The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Question: Cannot the image simply be reduced to satisfy the issue? I would do so myself, but I have no idea how much reduction is considered necessary. I feel this image is a helpful and appropriate inclusion. –
SJ Morg (
talk)
11:02, 6 January 2021 (UTC)reply
My question was directed at Truflip99, not the GAN reviewer. Removal of the questioned image is an easy solution, but is not the best solution, in my view. –
SJ Morg (
talk)
07:18, 7 January 2021 (UTC)reply
"...just outside of Milwaukie proper in unincorporated Clackamas County." what does "proper" and "unincorporated" mean? Unfamiliar with the geography of the US, thus I'm unfamiliar with these terms. GeraldWL07:27, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Done I've added the appropriate wikilinks. Should suffice for GA.
It is not entirely car-free. This is explained in the body.
"...as a northbound service of the transit mall"-- Is that all good, or is the name of the mall literally Transit Mall? If so, it must be capitalized. GeraldWL07:27, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
"Portland Transit Mall" is the proper name, while "
transit mall" is a common noun (i.e. Portland, the city... Portland Transit Mall, the transit mall)
I think since it's already in the lead, it's not necessary. Idk I've just been following the style of older FA articles (like
Line 1 (Sound Transit))
Daily ridership parameter in infobox has it "as of", but lead says "in September 2019." In means that it carried 11,000 during that month, while as of means that it carried 11,000 from its opening up to 2019. GeraldWL07:27, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Per the
template's usage: "The template ... is used to mark potentially dated statements, and will add an article to the appropriate hidden sub-category of Category:Articles containing potentially dated statements. This allows editors to catalogue statements that may become dated over time."
I'll start reverse here, from Services to History, from short to long.
Service
"..supplemented by TriMet bus route 291–Orange Night Bus"-- that's the bus route name? "291–Orange Night Bus"? Aren't buses only marked by numbers? GeraldWL08:26, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Yes. TriMet likes to be unique in this way I think.
This is not remotely unusual in the United States. Many (maybe even a majority of) urban transit systems give both numbers and names to routes. I realize this is very unusual in Europe (according to my British friends), but it is very common in the United States (and Canada). –
SJ Morg (
talk)
10:49, 6 January 2021 (UTC)reply
I use "service" instead of "line" because American light rail systems are unique in that lines frequently overlap and it just helps with differentiating that fact. Not a fan of them doing this either.
Indeed. The issue is, ridership predictions are used to ask for money from citizens and the US government to build these lines, and since TriMet couldn't meet its predictions after building the line, people were upset.
So the map caption has an external link.
WP:ELPOINTS says that "external links should not be used in the body of an article", with "rare exceptions" and with suggestion of using
Template:External media, or having it as a reference. Does this case fall under the rare exception? GeraldWL08:26, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Multi images: trivial, but I recommend replacing the Southeast Bybee Boulevard image with South Waterfront/Southwest Moody's, as it is the median of the station list. This is trivial, though. GeraldWL08:26, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
I agree, but there aren't any good pics of that station...
I would have another legend in the Key table, in white, that reads "Northbound travel only", if that is what white symbolizes. GeraldWL06:05, 6 January 2021 (UTC)reply
@
Gerald Waldo Luis: Given the topic, I really don't think it's necessary. It's fair assumption for any station in any part of the world to be served by trains running bi-directionally unless otherwise noted. Plus if that were the case, I would have added a "↑" icon next to those stations and a "Northbound only" key to indicate that. Please note that
MAX Yellow Line and
MAX Red Line both achieved FA without this being necessary. --
truflip99 (
talk)
07:04, 6 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Truflip99, got it. I think I misread the article initially, assuming that it's southbound platform and not station.
Not done I've already tried that in the two years I've been tweaking these tables, and trust me when I say it just doesn't look as good. :) Plus there is no wiki MOS to say what this should look like.
truflip99 (
talk)
08:44, 6 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Since it's referred to as "the Columbia Region Association of Governments", the abbreviation must be "the CRAG", not just "CRAG". GeraldWL13:32, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Common usage omits the "the" in this case
The omission of "the" is fairly common when an initialism can be pronounced as a word, which applies here. The abbreviated name of this entity is commonly spoken as "crag" (but written CRAG, of course). –
SJ Morg (
talk)
10:54, 6 January 2021 (UTC)reply
May not be necessary as other GA/FA articles don't do this? Not quite sure about this one tbh, just following other styles.
Revival and funding
"Metro, TriMet, Clackamas County, the cities of Portland and Milwaukie, and in-kind"-- suggest removing "the cities of", and change "and" with a comma. GeraldWL13:32, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Done
Construction and opening
"By that July, the project had reached 50-percent completion." Suggest changing to 'By that July, the project had been completed by 50%." I'm personally not a fan of alphebatizing percents, but if that's preferred you may keep that part. GeraldWL13:32, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Done I agree with you here. I've switched back and forth between spelling it out and not, just right now all of my articles spell it out. Do you know if there is a definitive wiki style for this? --
truflip99 (
talk)
19:33, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Gerald Waldo Luis To add, I think I'll have to remove the majority of your archived links as they are already archived in the Newsbank database, and it would effectively be an archive of an archive. --
truflip99 (
talk)
19:35, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Truflip99, this article is all good for GA. Just some more points:
Explanatory note c has an inappropriate boldface. Mind italicizing and unbolding, or just completely unbold?
Done
Some sources need archive. They are ref: 32, 70, 83, 92, 93, and 99.
I will go ahead and do these once Wayback Machine stops lagging. Please note that archiving is not a pre-requisite to GA status. With that said, I always have archiving as part of my to-do list for articles that I eventually wish to push through to FA review. --
truflip99 (
talk)
16:38, 6 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Perhaps
SJ Morg can help with the archiving. I am only able to archive one source manually: Toolforge doesn't archive the 6 sources above, and the Wayback Machine lags my laptop when I process it. GeraldWL11:30, 6 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Truflip99, 'pologies the wait! I'm currently on mobile, so it's gonna be hard to GA it. Need to move to the desktop first, so be patient. By afternoon UTC+7 I'll push this up. Anyway, since you have the MAX article and the line articles all G or FA, dp you plan to make them a featured topic? Just wondering. GeraldWL01:11, 8 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Gerald Waldo Luis Thanks again for the thorough review of this article. I'm quite impressed with the things you've caught having actively edited on WP for just the past year. Good luck on your projects here, and should you want any assistance please don't hesitate to leave me a message. And yes, I do plan to pursue Good/Featured Topic in the future, when I'm less lazy :D --
truflip99 (
talk)
18:59, 8 January 2021 (UTC)reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Question: Cannot the image simply be reduced to satisfy the issue? I would do so myself, but I have no idea how much reduction is considered necessary. I feel this image is a helpful and appropriate inclusion. –
SJ Morg (
talk)
11:02, 6 January 2021 (UTC)reply
My question was directed at Truflip99, not the GAN reviewer. Removal of the questioned image is an easy solution, but is not the best solution, in my view. –
SJ Morg (
talk)
07:18, 7 January 2021 (UTC)reply
"...just outside of Milwaukie proper in unincorporated Clackamas County." what does "proper" and "unincorporated" mean? Unfamiliar with the geography of the US, thus I'm unfamiliar with these terms. GeraldWL07:27, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Done I've added the appropriate wikilinks. Should suffice for GA.
It is not entirely car-free. This is explained in the body.
"...as a northbound service of the transit mall"-- Is that all good, or is the name of the mall literally Transit Mall? If so, it must be capitalized. GeraldWL07:27, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
"Portland Transit Mall" is the proper name, while "
transit mall" is a common noun (i.e. Portland, the city... Portland Transit Mall, the transit mall)
I think since it's already in the lead, it's not necessary. Idk I've just been following the style of older FA articles (like
Line 1 (Sound Transit))
Daily ridership parameter in infobox has it "as of", but lead says "in September 2019." In means that it carried 11,000 during that month, while as of means that it carried 11,000 from its opening up to 2019. GeraldWL07:27, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Per the
template's usage: "The template ... is used to mark potentially dated statements, and will add an article to the appropriate hidden sub-category of Category:Articles containing potentially dated statements. This allows editors to catalogue statements that may become dated over time."
I'll start reverse here, from Services to History, from short to long.
Service
"..supplemented by TriMet bus route 291–Orange Night Bus"-- that's the bus route name? "291–Orange Night Bus"? Aren't buses only marked by numbers? GeraldWL08:26, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Yes. TriMet likes to be unique in this way I think.
This is not remotely unusual in the United States. Many (maybe even a majority of) urban transit systems give both numbers and names to routes. I realize this is very unusual in Europe (according to my British friends), but it is very common in the United States (and Canada). –
SJ Morg (
talk)
10:49, 6 January 2021 (UTC)reply
I use "service" instead of "line" because American light rail systems are unique in that lines frequently overlap and it just helps with differentiating that fact. Not a fan of them doing this either.
Indeed. The issue is, ridership predictions are used to ask for money from citizens and the US government to build these lines, and since TriMet couldn't meet its predictions after building the line, people were upset.
So the map caption has an external link.
WP:ELPOINTS says that "external links should not be used in the body of an article", with "rare exceptions" and with suggestion of using
Template:External media, or having it as a reference. Does this case fall under the rare exception? GeraldWL08:26, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Multi images: trivial, but I recommend replacing the Southeast Bybee Boulevard image with South Waterfront/Southwest Moody's, as it is the median of the station list. This is trivial, though. GeraldWL08:26, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
I agree, but there aren't any good pics of that station...
I would have another legend in the Key table, in white, that reads "Northbound travel only", if that is what white symbolizes. GeraldWL06:05, 6 January 2021 (UTC)reply
@
Gerald Waldo Luis: Given the topic, I really don't think it's necessary. It's fair assumption for any station in any part of the world to be served by trains running bi-directionally unless otherwise noted. Plus if that were the case, I would have added a "↑" icon next to those stations and a "Northbound only" key to indicate that. Please note that
MAX Yellow Line and
MAX Red Line both achieved FA without this being necessary. --
truflip99 (
talk)
07:04, 6 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Truflip99, got it. I think I misread the article initially, assuming that it's southbound platform and not station.
Not done I've already tried that in the two years I've been tweaking these tables, and trust me when I say it just doesn't look as good. :) Plus there is no wiki MOS to say what this should look like.
truflip99 (
talk)
08:44, 6 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Since it's referred to as "the Columbia Region Association of Governments", the abbreviation must be "the CRAG", not just "CRAG". GeraldWL13:32, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Common usage omits the "the" in this case
The omission of "the" is fairly common when an initialism can be pronounced as a word, which applies here. The abbreviated name of this entity is commonly spoken as "crag" (but written CRAG, of course). –
SJ Morg (
talk)
10:54, 6 January 2021 (UTC)reply
May not be necessary as other GA/FA articles don't do this? Not quite sure about this one tbh, just following other styles.
Revival and funding
"Metro, TriMet, Clackamas County, the cities of Portland and Milwaukie, and in-kind"-- suggest removing "the cities of", and change "and" with a comma. GeraldWL13:32, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Done
Construction and opening
"By that July, the project had reached 50-percent completion." Suggest changing to 'By that July, the project had been completed by 50%." I'm personally not a fan of alphebatizing percents, but if that's preferred you may keep that part. GeraldWL13:32, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Done I agree with you here. I've switched back and forth between spelling it out and not, just right now all of my articles spell it out. Do you know if there is a definitive wiki style for this? --
truflip99 (
talk)
19:33, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Gerald Waldo Luis To add, I think I'll have to remove the majority of your archived links as they are already archived in the Newsbank database, and it would effectively be an archive of an archive. --
truflip99 (
talk)
19:35, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Truflip99, this article is all good for GA. Just some more points:
Explanatory note c has an inappropriate boldface. Mind italicizing and unbolding, or just completely unbold?
Done
Some sources need archive. They are ref: 32, 70, 83, 92, 93, and 99.
I will go ahead and do these once Wayback Machine stops lagging. Please note that archiving is not a pre-requisite to GA status. With that said, I always have archiving as part of my to-do list for articles that I eventually wish to push through to FA review. --
truflip99 (
talk)
16:38, 6 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Perhaps
SJ Morg can help with the archiving. I am only able to archive one source manually: Toolforge doesn't archive the 6 sources above, and the Wayback Machine lags my laptop when I process it. GeraldWL11:30, 6 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Truflip99, 'pologies the wait! I'm currently on mobile, so it's gonna be hard to GA it. Need to move to the desktop first, so be patient. By afternoon UTC+7 I'll push this up. Anyway, since you have the MAX article and the line articles all G or FA, dp you plan to make them a featured topic? Just wondering. GeraldWL01:11, 8 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Gerald Waldo Luis Thanks again for the thorough review of this article. I'm quite impressed with the things you've caught having actively edited on WP for just the past year. Good luck on your projects here, and should you want any assistance please don't hesitate to leave me a message. And yes, I do plan to pursue Good/Featured Topic in the future, when I'm less lazy :D --
truflip99 (
talk)
18:59, 8 January 2021 (UTC)reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.