![]() | This article was nominated for deletion on 22 March 2011 (UTC). The result of the discussion was merge to List of Asian Americans. |
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Will change flags of nation to appropriate flag at time of birth. -- RightCowLeftCoast ( talk) 06:45, 16 February 2011 (UTC)
Recently an IP editor removed the flags relating to the ancestry of the Asian American astronauts, this was reverted, only to be removed again. The IP editor gave the removal reasons for the following reasons:
It's inappropriate to use a politcal symbol, ie a national flag, to represent a person's ethnicity specially for American born in the US.
and
Undid revision 418113756. The use of a national flag is a form of political allegiance and you can't arbitrarily assign foreign allegiance to someone born in the US base on their surname.
These flags have been in the article since it was created. Only recently did I change the flags to match the flag of that nation at the time of the individual's birth. This kept with MOS:FLAG#Historical considerations.
It is my contention, holding an opposing view of the IP editor that the listing, and inclusion of a flag, is not meant to indicate the individual holds any allegiance to the nation in question, but as the table indicates it is the country of origin of the individual's ethnicity.
Rather than this developing into an WP:EW, I would like to reach a consensus as to whether the article should include flags or not. -- RightCowLeftCoast ( talk) 10:33, 11 March 2011 (UTC)
I'm the IP editor that removed the PRC flags as symbol of Chinese ancestry. I apologize for the controversies but I strongly object to the use of the PRC flag as a representation of people of Chinese ancestry. PRC is a single party authoritarian state so there is very little distinction between the state and the party. I don't have anything against the communist party, however, I do object to authoritarian state regardless of party affiliations. It would be like an American flag with a picture of a donkey or an elephant substituting the 50 white stars, and outlawing the other parties. PRC flag, represents the single party rule of China, rather than China, and much less its people. Quoting wikipedia's entry on the PRC flag, "The red represents revolution; the five stars and their relationship represent the unity of the Chinese people under the leadership of the Communist Party of China."
Bringing this back to the greater Asian American representation, question arises when we expand beyond just the "Han" Chinese. Should we represent Dalai Lama's ancestry using the PRC flag or the Tibetan flag? Furthermore, what's the criteria for using the PRC flag on someone whose Chinese ancestry predates that of the PRC? Take astronaut Franklin Chang-Diaz, how is he related to PRC?
I don't mind mentioning someone's ethnicity, but I do object to using political flags to identify an individual without a clear set of criteria. I understand the intention of using the flag is not to represent political affiliation, but national flags are political symbols regardless of our intentions. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.194.233.98 ( talk) 10:08, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
Presently there has been a consensus (as stated at the beginning of this discussion thread) to keep the flags. I understand the objection stated, however, that does not mean that I agree with the objection.
As stated before, if you contend that the use of flags violates WP:FLAGBIO, please propose how else the individual's on this list should have their ethnicity(s) indicated on this list, and attempt to build a consensus for that change.-- RightCowLeftCoast ( talk) 10:25, 19 March 2011 (UTC)
I don't have a problem with the flags, but I'm concerned about this list as a whole. In particular, without a source making a similar list, it appears to fail the notability critera WP:NLIST. Mlm42 ( talk) 19:10, 11 March 2011 (UTC)
Per the 2011-03-30 consensus, per Tag at top of the article, I have completed the merge.
Done
Cheers. N2e ( talk) 23:14, 11 April 2011 (UTC)
![]() | This article was nominated for deletion on 22 March 2011 (UTC). The result of the discussion was merge to List of Asian Americans. |
This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page. |
![]() | This redirect does not require a rating on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Will change flags of nation to appropriate flag at time of birth. -- RightCowLeftCoast ( talk) 06:45, 16 February 2011 (UTC)
Recently an IP editor removed the flags relating to the ancestry of the Asian American astronauts, this was reverted, only to be removed again. The IP editor gave the removal reasons for the following reasons:
It's inappropriate to use a politcal symbol, ie a national flag, to represent a person's ethnicity specially for American born in the US.
and
Undid revision 418113756. The use of a national flag is a form of political allegiance and you can't arbitrarily assign foreign allegiance to someone born in the US base on their surname.
These flags have been in the article since it was created. Only recently did I change the flags to match the flag of that nation at the time of the individual's birth. This kept with MOS:FLAG#Historical considerations.
It is my contention, holding an opposing view of the IP editor that the listing, and inclusion of a flag, is not meant to indicate the individual holds any allegiance to the nation in question, but as the table indicates it is the country of origin of the individual's ethnicity.
Rather than this developing into an WP:EW, I would like to reach a consensus as to whether the article should include flags or not. -- RightCowLeftCoast ( talk) 10:33, 11 March 2011 (UTC)
I'm the IP editor that removed the PRC flags as symbol of Chinese ancestry. I apologize for the controversies but I strongly object to the use of the PRC flag as a representation of people of Chinese ancestry. PRC is a single party authoritarian state so there is very little distinction between the state and the party. I don't have anything against the communist party, however, I do object to authoritarian state regardless of party affiliations. It would be like an American flag with a picture of a donkey or an elephant substituting the 50 white stars, and outlawing the other parties. PRC flag, represents the single party rule of China, rather than China, and much less its people. Quoting wikipedia's entry on the PRC flag, "The red represents revolution; the five stars and their relationship represent the unity of the Chinese people under the leadership of the Communist Party of China."
Bringing this back to the greater Asian American representation, question arises when we expand beyond just the "Han" Chinese. Should we represent Dalai Lama's ancestry using the PRC flag or the Tibetan flag? Furthermore, what's the criteria for using the PRC flag on someone whose Chinese ancestry predates that of the PRC? Take astronaut Franklin Chang-Diaz, how is he related to PRC?
I don't mind mentioning someone's ethnicity, but I do object to using political flags to identify an individual without a clear set of criteria. I understand the intention of using the flag is not to represent political affiliation, but national flags are political symbols regardless of our intentions. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.194.233.98 ( talk) 10:08, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
Presently there has been a consensus (as stated at the beginning of this discussion thread) to keep the flags. I understand the objection stated, however, that does not mean that I agree with the objection.
As stated before, if you contend that the use of flags violates WP:FLAGBIO, please propose how else the individual's on this list should have their ethnicity(s) indicated on this list, and attempt to build a consensus for that change.-- RightCowLeftCoast ( talk) 10:25, 19 March 2011 (UTC)
I don't have a problem with the flags, but I'm concerned about this list as a whole. In particular, without a source making a similar list, it appears to fail the notability critera WP:NLIST. Mlm42 ( talk) 19:10, 11 March 2011 (UTC)
Per the 2011-03-30 consensus, per Tag at top of the article, I have completed the merge.
Done
Cheers. N2e ( talk) 23:14, 11 April 2011 (UTC)