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Reviewer: Axl ( talk • contribs • count) 20:13, 15 September 2011 (UTC)
This article has been at WP:GAN for ages! Okay, I'll review it. Axl ¤ [Talk] 20:13, 15 September 2011 (UTC)
Disclaimer: I do not watch Coronation Street and I had no idea who Kylie Turner was until I saw this article. Axl ¤ [Talk] 20:17, 15 September 2011 (UTC)
From the lead section, paragraph 3: "It was a change in direction for the character, when money was not enough for her to leave "someone she loves"." The latter part of the sentence is a little awkward. How about "It was a change in direction for the character, with the lure of money insufficient for her to leave "someone she loves"."? Axl ¤ [Talk] 20:31, 15 September 2011 (UTC) Done
From the lead section, paragraph 4: "Outlets such as Orange U.K. and the Daily Mirror have favoured her fights with Becky and Tina." What does "favoured" mean in this context? Axl ¤ [Talk] 20:41, 15 September 2011 (UTC) Done
From the lead section, paragraph 4: "However Jaci Stephen of the Daily Mail has criticised Kylie for her deceit and branded some of her material as "dull"." I don't think that Jaci Stephen is important enough to mention her by name. Axl ¤ [Talk] 20:45, 15 September 2011 (UTC) Done
From "Introduction and selling Max", paragraph 1: "Kelly described Kylie and Becky as having a love-hate relationship, but at the time she "wants to kill her"." Who wants to kill whom? Axl ¤ [Talk] 21:25, 15 September 2011 (UTC) Done
From "Introduction and selling Max", paragraph 1: "Lane herself stated that Kylie loves her sister but "feels resentful that she left home when she was only eight."" Who left home when who was eight? Axl ¤ [Talk] 22:07, 15 September 2011 (UTC) Done
Raintheone, thanks for your fixes. Axl ¤ [Talk] 22:28, 18 September 2011 (UTC)
From "Introduction and selling Max", paragraph 2: "Steve decides not to say anything to Becky because he thinks he doesn't trust her." I'm not sure what this means. Axl ¤ [Talk] 22:30, 18 September 2011 (UTC) Done
From "Marriage to David Platt", paragraph 2: "Though stressed: "bearing in mind how possessive Gail is of David, it doesn't bode well for the future." " I'm not sure what this sentence means. Axl ¤ [Talk] 21:05, 19 September 2011 (UTC) Done
The "Storylines" section is lacking in references. I see that similar GAs such as " Becky McDonald" and " Danielle Jones (EastEnders)" also have "Storylines" sections that lack references. Why is this? Is this a deliberate guideline from WikiProject Soap Operas? Axl ¤ [Talk] 21:41, 19 September 2011 (UTC)
From "Storylines", paragraph 1: "Kylie is awarded custody of her son. Later she steals money from the till at Roy's Rolls, and jets off to Cyprus on holiday but returns a couple of weeks later with a new boyfriend, Demetri. She tells Becky that she has come back to take Max to live in Cyprus, leaving Becky heartbroken." When Kylie went to Cyprus, did she leave Max with Becky? Axl ¤ [Talk] 17:21, 20 September 2011 (UTC) Done
From "Storylines", paragraph 2: "Max goes missing on the day of the tram crash." "The tram crash" is introduced as if it is a specific event that the reader should know about. It seems that a tram crashed and Max went missing on the same day. Axl ¤ [Talk] 18:05, 20 September 2011 (UTC) Done
I'm going to skip the "Storylines" section for the time being, until I have WikiProject Soap Operas' consensus view. Axl ¤ [Talk] 22:38, 20 September 2011 (UTC)
From "Reception", paragraph 1: "Tony Stewart of the same publication said that the Kylie and David pairing was brilliant." Did Stewart actually use the word "brilliant"? If so, it should be in inverted commas. If not, it should be replaced with the description that he actually used, in inverted commas. Axl ¤ [Talk] 22:42, 20 September 2011 (UTC) Done
From "Reception", paragraph 1: "When Tina and Graeme asked Kylie to keep their secret...". What secret? Axl ¤ [Talk] 23:25, 20 September 2011 (UTC) Done
Hey Axl. What is the next step of the review. I'm not sure if you are busy atm or not. RaintheOne BAM 00:30, 26 September 2011 (UTC)
Following my concern regarding the lack of sourcing for the "Storylines" section, I reviewed the guidance at WikiProject Soap Operas and invited them to comment. I also invited WikiProject Television to comment, because their guidance was quoted: "Plot summaries do not normally require citations; the television show itself is the source, as the accuracy of the plot description can be verified by watching the episode in question."
WikiProject Soap Operas used this statement in MOSTV to justify the absence of references in their fictional character articles. In my opinion, this guidance applies specifically to episode articles (or lists of episodes) where the individual episode is named.
I invited the WikiProject to add an explicit statement regarding their consensus to their guideline. After several days of silence, Raintheone added a statement:-
"As agreed by wikiproject participants, storyline sections do not require sourcing, as the programme itself acts as the source. These sections can be verified by watching the series."
In my opinion, it is implausible to suggest that information should be verified by watching hundreds of hours of a television series. This statement directly conflicts with verifiability. Nevertheless, this is the justification from WikiProject Soap Operas. Indeed there are several WikiProject Soap Operas fictional character GAs with a similar approach to referencing.
"Kylie Turner" technically meets the WikiProject Soap Operas guideline. Therefore I am reluctantly awarding GA status.
I am not a member of WikiProject Soap Operas and I have no particular interest in Coronation Street or soap operas in general. I took on this GA review because "Kylie Turner" had been waiting at GAN for a long time. (I believe that it was the oldest unreviewed nomination at the time.) It is unfortunate that WikiProject Soap Operas' consensus conflicts with my understanding of WP:V. I shall not review a WikiProject Soap Operas article again.
For completion, I'll list the individual GA criteria:-
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Reviewer: Axl ( talk • contribs • count) 20:13, 15 September 2011 (UTC)
This article has been at WP:GAN for ages! Okay, I'll review it. Axl ¤ [Talk] 20:13, 15 September 2011 (UTC)
Disclaimer: I do not watch Coronation Street and I had no idea who Kylie Turner was until I saw this article. Axl ¤ [Talk] 20:17, 15 September 2011 (UTC)
From the lead section, paragraph 3: "It was a change in direction for the character, when money was not enough for her to leave "someone she loves"." The latter part of the sentence is a little awkward. How about "It was a change in direction for the character, with the lure of money insufficient for her to leave "someone she loves"."? Axl ¤ [Talk] 20:31, 15 September 2011 (UTC) Done
From the lead section, paragraph 4: "Outlets such as Orange U.K. and the Daily Mirror have favoured her fights with Becky and Tina." What does "favoured" mean in this context? Axl ¤ [Talk] 20:41, 15 September 2011 (UTC) Done
From the lead section, paragraph 4: "However Jaci Stephen of the Daily Mail has criticised Kylie for her deceit and branded some of her material as "dull"." I don't think that Jaci Stephen is important enough to mention her by name. Axl ¤ [Talk] 20:45, 15 September 2011 (UTC) Done
From "Introduction and selling Max", paragraph 1: "Kelly described Kylie and Becky as having a love-hate relationship, but at the time she "wants to kill her"." Who wants to kill whom? Axl ¤ [Talk] 21:25, 15 September 2011 (UTC) Done
From "Introduction and selling Max", paragraph 1: "Lane herself stated that Kylie loves her sister but "feels resentful that she left home when she was only eight."" Who left home when who was eight? Axl ¤ [Talk] 22:07, 15 September 2011 (UTC) Done
Raintheone, thanks for your fixes. Axl ¤ [Talk] 22:28, 18 September 2011 (UTC)
From "Introduction and selling Max", paragraph 2: "Steve decides not to say anything to Becky because he thinks he doesn't trust her." I'm not sure what this means. Axl ¤ [Talk] 22:30, 18 September 2011 (UTC) Done
From "Marriage to David Platt", paragraph 2: "Though stressed: "bearing in mind how possessive Gail is of David, it doesn't bode well for the future." " I'm not sure what this sentence means. Axl ¤ [Talk] 21:05, 19 September 2011 (UTC) Done
The "Storylines" section is lacking in references. I see that similar GAs such as " Becky McDonald" and " Danielle Jones (EastEnders)" also have "Storylines" sections that lack references. Why is this? Is this a deliberate guideline from WikiProject Soap Operas? Axl ¤ [Talk] 21:41, 19 September 2011 (UTC)
From "Storylines", paragraph 1: "Kylie is awarded custody of her son. Later she steals money from the till at Roy's Rolls, and jets off to Cyprus on holiday but returns a couple of weeks later with a new boyfriend, Demetri. She tells Becky that she has come back to take Max to live in Cyprus, leaving Becky heartbroken." When Kylie went to Cyprus, did she leave Max with Becky? Axl ¤ [Talk] 17:21, 20 September 2011 (UTC) Done
From "Storylines", paragraph 2: "Max goes missing on the day of the tram crash." "The tram crash" is introduced as if it is a specific event that the reader should know about. It seems that a tram crashed and Max went missing on the same day. Axl ¤ [Talk] 18:05, 20 September 2011 (UTC) Done
I'm going to skip the "Storylines" section for the time being, until I have WikiProject Soap Operas' consensus view. Axl ¤ [Talk] 22:38, 20 September 2011 (UTC)
From "Reception", paragraph 1: "Tony Stewart of the same publication said that the Kylie and David pairing was brilliant." Did Stewart actually use the word "brilliant"? If so, it should be in inverted commas. If not, it should be replaced with the description that he actually used, in inverted commas. Axl ¤ [Talk] 22:42, 20 September 2011 (UTC) Done
From "Reception", paragraph 1: "When Tina and Graeme asked Kylie to keep their secret...". What secret? Axl ¤ [Talk] 23:25, 20 September 2011 (UTC) Done
Hey Axl. What is the next step of the review. I'm not sure if you are busy atm or not. RaintheOne BAM 00:30, 26 September 2011 (UTC)
Following my concern regarding the lack of sourcing for the "Storylines" section, I reviewed the guidance at WikiProject Soap Operas and invited them to comment. I also invited WikiProject Television to comment, because their guidance was quoted: "Plot summaries do not normally require citations; the television show itself is the source, as the accuracy of the plot description can be verified by watching the episode in question."
WikiProject Soap Operas used this statement in MOSTV to justify the absence of references in their fictional character articles. In my opinion, this guidance applies specifically to episode articles (or lists of episodes) where the individual episode is named.
I invited the WikiProject to add an explicit statement regarding their consensus to their guideline. After several days of silence, Raintheone added a statement:-
"As agreed by wikiproject participants, storyline sections do not require sourcing, as the programme itself acts as the source. These sections can be verified by watching the series."
In my opinion, it is implausible to suggest that information should be verified by watching hundreds of hours of a television series. This statement directly conflicts with verifiability. Nevertheless, this is the justification from WikiProject Soap Operas. Indeed there are several WikiProject Soap Operas fictional character GAs with a similar approach to referencing.
"Kylie Turner" technically meets the WikiProject Soap Operas guideline. Therefore I am reluctantly awarding GA status.
I am not a member of WikiProject Soap Operas and I have no particular interest in Coronation Street or soap operas in general. I took on this GA review because "Kylie Turner" had been waiting at GAN for a long time. (I believe that it was the oldest unreviewed nomination at the time.) It is unfortunate that WikiProject Soap Operas' consensus conflicts with my understanding of WP:V. I shall not review a WikiProject Soap Operas article again.
For completion, I'll list the individual GA criteria:-