Biographical Dictionnary of Canada, while others come from official genealogical publications and ressources (records).
BUT, I cannot correct the title, which gives he name incorrectly, because who ever started it was not working with primary sources and probably did not had access to official records here in Quebec.
I there is someone with the necessary access to do the appropriate correction.
P.S.: Elisabeth (is French) and Elizabeth (is English), that person was born in the French colonies and baptised in a French catholic church. And though her baptism has not been found yet, her confirmation was found, as well as most of her siblings baptisms, her first marriage and baptism of at least 2 of her oldest children, all in French catholic churches. The fact that American historians changed her name in various old publications should not matter. But if it is possible to use the English spelling as an alternative for the search engine, that would probably be a good idea. She is also known as Isabelle Couc, Isabelle and Elisabeth being interchangeable in French.
Would probably be a good idea to make a French version for this page, but I am not familiar enough your website and the various functions to do it for the moment. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Petitefleur qc ( talk • contribs) 04:55, 17 August 2008 (UTC)
Two & a half years ago, Dincher asked me to take a look at this article. Better late than never! I hope there are still some people watching this.
The article has some problems, due to the use of some unreliable sources, from both the web and old books. I know the contributors were having trouble finding sources at the time. Google Books has greatly expanded in the last couple of years, of course, which has enabled me to at least glimpse some modern scholarly sources. That brief review leads me to the following observations:
I'll be happy to make some revisions and add some notes & sources to the article, once it's moved to "Madame Montour". Cheers! — Kevin Myers 05:55, 27 October 2009 (UTC)
Not all marriages and children are shown. The names in green are possibly
Madame Montour.
Pierre Couc dit Lafleur (1627–1690) | Marie Miteçamegçkçe (1631–1699) | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Madeleine | Louis Couc Montour (c. 1659–1709) | Elizabeth Couc (b. 1667) | Marguerite Couc (b. 1664) | Jean Baptiste Couc (b. 1673) | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Daughter (b. c. 1685) | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Andrew Montour | "French Margaret" | "Queen Esther" | Michael Montour | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
John Montour | Nicholas Montour | "Queen Catharine" | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
This is preliminary. I have a couple of sources to consult before this can be added to any articles. But please comment if it doesn't look right or doesn't make sense. The chart is supposed to convey something potentially confusing: that there are two candidates for "Madame Montour", and thus two candidates for Andrew Montour's mother, as well as three possible candidates for the mother of French Margaret. Make sense? If not, maybe the article text, when updated soon, will help. Another approach would be to have two (or three) different trees, one for each interpretation. Comments? — Kevin Myers 07:43, 30 October 2009 (UTC)
You've made some sense out of some pretty confusing family history. Very good work. Dincher ( talk) 20:33, 30 October 2009 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Madame Montour. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 18:33, 29 May 2017 (UTC)