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![]() | The contents of the Jayne's Hat page were merged into List of Firefly (TV series) characters. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected page, please see its history; for the discussion at that location, see its talk page. |
Neither the Operative or Mr. Universe belong in this category since neither existed in the television series. Shsilver 21:26, 9 November 2005 (UTC)
— Jeff Q (talk) 23:42, 9 November 2005 (UTC)
I'm troubled by the current use of the moniker "Hands of Blue" for the blue-gloved men pursuing River and Simon. I am aware of no canonical source for this name. River's chant of "two by two, hands of blue" is obviously descriptive, but not obviously nominative. They might as well be referred to as the "Two by Twos" if we merely assume River's chant includes a proper name. Joss Whedon refers to them (in the " Train Job" DVD commentary) as "the men with blue hands" and "the blue-hands men", obviously not an actual name, unless the latter is assumed to be capitalized; i.e., the Blue-Hands Men, which I doubt. (There is no DVD commentary for " Ariel", the only other episode in which they appear. They don't appear in Serenity, and I don't believe they are named in the comics, either.) The only reliable source I've found so far for any name is IMDb, whose character listings for "The Train Job" and "Ariel" list them both as "Blue Glove", suggesting the appellation of "Blue Gloves" for the pair. Does anyone have any other canonical (i.e., non-fan) source for a name? ~ Jeff Q (talk) 05:18, 6 December 2005 (UTC)
To raise a question. In the Dark Horse graphic novel
Serenity: Those Left Behind it is revealed that the blue material of their gloves actually covers the torso of the blue-gloved blue-hands men; isn't there a source that says that blue material is the shield that makes them immune to their sonic weapon that killed others by hemmorhage in
Ariel?
Naaman Brown (
talk)
15:02, 2 August 2009 (UTC)
I'm sorry if my Firefly knowledge is getting rusty, but do we have a source for the following statement under Minor characters in Firefly#Nandi?
As best I recall, Nandi's death was not even explicitly connected to Inara's departure from Serenity, which seemed more a means to avoid complications with Mal. And I also don't recall her returning to Sihnon, just that she wound up at the Companion outpost shown in the film. Did I forget something in the comics, film, or film novelization? ~ Jeff Q (talk) 05:46, 11 January 2006 (UTC)
Re: Wikipedia:Notability_(fiction)#Fiction_in_Wikipedia
I believe a merger is in line with Wikipedia guidelines. -b 07:27, 16 January 2006 (UTC)
Unless anyone objects, I'm going to move this page to List of minor characters in Firefly, as that is the suggested name on WP:FICT. The Wookieepedian 23:13, 10 March 2006 (UTC)
Okay, at the end of the Operative's section it claims that the movie implies he is planning to commit suicide. That, it seems to me, is pure speculation. True, his mission in life has been completely destroyed, and many people would commit suicide rather than face a world that they feel offers them nothing (And that they can offer nothing to), but merely being a possibility doesn't mean that the film suggests it. There needs to be something more concrete than just him being disillusioned with life. 67.85.165.48 00:50, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
Yeah. Gotta chime in on this one. It was not implicitly stated the Operative's plans for suicide. However with the movie opening in on the Operative's discussions of the Japanese tradition of seppoku in regards to the failure of the scientists to maintain control over River Tam, the notion that following the movie he would commit suicide, or at the very least contemplate it, isn't just a natural assumption. It has been established as his "natural course" based on the Operative's previous statements. User:Smokachu (talk) 02:34, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
The second paragraph of the Operative's entry implies ("... an operative is an agent of the Alliance government.") that there are multiple Operatives. Is it explicitly stated anywhere that there is more than one, or only one Operative? -- Pentasyllabic 05:31, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
In Serenity, the doctor in the opening scene specifically says "an Operative", not "the Operative," meaning that the was only one of many. It's not definite evidence, but it's an implication, same as the entry. JBK405 05:39, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
76.179.230.4 ( talk) 05:09, 30 July 2008 (UTC)
Per Wikipedia:Mediation_Cabal/Cases/2008-01-09_List_of_characters_in_the_Firefly_universe and the lack of progress in most FF character articles (it's been more than four months), I'll trim&merge Hoban Washburne, Zoe Washburne, Jayne Cobb, Simon Tam and potentially Kaylee Frye (nine sources for three rather basic descriptions in the intro?) here as my time allows. – sgeureka t• c 07:40, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
This merger is idiotic. As soon as I have the time, every article will be reverted back. If anyone tries to fuck up wikipedia by merging again, I'll report it as vandalism. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.184.105.128 ( talk • contribs)
This merger is ridiculous... instead of having a group of good articles about the main characters, we have a humongous article made for the sake of mergist zealots who target every article related to quality popular culture.-- Gonzalo84 ( talk) 01:05, 18 May 2008 (UTC)
Need some consensus about this, so we don't keep changing it back and forth. In the episode, they do indeed say 'ident card'. However, this is slang for 'identification card'. For an encyclopaedic entry, my opinion is to have 'identification card'. I think this is the same as choosing to use 'universe over " 'verse" in the articles. We shouldn't use in-universe slang, even though by putting it in quotations it is made more acceptable and correct as opposed to having no quotations. Zybthranger ( talk) 13:49, 20 April 2008 (UTC)
I cannot see any merger discussion for this article, it appears to contain the fabled "real-world information" that those who hang around talking about notability dream about, so I'm not sure why it has been merged. I restored the article but Eusebeus had a short-lived attack of the TTN-itis, before changing his mind. Catchpole ( talk) 18:03, 23 April 2008 (UTC)
Rather unrelated to this other discussion, but that's twice now someone's been trying to insert speculation into Book's summary section. If anyone is reading this and thinking about doing the same, find some freakin' sources. Maratanos ( talk) 00:57, 3 July 2008 (UTC)
I hope I don't get anybody mad, but I removed the notability tag on this article. We already went over this quite recently and this article is, in fact, the result of a process of examining the notability of the subject. Any further cuts seem mighty dubious to me, since we would be left with no choice but to push all this information into the main article, which is already too long. Maratanos ( talk) 19:54, 2 June 2008 (UTC)
The entry for Mr. Universe says he is the second jewish character. Who is the first? -- Phoenix Hacker ( talk) 21:33, 7 June 2008 (UTC)
I think this is stupid as there is nothing to say that for instance most of the Chinese (aka everyone) are or are not Jewish or that jews even exist in this alternate future. Otherwise why not start a list of the Christians and Muslims and most importantly the Pastafarians or single out a particular character and examine what religion they are or are not. I think the religions of the Brown-coat universe would correlate to the Buffy-verse and that the bible (or Torah or Koran) is mythology except even more-so as this is the future aka startrek or starwars. tymes ( talk) 23:15, 14 July 2012 (UTC)
Re [1]
It's rather ambiguous as to what happened. Sure, she was on his ship, but we do know she's psychic, and there's only so much information one can deduce from another's living quarters. It'd be hard to be terribly accurate. Is there any official word on this one in the commentary or anything? Maratanos ( talk) 17:38, 2 July 2008 (UTC)
Re [2]
Needs a source. Sorry. Maratanos ( talk) 21:32, 5 July 2008 (UTC)
This article is packed with fancruft. I love the show but this is a bit much even for me. Do we really need the tidbit about Niska cutting off Mal's ear?? I think you could reconstruct the plot of every gorram episode with the amount of detail in this article.
Just sayin'. 99.154.3.177 ( talk) 02:38, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
Just sayin' as well... I think you picked the wrong example there. Niska cutting off Mal's ear is a quick and effective way just to show how malicious and amoral the man is. So I feel that point in particular to be relevant. However I do agree that far too much of these articles (and the individual character articles that once existed as well) is dedicated towards telling the entire plot of the show, ignoring Wikipedia's MO of a quick easy to read source of basic information. Smokachu ( talk) 02:53, 12 August 2011 (UTC)
Shouldn't we mention that Inara frequently participates in a form of state-sanctioned prostitution? Calling her merely a courtesan and entertainer might be misleading. 59.92.54.117 ( talk) 13:29, 18 August 2009 (UTC)
Why is Xiang Yu linked (and disclaimed)? The script of "War Stories" has Shan Yu and describes him as a 'dictator', not an ancient military commander. I assumed he's in our future. — Tamfang ( talk) 05:28, 9 March 2010 (UTC)
Saffron is known by multiple aliases, but they didn't each need their own section, and the circular loop they were put in was unnecessary. I've removed the extra sections. Both extra names are available with explanations in the Saffron section. —Preceding unsigned comment added by SeanBrockest ( talk • contribs) 15:50, 26 March 2010 (UTC)
"occasionally laconic sense of humor." I see what you did there... Thank you, whomever added that line! RandomLurker ( talk) 18:41, 27 July 2011 (UTC)
I'm wondering if some sort of acknowledgement ought to be made that Inara's choice to be aboard Serenity is unusual. If I recall correctly, at at least one point she's questioned about why she's on such a ship. Jennadorf ( talk) 07:32, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
![]() | This article is rated List-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
![]() | The contents of the Jayne's Hat page were merged into List of Firefly (TV series) characters. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected page, please see its history; for the discussion at that location, see its talk page. |
Neither the Operative or Mr. Universe belong in this category since neither existed in the television series. Shsilver 21:26, 9 November 2005 (UTC)
— Jeff Q (talk) 23:42, 9 November 2005 (UTC)
I'm troubled by the current use of the moniker "Hands of Blue" for the blue-gloved men pursuing River and Simon. I am aware of no canonical source for this name. River's chant of "two by two, hands of blue" is obviously descriptive, but not obviously nominative. They might as well be referred to as the "Two by Twos" if we merely assume River's chant includes a proper name. Joss Whedon refers to them (in the " Train Job" DVD commentary) as "the men with blue hands" and "the blue-hands men", obviously not an actual name, unless the latter is assumed to be capitalized; i.e., the Blue-Hands Men, which I doubt. (There is no DVD commentary for " Ariel", the only other episode in which they appear. They don't appear in Serenity, and I don't believe they are named in the comics, either.) The only reliable source I've found so far for any name is IMDb, whose character listings for "The Train Job" and "Ariel" list them both as "Blue Glove", suggesting the appellation of "Blue Gloves" for the pair. Does anyone have any other canonical (i.e., non-fan) source for a name? ~ Jeff Q (talk) 05:18, 6 December 2005 (UTC)
To raise a question. In the Dark Horse graphic novel
Serenity: Those Left Behind it is revealed that the blue material of their gloves actually covers the torso of the blue-gloved blue-hands men; isn't there a source that says that blue material is the shield that makes them immune to their sonic weapon that killed others by hemmorhage in
Ariel?
Naaman Brown (
talk)
15:02, 2 August 2009 (UTC)
I'm sorry if my Firefly knowledge is getting rusty, but do we have a source for the following statement under Minor characters in Firefly#Nandi?
As best I recall, Nandi's death was not even explicitly connected to Inara's departure from Serenity, which seemed more a means to avoid complications with Mal. And I also don't recall her returning to Sihnon, just that she wound up at the Companion outpost shown in the film. Did I forget something in the comics, film, or film novelization? ~ Jeff Q (talk) 05:46, 11 January 2006 (UTC)
Re: Wikipedia:Notability_(fiction)#Fiction_in_Wikipedia
I believe a merger is in line with Wikipedia guidelines. -b 07:27, 16 January 2006 (UTC)
Unless anyone objects, I'm going to move this page to List of minor characters in Firefly, as that is the suggested name on WP:FICT. The Wookieepedian 23:13, 10 March 2006 (UTC)
Okay, at the end of the Operative's section it claims that the movie implies he is planning to commit suicide. That, it seems to me, is pure speculation. True, his mission in life has been completely destroyed, and many people would commit suicide rather than face a world that they feel offers them nothing (And that they can offer nothing to), but merely being a possibility doesn't mean that the film suggests it. There needs to be something more concrete than just him being disillusioned with life. 67.85.165.48 00:50, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
Yeah. Gotta chime in on this one. It was not implicitly stated the Operative's plans for suicide. However with the movie opening in on the Operative's discussions of the Japanese tradition of seppoku in regards to the failure of the scientists to maintain control over River Tam, the notion that following the movie he would commit suicide, or at the very least contemplate it, isn't just a natural assumption. It has been established as his "natural course" based on the Operative's previous statements. User:Smokachu (talk) 02:34, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
The second paragraph of the Operative's entry implies ("... an operative is an agent of the Alliance government.") that there are multiple Operatives. Is it explicitly stated anywhere that there is more than one, or only one Operative? -- Pentasyllabic 05:31, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
In Serenity, the doctor in the opening scene specifically says "an Operative", not "the Operative," meaning that the was only one of many. It's not definite evidence, but it's an implication, same as the entry. JBK405 05:39, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
76.179.230.4 ( talk) 05:09, 30 July 2008 (UTC)
Per Wikipedia:Mediation_Cabal/Cases/2008-01-09_List_of_characters_in_the_Firefly_universe and the lack of progress in most FF character articles (it's been more than four months), I'll trim&merge Hoban Washburne, Zoe Washburne, Jayne Cobb, Simon Tam and potentially Kaylee Frye (nine sources for three rather basic descriptions in the intro?) here as my time allows. – sgeureka t• c 07:40, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
This merger is idiotic. As soon as I have the time, every article will be reverted back. If anyone tries to fuck up wikipedia by merging again, I'll report it as vandalism. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.184.105.128 ( talk • contribs)
This merger is ridiculous... instead of having a group of good articles about the main characters, we have a humongous article made for the sake of mergist zealots who target every article related to quality popular culture.-- Gonzalo84 ( talk) 01:05, 18 May 2008 (UTC)
Need some consensus about this, so we don't keep changing it back and forth. In the episode, they do indeed say 'ident card'. However, this is slang for 'identification card'. For an encyclopaedic entry, my opinion is to have 'identification card'. I think this is the same as choosing to use 'universe over " 'verse" in the articles. We shouldn't use in-universe slang, even though by putting it in quotations it is made more acceptable and correct as opposed to having no quotations. Zybthranger ( talk) 13:49, 20 April 2008 (UTC)
I cannot see any merger discussion for this article, it appears to contain the fabled "real-world information" that those who hang around talking about notability dream about, so I'm not sure why it has been merged. I restored the article but Eusebeus had a short-lived attack of the TTN-itis, before changing his mind. Catchpole ( talk) 18:03, 23 April 2008 (UTC)
Rather unrelated to this other discussion, but that's twice now someone's been trying to insert speculation into Book's summary section. If anyone is reading this and thinking about doing the same, find some freakin' sources. Maratanos ( talk) 00:57, 3 July 2008 (UTC)
I hope I don't get anybody mad, but I removed the notability tag on this article. We already went over this quite recently and this article is, in fact, the result of a process of examining the notability of the subject. Any further cuts seem mighty dubious to me, since we would be left with no choice but to push all this information into the main article, which is already too long. Maratanos ( talk) 19:54, 2 June 2008 (UTC)
The entry for Mr. Universe says he is the second jewish character. Who is the first? -- Phoenix Hacker ( talk) 21:33, 7 June 2008 (UTC)
I think this is stupid as there is nothing to say that for instance most of the Chinese (aka everyone) are or are not Jewish or that jews even exist in this alternate future. Otherwise why not start a list of the Christians and Muslims and most importantly the Pastafarians or single out a particular character and examine what religion they are or are not. I think the religions of the Brown-coat universe would correlate to the Buffy-verse and that the bible (or Torah or Koran) is mythology except even more-so as this is the future aka startrek or starwars. tymes ( talk) 23:15, 14 July 2012 (UTC)
Re [1]
It's rather ambiguous as to what happened. Sure, she was on his ship, but we do know she's psychic, and there's only so much information one can deduce from another's living quarters. It'd be hard to be terribly accurate. Is there any official word on this one in the commentary or anything? Maratanos ( talk) 17:38, 2 July 2008 (UTC)
Re [2]
Needs a source. Sorry. Maratanos ( talk) 21:32, 5 July 2008 (UTC)
This article is packed with fancruft. I love the show but this is a bit much even for me. Do we really need the tidbit about Niska cutting off Mal's ear?? I think you could reconstruct the plot of every gorram episode with the amount of detail in this article.
Just sayin'. 99.154.3.177 ( talk) 02:38, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
Just sayin' as well... I think you picked the wrong example there. Niska cutting off Mal's ear is a quick and effective way just to show how malicious and amoral the man is. So I feel that point in particular to be relevant. However I do agree that far too much of these articles (and the individual character articles that once existed as well) is dedicated towards telling the entire plot of the show, ignoring Wikipedia's MO of a quick easy to read source of basic information. Smokachu ( talk) 02:53, 12 August 2011 (UTC)
Shouldn't we mention that Inara frequently participates in a form of state-sanctioned prostitution? Calling her merely a courtesan and entertainer might be misleading. 59.92.54.117 ( talk) 13:29, 18 August 2009 (UTC)
Why is Xiang Yu linked (and disclaimed)? The script of "War Stories" has Shan Yu and describes him as a 'dictator', not an ancient military commander. I assumed he's in our future. — Tamfang ( talk) 05:28, 9 March 2010 (UTC)
Saffron is known by multiple aliases, but they didn't each need their own section, and the circular loop they were put in was unnecessary. I've removed the extra sections. Both extra names are available with explanations in the Saffron section. —Preceding unsigned comment added by SeanBrockest ( talk • contribs) 15:50, 26 March 2010 (UTC)
"occasionally laconic sense of humor." I see what you did there... Thank you, whomever added that line! RandomLurker ( talk) 18:41, 27 July 2011 (UTC)
I'm wondering if some sort of acknowledgement ought to be made that Inara's choice to be aboard Serenity is unusual. If I recall correctly, at at least one point she's questioned about why she's on such a ship. Jennadorf ( talk) 07:32, 22 March 2015 (UTC)