While the biographies of living persons policy does not apply directly to the subject of this article, it may contain material that relates to living persons, such as friends and family of persons no longer living, or living persons involved in the subject matter. Unsourced or poorly sourced contentious material about living persons must be removed immediately. If such material is re-inserted repeatedly, or if there are other concerns related to this policy, please see this noticeboard. |
![]() | This article is rated List-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
![]() | On 12 May 2019, it was proposed that this article be moved from List of Presidents of Germany to List of presidents of Germany. The result of the discussion was moved. |
I´m not happy with this problematic division of the list, because it suggests reunited germany is a new formed state. Formally in 1990 the six new states only joined the federal republic, which kept on existing as before (just like the united states remained the united states when new states joined the union). The subdivision in "Bonn Republic" and "Berlin Republic" is only a (very controversial!) historico-cultural narrative, which has no constitutional foundation (and the caesura would be 1999 and not 1990!). I would propose the following structure of the article:
Contents 1 Weimar Republic (1919–1933) 2 Nazi Germany (1933–1945) 3 German Democratic Republic (1949–1990) 4 Federal Republic (1949–present)
The old structure follows a false and unscientific conception of german history, that should not be supported in an encyclopedia. I hope, I find your agreement to revise the article in the proposed form. Alektor89 ( talk) 21:32, 15 August 2016 (UTC)
I don't think Hitler should be included in this list, because he abolished the title President. His official title translates into English as "Leader and Reich Chancellor" - "President" is nowhere to be seen. The page should be amended to suit this. 82.19.94.146
Although Hitler never claimed the office of Reich President, he did assume its duties following the merger of that office with that of Reich Chancellor (Reichskanzler) upon the death of Reichspräsident Paul von Hindenburg on 2 August 1934. After the merger of the two offices, a "Präsidialkanzlei" (Presidential Chancellery) under the direction of Staatsminister (Minister of State) Dr. Otto Meissner (who was formerly the top aide to von Hindenburg) was created to assist Hitler in the performance of his duties as head of the German state. Hitler was the German head of state de facto and de jure (due in part to the passage of the Enabling Act by the Reichstag in 1933, which authorized Hitler to, among other things, issue a law combining the offices of President and Chancellor) and it is therefore appropriate to include Hitler in this list, at least in mentioning the technical vacancy of the office of Reichspräsident between von Hindenburg's death in 1934 and the appointment of Karl Dönitz by Hitler in 1945. Cvieg 04:35, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
Who keeps changing the color of Hindenburg into dark red (communist)? The appropriate color for a conservative politician is blue.
Two points about recent events involving this article:
Iota ( talk) 02:02, 28 September 2009 (UTC)
Honestly people, this list makes absolutely no sense at all. Comparing a Reichspräsident to a Bundespräsident is just as moronic as comparing a Roman Emperor to a Holy Roman Emperor. Yes, the titles may sound similar, but they're so very much not the same. In fact the fathers (and mothers) of the modern day German constitution went to great length to make sure that a Bundespräsident had virtually nothing at all to do with a Reichspräsident, much like the modern day Bundeskanzler doesn't have a lot in common with his Reichskanzler predecessors. Furthermore no - and I can't stress this point enough - absolutely, completely, totally NO German constitutional expert would ever draw a line from the offices of the Weimar Republic to those of the Federal Republic of Germany (or, for that matter, those of the GDR). Why? Because the Weimar Republic and the Federal Republic of Germany are two completely different political entities with absolutely no ties whatsoever. So could somebody please stop creating legal and/or historical continuity where it doesn't exist? Because if not, I swear to you: I'll start an article called "America" and put absolutely everything in there, claiming continuity from the native american chieftains to the British King and the President of the United States. Sounds crazy? Well, so is this list! -- Eisenmaus ( talk) 22:11, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
What does it mean "acting" next to the names of Hans Luther and Walter Simons??? 95.35.228.144 ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 08:07, 30 March 2010 (UTC).
Should we include acting presidents in the main list? For the sake of completeness, I feel that we should. There is a separate table of acting presidents at the bottom of the page, but they are much easier to place if listed in their chronological place in the full list. I propose including them in the list like this. I suspect that RJFF may disagree. BartBassist ( talk) 21:52, 16 May 2012 (UTC)
Since between 1949 and 1990, there were more than one states in Germany, I figure that the third one should be included, so I did... Ericl ( talk) 01:29, 6 September 2011 (UTC)
The result of the proposal was move per request. I do see the point both sides are making on the "German presidents" vs. "of Germany", but discussion on that secondary issue is not extensive enough, so I suggest that if anyone feels strongly about it, a subsequent request should be made, where it can be focused on.-- Fuhghettaboutit ( talk) 23:58, 4 August 2010 (UTC)
List of German presidents since 1919 → List of German presidents — As a list of all German presidents, including the Weimar Republic, Nazi Germany, East and West Germany, and Germany after reunification, it doesn't seem necessary to include "since 1919" in the article title. Other than the listed individuals, there have been no other German presidents; before the end of the First World War, Germany was an empire, and before that there wasn't a unified German state. Compare this with List of Presidents of France, a list which comprises French presidents of multiple republics dating back to 1848, when the presidency was created. City of Destruction (The Celestial City) 01:02, 28 July 2010 (UTC) Support per nom. warrior 4321 05:34, 28 July 2010 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: not moved. Armbrust The Homunculus 07:40, 15 August 2014 (UTC)
List of German presidents → List of German Heads of State since 1919 – Hitler didn't use the title of president. 76.105.96.92 ( talk) 00:05, 8 August 2014 (UTC)
*'''Support'''
or *'''Oppose'''
, then sign your comment with ~~~~
. Since
polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account
Wikipedia's policy on article titles.Who is the current leader of German Mukama Patrick ( talk) 20:19, 10 November 2016 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved with uppercase President. ( closed by non-admin page mover) feminist ( talk) 07:20, 25 November 2018 (UTC)
– to match other list of presidents pages. עם ישראל חי ( talk) 19:35, 6 November 2018 (UTC) --Relisting. Steel1943 ( talk) 02:07, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:List of Presidents of Austria which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. — RMCD bot 12:46, 12 May 2019 (UTC)
Hitler was not a president!
No one calls Hitler a president, it's not even WP:COMMONNAME.
Altanner1991 ( talk) 02:39, 14 August 2020 (UTC)
I think these are useless because they're unsourced and it is hard to count across Nazism etc. They should simply be removed. Altanner1991 ( talk) 19:59, 14 August 2020 (UTC)
While the biographies of living persons policy does not apply directly to the subject of this article, it may contain material that relates to living persons, such as friends and family of persons no longer living, or living persons involved in the subject matter. Unsourced or poorly sourced contentious material about living persons must be removed immediately. If such material is re-inserted repeatedly, or if there are other concerns related to this policy, please see this noticeboard. |
![]() | This article is rated List-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
![]() | On 12 May 2019, it was proposed that this article be moved from List of Presidents of Germany to List of presidents of Germany. The result of the discussion was moved. |
I´m not happy with this problematic division of the list, because it suggests reunited germany is a new formed state. Formally in 1990 the six new states only joined the federal republic, which kept on existing as before (just like the united states remained the united states when new states joined the union). The subdivision in "Bonn Republic" and "Berlin Republic" is only a (very controversial!) historico-cultural narrative, which has no constitutional foundation (and the caesura would be 1999 and not 1990!). I would propose the following structure of the article:
Contents 1 Weimar Republic (1919–1933) 2 Nazi Germany (1933–1945) 3 German Democratic Republic (1949–1990) 4 Federal Republic (1949–present)
The old structure follows a false and unscientific conception of german history, that should not be supported in an encyclopedia. I hope, I find your agreement to revise the article in the proposed form. Alektor89 ( talk) 21:32, 15 August 2016 (UTC)
I don't think Hitler should be included in this list, because he abolished the title President. His official title translates into English as "Leader and Reich Chancellor" - "President" is nowhere to be seen. The page should be amended to suit this. 82.19.94.146
Although Hitler never claimed the office of Reich President, he did assume its duties following the merger of that office with that of Reich Chancellor (Reichskanzler) upon the death of Reichspräsident Paul von Hindenburg on 2 August 1934. After the merger of the two offices, a "Präsidialkanzlei" (Presidential Chancellery) under the direction of Staatsminister (Minister of State) Dr. Otto Meissner (who was formerly the top aide to von Hindenburg) was created to assist Hitler in the performance of his duties as head of the German state. Hitler was the German head of state de facto and de jure (due in part to the passage of the Enabling Act by the Reichstag in 1933, which authorized Hitler to, among other things, issue a law combining the offices of President and Chancellor) and it is therefore appropriate to include Hitler in this list, at least in mentioning the technical vacancy of the office of Reichspräsident between von Hindenburg's death in 1934 and the appointment of Karl Dönitz by Hitler in 1945. Cvieg 04:35, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
Who keeps changing the color of Hindenburg into dark red (communist)? The appropriate color for a conservative politician is blue.
Two points about recent events involving this article:
Iota ( talk) 02:02, 28 September 2009 (UTC)
Honestly people, this list makes absolutely no sense at all. Comparing a Reichspräsident to a Bundespräsident is just as moronic as comparing a Roman Emperor to a Holy Roman Emperor. Yes, the titles may sound similar, but they're so very much not the same. In fact the fathers (and mothers) of the modern day German constitution went to great length to make sure that a Bundespräsident had virtually nothing at all to do with a Reichspräsident, much like the modern day Bundeskanzler doesn't have a lot in common with his Reichskanzler predecessors. Furthermore no - and I can't stress this point enough - absolutely, completely, totally NO German constitutional expert would ever draw a line from the offices of the Weimar Republic to those of the Federal Republic of Germany (or, for that matter, those of the GDR). Why? Because the Weimar Republic and the Federal Republic of Germany are two completely different political entities with absolutely no ties whatsoever. So could somebody please stop creating legal and/or historical continuity where it doesn't exist? Because if not, I swear to you: I'll start an article called "America" and put absolutely everything in there, claiming continuity from the native american chieftains to the British King and the President of the United States. Sounds crazy? Well, so is this list! -- Eisenmaus ( talk) 22:11, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
What does it mean "acting" next to the names of Hans Luther and Walter Simons??? 95.35.228.144 ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 08:07, 30 March 2010 (UTC).
Should we include acting presidents in the main list? For the sake of completeness, I feel that we should. There is a separate table of acting presidents at the bottom of the page, but they are much easier to place if listed in their chronological place in the full list. I propose including them in the list like this. I suspect that RJFF may disagree. BartBassist ( talk) 21:52, 16 May 2012 (UTC)
Since between 1949 and 1990, there were more than one states in Germany, I figure that the third one should be included, so I did... Ericl ( talk) 01:29, 6 September 2011 (UTC)
The result of the proposal was move per request. I do see the point both sides are making on the "German presidents" vs. "of Germany", but discussion on that secondary issue is not extensive enough, so I suggest that if anyone feels strongly about it, a subsequent request should be made, where it can be focused on.-- Fuhghettaboutit ( talk) 23:58, 4 August 2010 (UTC)
List of German presidents since 1919 → List of German presidents — As a list of all German presidents, including the Weimar Republic, Nazi Germany, East and West Germany, and Germany after reunification, it doesn't seem necessary to include "since 1919" in the article title. Other than the listed individuals, there have been no other German presidents; before the end of the First World War, Germany was an empire, and before that there wasn't a unified German state. Compare this with List of Presidents of France, a list which comprises French presidents of multiple republics dating back to 1848, when the presidency was created. City of Destruction (The Celestial City) 01:02, 28 July 2010 (UTC) Support per nom. warrior 4321 05:34, 28 July 2010 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: not moved. Armbrust The Homunculus 07:40, 15 August 2014 (UTC)
List of German presidents → List of German Heads of State since 1919 – Hitler didn't use the title of president. 76.105.96.92 ( talk) 00:05, 8 August 2014 (UTC)
*'''Support'''
or *'''Oppose'''
, then sign your comment with ~~~~
. Since
polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account
Wikipedia's policy on article titles.Who is the current leader of German Mukama Patrick ( talk) 20:19, 10 November 2016 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved with uppercase President. ( closed by non-admin page mover) feminist ( talk) 07:20, 25 November 2018 (UTC)
– to match other list of presidents pages. עם ישראל חי ( talk) 19:35, 6 November 2018 (UTC) --Relisting. Steel1943 ( talk) 02:07, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:List of Presidents of Austria which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. — RMCD bot 12:46, 12 May 2019 (UTC)
Hitler was not a president!
No one calls Hitler a president, it's not even WP:COMMONNAME.
Altanner1991 ( talk) 02:39, 14 August 2020 (UTC)
I think these are useless because they're unsourced and it is hard to count across Nazism etc. They should simply be removed. Altanner1991 ( talk) 19:59, 14 August 2020 (UTC)