![]() | LNER Gresley Classes A1 and A3 was one of the Engineering and technology good articles, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake. | |||||||||||||||||||||
|
![]() | This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Add a couple more pictures. Add a paragraph/section on the preserved A3 Flying Scotsman and new build A1 Tornado.
|
The Specification table contains at least one error - Common sense says that the fuel capacity should be 6-8000Kg, 820kg IS wrong. AHEMSLTD 20:01, 14 January 2006 (UTC)
For obvious reasons I am deleting much of the following passage: "No. 4472 Flying Scotsman is the only survivor of the class and has a strong personality to that of Liberal Party Leader, David Owen. His activities since being purchased for preservation in 1963 are such trips to USA and Australia have made him one of the best known and widely recognised steam locomotives in the world and a very good prime minister too." —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.29.36.6 ( talk) 22:20, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
This character has been on the rampage in steam locomotive article for months. He sometimes makes valid edits, but seems to be obsessed with the Reverend Awdry's little world and equating locomotive "personalities" with politicians". I have tried reasoning with him but he is quite incorrigible and unfortunately may have to be blocked.-- John of Paris 02:26, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
The comments on slipping and driving techniques are very interesting. However they are rather specialised for the general reader and apply more to general questions of Pacific design or design of locomotives with idle trailing axles rather than being specific to the A1. They also bring in a lot of chronological confusion — mention of Kings, A4s and the performance of A3s on the Waverley route when we are supposed to be discussing the A1 is quite dizzying. I would hesitate to remove these comments but wonder if a better place could not be found for them with appropriate internal links. This would leave space for a more rigourous and detailed history of the class. For instance there is little mention of the 1925 exchanges with the GWR Castle locomotives nor the benefits brought about by long travel valves (the 100 mph run is just one of them and would probably not have been possible without them).-- John of Paris 02:18, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
I would also like to know more about the "wheel burn" problem. The only mention I have ever seen was in Brian Hollingsworth's bookon "LBSC" on the subject of his practical advice (page 101): "Even people from other departments found his advice good; for example at Darlington some years ago there was an "insoluble" problem of locomotives slipping at the end of of the down main platform. Because of serious wheel-burns rails had to be changed every few days and this had gone on for years. The curve had been eased at considerable cost (it involved alterations to the main platform) with negligible improvement. The only man for miles around to have read 'Curly on slipping' then made this point that even on a flat curve one wheel must slip; hence only one could 'bite'. He then suggested (to the derision of his colleagues) that the curve should be made sharper and hence shorter; this could be done so that just ahead of the water column at the spot where the driving wheels always came to rest, the track was dead straight. In desperation this alteration was carried out and Bingo! - no more problem, only a big undeserved boost to the Hollingsworth reputation." — Two points then: does anyone know of any other references to wheel burn? Did they occur in many places and were Gresley Pacifics the sole responsible? This all smacks to me of subtle weasel words.-- John of Paris ( talk) 12:54, 25 November 2007 (UTC)
Been having a go at a rewrite of this article trying to respect some sort of historical sequence that is rather lacking in the present version. Have put my efforts into User:John of Paris/sandbox 6. All are welcome with bucket and spade.-- John of Paris ( talk) 00:02, 7 December 2007 (UTC)
Am importing new version today.-- John of Paris ( talk) 15:35, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
The Union catalogue of many of the UK university libraries ( Copac) shows a number of copies of "The book of the railway" by John Richard Hind, all dated 1927.
Unfortunately, that means it's still in copyright in the United States, and will be until 2022. (If the book had been published five years earlier (pre-1923) it would have been okay; but that would have been difficult for an image in LNER green...)
It is a very nice drawing. But if the busybodies come around, it may be hard to convince them that this pic is doing something that couldn't be replaced with free content -- eg a modern photo of a restored A3 under steam.
If there were official LNER posters that strongly emphasised the A3, one of those might be a better bet, as indicating not just what the engine looked like, but also how it could be (in fact was) used to promote the railway as a whole. Jheald ( talk) 18:58, 17 December 2007 (UTC)
I've assessed this as B class. Good solid work there, just needs a little more expansion. Mjroots ( talk) 12:31, 20 January 2008 (UTC)
Part of my concerns about '...increased lap and travel...' in the Early Improvements section have been addressed. (Thanks JofP!) However, there is still the problem that the paragraph does not help the reader work out what 'lap and travel' are. A knowledgeable reader will (probably) guess that they relate to the valve gear, somehow, but (a) this is not stated, and (b) it assumes that the reader knows what the two terms actually refer to. It does not help that the valve gear article does not say what they are either (well, 'lap' is mentioned, but I needed to use a search tool to find it!)
Providing links to (new) subsections of the valve gear article would suffice (presumably neither lap nor travel would be appropriate :0) ) -- I don't think they need to be descibed in full here.
EdJogg ( talk) 14:57, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
Well it is hard to explain, not because the principle is complicated, but a lot of things are taking place simultaneously. It is however absolutely crucial to the understanding of the history of the Gresley Pacifics. On the other hand, if people only see jargon, what's the use? You are right, there does need to be a special article on the subject of valve events with blue links; I think we're making a reasonable start with this sort of question in the Steam locomotive article so we can take it from there. In the meantime let's try to sketch out the lap and lead issue here first and see if I can put it over simply.
The port is the passage by which the steam enters and exits the cylinder from the adjacent steam chest in which a sliding valve works. An ordinary double-acting cylinder needs two ports, one at each end; each port deals with steam going both in and out, in other words both admission and exhaust events. The valve controlling these has two valve heads each controlling its own port: as the valve travels, the leading edge of the valve head slides over the port, closing it off, then the valve continues its travel until the other side of the valve head uncovers the port, opening it up to the passage of steam again to exhaust it. One edge of the valve head (admission edge) controls inlet, the valve travels on until the opposite side of the head (exhaust edge) controls exhaust. A sliding valve (whether of the slide-valve or piston-valve type) has to simultaneously control both admission and exhaust steam at either end of the cylinder, and this is where it starts to get complicated. The problem is that the cylinder ends need to be open to exhaust for a longer period than admission, especially at high speed in order to give the exhaust steam time to get out. The wheeze (found in the 1840s) is to make a valve that overlaps the admission edges in such a way as to close the admission port early in the travel, in order be able to use the steam expansively whilst leaving the exhaust port at the other end still open for a short time more to ensure complete evacuation. It is obvious that that lengthening lap means that to carry out its task, the valve must travel a greater distance so it is also obvious that travel derives from lap (lead is a quite different thing). The reason why short lap/travel valves were the norm at the end of the 19th century is because piston speeds were lower and it was the custom to work at longer cut-offs, so if you wanted a fast engine, one way was to increase the size of the driving wheels, which of course reduced tractive power; it was also felt that increased travel meant increased wear, especially with the primitive lubrication of the period. As the early 20th century progressed and trains got heavier, the need was for both power and speed. At first the tendency was to increase boiler size, but taking this too far this upset the the nicely-balanced proportions between the the components that had previously been achieved, also in Britain they were getting to at the limits of the loading gauge. Other balances had to be found. Churchward was the bold pioneer in the matter of valve events and by 1905 had made the first necessary advances in this field (and others) Others followed after WW1; starting with Maunsell and soon Gresley, but unfortunately in his case the advance to long travel valves coincided with his first 3-cylinder Mogul loco with derived valve gear. Due to imperfect bearings, as play developed in the central pivot, long travel in the outside valves became overtravel for the inside valve that started hitting the end of the steam chest. A return to short valve travel was his makeshift expedient for preventing this, but it hamstrung fine locomotives by cutting off the exhaust too soon and choking the cylinders. This was the Pacifics' chronic ailment that allowed them to be easily out-performed by smaller GWR 4-6-0s in 1926. This story is very well told by Nock in his 1945 book of how the Pacifics were able to rapidly realise their potential as soon as the LNER people were able learn from "industrial espionage" of the GWR Castles apparently carried out in the dead of night on one of the visiting engines (I'm sure the GW people turned a blind eye, but they weren't going to give it to them on a plate). This is a classic example of Porta's metaphore: "a chain is only as strong as its weakest link".-- John of Paris ( talk) 13:24, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
It would be churlish of me to refuse to list this article as a GA until what are a few minor problems are sorted, so I won't, as I trust this community of editors to address these minor points.
This is an informative and obviously well-researched article, and I congratulate all of the editors who have worked on it on producing such a fine piece of work. -- Malleus Fatuorum ( talk) 00:16, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
Just intercepted a comment at the FA Peer Review ( Wikipedia:Peer review/LNER Class A1/A3/archive1). We have a serious problem with this article, and that is the slash in the title. This page is actually called "A3" and it is a sub-page of "LNER Class A1". This was discovered because the peer review process picked up the latter as the article title, and I just worked out what's going on!
So, folks. Suggestions for an alternative title please? (one without a slash, that is!)
EdJogg ( talk) 17:33, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
The current lead pargraph begins:
Now to my mind this is grammatically incorrect, although it does now match the current article title.
I would have said it should either start:
...which is what it was previously, or:
In either case, the article name should be changed to suit, with the bold text following LNER as the new title.
My personal preference is for the third version.
Thoughts, please? EdJogg ( talk) 13:08, 21 April 2008 (UTC)
My thought on the issue is to standardise with the other LNER articles, and call it the LNER Gresley Classes A1 and A3, as although they were technically the same locomotive, they were distictly different in vital aspect of their design. -- Bulleid Pacific ( talk) 00:28, 27 May 2008 (UTC)
The article (as it stands) has the three cranks set at 120 degrees, but this is wrong. Because of the inclination of the middle cylinder (Nock has it at 1 in 8 or about 7 degrees) the crank angle differences were 120-113-127. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.177.19.83 ( talk) 02:09, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
< using Gresley conjugated valve gear to derive the motion of the two outside valve spindles >
is putting the cart well before the horse. What the conjugation did was to derive the motion of the inside valve spindle from those of the two outside cylinders!! 86.177.19.83 ( talk) 02:16, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
Is there any authority other than ref. 23 (Reed's 'Profile') for the statement that these were fitted to one locomotive in 1935? I note, without further comment as to the truth of Reed's text, that the books by Bellwood&Jenkinson, Brown and Nock and, presumably, therefore, though I've not read it, the paper by Spencer make no mention of such a fitting. 86.177.19.83 ( talk) 21:40, 12 November 2010 (UTC)
I don't think this article about a British locomotive needs ELEVEN instances of the phrase 'long ton' (or tons) to remind the reader how large the ton is in the UK. The 'long ton' is almost unheard of in British English (which is what this article is written in) except among mensuration anoraks. 86.178.18.228 ( talk) 07:09, 16 January 2011 (UTC)
{{
convert}}
template has been used to achieve both conversion and disambiguation. It might be worth remembering that similar confusion can arise over liquid measures, where the pint (16 or 20 fl. oz.) and gallon (128 or 160 fl. oz.) show an even greater disparity between UK and US versions - the UK measures are 25% larger than the US. --
Redrose64 (
talk)
12:45, 16 January 2011 (UTC)
The A1 and A3s were separate classes, one is a rebuild of the other. So they need to be split. Tony May ( talk) 18:06, 8 March 2012 (UTC)
Hi'
< Eventually all of the A1 locomotives were rebuilt to A3 specifications. >
Not 1470
109.158.245.1 ( talk) 10:25, 10 August 2015 (UTC)
The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:LNER Gresley Classes A1 and A3/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.
Initial assessment at start class as it clearly met that.
B class assessment:-
|
Last edited at 14:06, 2 June 2008 (UTC). Substituted at 21:29, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
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Not usually someone to edit here and would rather someone else did it so I don't screw up the page by accident
Can the mention of Thompson in the wartime service section be removed, it doesn't actually speak about the wartime performance of these locomotives, it isn't relevant and moreover presents a historically inaccurate view of Thompson as unsynpathetic to Gresley's designs. This trope shouldn't be in this article 1.145.185.55 ( talk) 22:39, 23 February 2022 (UTC)
Talk:LNER Gresley Classes A1 and A3/GA1
The reason why I am bringing this up is because BigSneeze444 removed the mention of Gordon the Big Engine from Thomas & Friends due to it being unsourced. He has also done so to many other pages, including the Caledonian Railway 812 and 652 Classes article, where he removed the mention of Donald and Douglas due to it also being unsourced. However, a variety of other locomotives that the characters were based on, do have mentions of the characters themselves in their respective "In fiction" sections (e.g. GER Class C53, having a mention of Toby The Tram Engine), so if all the other real-life locomotives have mentions of the characters in their "In fiction" section, then this article and the Caledonian Railway 812 and 652 Classes should have "In fiction" mentions of Gordon and Donald and Douglas respectively as well, as long as there's a reliable source for that matter. -- Magnatyrannus ( talk | contribs) 23:06, 9 November 2022 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Much of the article is uncited, including the entire "Wartime service" section. Trainsandotherthings ( talk) 02:08, 26 April 2024 (UTC)
![]() | LNER Gresley Classes A1 and A3 was one of the Engineering and technology good articles, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake. | |||||||||||||||||||||
|
![]() | This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Add a couple more pictures. Add a paragraph/section on the preserved A3 Flying Scotsman and new build A1 Tornado.
|
The Specification table contains at least one error - Common sense says that the fuel capacity should be 6-8000Kg, 820kg IS wrong. AHEMSLTD 20:01, 14 January 2006 (UTC)
For obvious reasons I am deleting much of the following passage: "No. 4472 Flying Scotsman is the only survivor of the class and has a strong personality to that of Liberal Party Leader, David Owen. His activities since being purchased for preservation in 1963 are such trips to USA and Australia have made him one of the best known and widely recognised steam locomotives in the world and a very good prime minister too." —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.29.36.6 ( talk) 22:20, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
This character has been on the rampage in steam locomotive article for months. He sometimes makes valid edits, but seems to be obsessed with the Reverend Awdry's little world and equating locomotive "personalities" with politicians". I have tried reasoning with him but he is quite incorrigible and unfortunately may have to be blocked.-- John of Paris 02:26, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
The comments on slipping and driving techniques are very interesting. However they are rather specialised for the general reader and apply more to general questions of Pacific design or design of locomotives with idle trailing axles rather than being specific to the A1. They also bring in a lot of chronological confusion — mention of Kings, A4s and the performance of A3s on the Waverley route when we are supposed to be discussing the A1 is quite dizzying. I would hesitate to remove these comments but wonder if a better place could not be found for them with appropriate internal links. This would leave space for a more rigourous and detailed history of the class. For instance there is little mention of the 1925 exchanges with the GWR Castle locomotives nor the benefits brought about by long travel valves (the 100 mph run is just one of them and would probably not have been possible without them).-- John of Paris 02:18, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
I would also like to know more about the "wheel burn" problem. The only mention I have ever seen was in Brian Hollingsworth's bookon "LBSC" on the subject of his practical advice (page 101): "Even people from other departments found his advice good; for example at Darlington some years ago there was an "insoluble" problem of locomotives slipping at the end of of the down main platform. Because of serious wheel-burns rails had to be changed every few days and this had gone on for years. The curve had been eased at considerable cost (it involved alterations to the main platform) with negligible improvement. The only man for miles around to have read 'Curly on slipping' then made this point that even on a flat curve one wheel must slip; hence only one could 'bite'. He then suggested (to the derision of his colleagues) that the curve should be made sharper and hence shorter; this could be done so that just ahead of the water column at the spot where the driving wheels always came to rest, the track was dead straight. In desperation this alteration was carried out and Bingo! - no more problem, only a big undeserved boost to the Hollingsworth reputation." — Two points then: does anyone know of any other references to wheel burn? Did they occur in many places and were Gresley Pacifics the sole responsible? This all smacks to me of subtle weasel words.-- John of Paris ( talk) 12:54, 25 November 2007 (UTC)
Been having a go at a rewrite of this article trying to respect some sort of historical sequence that is rather lacking in the present version. Have put my efforts into User:John of Paris/sandbox 6. All are welcome with bucket and spade.-- John of Paris ( talk) 00:02, 7 December 2007 (UTC)
Am importing new version today.-- John of Paris ( talk) 15:35, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
The Union catalogue of many of the UK university libraries ( Copac) shows a number of copies of "The book of the railway" by John Richard Hind, all dated 1927.
Unfortunately, that means it's still in copyright in the United States, and will be until 2022. (If the book had been published five years earlier (pre-1923) it would have been okay; but that would have been difficult for an image in LNER green...)
It is a very nice drawing. But if the busybodies come around, it may be hard to convince them that this pic is doing something that couldn't be replaced with free content -- eg a modern photo of a restored A3 under steam.
If there were official LNER posters that strongly emphasised the A3, one of those might be a better bet, as indicating not just what the engine looked like, but also how it could be (in fact was) used to promote the railway as a whole. Jheald ( talk) 18:58, 17 December 2007 (UTC)
I've assessed this as B class. Good solid work there, just needs a little more expansion. Mjroots ( talk) 12:31, 20 January 2008 (UTC)
Part of my concerns about '...increased lap and travel...' in the Early Improvements section have been addressed. (Thanks JofP!) However, there is still the problem that the paragraph does not help the reader work out what 'lap and travel' are. A knowledgeable reader will (probably) guess that they relate to the valve gear, somehow, but (a) this is not stated, and (b) it assumes that the reader knows what the two terms actually refer to. It does not help that the valve gear article does not say what they are either (well, 'lap' is mentioned, but I needed to use a search tool to find it!)
Providing links to (new) subsections of the valve gear article would suffice (presumably neither lap nor travel would be appropriate :0) ) -- I don't think they need to be descibed in full here.
EdJogg ( talk) 14:57, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
Well it is hard to explain, not because the principle is complicated, but a lot of things are taking place simultaneously. It is however absolutely crucial to the understanding of the history of the Gresley Pacifics. On the other hand, if people only see jargon, what's the use? You are right, there does need to be a special article on the subject of valve events with blue links; I think we're making a reasonable start with this sort of question in the Steam locomotive article so we can take it from there. In the meantime let's try to sketch out the lap and lead issue here first and see if I can put it over simply.
The port is the passage by which the steam enters and exits the cylinder from the adjacent steam chest in which a sliding valve works. An ordinary double-acting cylinder needs two ports, one at each end; each port deals with steam going both in and out, in other words both admission and exhaust events. The valve controlling these has two valve heads each controlling its own port: as the valve travels, the leading edge of the valve head slides over the port, closing it off, then the valve continues its travel until the other side of the valve head uncovers the port, opening it up to the passage of steam again to exhaust it. One edge of the valve head (admission edge) controls inlet, the valve travels on until the opposite side of the head (exhaust edge) controls exhaust. A sliding valve (whether of the slide-valve or piston-valve type) has to simultaneously control both admission and exhaust steam at either end of the cylinder, and this is where it starts to get complicated. The problem is that the cylinder ends need to be open to exhaust for a longer period than admission, especially at high speed in order to give the exhaust steam time to get out. The wheeze (found in the 1840s) is to make a valve that overlaps the admission edges in such a way as to close the admission port early in the travel, in order be able to use the steam expansively whilst leaving the exhaust port at the other end still open for a short time more to ensure complete evacuation. It is obvious that that lengthening lap means that to carry out its task, the valve must travel a greater distance so it is also obvious that travel derives from lap (lead is a quite different thing). The reason why short lap/travel valves were the norm at the end of the 19th century is because piston speeds were lower and it was the custom to work at longer cut-offs, so if you wanted a fast engine, one way was to increase the size of the driving wheels, which of course reduced tractive power; it was also felt that increased travel meant increased wear, especially with the primitive lubrication of the period. As the early 20th century progressed and trains got heavier, the need was for both power and speed. At first the tendency was to increase boiler size, but taking this too far this upset the the nicely-balanced proportions between the the components that had previously been achieved, also in Britain they were getting to at the limits of the loading gauge. Other balances had to be found. Churchward was the bold pioneer in the matter of valve events and by 1905 had made the first necessary advances in this field (and others) Others followed after WW1; starting with Maunsell and soon Gresley, but unfortunately in his case the advance to long travel valves coincided with his first 3-cylinder Mogul loco with derived valve gear. Due to imperfect bearings, as play developed in the central pivot, long travel in the outside valves became overtravel for the inside valve that started hitting the end of the steam chest. A return to short valve travel was his makeshift expedient for preventing this, but it hamstrung fine locomotives by cutting off the exhaust too soon and choking the cylinders. This was the Pacifics' chronic ailment that allowed them to be easily out-performed by smaller GWR 4-6-0s in 1926. This story is very well told by Nock in his 1945 book of how the Pacifics were able to rapidly realise their potential as soon as the LNER people were able learn from "industrial espionage" of the GWR Castles apparently carried out in the dead of night on one of the visiting engines (I'm sure the GW people turned a blind eye, but they weren't going to give it to them on a plate). This is a classic example of Porta's metaphore: "a chain is only as strong as its weakest link".-- John of Paris ( talk) 13:24, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
It would be churlish of me to refuse to list this article as a GA until what are a few minor problems are sorted, so I won't, as I trust this community of editors to address these minor points.
This is an informative and obviously well-researched article, and I congratulate all of the editors who have worked on it on producing such a fine piece of work. -- Malleus Fatuorum ( talk) 00:16, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
Just intercepted a comment at the FA Peer Review ( Wikipedia:Peer review/LNER Class A1/A3/archive1). We have a serious problem with this article, and that is the slash in the title. This page is actually called "A3" and it is a sub-page of "LNER Class A1". This was discovered because the peer review process picked up the latter as the article title, and I just worked out what's going on!
So, folks. Suggestions for an alternative title please? (one without a slash, that is!)
EdJogg ( talk) 17:33, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
The current lead pargraph begins:
Now to my mind this is grammatically incorrect, although it does now match the current article title.
I would have said it should either start:
...which is what it was previously, or:
In either case, the article name should be changed to suit, with the bold text following LNER as the new title.
My personal preference is for the third version.
Thoughts, please? EdJogg ( talk) 13:08, 21 April 2008 (UTC)
My thought on the issue is to standardise with the other LNER articles, and call it the LNER Gresley Classes A1 and A3, as although they were technically the same locomotive, they were distictly different in vital aspect of their design. -- Bulleid Pacific ( talk) 00:28, 27 May 2008 (UTC)
The article (as it stands) has the three cranks set at 120 degrees, but this is wrong. Because of the inclination of the middle cylinder (Nock has it at 1 in 8 or about 7 degrees) the crank angle differences were 120-113-127. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.177.19.83 ( talk) 02:09, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
< using Gresley conjugated valve gear to derive the motion of the two outside valve spindles >
is putting the cart well before the horse. What the conjugation did was to derive the motion of the inside valve spindle from those of the two outside cylinders!! 86.177.19.83 ( talk) 02:16, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
Is there any authority other than ref. 23 (Reed's 'Profile') for the statement that these were fitted to one locomotive in 1935? I note, without further comment as to the truth of Reed's text, that the books by Bellwood&Jenkinson, Brown and Nock and, presumably, therefore, though I've not read it, the paper by Spencer make no mention of such a fitting. 86.177.19.83 ( talk) 21:40, 12 November 2010 (UTC)
I don't think this article about a British locomotive needs ELEVEN instances of the phrase 'long ton' (or tons) to remind the reader how large the ton is in the UK. The 'long ton' is almost unheard of in British English (which is what this article is written in) except among mensuration anoraks. 86.178.18.228 ( talk) 07:09, 16 January 2011 (UTC)
{{
convert}}
template has been used to achieve both conversion and disambiguation. It might be worth remembering that similar confusion can arise over liquid measures, where the pint (16 or 20 fl. oz.) and gallon (128 or 160 fl. oz.) show an even greater disparity between UK and US versions - the UK measures are 25% larger than the US. --
Redrose64 (
talk)
12:45, 16 January 2011 (UTC)
The A1 and A3s were separate classes, one is a rebuild of the other. So they need to be split. Tony May ( talk) 18:06, 8 March 2012 (UTC)
Hi'
< Eventually all of the A1 locomotives were rebuilt to A3 specifications. >
Not 1470
109.158.245.1 ( talk) 10:25, 10 August 2015 (UTC)
The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:LNER Gresley Classes A1 and A3/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.
Initial assessment at start class as it clearly met that.
B class assessment:-
|
Last edited at 14:06, 2 June 2008 (UTC). Substituted at 21:29, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on LNER Gresley Classes A1 and A3. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
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Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 13:58, 14 December 2017 (UTC)
Not usually someone to edit here and would rather someone else did it so I don't screw up the page by accident
Can the mention of Thompson in the wartime service section be removed, it doesn't actually speak about the wartime performance of these locomotives, it isn't relevant and moreover presents a historically inaccurate view of Thompson as unsynpathetic to Gresley's designs. This trope shouldn't be in this article 1.145.185.55 ( talk) 22:39, 23 February 2022 (UTC)
Talk:LNER Gresley Classes A1 and A3/GA1
The reason why I am bringing this up is because BigSneeze444 removed the mention of Gordon the Big Engine from Thomas & Friends due to it being unsourced. He has also done so to many other pages, including the Caledonian Railway 812 and 652 Classes article, where he removed the mention of Donald and Douglas due to it also being unsourced. However, a variety of other locomotives that the characters were based on, do have mentions of the characters themselves in their respective "In fiction" sections (e.g. GER Class C53, having a mention of Toby The Tram Engine), so if all the other real-life locomotives have mentions of the characters in their "In fiction" section, then this article and the Caledonian Railway 812 and 652 Classes should have "In fiction" mentions of Gordon and Donald and Douglas respectively as well, as long as there's a reliable source for that matter. -- Magnatyrannus ( talk | contribs) 23:06, 9 November 2022 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Much of the article is uncited, including the entire "Wartime service" section. Trainsandotherthings ( talk) 02:08, 26 April 2024 (UTC)