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Appearing on American Idol after being expelled from BJU doesn't make one notable--not even in Greenville, although there was a short piece on him this week in the Greenville News that didn't mention BJU. Sligh is certainly no "rock star." Someone said of Zsa Zsa Gabor that she was famous for being famous. Wait a bit; if Sligh survives on American Idol, he may become "notable," at least by the Zha Zha Gabor standard.-- John Foxe 14:50, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
Chris Sligh's former affiliation with the university was mentioned repeatedly by Greenville's Fox station and WHNS. It also merited an hour's worth of discussion on the SC Upstate's most popular talk radio program, the Ralph Bristol Show. A review of American Idol commentators shows that Chris is the current favorite, and the judges' comments late last year indicate that Sligh has made a significant impression on them, as well. But I agree, we can wait until at least after Hollywood. ExpectantCloisterance 22:34, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
I find it interesting that a gay porno star can remain as a notable non-graduate but a talented young man who is definately notable (whether he wins or not..he's already made his mark on the US and you can't argue with that) to a number of people is constantly deleted. Surely the fact that in the last 24 hours at least 5 people have tried to add him to the list is enough to convince you that he's noteworthy. ge
John Foxe: I'm fascinated! Apparently you are blessed with an all knowing sense of what is fact and what is mere opinion. Isn't it as much a matter of opinion that you seem to think Chris is not notable? Let's examine the facts: According to MSNBC, over 25% of the nearly 16,000 people that voted think Chris is notable. Take a minute out of your obsession with Wikipedia and check out some of the many fan sites cropping up all over the internet. While I agree that subjective statements like "Chris Sligh, the totally rad future American Idol (or something like that)" should not be on a Wikipedia site, objective statements like "Chris Sligh, former student, contestant on the popular TV show American Idol, recognized by many top news sites as having exceptional talent" should be allowed. While you personally may not believe he is notable, the fact of the matter is, a good deal of America thinks he is. I personally don't find several of the people on the page notable. I spent four years of my life at the school and happen to have a good idea who from my school is notable and who is not. I don't find a porn star to be notable: I find it to be disgusting but you don't see me deleting his name. Why? Because I know that someone out there found him to be of some note, and as the statement was objective and I suppose the guy was somewhat famous, he has as much a right to be considered a notable non-graduate as the next guy. Now, I'm not sure who made you the Wiki-police, but please be aware that people will continue to add Chris as a notable non-grad so you might as well give it up and realize that you've been out opinioned. My recommendation for you?..get your panties out of a twist, log off your wiki account for once and kick back Tuesday night and vote for Chris Sligh. You might actually enjoy yourself. Your fan and avid devotee, ge
Dearest John Foxe: answer me just this one question: did you attend BJU? Actually I lied, I have a couple of questions. What is your obsession with the BJU page? Why are you so naturally disposed to being negative? Is there some rule on Wikipedia that anyone named under a particular article must have his or her own article? Now, I think the community has already decided who the vandal is, especially since over on facebook we're having a rip roaring time laughing at your rather OCD tendencies concerning the BJU article on Wiki. In fact, I think we might just create a fan group just for you...but forgive me, I digress. The fact of the matter still remains that we are breaking no rules by posting factual information concerning Chris Sligh. As Wikipedia is a sort of webpage for the masses, we have as much right to add Chris Sligh as whoever added Billy Graham or our dearly beloved porn star did. I have quite a few other things to say concerning you personally but I'm afraid they are far to subjective to mention in this particular venue so I'll save them for facebook. Cheers friend. I hope you have a fabulous evening. If Jack Bauer isn't notable enough to divert you from Wikipedia for an hour then I'm afraid there is no hope for you. yours, ge
You didn't answer my question: did you attend BJU? But then, I noticed you also conveniently bypassed that question on another discussion up there which means you probably don't want to admit that you have even less credibility in dealing with the Bob Jones University page than you already think you have. Stop avoiding the question Foxe: Did you attend Bob Jones University? I'll be honest with you, I'm not going to lose any sleep if Chris Sligh doesn't manage to remain on this particular site. The main reason I've even been pressing this issue is b/c of the rules you seem to create on a whim so that the BJU page can remain just as you want it to be. The reason I really want to know if you were even a student is b/c if you weren't, you really should leave the editing of this page up to people who actually know the school. If you were, I'd really like to know why you consider yourself the living expert on Bob Jones University and the sole editor of it's wiki page. This website is a public website, to be edited by the public. Like the person above me pointed out, there are others on the page without their own articles. There are others on a LOT of pages on wikipedia that don't have their own articles. There is a statement just below this box that says "encyclopedic content must be verifiable". What we have been trying to add IS verifiable...we can produce quotes from many well known news sites that by their mere existence prove the fact that Chris is notable. That, plus the fact that he is undeniably a former student of Bob Jones= notable non-graduate. Please take a good look at the reasons you are so adamant that he in particular should not remain on the site b/c they really don't jive with the basic premise of Wikipedia. You have singlehandedly decided to commandeer a bit of cyberspace that doesn't really belong to you and you need to loosen your grasp and allow other well informed people to make additions. g.e.
add to the people without articles: Emery Bopp (a dearly beloved former teacher of mine who just passed away) and Mr. Koons. Both most definately notable as they have been published and had their work shown nationally and internationally. Yet still without articles. The article argument is completely invalid. Anyway, I see the solution to the problem seems to be to delete notable non grads altogether. I suppose that's one method of having the last word, however you still have several categories full of article-less people. ge
Well said. Mr. "Foxe", perhaps the reason none of us has created a bio yet is because most of us have lives and don't have as much time on our hands as you seem to have to create bios for anyone and everyone on Wikipedia. Now I know your retort is going to be "well, you seem to have enough time to come on here and post..", and my answer to that is, quite honestly it takes about 1 minute to write a fairly decent rebuttal to your highly illogical and contradictory statements. 1. there is no rule about having to have an article 2. you have no right to be the sole editor of this page. 3. you proved by your statement that Chris was "crass and pandering" that this is no more than a personal thing for you. You quite obviously have something against Chris and it is him and him alone you don't want to see on this page (the whole article argument aside). 4. you refuse to acknowledge whether you actually attended the University and by doing so, lose credibility with the many alumnists who are taking part in this discussion. To be honest, I'm getting to the point of researching how to report you because your actions are that of a vandal, not someone dedicated to maintaining the integrity of this page. ge
Those who have been at the school in recent years, is there really any doubt in your minds as to who "John Foxe" is? I think it is blantently obvious myself. As a current student though, this has definately been an interesting read. But these are the kinds of things that make the school look foolish to people though. The One who the school is trying to reflect never ran around the world trying to be an undercover cop. His focus was solely above, and not on what people perceived Him as. I hope one day the school can focus solely in that direction, and not live being paranoid about what people think of them. Focusing on the former, takes care of the latter. Stop pointing around, point up; and watch how that takes care of your orginal problem. Jumper222 22:05, 22 February 2007 (UTC) word!
This discussion is pretty nasty. But then again, so are JohnFoxe's tactics. I can't imagine how much of his time has been consumed by this debate. Is it really worth it? JohnFoxe, you should consider this before you again delete Chris Sligh's name from the BJU wiki. Because of American Idol Chris Sligh is more famous than BJU. Yes, more people know about Chris Sligh than know about BJU. He is discussed on radio shows spanning the nation; websites around the world; even TV sets around the world. There are people in the UK who are watching American Idol this season because of Chris Sligh. These facts are more than enough reason to consider Chris Sligh 'notable.' Dsiglin 03:30, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
All I've asked for is a Wikipedia bio for Sligh that can pass the AfD test. Once over that hurdle, so far as I'm concerned, Sligh will be a worthy addition to the BJU page. Until then, no.-- John Foxe 10:41, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
Well that's just it isn't it then... WHO CARES WHAT "YOU" ASK FOR!!! You are NOT the executive branch of Wikipedia! The one thing positive in all of this mess is that about a dozen or so people have taken it upon themselves to learn the "ins and outs" of Wikipedia as well as can be known. People that have chosen to study the site and become smartly enabled to work within its confines. The terrible thing is that the motivation for this comes from a user named JohnFoxe who has abandoned that system and continuously DEMANDS that the world of wiki recognize HIS autohity, which in reality is moot. Quote "All I've asked for..." and "so far as I'm concerned" John Foxe has actually argued against himself and won with this statement "I'll lose by an overwhelming margin." Here is the issue... is Chris Sligh "notable" enough to be listed as a "Notable student (non-gradutate)" here on the BJU page. The overwhelming majority of persons here believe so, the overwheming evidence of his appearance in the national media testifies to his notability... yet one vocal minority says no, or at least "only on MY terms." You have no legitimate terms to enforce JohnFoxe. I have requested a review of this debate by Saxifrage. Thank you for your time again and hopefully this will be resolved soon. ~~FedUpWithJohnFoxe~~
Its a sad day when we are before the Throne of God and have to give an account of how we spent the time he gave us on this forum. John Foxe: humble thyself as if you are humbling to the Lord. nobojo: God will not be mocked. EddieTure: humble thyself and trust in the Lord, let no vain or foolish talk proceed out of your mouth, but only what is eddifying... To the all: Lets leave the pettiness that is unacceptable before the Lord. John Foxe, if you would like to be a martyr, then I suggest serving Christ in a foreign mission field where you may better serve Him then your own selfishness. EddieTure 18:06, 24 February 2007 (UTC)
John Foxe you wouldn't happen to be that guy who got banned a while back for removing historically accurate facts about BJU because your view was they painted the university as racist even though the lines only stated facts and not editorial opinion. Whom also is on the BJU quasi administration with a title like "public relations officer" because you were pretty quick to recognize the BJU IP address. I hope you didn't get that rule made banning wiki or got a student kicked out for that comment. JP . 66.169.43.61 04:17, 26 March 2007 (UTC) BJU student for total disclosure
To continue the discussion about American Idol contestant Chris Sligh and what constitutes "notability" for this page: It is my contention that Sligh requires a Wikipedia bio that can pass the AfD test before he is listed here as a former student. The Wikipedia community needs to make the decision about whether this TV show contestant is "notable" or just fleetingly well known; and such a decision can only be made after a full biography is presented to the community for its consideration. Once over the AfD hurdle, so far as I'm concerned, Sligh would be a worthy addition to the BJU page. I might add that I have never met Sligh, never heard him sing, and have no personal animosity towards the young man.
Yes, there are people on this list who do not have Wiki bios. I have grandfathered in everyone who was on the previous list. Virtually all of these individuals (barring a couple of the donors and two or three of the state legislators) are worthy of their own Wikipedia articles. Nevertheless, there are no "former students (non-graduates)" who do not have their own Wiki bios. I believe that if would be wise to maintain that standard for this category. As a practical matter, it's easier to keep out someone's uncle or the local fruit-and-nut bar if there is a standard to which Wikipedians can appeal.-- John Foxe 23:36, 24 February 2007 (UTC)
Sorry John Foxe, your "removed Sligh until he has a proper Wiki bio" mantra is getting old. As of March 9 Chris has a genuine, bona fide wikipedia bio. ( Barang 20:52, 11 March 2007 (UTC))
Please do not assume ownership of articles such as List of notable people associated with Bob Jones University. If you aren't willing to allow your contributions to be edited extensively or be redistributed by others, please do not submit them. Thank you.— Emote Talk Page 18:24, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
I will use all my obstructive powers to prevent the inclusion of Chris Sligh's name here until he has a proper Wiki bio. All I've asked for is a Wikipedia bio that can pass the AfD test. Once over that hurdle, so far as I'm concerned, Sligh will be a worthy addition to the BJU page. Here's the scenario. You write a bio for Sligh. I'll slap an AfD tag on it and propose deletion. You gather a group of like minded folks to vote "keep." I'll lose by an overwhelming margin. Sligh has his Wiki bio. I will no longer obstruct his name being listed here. The End.--John Foxe 11:16, 22 February 2007 (UTC)
What I am defending is a standard by which additional names can be added to the BJU list of "Former Students (Non-Graduates)." Future additions can only be personal preference unless there is a standard for inclusion, and a reasonable one is that a suggested addition have his own Wiki-bio. You are correct in assuming that I "don't really care whether Sligh is on the page or not." I don't and never have. I have been interested in establishing a standard for this list.
I have no martyr complex. I have suffered no oppression. I've won. I promised to fight the inclusion of Chris Sligh's name on this list until he had a Wikipedia bio that could pass AfD, and I've kept my word. He now has a Wiki-bio, and it will shortly pass AfD.-- John Foxe 11:02, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
I have no interest in deleting Sligh's name from the list. The community has spoken, which is what I intended from the beginning. Here's what I wrote almost a month ago.
I will use all my obstructive powers to prevent the inclusion of Chris Sligh's name here until he has a proper Wiki bio. All I've asked for is a Wikipedia bio that can pass the AfD test. Once over that hurdle, so far as I'm concerned, Sligh will be a worthy addition to the BJU page. Here's the scenario. You write a bio for Sligh. I'll slap an AfD tag on it and propose deletion. You gather a group of like minded folks to vote "keep." I'll lose by an overwhelming margin. Sligh has his Wiki bio. I will no longer obstruct his name being listed here. The End.--John Foxe 11:16, 22 February 2007 (UTC)
I am a man of my word. Nevertheless, if another person without a Wiki-bio is proposed for this list, I will follow exactly the same course as I have done in this case.-- John Foxe 13:30, 16 March 2007 (UTC)
John Foxe you wouldn't happen to be that guy who got banned a while back for removing historically accurate facts about BJU because your view was they painted the university as racist even though the lines only stated facts and not editorial opinion. Whom also is on the BJU quasi administration with a title like "public relations officer" because you were pretty quick to recognize the BJU IP address. I hope you didn't get that rule made banning wiki or got a student kicked out for that comment. JP.
66.169.43.61
04:21, 26 March 2007 (UTC) BJU student for total disclosure.
I have removed the following notables from the lists, although with every belief that these gentlemen belong on them. In my opinion, it is important that there be some objective criterion for being added to the list of "notable graduates" or "notable honorary degree recipients," especially because BJU is so controversial, and that that criterion should be a Wikipedia biography that can withstand an AFD challenge. I'll continue to watch this list, and if biographies appear, I'll add them back to the proper list. I'll even try to put together some biographies myself as I have opportunity.-- John Foxe 19:06, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
John Foxe ( talk) 20:47, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
John Foxe ( talk) 20:48, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
References
Mary Lamb was recognized by Cambridge's Who's Who. She is on BJU's faculty. [1] -- 158.158.240.230 ( talk) 20:23, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
Wayne Mouritzen
Wayne Mouritzen was a noteable and beloved GAY -- the word "homosexual" to denote a person is out of fashion and considered both pejorative and offensive by most gay people -- alumnus of Bob Jones University. The controversy that surrounded his ban letter from campus (and the University's subsequent partial recanting) is a part of Bob Jones University's legacy, particularly since this is an ongoing pattern the university deploys with its gay students and alumni, as you are no doubt aware. Please consult the meaning of the word "encyclopedia." To claim that factual information that gives a more complete picture of the subject at hand is "not encyclopedic" is to ignore the etymology of the very word itself: "complete knowledge." Brodacious ( talk) 22:42, 4 March 2014 (UTC)
David R. Anderson
David is rector of one of the largest Episcopal congregations in the United States. Regardless that he does not currently have a wikipedia page himself, he meets the definition of a noteworthy person. He is far more noteworthy (and influential), then Jamie Langston Turner, for example, who is a lovely person, nonetheless. http://www.saintlukesdarien.org/content.cfm?id=149&member_id=18
Brodacious ( talk) 22:55, 4 March 2014 (UTC)
We've been through this business a number of times before, although not recently. There needs to be some objective measure of what notable means. I didn't establish the "red link" standard, but it's a good one. I'll be glad to go with you to some Wikipedia mediation forum if you wish. Note that there are some redlinked BJU grads in the comments above for whom no one has yet written Wikipedia biographies. I'd encourage you to add Mouritzen and Anderson to that list—even to write your own AfD-proof bios for them-- John Foxe ( talk) 23:17, 4 March 2014 (UTC)
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Appearing on American Idol after being expelled from BJU doesn't make one notable--not even in Greenville, although there was a short piece on him this week in the Greenville News that didn't mention BJU. Sligh is certainly no "rock star." Someone said of Zsa Zsa Gabor that she was famous for being famous. Wait a bit; if Sligh survives on American Idol, he may become "notable," at least by the Zha Zha Gabor standard.-- John Foxe 14:50, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
Chris Sligh's former affiliation with the university was mentioned repeatedly by Greenville's Fox station and WHNS. It also merited an hour's worth of discussion on the SC Upstate's most popular talk radio program, the Ralph Bristol Show. A review of American Idol commentators shows that Chris is the current favorite, and the judges' comments late last year indicate that Sligh has made a significant impression on them, as well. But I agree, we can wait until at least after Hollywood. ExpectantCloisterance 22:34, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
I find it interesting that a gay porno star can remain as a notable non-graduate but a talented young man who is definately notable (whether he wins or not..he's already made his mark on the US and you can't argue with that) to a number of people is constantly deleted. Surely the fact that in the last 24 hours at least 5 people have tried to add him to the list is enough to convince you that he's noteworthy. ge
John Foxe: I'm fascinated! Apparently you are blessed with an all knowing sense of what is fact and what is mere opinion. Isn't it as much a matter of opinion that you seem to think Chris is not notable? Let's examine the facts: According to MSNBC, over 25% of the nearly 16,000 people that voted think Chris is notable. Take a minute out of your obsession with Wikipedia and check out some of the many fan sites cropping up all over the internet. While I agree that subjective statements like "Chris Sligh, the totally rad future American Idol (or something like that)" should not be on a Wikipedia site, objective statements like "Chris Sligh, former student, contestant on the popular TV show American Idol, recognized by many top news sites as having exceptional talent" should be allowed. While you personally may not believe he is notable, the fact of the matter is, a good deal of America thinks he is. I personally don't find several of the people on the page notable. I spent four years of my life at the school and happen to have a good idea who from my school is notable and who is not. I don't find a porn star to be notable: I find it to be disgusting but you don't see me deleting his name. Why? Because I know that someone out there found him to be of some note, and as the statement was objective and I suppose the guy was somewhat famous, he has as much a right to be considered a notable non-graduate as the next guy. Now, I'm not sure who made you the Wiki-police, but please be aware that people will continue to add Chris as a notable non-grad so you might as well give it up and realize that you've been out opinioned. My recommendation for you?..get your panties out of a twist, log off your wiki account for once and kick back Tuesday night and vote for Chris Sligh. You might actually enjoy yourself. Your fan and avid devotee, ge
Dearest John Foxe: answer me just this one question: did you attend BJU? Actually I lied, I have a couple of questions. What is your obsession with the BJU page? Why are you so naturally disposed to being negative? Is there some rule on Wikipedia that anyone named under a particular article must have his or her own article? Now, I think the community has already decided who the vandal is, especially since over on facebook we're having a rip roaring time laughing at your rather OCD tendencies concerning the BJU article on Wiki. In fact, I think we might just create a fan group just for you...but forgive me, I digress. The fact of the matter still remains that we are breaking no rules by posting factual information concerning Chris Sligh. As Wikipedia is a sort of webpage for the masses, we have as much right to add Chris Sligh as whoever added Billy Graham or our dearly beloved porn star did. I have quite a few other things to say concerning you personally but I'm afraid they are far to subjective to mention in this particular venue so I'll save them for facebook. Cheers friend. I hope you have a fabulous evening. If Jack Bauer isn't notable enough to divert you from Wikipedia for an hour then I'm afraid there is no hope for you. yours, ge
You didn't answer my question: did you attend BJU? But then, I noticed you also conveniently bypassed that question on another discussion up there which means you probably don't want to admit that you have even less credibility in dealing with the Bob Jones University page than you already think you have. Stop avoiding the question Foxe: Did you attend Bob Jones University? I'll be honest with you, I'm not going to lose any sleep if Chris Sligh doesn't manage to remain on this particular site. The main reason I've even been pressing this issue is b/c of the rules you seem to create on a whim so that the BJU page can remain just as you want it to be. The reason I really want to know if you were even a student is b/c if you weren't, you really should leave the editing of this page up to people who actually know the school. If you were, I'd really like to know why you consider yourself the living expert on Bob Jones University and the sole editor of it's wiki page. This website is a public website, to be edited by the public. Like the person above me pointed out, there are others on the page without their own articles. There are others on a LOT of pages on wikipedia that don't have their own articles. There is a statement just below this box that says "encyclopedic content must be verifiable". What we have been trying to add IS verifiable...we can produce quotes from many well known news sites that by their mere existence prove the fact that Chris is notable. That, plus the fact that he is undeniably a former student of Bob Jones= notable non-graduate. Please take a good look at the reasons you are so adamant that he in particular should not remain on the site b/c they really don't jive with the basic premise of Wikipedia. You have singlehandedly decided to commandeer a bit of cyberspace that doesn't really belong to you and you need to loosen your grasp and allow other well informed people to make additions. g.e.
add to the people without articles: Emery Bopp (a dearly beloved former teacher of mine who just passed away) and Mr. Koons. Both most definately notable as they have been published and had their work shown nationally and internationally. Yet still without articles. The article argument is completely invalid. Anyway, I see the solution to the problem seems to be to delete notable non grads altogether. I suppose that's one method of having the last word, however you still have several categories full of article-less people. ge
Well said. Mr. "Foxe", perhaps the reason none of us has created a bio yet is because most of us have lives and don't have as much time on our hands as you seem to have to create bios for anyone and everyone on Wikipedia. Now I know your retort is going to be "well, you seem to have enough time to come on here and post..", and my answer to that is, quite honestly it takes about 1 minute to write a fairly decent rebuttal to your highly illogical and contradictory statements. 1. there is no rule about having to have an article 2. you have no right to be the sole editor of this page. 3. you proved by your statement that Chris was "crass and pandering" that this is no more than a personal thing for you. You quite obviously have something against Chris and it is him and him alone you don't want to see on this page (the whole article argument aside). 4. you refuse to acknowledge whether you actually attended the University and by doing so, lose credibility with the many alumnists who are taking part in this discussion. To be honest, I'm getting to the point of researching how to report you because your actions are that of a vandal, not someone dedicated to maintaining the integrity of this page. ge
Those who have been at the school in recent years, is there really any doubt in your minds as to who "John Foxe" is? I think it is blantently obvious myself. As a current student though, this has definately been an interesting read. But these are the kinds of things that make the school look foolish to people though. The One who the school is trying to reflect never ran around the world trying to be an undercover cop. His focus was solely above, and not on what people perceived Him as. I hope one day the school can focus solely in that direction, and not live being paranoid about what people think of them. Focusing on the former, takes care of the latter. Stop pointing around, point up; and watch how that takes care of your orginal problem. Jumper222 22:05, 22 February 2007 (UTC) word!
This discussion is pretty nasty. But then again, so are JohnFoxe's tactics. I can't imagine how much of his time has been consumed by this debate. Is it really worth it? JohnFoxe, you should consider this before you again delete Chris Sligh's name from the BJU wiki. Because of American Idol Chris Sligh is more famous than BJU. Yes, more people know about Chris Sligh than know about BJU. He is discussed on radio shows spanning the nation; websites around the world; even TV sets around the world. There are people in the UK who are watching American Idol this season because of Chris Sligh. These facts are more than enough reason to consider Chris Sligh 'notable.' Dsiglin 03:30, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
All I've asked for is a Wikipedia bio for Sligh that can pass the AfD test. Once over that hurdle, so far as I'm concerned, Sligh will be a worthy addition to the BJU page. Until then, no.-- John Foxe 10:41, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
Well that's just it isn't it then... WHO CARES WHAT "YOU" ASK FOR!!! You are NOT the executive branch of Wikipedia! The one thing positive in all of this mess is that about a dozen or so people have taken it upon themselves to learn the "ins and outs" of Wikipedia as well as can be known. People that have chosen to study the site and become smartly enabled to work within its confines. The terrible thing is that the motivation for this comes from a user named JohnFoxe who has abandoned that system and continuously DEMANDS that the world of wiki recognize HIS autohity, which in reality is moot. Quote "All I've asked for..." and "so far as I'm concerned" John Foxe has actually argued against himself and won with this statement "I'll lose by an overwhelming margin." Here is the issue... is Chris Sligh "notable" enough to be listed as a "Notable student (non-gradutate)" here on the BJU page. The overwhelming majority of persons here believe so, the overwheming evidence of his appearance in the national media testifies to his notability... yet one vocal minority says no, or at least "only on MY terms." You have no legitimate terms to enforce JohnFoxe. I have requested a review of this debate by Saxifrage. Thank you for your time again and hopefully this will be resolved soon. ~~FedUpWithJohnFoxe~~
Its a sad day when we are before the Throne of God and have to give an account of how we spent the time he gave us on this forum. John Foxe: humble thyself as if you are humbling to the Lord. nobojo: God will not be mocked. EddieTure: humble thyself and trust in the Lord, let no vain or foolish talk proceed out of your mouth, but only what is eddifying... To the all: Lets leave the pettiness that is unacceptable before the Lord. John Foxe, if you would like to be a martyr, then I suggest serving Christ in a foreign mission field where you may better serve Him then your own selfishness. EddieTure 18:06, 24 February 2007 (UTC)
John Foxe you wouldn't happen to be that guy who got banned a while back for removing historically accurate facts about BJU because your view was they painted the university as racist even though the lines only stated facts and not editorial opinion. Whom also is on the BJU quasi administration with a title like "public relations officer" because you were pretty quick to recognize the BJU IP address. I hope you didn't get that rule made banning wiki or got a student kicked out for that comment. JP . 66.169.43.61 04:17, 26 March 2007 (UTC) BJU student for total disclosure
To continue the discussion about American Idol contestant Chris Sligh and what constitutes "notability" for this page: It is my contention that Sligh requires a Wikipedia bio that can pass the AfD test before he is listed here as a former student. The Wikipedia community needs to make the decision about whether this TV show contestant is "notable" or just fleetingly well known; and such a decision can only be made after a full biography is presented to the community for its consideration. Once over the AfD hurdle, so far as I'm concerned, Sligh would be a worthy addition to the BJU page. I might add that I have never met Sligh, never heard him sing, and have no personal animosity towards the young man.
Yes, there are people on this list who do not have Wiki bios. I have grandfathered in everyone who was on the previous list. Virtually all of these individuals (barring a couple of the donors and two or three of the state legislators) are worthy of their own Wikipedia articles. Nevertheless, there are no "former students (non-graduates)" who do not have their own Wiki bios. I believe that if would be wise to maintain that standard for this category. As a practical matter, it's easier to keep out someone's uncle or the local fruit-and-nut bar if there is a standard to which Wikipedians can appeal.-- John Foxe 23:36, 24 February 2007 (UTC)
Sorry John Foxe, your "removed Sligh until he has a proper Wiki bio" mantra is getting old. As of March 9 Chris has a genuine, bona fide wikipedia bio. ( Barang 20:52, 11 March 2007 (UTC))
Please do not assume ownership of articles such as List of notable people associated with Bob Jones University. If you aren't willing to allow your contributions to be edited extensively or be redistributed by others, please do not submit them. Thank you.— Emote Talk Page 18:24, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
I will use all my obstructive powers to prevent the inclusion of Chris Sligh's name here until he has a proper Wiki bio. All I've asked for is a Wikipedia bio that can pass the AfD test. Once over that hurdle, so far as I'm concerned, Sligh will be a worthy addition to the BJU page. Here's the scenario. You write a bio for Sligh. I'll slap an AfD tag on it and propose deletion. You gather a group of like minded folks to vote "keep." I'll lose by an overwhelming margin. Sligh has his Wiki bio. I will no longer obstruct his name being listed here. The End.--John Foxe 11:16, 22 February 2007 (UTC)
What I am defending is a standard by which additional names can be added to the BJU list of "Former Students (Non-Graduates)." Future additions can only be personal preference unless there is a standard for inclusion, and a reasonable one is that a suggested addition have his own Wiki-bio. You are correct in assuming that I "don't really care whether Sligh is on the page or not." I don't and never have. I have been interested in establishing a standard for this list.
I have no martyr complex. I have suffered no oppression. I've won. I promised to fight the inclusion of Chris Sligh's name on this list until he had a Wikipedia bio that could pass AfD, and I've kept my word. He now has a Wiki-bio, and it will shortly pass AfD.-- John Foxe 11:02, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
I have no interest in deleting Sligh's name from the list. The community has spoken, which is what I intended from the beginning. Here's what I wrote almost a month ago.
I will use all my obstructive powers to prevent the inclusion of Chris Sligh's name here until he has a proper Wiki bio. All I've asked for is a Wikipedia bio that can pass the AfD test. Once over that hurdle, so far as I'm concerned, Sligh will be a worthy addition to the BJU page. Here's the scenario. You write a bio for Sligh. I'll slap an AfD tag on it and propose deletion. You gather a group of like minded folks to vote "keep." I'll lose by an overwhelming margin. Sligh has his Wiki bio. I will no longer obstruct his name being listed here. The End.--John Foxe 11:16, 22 February 2007 (UTC)
I am a man of my word. Nevertheless, if another person without a Wiki-bio is proposed for this list, I will follow exactly the same course as I have done in this case.-- John Foxe 13:30, 16 March 2007 (UTC)
John Foxe you wouldn't happen to be that guy who got banned a while back for removing historically accurate facts about BJU because your view was they painted the university as racist even though the lines only stated facts and not editorial opinion. Whom also is on the BJU quasi administration with a title like "public relations officer" because you were pretty quick to recognize the BJU IP address. I hope you didn't get that rule made banning wiki or got a student kicked out for that comment. JP.
66.169.43.61
04:21, 26 March 2007 (UTC) BJU student for total disclosure.
I have removed the following notables from the lists, although with every belief that these gentlemen belong on them. In my opinion, it is important that there be some objective criterion for being added to the list of "notable graduates" or "notable honorary degree recipients," especially because BJU is so controversial, and that that criterion should be a Wikipedia biography that can withstand an AFD challenge. I'll continue to watch this list, and if biographies appear, I'll add them back to the proper list. I'll even try to put together some biographies myself as I have opportunity.-- John Foxe 19:06, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
John Foxe ( talk) 20:47, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
John Foxe ( talk) 20:48, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
References
Mary Lamb was recognized by Cambridge's Who's Who. She is on BJU's faculty. [1] -- 158.158.240.230 ( talk) 20:23, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
Wayne Mouritzen
Wayne Mouritzen was a noteable and beloved GAY -- the word "homosexual" to denote a person is out of fashion and considered both pejorative and offensive by most gay people -- alumnus of Bob Jones University. The controversy that surrounded his ban letter from campus (and the University's subsequent partial recanting) is a part of Bob Jones University's legacy, particularly since this is an ongoing pattern the university deploys with its gay students and alumni, as you are no doubt aware. Please consult the meaning of the word "encyclopedia." To claim that factual information that gives a more complete picture of the subject at hand is "not encyclopedic" is to ignore the etymology of the very word itself: "complete knowledge." Brodacious ( talk) 22:42, 4 March 2014 (UTC)
David R. Anderson
David is rector of one of the largest Episcopal congregations in the United States. Regardless that he does not currently have a wikipedia page himself, he meets the definition of a noteworthy person. He is far more noteworthy (and influential), then Jamie Langston Turner, for example, who is a lovely person, nonetheless. http://www.saintlukesdarien.org/content.cfm?id=149&member_id=18
Brodacious ( talk) 22:55, 4 March 2014 (UTC)
We've been through this business a number of times before, although not recently. There needs to be some objective measure of what notable means. I didn't establish the "red link" standard, but it's a good one. I'll be glad to go with you to some Wikipedia mediation forum if you wish. Note that there are some redlinked BJU grads in the comments above for whom no one has yet written Wikipedia biographies. I'd encourage you to add Mouritzen and Anderson to that list—even to write your own AfD-proof bios for them-- John Foxe ( talk) 23:17, 4 March 2014 (UTC)
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