Text and/or other creative content from this version of List of mass shootings in the United States was copied or moved into List of mass shootings in the United States in 2018. The former page's history now serves to provide attribution for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists. |
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I think I got a decent start on this article, but if anyone has any ideas on how to improve this list, feel free to share your thoughts! Ottoshade ( talk) 03:09, 27 August 2018 (UTC)
I've added this point to the article lead just to mention that the article intentionally begins starting from 1966. I think there should be some additional discussion as this article develops about the following things:
GorillaWarfare (talk) 07:45, 28 October 2018 (UTC)
Elaborating on my comment in the section above, does this page need to be split? I just finished filling out the descriptions for the list of shootings in 2018, and the page is now 167KB (see WP:SIZESPLIT). The other years are very short tables, but if we fill in data from lists of shootings like [1] we'll soon have similarly long lists. The alternative would be to only list shootings that have been determined to be notable enough to have their own Wikipedia articles, or perhaps there's a middle ground where a main article could list those notable shootings and then link to per-year pages for the rest. Thoughts? Pinging Ottoshade and Leaky Solar since you've actively created/improved this page. GorillaWarfare (talk) 05:56, 30 October 2018 (UTC)
The current list has some specious consideration to mass shooting. Most of the noted sources also don't use incidents in which victims include family (instead, being classified as domestic violence and being omitted from lists and databases like gang activity is). Secondary to this, when more than one location is involved or more than one day is, it's considered a spree and/or rampage killing rather than a mass shooting by all modern sourcing. For example, the vague January 2019 Louisiana shootings actually isn't even notable and shouldn't have a Wiki article, however it's both domestic AND not in one location. He killed his parents, then traveled to another county and killed his girlfriend and her parents. This would by no stretch be considered a mass shooting. If anything, domestic incidents with multiple victims happen weekly and nothing about the 1/19 shootings makes them notable.
Second example is the YouTube shooting. Only three were shot - which doesn't meet most of the stated criteria. The four injuries included a woman who hurt her ankle fleeing, which has never been used in stats for mass shootings. In this case, only one source - which uses three and not a definition used in any other manner by anyone else - states victims should be three and not four. No source uses fleeing injuries in the data tallies. Four shot is almost universally accepted now (though standards on how many shot versus how many killed, etc. vary.)
Third example is the Pecan Park "mass shooting". While a notable event for Wiki, it's not a mass shooting, as the event was involving a no-knock warrant and police shooting each other. Two died in the botched job, but there was no "one shooter", no public place and not even three shot by perpetrators. The two shooting victims were the unarmed homeowners shot by cops. The other injuries were inflicted by fragments from shooting through walls.
So, in this page, proposals to clean it up.
As for discussion, I propose to also remove incidents in which those injured by bullets aren't included by those hit with bullet fragments, but I'm open to suggestions on that because then you start trying to parse minuscule data. That said, more than a few cases involve people who were targeted being shot, and bystanders were injured with fragments. To me, this would be akin to a shooter hitting three people, and a cop shooting at the shooter hits a fourth innocent behind them. Does this meet the criteria set forth? I'm not sure. The event itself caused the death, but the fourth person wasn't killed by the perpetrator. If we start included those in the list as well, it would get pretty messy, IMO. Seola ( talk) 12:59, 9 August 2019 (UTC)
I checked this list for one well known event, 14 November 1991 in Royal Oak, MI. It was Not listed. Are there others missing?
There are other problematic entries in the list but I don't have time right now to go through it.
Removing graph as per WP:SYNTH/No original research. There is a difference between providing a list and using that list to produce a graph. The purpose of providing a graph is to synthesize the data so that one may visually observe trends on the aggregate. However, people aren't trying to draw conclusions about the state of this Wikipedia page, which is what that graph actually charts, but instead they are using it to draw conclusions about the frequency of mass shootings over time.
A scientific, methodological survey would take special care in its standards for collecting data. If we introduce bias, say by using a method which produces data which is less complete in the past than in the present, we might come to the wrong conclusions. It could be the case that the statistic is declining, but that this list has fewer records in the past due to the lack of sources represented in this page. In this case, the graph would be deliberately misleading to any casual reader of the article.
Regardless of the accuracy of the data on this page, producing such a graph or establishing standards would be producing original research. This is clearly outside the scope of an encyclopedia and Wikipedia in particular. Kphawkins ( talk) 20:11, 29 October 2019 (UTC)
Growing up these past 5 decades, "mass shooting" has always meant to me that there was a shooting of several people by one or more assailants who are generally unrelated to the victims at a public location or business/organization/governmental office. While I don't agree that familicide should be considered a mass shooting, I understand that it is considered such on WP. I came here looking for information about mass shootings and, having once looked at a similar list years ago, was shocked by how much longer the list had become (for years I looked at previously) until I noted the familicides.
However, I have a suggestion. I feel that the list presents a somewhat inaccurate - and fear-inducing - picture of mass shootings and, thus, I would like to suggest that entries involving member(s) of a family killing some or all of their family should have a different background color or some other obvious indicator that this was familicide. This will serve to reduce the, IMHO, excessive volume of this list that was most likely caused by journalistic enthusiasm/sensationalism in such a way that people can still see familicides without coming away with the impression that mass shootings are far more prevalent than they really are. This also serves the purpose of demonstrating to readers how likely they are to be killed by family rather than in another type of mass shooting. I feel that the list, with its current state, presents a situation that is distorted and will make people be more fearful.
I don't know how to make the adjustment myself or I would've done so. ReveurGAM ( talk) 13:29, 14 September 2020 (UTC)
The order of the list is wrong. The data should be listed chronological from top to bottom. As in Prison riot, List of epidemics, 2020 in stand-up comedy, just to name a random few. I thought this was the standard Wikipedia guideline. Aquatic Ambiance ( talk) 09:02, 20 September 2020 (UTC)
Why is there not a list like this one but for shootings outside the US? 98.196.107.178 ( talk) 17:59, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
I keep trying to add the Maquoketa Caves State Park Shooting, where a man shot and killed 3 people, and then killed himself, to this list. However, my edit keeps getting reverted. So how are mass shootings defined on this Wikipedia page? The Maquoketa Caves Mass shooting would be a mass shooting according to the Stanford MSA Data Project definition, the Mass Shooting Tracker definition, and the Mother Jones definition according to the definition section of this article.
The Mercy Hospital shooting, the Aztec high school shooting, the Weis Market shooting, the Kirkersville shooting, the North Park elementary school shooting, the 2015 Colorado Springs shooting, the Alison Park/Adam Ward murders, the 2013 Los Angeles airport shooting, the Clackamas Town Center Shooting, the Delisle triple murder, and the attempted Ronald Reagen assassination all fit into the same category as the Maquoketa caves mass shooting, where 3 people were shot [excluding the perpetrator]. So if the Maquoleta Caves Mass shooting does not apply as a mass shooting, we must remove all of the above listed mass shootings from this wikipedia article as well. Silent-Rains ( talk) 15:41, 31 July 2022 (UTC)
This list currently includes several shootouts. If shootouts are to be included, the list should also include the Matewan massacre of 1920 which resulted in 10 deaths. Nosferattus ( talk) 04:29, 4 November 2022 (UTC)
Would it be feasible to include some sort of information as to the weapon(s) used? Something as simple as a number from 1 to 7 indicating which of a handgun (1), a semiautomatic (2), and/or something else (4). For example 5 = 1+4 would mean the use of both a handgun and something other than a handgun or a semiautomatic. Or maybe interchange 2 and 4 if the three powers of two are ordered by perceived effectiveness, thereby shrinking my example of 1+4 to 1+2. Vaughan Pratt ( talk) 19:32, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
@ Silent-Rains and Love of Corey: With this edit, Love of Corey removed a number of incidents from this page on the apparent basis that they don't qualify as "mass shootings" (per a discussion here). However, on this very page, there are multiple definitions of what our sources consider "mass shootings". Some use "one location", but others use a more broad "same incident" (suggesting multiple locations would be acceptable). In particular, the 1933 Cleveland shooting and 2023 Yakima shooting articles seem, to me, to meet the definition of a "mass shooting" at least as defined here. — Locke Cole • t • c 07:19, 19 February 2023 (UTC)
Mass shooting in Memphis it is listed in [ [2]] and idk how to add it lol Melofy ( talk) 18:54, 31 March 2023 (UTC)
The deadliest mass shooting ever in the US by far was the Wounded Knee massacre in 1890. Was this inconvenient because it was perpetrated by the government against an indigenous population while in the process of disarming them? 98.186.207.4 ( talk) 23:10, 3 April 2023 (UTC)
The April 13, 2017 Fresno California shooting was not a mass shooting. There were five days between the first shooting (with 1 victim) and the second shooting (with 3 victims), so this incident doesn't fit any of the commonly accepted definitions of a mass shooting (i.e., four or more people shot at approximately the same place and time). EschewObfuse10 ( talk) 19:18, 13 April 2023 (UTC)
Don't we know the names of any of these mass shooters? It's a little hard to believe that all of them have been anonymous or remain unidentified. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.95.43.253 ( talk) 00:54, 16 May 2023 (UTC)
@ Lettler: The two definitions of mass shootings that allow 3 victims both exclude gang-related shootings. The Michigan shootings were gang-related, which is why I don't think they qualify. CodeTalker ( talk) 16:38, 18 May 2023 (UTC)
The redirect List of mass shootings in the United States in 2024 has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 December 8 § List of mass shootings in the United States in 2024 until a consensus is reached. Silcox ( talk) 19:08, 8 December 2023 (UTC)
Text and/or other creative content from this version of List of mass shootings in the United States was copied or moved into List of mass shootings in the United States in 2018. The former page's history now serves to provide attribution for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists. |
This article is rated List-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
I think I got a decent start on this article, but if anyone has any ideas on how to improve this list, feel free to share your thoughts! Ottoshade ( talk) 03:09, 27 August 2018 (UTC)
I've added this point to the article lead just to mention that the article intentionally begins starting from 1966. I think there should be some additional discussion as this article develops about the following things:
GorillaWarfare (talk) 07:45, 28 October 2018 (UTC)
Elaborating on my comment in the section above, does this page need to be split? I just finished filling out the descriptions for the list of shootings in 2018, and the page is now 167KB (see WP:SIZESPLIT). The other years are very short tables, but if we fill in data from lists of shootings like [1] we'll soon have similarly long lists. The alternative would be to only list shootings that have been determined to be notable enough to have their own Wikipedia articles, or perhaps there's a middle ground where a main article could list those notable shootings and then link to per-year pages for the rest. Thoughts? Pinging Ottoshade and Leaky Solar since you've actively created/improved this page. GorillaWarfare (talk) 05:56, 30 October 2018 (UTC)
The current list has some specious consideration to mass shooting. Most of the noted sources also don't use incidents in which victims include family (instead, being classified as domestic violence and being omitted from lists and databases like gang activity is). Secondary to this, when more than one location is involved or more than one day is, it's considered a spree and/or rampage killing rather than a mass shooting by all modern sourcing. For example, the vague January 2019 Louisiana shootings actually isn't even notable and shouldn't have a Wiki article, however it's both domestic AND not in one location. He killed his parents, then traveled to another county and killed his girlfriend and her parents. This would by no stretch be considered a mass shooting. If anything, domestic incidents with multiple victims happen weekly and nothing about the 1/19 shootings makes them notable.
Second example is the YouTube shooting. Only three were shot - which doesn't meet most of the stated criteria. The four injuries included a woman who hurt her ankle fleeing, which has never been used in stats for mass shootings. In this case, only one source - which uses three and not a definition used in any other manner by anyone else - states victims should be three and not four. No source uses fleeing injuries in the data tallies. Four shot is almost universally accepted now (though standards on how many shot versus how many killed, etc. vary.)
Third example is the Pecan Park "mass shooting". While a notable event for Wiki, it's not a mass shooting, as the event was involving a no-knock warrant and police shooting each other. Two died in the botched job, but there was no "one shooter", no public place and not even three shot by perpetrators. The two shooting victims were the unarmed homeowners shot by cops. The other injuries were inflicted by fragments from shooting through walls.
So, in this page, proposals to clean it up.
As for discussion, I propose to also remove incidents in which those injured by bullets aren't included by those hit with bullet fragments, but I'm open to suggestions on that because then you start trying to parse minuscule data. That said, more than a few cases involve people who were targeted being shot, and bystanders were injured with fragments. To me, this would be akin to a shooter hitting three people, and a cop shooting at the shooter hits a fourth innocent behind them. Does this meet the criteria set forth? I'm not sure. The event itself caused the death, but the fourth person wasn't killed by the perpetrator. If we start included those in the list as well, it would get pretty messy, IMO. Seola ( talk) 12:59, 9 August 2019 (UTC)
I checked this list for one well known event, 14 November 1991 in Royal Oak, MI. It was Not listed. Are there others missing?
There are other problematic entries in the list but I don't have time right now to go through it.
Removing graph as per WP:SYNTH/No original research. There is a difference between providing a list and using that list to produce a graph. The purpose of providing a graph is to synthesize the data so that one may visually observe trends on the aggregate. However, people aren't trying to draw conclusions about the state of this Wikipedia page, which is what that graph actually charts, but instead they are using it to draw conclusions about the frequency of mass shootings over time.
A scientific, methodological survey would take special care in its standards for collecting data. If we introduce bias, say by using a method which produces data which is less complete in the past than in the present, we might come to the wrong conclusions. It could be the case that the statistic is declining, but that this list has fewer records in the past due to the lack of sources represented in this page. In this case, the graph would be deliberately misleading to any casual reader of the article.
Regardless of the accuracy of the data on this page, producing such a graph or establishing standards would be producing original research. This is clearly outside the scope of an encyclopedia and Wikipedia in particular. Kphawkins ( talk) 20:11, 29 October 2019 (UTC)
Growing up these past 5 decades, "mass shooting" has always meant to me that there was a shooting of several people by one or more assailants who are generally unrelated to the victims at a public location or business/organization/governmental office. While I don't agree that familicide should be considered a mass shooting, I understand that it is considered such on WP. I came here looking for information about mass shootings and, having once looked at a similar list years ago, was shocked by how much longer the list had become (for years I looked at previously) until I noted the familicides.
However, I have a suggestion. I feel that the list presents a somewhat inaccurate - and fear-inducing - picture of mass shootings and, thus, I would like to suggest that entries involving member(s) of a family killing some or all of their family should have a different background color or some other obvious indicator that this was familicide. This will serve to reduce the, IMHO, excessive volume of this list that was most likely caused by journalistic enthusiasm/sensationalism in such a way that people can still see familicides without coming away with the impression that mass shootings are far more prevalent than they really are. This also serves the purpose of demonstrating to readers how likely they are to be killed by family rather than in another type of mass shooting. I feel that the list, with its current state, presents a situation that is distorted and will make people be more fearful.
I don't know how to make the adjustment myself or I would've done so. ReveurGAM ( talk) 13:29, 14 September 2020 (UTC)
The order of the list is wrong. The data should be listed chronological from top to bottom. As in Prison riot, List of epidemics, 2020 in stand-up comedy, just to name a random few. I thought this was the standard Wikipedia guideline. Aquatic Ambiance ( talk) 09:02, 20 September 2020 (UTC)
Why is there not a list like this one but for shootings outside the US? 98.196.107.178 ( talk) 17:59, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
I keep trying to add the Maquoketa Caves State Park Shooting, where a man shot and killed 3 people, and then killed himself, to this list. However, my edit keeps getting reverted. So how are mass shootings defined on this Wikipedia page? The Maquoketa Caves Mass shooting would be a mass shooting according to the Stanford MSA Data Project definition, the Mass Shooting Tracker definition, and the Mother Jones definition according to the definition section of this article.
The Mercy Hospital shooting, the Aztec high school shooting, the Weis Market shooting, the Kirkersville shooting, the North Park elementary school shooting, the 2015 Colorado Springs shooting, the Alison Park/Adam Ward murders, the 2013 Los Angeles airport shooting, the Clackamas Town Center Shooting, the Delisle triple murder, and the attempted Ronald Reagen assassination all fit into the same category as the Maquoketa caves mass shooting, where 3 people were shot [excluding the perpetrator]. So if the Maquoleta Caves Mass shooting does not apply as a mass shooting, we must remove all of the above listed mass shootings from this wikipedia article as well. Silent-Rains ( talk) 15:41, 31 July 2022 (UTC)
This list currently includes several shootouts. If shootouts are to be included, the list should also include the Matewan massacre of 1920 which resulted in 10 deaths. Nosferattus ( talk) 04:29, 4 November 2022 (UTC)
Would it be feasible to include some sort of information as to the weapon(s) used? Something as simple as a number from 1 to 7 indicating which of a handgun (1), a semiautomatic (2), and/or something else (4). For example 5 = 1+4 would mean the use of both a handgun and something other than a handgun or a semiautomatic. Or maybe interchange 2 and 4 if the three powers of two are ordered by perceived effectiveness, thereby shrinking my example of 1+4 to 1+2. Vaughan Pratt ( talk) 19:32, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
@ Silent-Rains and Love of Corey: With this edit, Love of Corey removed a number of incidents from this page on the apparent basis that they don't qualify as "mass shootings" (per a discussion here). However, on this very page, there are multiple definitions of what our sources consider "mass shootings". Some use "one location", but others use a more broad "same incident" (suggesting multiple locations would be acceptable). In particular, the 1933 Cleveland shooting and 2023 Yakima shooting articles seem, to me, to meet the definition of a "mass shooting" at least as defined here. — Locke Cole • t • c 07:19, 19 February 2023 (UTC)
Mass shooting in Memphis it is listed in [ [2]] and idk how to add it lol Melofy ( talk) 18:54, 31 March 2023 (UTC)
The deadliest mass shooting ever in the US by far was the Wounded Knee massacre in 1890. Was this inconvenient because it was perpetrated by the government against an indigenous population while in the process of disarming them? 98.186.207.4 ( talk) 23:10, 3 April 2023 (UTC)
The April 13, 2017 Fresno California shooting was not a mass shooting. There were five days between the first shooting (with 1 victim) and the second shooting (with 3 victims), so this incident doesn't fit any of the commonly accepted definitions of a mass shooting (i.e., four or more people shot at approximately the same place and time). EschewObfuse10 ( talk) 19:18, 13 April 2023 (UTC)
Don't we know the names of any of these mass shooters? It's a little hard to believe that all of them have been anonymous or remain unidentified. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.95.43.253 ( talk) 00:54, 16 May 2023 (UTC)
@ Lettler: The two definitions of mass shootings that allow 3 victims both exclude gang-related shootings. The Michigan shootings were gang-related, which is why I don't think they qualify. CodeTalker ( talk) 16:38, 18 May 2023 (UTC)
The redirect List of mass shootings in the United States in 2024 has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 December 8 § List of mass shootings in the United States in 2024 until a consensus is reached. Silcox ( talk) 19:08, 8 December 2023 (UTC)