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Legolas2186 asked me to look over the article and comment on its suitability for FAC. Here are some comments that should be addressed before bringing it to FAC, in my opinion:
Hope this helps. -- Laser brain (talk) 17:08, 29 January 2012 (UTC)
Jivesh1205 ( Talk) 08:04, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
Why isn't there any mention of Prince, who played guitar on the record? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.221.182.227 ( talk) 19:08, 29 September 2012 (UTC)
Lucy O'Brien's "Like An Icon" (2007) is referenced as the source for all of the info about Madonna fighting with Patrick Leonard during the recording of the song, shouting at other people etc. etc. (pg. 119). However, not only is the page number incorrect, but NONE of this information appears in "Like An Icon". What is the true source of this info? If it can't be substantiated, it should be deleted. 121.222.141.243 ( talk) 06:11, 11 May 2013 (UTC)
"The women of Spanish East Harlem in New York call their Church as la casa di momma (Momma's House)."
The section on the recording process is full of inaccuracies. Lucy O'Brien's book, "Like An Icon" is quoted as the source for much of this section, but many of the quotes attributed to Guy Pratt and Bruce Gaistch about the recording of the song actually refer to the recording of the album. For example, this article specifically states that according to Guy Pratt, Madonna gave specific instructions to the musicians concerning what she wanted them to play, after having run through the song once with them. Guy Pratt was referring to the recording session for "Oh Father", though, NOT "Like A Prayer". Similarly, according to this article, Bruce Gaistch told Pat Leonard that the song, "Like A Prayer", was as good as it was going to get, and that they were finished with it. Again, this is incorrect, as Bruce was referring to the album recording session in general, and not to the track, "Like A Prayer". This article needs to be reviewed and extensively edited to remove all of these incorrect and inaccurate statements. 101.162.202.227 ( talk) 13:00, 2 March 2014 (UTC)
I think the following assertion is inaccurate and unfounded:
"The usage of choir and organ in the song was an unprecedented blend of pop with religious music, which paved the way for gospel music to be more mainstream than before."
Obviously the cited author is ignoring the long association of gospel and choral music with rock and roll. There are numerous examples, from the Edwin Hawkins Singers "Oh Happy Day," to both Leon Russell's and B.B. King's versions of "Hummingbird," along with various songs from artists such as the Staple Singers and Stevie Wonder. This citation fallaciously asserts that Madonna was breaking new ground, when it obviously had been done many times before her. Just because he says it, doesn't make it so.
Gil gosseyn (
talk)
07:18, 27 February 2016 (UTC)
Another MAJOR example of combining rock and gospel was the Rolling Stones' song "You Can't Always Get What You Want," which was recorded on 16 and 17 November 1968 at Olympic Sound Studios in London. It features the London Bach Choir. This precedes "Like A Prayer by a full TWENTY YEARS! If there are no further responses on this topic, I will delete the fallacious reference in a week. Gil gosseyn ( talk) 17:15, 29 March 2016 (UTC)
How is cross burning a symbol of Catholicism? All I've seen online is that it was widely associated with the KKK. There's no proof that it was a Catholic symbol. I'd like the person that wrote this to site where they got that idea from, otherwise I will edit that information out. I'm surprised no one got offended by that. Aaron Saltzer ( talk) 21:06, 2 September 2014 (UTC)
I saw that. I reread it. I misunderstood. Sorry. Aaron Saltzer ( talk) 16:39, 3 September 2014 (UTC)
Patrick Leonard says quite authoritatively that the guitar at the start, at least, is Prince. Should this be added? Was wondering if anyone has any counter-source in case this is memory playing tricks with him. Blythwood ( talk) 10:21, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
In the Like_a_Prayer_(song)#Composition section, I noticed that the chord progressions were listed rather incorrectly:
which totally does not match what I hear in the official music video.
Looking at the referenced music sheet at http://www.musicnotes.com/sheetmusic/mtd.asp?ppn=MN0070693, it became clear to me that whoever first copied the chords to Wikipedia did not understand slash chords, and the initial three chords of "Dm, C/D and Gm/D" became five chords of "Dm, C, D, Gm, D"...
Another point of contention is that Madonna's opening solo is probably the "opening verse" rather than the "opening chorus".
Then, finally, the erroneously written Dm–C–E–C7–B♭–F–A, probably meant to be Dm–C/E–C7–B♭–F/A or Dm–C/E–C7/B♭–F/A, is neither the beginning of any verse or the chorus, but rather, seems like the continuation after Dm–C/D–Gm/D in the same opening verse.
But the actual chorus of "When you call my name, it's like a little prayer..." has the chord progression of F–C–B♭–F/A–F/D–Gm/D–F (from http://pop-sheet-music.com/Files/abf97916e62bcde78f924d6ca4c75366.pdf, because the sample page on http://www.musicnotes.com/sheetmusic/mtd.asp?ppn=MN0070693 does not even reach that chorus...
And what is more saddening is that these errors in chord progressions have propagated to translations, e.g. French and Polish.
Anyhow, I decided to at least fix the slash chords first, as follows:
I think a more accurate version would look something like:
though I do begin to wonder if it is a good idea to list out all the chord progressions in the Wiki article.
But I am sure there are professional musicians here who know how to fix this paragraph properly, so that's why I am writing this help request. :-) Many thanks!
Anthony Fok ( talk) 11:59, 16 November 2015 (UTC)
Like a Prayer was considered the 50th best song of the 80s by Pitchfork. Can you add this to the article? http://pitchfork.com/features/staff-lists/9700-the-200-best-songs-of-the-1980s/8/
Jimoincolor ( talk) 20:47, 18 February 2016 (UTC)
Where's the citation? I am skeptical because there is no citation this occurred. I honestly can't recall in my lifetime (and I'm in that "middle-age" demographic) when the Vatican has officially condemned any pop music video or anything else in the current media. There are groups of Catholics that will absolutely make their outrage public. I just find it very hard to believe that this video so offended the pope or any high-ranking clergy that it was even on the priority list of making official comment. Even by 1989, human nature and historical gaffs were common knowledge. Condemn a song, a video, a movie, or a book, and surprise, surprise! It's an advertisement. People who had no interest in these various works can't get to them fast enough to see what all the fuss is about. I'm pretty sure the Vatican had learned the futility by 1989 when this was released. A statement that the Vatican condemned this video should be easily cited via their massive website. I have good reasons for why I'm skeptical that would include opinion and possibly "original research" and shall be omitted. Hopefully I am allowed to say, "Citation needed!" — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2605:E000:6341:600:31C5:97D5:B0EA:5061 ( talk) 16:47, 21 November 2016 (UTC)
http://uproxx.com/sepinwall/the-leftovers-soundtrack-liza-richardson-interview/2/ Madonna refused her song to be used in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NzakrA2NUpg&feature=youtu.be. Richardson reports "the licenser of Madonna, Warner/Chappell, [...] felt really bad that she said no, because that’s a very special song to her. She even said, “You can have any other song of mine but just not that one.” "
Aurbeh (
talk) 09:05, 11 June 2017 (UTC)--
Aurbeh (
talk)
09:05, 11 June 2017 (UTC)
— IB [ Poke ] 16:41, 21 March 2018 (UTC)
User @ SummerPhDv2.0: removed this version since he thinks is a "peacockery" sentence. I don't wanna make an edit war, but I think based on own several lists inside the article like Rolling Stone (and this example is not a Madonna's list of best song) we could include this. Or maybe rewrite the setence: ""Like a Prayer" is considered to be one of the best songs of Madonna's career and has been included in several critic lists among best pop (or general) songs of all time... (like Rolling Stone)", e.g. I think is common sense, we don't need a reference saying United States is a country? Or we need?. -- Apoxyomenus ( talk) 13:32, 14 December 2019 (UTC)
-- Apoxyomenus ( talk) 21:53, 13 September 2023 (UTC)
As we saw that Video clip, Black Woman sings with her Choirs like a Charismatic Movement. I think it's Methodist Church with Black Choirs like Woman Preacher (Priest) and many Black people on that church.
Because from their style on Worship, This is Similiar with Protestant.
Methodist Church also has statue like Jesus Statue who stands. 223.255.229.26 ( talk) 12:21, 17 April 2024 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Like a Prayer (song) article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: 1 |
![]() | Like a Prayer (song) has been listed as one of the Music good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
![]() | Like a Prayer (song) is part of the Like a Prayer series, a good topic. It is also part of the Celebration (Madonna album) series, a good topic. These are identified as among the best series of articles produced by the Wikipedia community. If you can update or improve them, please do so. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
![]() | This article is rated GA-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Legolas2186 asked me to look over the article and comment on its suitability for FAC. Here are some comments that should be addressed before bringing it to FAC, in my opinion:
Hope this helps. -- Laser brain (talk) 17:08, 29 January 2012 (UTC)
Jivesh1205 ( Talk) 08:04, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
Why isn't there any mention of Prince, who played guitar on the record? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.221.182.227 ( talk) 19:08, 29 September 2012 (UTC)
Lucy O'Brien's "Like An Icon" (2007) is referenced as the source for all of the info about Madonna fighting with Patrick Leonard during the recording of the song, shouting at other people etc. etc. (pg. 119). However, not only is the page number incorrect, but NONE of this information appears in "Like An Icon". What is the true source of this info? If it can't be substantiated, it should be deleted. 121.222.141.243 ( talk) 06:11, 11 May 2013 (UTC)
"The women of Spanish East Harlem in New York call their Church as la casa di momma (Momma's House)."
The section on the recording process is full of inaccuracies. Lucy O'Brien's book, "Like An Icon" is quoted as the source for much of this section, but many of the quotes attributed to Guy Pratt and Bruce Gaistch about the recording of the song actually refer to the recording of the album. For example, this article specifically states that according to Guy Pratt, Madonna gave specific instructions to the musicians concerning what she wanted them to play, after having run through the song once with them. Guy Pratt was referring to the recording session for "Oh Father", though, NOT "Like A Prayer". Similarly, according to this article, Bruce Gaistch told Pat Leonard that the song, "Like A Prayer", was as good as it was going to get, and that they were finished with it. Again, this is incorrect, as Bruce was referring to the album recording session in general, and not to the track, "Like A Prayer". This article needs to be reviewed and extensively edited to remove all of these incorrect and inaccurate statements. 101.162.202.227 ( talk) 13:00, 2 March 2014 (UTC)
I think the following assertion is inaccurate and unfounded:
"The usage of choir and organ in the song was an unprecedented blend of pop with religious music, which paved the way for gospel music to be more mainstream than before."
Obviously the cited author is ignoring the long association of gospel and choral music with rock and roll. There are numerous examples, from the Edwin Hawkins Singers "Oh Happy Day," to both Leon Russell's and B.B. King's versions of "Hummingbird," along with various songs from artists such as the Staple Singers and Stevie Wonder. This citation fallaciously asserts that Madonna was breaking new ground, when it obviously had been done many times before her. Just because he says it, doesn't make it so.
Gil gosseyn (
talk)
07:18, 27 February 2016 (UTC)
Another MAJOR example of combining rock and gospel was the Rolling Stones' song "You Can't Always Get What You Want," which was recorded on 16 and 17 November 1968 at Olympic Sound Studios in London. It features the London Bach Choir. This precedes "Like A Prayer by a full TWENTY YEARS! If there are no further responses on this topic, I will delete the fallacious reference in a week. Gil gosseyn ( talk) 17:15, 29 March 2016 (UTC)
How is cross burning a symbol of Catholicism? All I've seen online is that it was widely associated with the KKK. There's no proof that it was a Catholic symbol. I'd like the person that wrote this to site where they got that idea from, otherwise I will edit that information out. I'm surprised no one got offended by that. Aaron Saltzer ( talk) 21:06, 2 September 2014 (UTC)
I saw that. I reread it. I misunderstood. Sorry. Aaron Saltzer ( talk) 16:39, 3 September 2014 (UTC)
Patrick Leonard says quite authoritatively that the guitar at the start, at least, is Prince. Should this be added? Was wondering if anyone has any counter-source in case this is memory playing tricks with him. Blythwood ( talk) 10:21, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
In the Like_a_Prayer_(song)#Composition section, I noticed that the chord progressions were listed rather incorrectly:
which totally does not match what I hear in the official music video.
Looking at the referenced music sheet at http://www.musicnotes.com/sheetmusic/mtd.asp?ppn=MN0070693, it became clear to me that whoever first copied the chords to Wikipedia did not understand slash chords, and the initial three chords of "Dm, C/D and Gm/D" became five chords of "Dm, C, D, Gm, D"...
Another point of contention is that Madonna's opening solo is probably the "opening verse" rather than the "opening chorus".
Then, finally, the erroneously written Dm–C–E–C7–B♭–F–A, probably meant to be Dm–C/E–C7–B♭–F/A or Dm–C/E–C7/B♭–F/A, is neither the beginning of any verse or the chorus, but rather, seems like the continuation after Dm–C/D–Gm/D in the same opening verse.
But the actual chorus of "When you call my name, it's like a little prayer..." has the chord progression of F–C–B♭–F/A–F/D–Gm/D–F (from http://pop-sheet-music.com/Files/abf97916e62bcde78f924d6ca4c75366.pdf, because the sample page on http://www.musicnotes.com/sheetmusic/mtd.asp?ppn=MN0070693 does not even reach that chorus...
And what is more saddening is that these errors in chord progressions have propagated to translations, e.g. French and Polish.
Anyhow, I decided to at least fix the slash chords first, as follows:
I think a more accurate version would look something like:
though I do begin to wonder if it is a good idea to list out all the chord progressions in the Wiki article.
But I am sure there are professional musicians here who know how to fix this paragraph properly, so that's why I am writing this help request. :-) Many thanks!
Anthony Fok ( talk) 11:59, 16 November 2015 (UTC)
Like a Prayer was considered the 50th best song of the 80s by Pitchfork. Can you add this to the article? http://pitchfork.com/features/staff-lists/9700-the-200-best-songs-of-the-1980s/8/
Jimoincolor ( talk) 20:47, 18 February 2016 (UTC)
Where's the citation? I am skeptical because there is no citation this occurred. I honestly can't recall in my lifetime (and I'm in that "middle-age" demographic) when the Vatican has officially condemned any pop music video or anything else in the current media. There are groups of Catholics that will absolutely make their outrage public. I just find it very hard to believe that this video so offended the pope or any high-ranking clergy that it was even on the priority list of making official comment. Even by 1989, human nature and historical gaffs were common knowledge. Condemn a song, a video, a movie, or a book, and surprise, surprise! It's an advertisement. People who had no interest in these various works can't get to them fast enough to see what all the fuss is about. I'm pretty sure the Vatican had learned the futility by 1989 when this was released. A statement that the Vatican condemned this video should be easily cited via their massive website. I have good reasons for why I'm skeptical that would include opinion and possibly "original research" and shall be omitted. Hopefully I am allowed to say, "Citation needed!" — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2605:E000:6341:600:31C5:97D5:B0EA:5061 ( talk) 16:47, 21 November 2016 (UTC)
http://uproxx.com/sepinwall/the-leftovers-soundtrack-liza-richardson-interview/2/ Madonna refused her song to be used in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NzakrA2NUpg&feature=youtu.be. Richardson reports "the licenser of Madonna, Warner/Chappell, [...] felt really bad that she said no, because that’s a very special song to her. She even said, “You can have any other song of mine but just not that one.” "
Aurbeh (
talk) 09:05, 11 June 2017 (UTC)--
Aurbeh (
talk)
09:05, 11 June 2017 (UTC)
— IB [ Poke ] 16:41, 21 March 2018 (UTC)
User @ SummerPhDv2.0: removed this version since he thinks is a "peacockery" sentence. I don't wanna make an edit war, but I think based on own several lists inside the article like Rolling Stone (and this example is not a Madonna's list of best song) we could include this. Or maybe rewrite the setence: ""Like a Prayer" is considered to be one of the best songs of Madonna's career and has been included in several critic lists among best pop (or general) songs of all time... (like Rolling Stone)", e.g. I think is common sense, we don't need a reference saying United States is a country? Or we need?. -- Apoxyomenus ( talk) 13:32, 14 December 2019 (UTC)
-- Apoxyomenus ( talk) 21:53, 13 September 2023 (UTC)
As we saw that Video clip, Black Woman sings with her Choirs like a Charismatic Movement. I think it's Methodist Church with Black Choirs like Woman Preacher (Priest) and many Black people on that church.
Because from their style on Worship, This is Similiar with Protestant.
Methodist Church also has statue like Jesus Statue who stands. 223.255.229.26 ( talk) 12:21, 17 April 2024 (UTC)