![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 |
Ugg. The picture for this was done in MS paint. Can't we manage better than this?-- Crucible Guardian 19:30, 11 July 2005 (UTC)
Or somehting similar with a laser engraving a rock with the message? Rich Farmbrough 10:12, 13 October 2005 (UTC)
I added a new image to the page of the WWII kilroy. Its better quality than the drawing at the top, but since the traditional use is grafitti, and this is an engraving, I don't know if it is fitting to be the top level picture. Gaijin42 20:40, 15 May 2006 (UTC)
Huh? What the hell is with that far fetched crok of shit? If that merits two lines, I'll come up with my own wackier theory. -- Fizzl
Should really be updated to Kit, Weapon, Helmet & Computer.
222.154.185.27 04:36, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
Clap your hands and jump with joy, For you were here before Kilroy.
Sorry, boys, to spoil your joke. I was here but my pen was broke ! —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 85.68.238.55 ( talk) 07:16, 7 February 2007 (UTC).
thought i'd just tell people i've made a kilroy was here userbox. Template:User kilroy was here
Patrick ( talk) 21:27, 16 December 2006 (UTC)
User:Pengwiin/Userboxes/kilroywashere Pengwiin 21:25, 23 March 2007 (UTC)
On my commute to work today, I was stuck behind a truck for Kilroy Movers [1], an East Coast moving company and I noticed that the truck had markings claiming that they were the originators of "Kilroy was here". I don't know whether this is to be believed or not but the claim does exist. -- gwax UN ( say hi) 14:49, 15 May 2006 (UTC)
Maybe we should create a section for all these different theories and claims about the origin of "kilroy was here" and the associated doodle. Vsst 22:59, 15 June 2007 (UTC)
...is mentioned twice...fix it if I'm right, please... 76.217.102.155 22:03, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
Anyone know enough about this 2006 film to write up a page for it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Emurphy42 ( talk • contribs) 03:45, 10 January 2008 (UTC)
Image:Seriemagasinet.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
BetacommandBot ( talk) 07:51, 15 January 2008 (UTC)
Growing up in the 70s and 80s, my parents, grandparents, and great grandparents always had these ceramics of the Kilroy head and hand peeking over the tops of bookcase and curios (with the nose and fingers coming over the edge exactly like the Kilroy graphic). They called them "room watchers" and said they were good luck. I have inherited one and for a time it "lived" in my apartment. (I think it's in storage right now.)
Anyway, I came here looking for a reference to the ceramic incarnations. Perhaps it was not a widely known thing. I did have a relative that did ceramics for the family and perhaps she just made them for us to have. But, if anyone out there has also seen or heard of this, I'd be interested in knowing and maybe seeing a mention on the page.
If I ever find mine again, I'll try to get a picture taken to be uploaded. Medleystudios72 ( talk) 14:45, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
Classifying two of the urban legends with 'Dubious' is redundant, to say the least.
Being called an urban legend already casts the appropriate level of doubt on the plausibility of the two stories. Also tagging them as dubious has the unintended effect of saying "It's doubtful that this is really an urban legend", as opposed to the intended effect of saying "It's doubtful that this is true." Most readers should be intelligent enough to know that urban legends are seldom true, thus making the 'dubious' tag completely unnecessary (and possibly misleading) in this case. 130.164.66.223 ( talk) 19:29, 25 August 2008 (UTC)BDabbs 8/25/08
[Another legend states that the Transit Company of America held a competition in 1946 offering a real trolley car to the man who could verify he was the "real Kilroy". J. J. Kilroy brought his co-workers with him to prove that he was undeniably the true Kilroy. The other forty or so men who showed up were not able to establish they were the "real" Kilroy. Kilroy gave his prize to his nine children to play with in their front yard.]
a) This is not a legend, it is a newspaper article cited by the Wiki author as the most likely explanation of the "Kilroy was here" phrase, itself subsequently merged with the famous drawing.
b) Legends don't 'state' anything, that's their nature. The introductory phrase you are looking for is "According to another legend," a WAF pilot saw this written on the side of a UFO, or whatever. Bear in mind, too, that not all legends are urban legends. Urban legends are pretty much an email phenomenon and have a unique structure and propagation.
c) In the late forties and early fifties we took great pleasure in accessing the most inaccessible places we could imagine upon which to scratch this appealing element of culture. We (of course) included false dates. I, personally, applied this graffito to the end of one of the giant beams upon which the dome of Washington state's capitol rests and dated it with my sister's birthdate of August 21, 1939. We also relished putting it on various structural members of the many new buildings going up in the post-War building boom, the insides of 4' sewer pipes waiting to be buried the next day, the concrete footing of a bank vault awaiting installation, the flagpole on the Smith Tower, and so forth. The joy of the graffito was in drawing it without a horizontal line; rather, the line was implied by the fingers and nose. Sometimes my personal variation added a pot belly and clown feet; further elaboration included shabby shoes with a big toe sticking out, and a scraggle of ramen noodle-y hair.
It isn't ancient history. Read such seniors' sites as "Suddenly Senior" and check out the articles and readers' comments to learn from those who lived the era. Good grief, all y'alls, Bill Mauldin only just died in 2003!
fwiw SeattleSue ( talk) 21:49, 22 October 2008 (UTC)
The article says this is all over the world. I would love to see some examples added to the article. Any ideas?-- Anna Frodesiak ( talk) 15:00, 10 December 2008 (UTC)
This doodle is given godly status in thsi article. Why? Soldiers would doodle it here or there to let next companies know the area was passed through. citation needed What are all these asinine legends around it? If it doesn’t have some sort of citation, just delete it. My god, wiki is trying to fill an entire page with nonsense. "as usual"
What are you talking about? This graffiti is famous. It is not just limited to soilders in WW2. It has been seen all over the world in cities, towns everywhere. It has fallen out of practice in the last 30 years, but for I time everyone was drawing it everywhere. And no need to take the lords name in vane. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.40.63.122 ( talk) 06:53, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
-G
Kilroy is on the WWII memorial in D.C.
They missed the Styx song,Mr. Roboto. The song ends with "This time has come at last, To throw away this mask, so everyone can see, my true identity... I'm Kilroy! Kilroy! Kilroy!"
Well, I am sure everything in this article is NPOV and accurate ;) -- Cimon Avaro on a pogo stick 19:14 21 Jun 2003 (UTC)
Totally Kilroy rocks. I say its the best griffiti ever. If it spooks Hitler, its okay with me. :) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.231.195.195 ( talk) 06:16, 30 January 2009 (UTC)
And I don't even get what it is. 216.227.90.154 ( talk) 23:15, 11 November 2008 (UTC) Creepy isn't the word. There's something wrong with in some indescribable way.-- Anna Frodesiak ( talk) 14:59, 10 December 2008 (UTC)
Yes, Anna, and I misread all my live "Killjoy" because he is controlling over the fence. Nowar was here —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.233.199.241 ( talk) 15:59, 14 September 2009 (UTC)
I thought someone would have made reference to Thomas Pynchon's "V". I think the Kilroy reference is in the article of "V".
Is it appropriate to mention this here? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.12.150.147 ( talk) 04:42, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
It seems that "Herbie was here" was a Canadian equivalent of "Kilroy was here". Herbie was a cartoon character created in 1944 by Bing Coughlin for the Maple Leaf, a Canadian forces magazine. His face resembles Chad, and even used the phrase "Wot, no--?" at least once. The sourcing isn't great so I'm not sure about including this. [2] [3] [4] Fences& Windows 00:00, 14 June 2010 (UTC)
Kilroy Travels [5] is a Finnish travel agency. Should it be included? JIP | Talk 15:03, 3 March 2006 (UTC)
That depends. Was the name of the agency based on the "Kilroy was here" phenomenon? If so, then it could be mentioned. Vsst 22:57, 15 June 2007 (UTC)
In an edit in 2004, Tannin asserts
I hav livd in Australia my entire life, and hav never seen this. Can enyone verify it? MichaelWard 03:00, 29 April 2006 (UTC)
As a child of the '80's, I have WRITTEN and doodled all over my home town with 'foo woz ere' but I have no idea how it came about. Sorry... just something that was a big fad in the 70's and 80's in rural Victoria. 203.208.91.192 04:13, 11 May 2007 (UTC)rosewart
In the Squaresoft (now Square-Enix) game Vagrant Story, there's a room among the dungeon maps that has the title "Kilroy was Here" in it, though I don't remember exactly which room it was. Mimeblade ( talk) 20:00, 9 June 2008 (UTC)
killroy pops up in halo 3 too —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.155.60.89 ( talk) 01:47, 23 July 2008 (UTC)
Back in the 60s or 70s I read a computer programming book -- don't recall the name. That book had many instances of a Kilroy cartoon being used to add levity and to illustrate various concepts; that was my first encounter with Kilroy. But when I made some enquiries I learned that it was a WWII remnant that was still part of popular culture of the WWII generation, but only distant echos of it were being passed down/retained by the newer generations. codeslinger compsalot
67.40.8.215 (
talk)
15:22, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
"n the United Kingdom, such graffiti are known as "chads"."
No. No they aren't. Not to my knowledge, anyway. I live in the UK, and I've never heard the thing refereed to as anything other than 'the Kilroy woz here' cartoon, or similar. Either that, or the 'wot, no ___?' cartoon. WikiReaderer 18:32, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
I've never heard it either, and mentioning it to my mother she never had either.-- 85.183.157.253 ( talk) 09:05, 4 April 2009 (UTC)
Yup, I concur, growing up in the 70s in England they were referred to as "Chads" or "Mr Chad". I also owned a ceramic bookshelf Chad and purchased a secondhand vinyl copy of Pink Floyd's "The Wall" album where the previous owner had written "Chad Woz Ere" on it. I also comment my source code to this day with my name and Woz Ere. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.151.148.141 ( talk) 19:20, 10 March 2011 (UTC)
Currently the last line of this section cites this page: [6] as a source... I'm not sure of the validity of this, as it's a link to h2g2, a user-contributed collaboration which itself cites no reference... granted, I haven't actually read WP:V, but the way I see it you might as well be citing this: [7] as a source. 216.57.96.1 15:50, 8 September 2007 (UTC)
Chavs, you Numpty — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.95.79.171 ( talk) 04:11, 3 October 2011 (UTC)
Modern military installations have "Wagner Loves the Cock" written all over their porta-johns. This has been reported in FOBs as a part of Operation Iraqi Freedom as well as Operation Enduring Freedom. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.66.101.173 ( talk) 20:38, 12 November 2011 (UTC)
I thikn we need to trim pop culture refs to ones that are particularly notable or exemplary. THis is a very popular phrase, and no doubt has been used in multitudes of places. Every individual tv episode or novel that did a 1 second gag using this is not needed to be mentioned. Gaijin42 ( talk) 17:09, 4 April 2012 (UTC)
I have restored material that was deleted as lacking references. Primary references (i.e., the episodes themselves) are fine for simple factual descriptions. μηδείς ( talk) 20:23, 26 August 2013 (UTC)
Kilroy also shows up as graffiti in the popular Counter-Strike series by Valve. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.171.222.253 ( talk) 07:45, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
I'm loathe to correct such a formidable polymath as Thomas Pynchon, but the circuit so depicted (as a series element) would be a band-stop filter (a notch filter); it could be part of a band-pass filter when inserted in parallel with the load. Rt3368 ( talk) 10:40, 20 June 2014 (UTC)
The theory that Kilroy was a deliberate nod by the US Army to a 17th century French dramatist was added by an IP sourced to "U.S. Army Slang, 2014, Anthony DiFatta, 2014 Self Published" - I cut it as WP:SPS and it was added back by User:Hungryusa without the source. Has this theory ever appeared outside of a recently self-published book? -- McGeddon ( talk) 21:52, 30 July 2014 (UTC)
Sir, have you considered the possibility before Kilroy was Here was recorded posthumously, the idea sprang from the "learning curve" during WWII. I understand we are at peace with other continents, yet, has America lost it's "learning curve" of a theory of itself "Kilroy Is Here", to the degree that computers and learning curve are available for learning, editing, and correcting? Thank you.
71.80.114.166 (
talk)
13:32, 11 August 2014 (UTC)HungryUSA
Hi - noob user here!
I made an account just to share what I think might be a very early sighting of Kilroy, at the Abbey of Sainte Foy in Conques, France. An article about the Abbey has a photo of carving above a doorway, thusly: /info/en/?search=Abbey_Church_of_Saint_Foy#/media/File:Conques_doorway_carving_2003_IMG_6330.JPG
Today I saw a photo circulating on Facebook, which has detail of that carving, thusly: https://gyazo.com/6cfc5dfefd1e0959981e93d97d6e5763
Hmmmm -- Caffieve ( talk) 16:12, 18 January 2016 (UTC)
In 2006 I added to "Popular Culture" an entry that stated "In the Podiobook 7th Son, a computer hacker who claims to be everywhere and be able to find out anything calls himself Kilroy 2.0" This was apparently removed when the page I created on the podcast was deleted. I believe the entry in this article is still valid. Here is the author's page about it which mentiones Kilroy 2.0 as a character, other sources that discuss it are Podiobooks ( part one and part two), [http://www.amazon.com/7th-Son-J-C-Hutchins/dp/0312384378 Amazon], and a review on Goodreads. Additionally, author has an entry on Wikipedia ( here) and the book is mentioned in the Wikipedia disambiguation entry " Seventh Son". I've had little success over the years of editing pages so I don't know how to add this properly so it is "acceptable" by the community.
Please advise how I should add this entry so it is "acceptable". -- Nerdvana ( talk) 15:00, 21 May 2016 (UTC)
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@ Dilidor: In my opinion, the Disney program Kilroy is not "ephemeral" or "alluded to on TV". Yes, the program is over 50 years old. But it's not anymore "ephemeral" than Viereck, Asimov and Pynchon. As I understand it, Viereck, Pynchon and Ken Young only mention Kilroy once. Isn't that the definition of "alluded to"?
(For those of you who don't know what we're discussing, yesterday Dilidor reverted my one-sentence addition about an example for TV to the article's "In popular culture" section. The section had the inline comment "Do not list frivolous and ephemeral examples of how Kilroy is mentioned or alluded to on TV shows, pop songs, advertising, etc.")
The Disney segment took up 4 hours over 4 weeks, is named for Kilroy and is the best TV program (so far as I know) that make references, many times, to the Kilroy legend. Why is that ephemeral? After all, the article itself is about something that happened 75 years ago.
And why should we contributors not list examples from TV, songs and ads just because someone has written an inline comment that says that we shouldn't? Who gave them the overriding authority to say what is and what is not part of the article? It is, at most, advice to one editor from another. Is isn't even signed. I take a different view.
The reason I edited the section was that I felt that something was left out. The article says "Kilroy has been seen in numerous television series and films and in computer and video games." And then it doesn't give examples. Why are essays and sci-fi stories OK but TV and movies are not?
Now if you can think of some other example of a TV program (or film) that weaves the legend of Kilroy Was Here with its story, fine, we'll use that. But if you can't, I think the Disney program should remain in to give an example of "Kilroy has been seen in numerous television series..." -- RoyGoldsmith ( talk) 03:36, 7 February 2019 (UTC)
James J Kilroy was the man behind the signature. an inspector, lived in Boston, Massachusetts, served in the Legislature and during World War II worked in a shipyard in Quincy where the famous saying was born. Millions of service men saw the slogan on the outgoing ships and all they knew was that "Kilroy" had been there first. Service men began placing the graffiti wherever the US Forces landed, claiming it was already there when they arrived. Kilroy then became the "Super-GI" who had always already been wherever the GIs went.
That's pure speculation, we should have more theories.
J. J. Kilroy was a rivet counter. He tagged the panels after counting the rivets so those rivets would not get counted again.
per: Research team at the History Channel.
How about adding this [9], or at least a mention of it. Not really off topic given what other articles contain.
gary was here — Preceding unsigned comment added by Garywasheree ( talk • contribs) 21:21, 26 March 2021 (UTC)
I added the following sentence to the "In popular culture" section:
In 1983 the American rock band Styx released a concept album Kilroy Was Here; beyond the title, there's no reference to the Kilroy meme, rather the album is named after its protagonist, one Robert Orin Charles Kilroy. [1]
References
An editor, User:Skyerise, rolled it back (per WP:BRD, and fine), with an edit summary of "That's what we call a 'mere mention' which doesn't merit a listing, indicated by lack of sources". So here I am, to make a case for this material. So let's see...
I don't know what the problem with "mere mention"s is but the entire section is mostly (not entirely) made of mere mentions. If we want to delete or severely trim the section, OK, but that's a different question altogether. Absent that, deleting this one entry seems kind of random... I assume it was picked up on a recent changes watchlist, and fine, I use those a lot myself, but in this case, there's no reason to single it out. Herostratus ( talk) 02:28, 28 June 2021 (UTC)
When trying to decide if a pop culture reference is appropriate to an article, ask yourself the following:
1. Has the subject (if a person or organization) acknowledged the existence of the reference? 2. Have multiple reliable sources pointed out the reference? 3. Did any real-world event occur because of the cultural element covered by the reference? 4. Did the referencing material significantly depend on the specific subject? For example, if the reference is to a specific model of car, did the material use that model car for some reason, or was it just a case of "use a well-known name of a car"?
If you cannot answer "yes" to at least one of these, you are probably just adding trivia. Get three or more, and you are probably adding genuinely encyclopedic content.
See the newly published New Yale Book of Quotations (Yale University Press) for the earliest known citations for "Kilroy" phrases. Fred Shapiro — Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.132.173.152 ( talk) 18:14, 19 October 2021 (UTC)
There's a lot of urban legends in this article, but it is lacking in solid facts. The most authoritative source for quotation origins is the New Yale Book of Quotations, which has documented citations of "Kilroy" appearing as early as April 21, 1945. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:192:80:99D0:BC44:F1D8:A11B:E991 ( talk) 13:35, 1 January 2023 (UTC)
It is extremely surprising that this question has not been brought up more times on the talk page. Firstly, the word "meme" is a neologism, and should not be used to describe a historical topic. Secondly, the materials cited for this claim are all unreliable info articles, the author even citing "Vox.com" The only reason why I didn't edit this is that I don't think I have the authority to make changes to such an important article without any outside input. That being said, does anybody have anything to say concerning this topic? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.141.103.123 ( talk) 19:02, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
It isn't a meme, the people who drew it didn't think it was a meme, the only reference to it as a meme comes from a magazine article in 2020. It's an absolutely preposterous description. Yellowmellow45 ( talk) 02:20, 30 November 2022 (UTC)
Originally, reading Kilroy described as a meme sort of shocked me and I instantly thought "That doesn't seem right." But after reading through the sources, it seems a reasonable description. I think that the word "meme" has seriously evolved over the last few years to include many more ideas and characters. I think even though the word did not exist at the time -it does now- and accurately describes the subject. I would vote to keep the meme description.(Although if someone wanted to, I think it could be useful to add a sentence or two explaining how the word didn't exist at the time and has only been used to describe it recently) GoldMiner24 Talk 05:16, 5 December 2022 (UTC)
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 |
Ugg. The picture for this was done in MS paint. Can't we manage better than this?-- Crucible Guardian 19:30, 11 July 2005 (UTC)
Or somehting similar with a laser engraving a rock with the message? Rich Farmbrough 10:12, 13 October 2005 (UTC)
I added a new image to the page of the WWII kilroy. Its better quality than the drawing at the top, but since the traditional use is grafitti, and this is an engraving, I don't know if it is fitting to be the top level picture. Gaijin42 20:40, 15 May 2006 (UTC)
Huh? What the hell is with that far fetched crok of shit? If that merits two lines, I'll come up with my own wackier theory. -- Fizzl
Should really be updated to Kit, Weapon, Helmet & Computer.
222.154.185.27 04:36, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
Clap your hands and jump with joy, For you were here before Kilroy.
Sorry, boys, to spoil your joke. I was here but my pen was broke ! —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 85.68.238.55 ( talk) 07:16, 7 February 2007 (UTC).
thought i'd just tell people i've made a kilroy was here userbox. Template:User kilroy was here
Patrick ( talk) 21:27, 16 December 2006 (UTC)
User:Pengwiin/Userboxes/kilroywashere Pengwiin 21:25, 23 March 2007 (UTC)
On my commute to work today, I was stuck behind a truck for Kilroy Movers [1], an East Coast moving company and I noticed that the truck had markings claiming that they were the originators of "Kilroy was here". I don't know whether this is to be believed or not but the claim does exist. -- gwax UN ( say hi) 14:49, 15 May 2006 (UTC)
Maybe we should create a section for all these different theories and claims about the origin of "kilroy was here" and the associated doodle. Vsst 22:59, 15 June 2007 (UTC)
...is mentioned twice...fix it if I'm right, please... 76.217.102.155 22:03, 28 October 2007 (UTC)
Anyone know enough about this 2006 film to write up a page for it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Emurphy42 ( talk • contribs) 03:45, 10 January 2008 (UTC)
Image:Seriemagasinet.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
BetacommandBot ( talk) 07:51, 15 January 2008 (UTC)
Growing up in the 70s and 80s, my parents, grandparents, and great grandparents always had these ceramics of the Kilroy head and hand peeking over the tops of bookcase and curios (with the nose and fingers coming over the edge exactly like the Kilroy graphic). They called them "room watchers" and said they were good luck. I have inherited one and for a time it "lived" in my apartment. (I think it's in storage right now.)
Anyway, I came here looking for a reference to the ceramic incarnations. Perhaps it was not a widely known thing. I did have a relative that did ceramics for the family and perhaps she just made them for us to have. But, if anyone out there has also seen or heard of this, I'd be interested in knowing and maybe seeing a mention on the page.
If I ever find mine again, I'll try to get a picture taken to be uploaded. Medleystudios72 ( talk) 14:45, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
Classifying two of the urban legends with 'Dubious' is redundant, to say the least.
Being called an urban legend already casts the appropriate level of doubt on the plausibility of the two stories. Also tagging them as dubious has the unintended effect of saying "It's doubtful that this is really an urban legend", as opposed to the intended effect of saying "It's doubtful that this is true." Most readers should be intelligent enough to know that urban legends are seldom true, thus making the 'dubious' tag completely unnecessary (and possibly misleading) in this case. 130.164.66.223 ( talk) 19:29, 25 August 2008 (UTC)BDabbs 8/25/08
[Another legend states that the Transit Company of America held a competition in 1946 offering a real trolley car to the man who could verify he was the "real Kilroy". J. J. Kilroy brought his co-workers with him to prove that he was undeniably the true Kilroy. The other forty or so men who showed up were not able to establish they were the "real" Kilroy. Kilroy gave his prize to his nine children to play with in their front yard.]
a) This is not a legend, it is a newspaper article cited by the Wiki author as the most likely explanation of the "Kilroy was here" phrase, itself subsequently merged with the famous drawing.
b) Legends don't 'state' anything, that's their nature. The introductory phrase you are looking for is "According to another legend," a WAF pilot saw this written on the side of a UFO, or whatever. Bear in mind, too, that not all legends are urban legends. Urban legends are pretty much an email phenomenon and have a unique structure and propagation.
c) In the late forties and early fifties we took great pleasure in accessing the most inaccessible places we could imagine upon which to scratch this appealing element of culture. We (of course) included false dates. I, personally, applied this graffito to the end of one of the giant beams upon which the dome of Washington state's capitol rests and dated it with my sister's birthdate of August 21, 1939. We also relished putting it on various structural members of the many new buildings going up in the post-War building boom, the insides of 4' sewer pipes waiting to be buried the next day, the concrete footing of a bank vault awaiting installation, the flagpole on the Smith Tower, and so forth. The joy of the graffito was in drawing it without a horizontal line; rather, the line was implied by the fingers and nose. Sometimes my personal variation added a pot belly and clown feet; further elaboration included shabby shoes with a big toe sticking out, and a scraggle of ramen noodle-y hair.
It isn't ancient history. Read such seniors' sites as "Suddenly Senior" and check out the articles and readers' comments to learn from those who lived the era. Good grief, all y'alls, Bill Mauldin only just died in 2003!
fwiw SeattleSue ( talk) 21:49, 22 October 2008 (UTC)
The article says this is all over the world. I would love to see some examples added to the article. Any ideas?-- Anna Frodesiak ( talk) 15:00, 10 December 2008 (UTC)
This doodle is given godly status in thsi article. Why? Soldiers would doodle it here or there to let next companies know the area was passed through. citation needed What are all these asinine legends around it? If it doesn’t have some sort of citation, just delete it. My god, wiki is trying to fill an entire page with nonsense. "as usual"
What are you talking about? This graffiti is famous. It is not just limited to soilders in WW2. It has been seen all over the world in cities, towns everywhere. It has fallen out of practice in the last 30 years, but for I time everyone was drawing it everywhere. And no need to take the lords name in vane. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.40.63.122 ( talk) 06:53, 26 August 2008 (UTC)
-G
Kilroy is on the WWII memorial in D.C.
They missed the Styx song,Mr. Roboto. The song ends with "This time has come at last, To throw away this mask, so everyone can see, my true identity... I'm Kilroy! Kilroy! Kilroy!"
Well, I am sure everything in this article is NPOV and accurate ;) -- Cimon Avaro on a pogo stick 19:14 21 Jun 2003 (UTC)
Totally Kilroy rocks. I say its the best griffiti ever. If it spooks Hitler, its okay with me. :) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.231.195.195 ( talk) 06:16, 30 January 2009 (UTC)
And I don't even get what it is. 216.227.90.154 ( talk) 23:15, 11 November 2008 (UTC) Creepy isn't the word. There's something wrong with in some indescribable way.-- Anna Frodesiak ( talk) 14:59, 10 December 2008 (UTC)
Yes, Anna, and I misread all my live "Killjoy" because he is controlling over the fence. Nowar was here —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.233.199.241 ( talk) 15:59, 14 September 2009 (UTC)
I thought someone would have made reference to Thomas Pynchon's "V". I think the Kilroy reference is in the article of "V".
Is it appropriate to mention this here? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.12.150.147 ( talk) 04:42, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
It seems that "Herbie was here" was a Canadian equivalent of "Kilroy was here". Herbie was a cartoon character created in 1944 by Bing Coughlin for the Maple Leaf, a Canadian forces magazine. His face resembles Chad, and even used the phrase "Wot, no--?" at least once. The sourcing isn't great so I'm not sure about including this. [2] [3] [4] Fences& Windows 00:00, 14 June 2010 (UTC)
Kilroy Travels [5] is a Finnish travel agency. Should it be included? JIP | Talk 15:03, 3 March 2006 (UTC)
That depends. Was the name of the agency based on the "Kilroy was here" phenomenon? If so, then it could be mentioned. Vsst 22:57, 15 June 2007 (UTC)
In an edit in 2004, Tannin asserts
I hav livd in Australia my entire life, and hav never seen this. Can enyone verify it? MichaelWard 03:00, 29 April 2006 (UTC)
As a child of the '80's, I have WRITTEN and doodled all over my home town with 'foo woz ere' but I have no idea how it came about. Sorry... just something that was a big fad in the 70's and 80's in rural Victoria. 203.208.91.192 04:13, 11 May 2007 (UTC)rosewart
In the Squaresoft (now Square-Enix) game Vagrant Story, there's a room among the dungeon maps that has the title "Kilroy was Here" in it, though I don't remember exactly which room it was. Mimeblade ( talk) 20:00, 9 June 2008 (UTC)
killroy pops up in halo 3 too —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.155.60.89 ( talk) 01:47, 23 July 2008 (UTC)
Back in the 60s or 70s I read a computer programming book -- don't recall the name. That book had many instances of a Kilroy cartoon being used to add levity and to illustrate various concepts; that was my first encounter with Kilroy. But when I made some enquiries I learned that it was a WWII remnant that was still part of popular culture of the WWII generation, but only distant echos of it were being passed down/retained by the newer generations. codeslinger compsalot
67.40.8.215 (
talk)
15:22, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
"n the United Kingdom, such graffiti are known as "chads"."
No. No they aren't. Not to my knowledge, anyway. I live in the UK, and I've never heard the thing refereed to as anything other than 'the Kilroy woz here' cartoon, or similar. Either that, or the 'wot, no ___?' cartoon. WikiReaderer 18:32, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
I've never heard it either, and mentioning it to my mother she never had either.-- 85.183.157.253 ( talk) 09:05, 4 April 2009 (UTC)
Yup, I concur, growing up in the 70s in England they were referred to as "Chads" or "Mr Chad". I also owned a ceramic bookshelf Chad and purchased a secondhand vinyl copy of Pink Floyd's "The Wall" album where the previous owner had written "Chad Woz Ere" on it. I also comment my source code to this day with my name and Woz Ere. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.151.148.141 ( talk) 19:20, 10 March 2011 (UTC)
Currently the last line of this section cites this page: [6] as a source... I'm not sure of the validity of this, as it's a link to h2g2, a user-contributed collaboration which itself cites no reference... granted, I haven't actually read WP:V, but the way I see it you might as well be citing this: [7] as a source. 216.57.96.1 15:50, 8 September 2007 (UTC)
Chavs, you Numpty — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.95.79.171 ( talk) 04:11, 3 October 2011 (UTC)
Modern military installations have "Wagner Loves the Cock" written all over their porta-johns. This has been reported in FOBs as a part of Operation Iraqi Freedom as well as Operation Enduring Freedom. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.66.101.173 ( talk) 20:38, 12 November 2011 (UTC)
I thikn we need to trim pop culture refs to ones that are particularly notable or exemplary. THis is a very popular phrase, and no doubt has been used in multitudes of places. Every individual tv episode or novel that did a 1 second gag using this is not needed to be mentioned. Gaijin42 ( talk) 17:09, 4 April 2012 (UTC)
I have restored material that was deleted as lacking references. Primary references (i.e., the episodes themselves) are fine for simple factual descriptions. μηδείς ( talk) 20:23, 26 August 2013 (UTC)
Kilroy also shows up as graffiti in the popular Counter-Strike series by Valve. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.171.222.253 ( talk) 07:45, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
I'm loathe to correct such a formidable polymath as Thomas Pynchon, but the circuit so depicted (as a series element) would be a band-stop filter (a notch filter); it could be part of a band-pass filter when inserted in parallel with the load. Rt3368 ( talk) 10:40, 20 June 2014 (UTC)
The theory that Kilroy was a deliberate nod by the US Army to a 17th century French dramatist was added by an IP sourced to "U.S. Army Slang, 2014, Anthony DiFatta, 2014 Self Published" - I cut it as WP:SPS and it was added back by User:Hungryusa without the source. Has this theory ever appeared outside of a recently self-published book? -- McGeddon ( talk) 21:52, 30 July 2014 (UTC)
Sir, have you considered the possibility before Kilroy was Here was recorded posthumously, the idea sprang from the "learning curve" during WWII. I understand we are at peace with other continents, yet, has America lost it's "learning curve" of a theory of itself "Kilroy Is Here", to the degree that computers and learning curve are available for learning, editing, and correcting? Thank you.
71.80.114.166 (
talk)
13:32, 11 August 2014 (UTC)HungryUSA
Hi - noob user here!
I made an account just to share what I think might be a very early sighting of Kilroy, at the Abbey of Sainte Foy in Conques, France. An article about the Abbey has a photo of carving above a doorway, thusly: /info/en/?search=Abbey_Church_of_Saint_Foy#/media/File:Conques_doorway_carving_2003_IMG_6330.JPG
Today I saw a photo circulating on Facebook, which has detail of that carving, thusly: https://gyazo.com/6cfc5dfefd1e0959981e93d97d6e5763
Hmmmm -- Caffieve ( talk) 16:12, 18 January 2016 (UTC)
In 2006 I added to "Popular Culture" an entry that stated "In the Podiobook 7th Son, a computer hacker who claims to be everywhere and be able to find out anything calls himself Kilroy 2.0" This was apparently removed when the page I created on the podcast was deleted. I believe the entry in this article is still valid. Here is the author's page about it which mentiones Kilroy 2.0 as a character, other sources that discuss it are Podiobooks ( part one and part two), [http://www.amazon.com/7th-Son-J-C-Hutchins/dp/0312384378 Amazon], and a review on Goodreads. Additionally, author has an entry on Wikipedia ( here) and the book is mentioned in the Wikipedia disambiguation entry " Seventh Son". I've had little success over the years of editing pages so I don't know how to add this properly so it is "acceptable" by the community.
Please advise how I should add this entry so it is "acceptable". -- Nerdvana ( talk) 15:00, 21 May 2016 (UTC)
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@ Dilidor: In my opinion, the Disney program Kilroy is not "ephemeral" or "alluded to on TV". Yes, the program is over 50 years old. But it's not anymore "ephemeral" than Viereck, Asimov and Pynchon. As I understand it, Viereck, Pynchon and Ken Young only mention Kilroy once. Isn't that the definition of "alluded to"?
(For those of you who don't know what we're discussing, yesterday Dilidor reverted my one-sentence addition about an example for TV to the article's "In popular culture" section. The section had the inline comment "Do not list frivolous and ephemeral examples of how Kilroy is mentioned or alluded to on TV shows, pop songs, advertising, etc.")
The Disney segment took up 4 hours over 4 weeks, is named for Kilroy and is the best TV program (so far as I know) that make references, many times, to the Kilroy legend. Why is that ephemeral? After all, the article itself is about something that happened 75 years ago.
And why should we contributors not list examples from TV, songs and ads just because someone has written an inline comment that says that we shouldn't? Who gave them the overriding authority to say what is and what is not part of the article? It is, at most, advice to one editor from another. Is isn't even signed. I take a different view.
The reason I edited the section was that I felt that something was left out. The article says "Kilroy has been seen in numerous television series and films and in computer and video games." And then it doesn't give examples. Why are essays and sci-fi stories OK but TV and movies are not?
Now if you can think of some other example of a TV program (or film) that weaves the legend of Kilroy Was Here with its story, fine, we'll use that. But if you can't, I think the Disney program should remain in to give an example of "Kilroy has been seen in numerous television series..." -- RoyGoldsmith ( talk) 03:36, 7 February 2019 (UTC)
James J Kilroy was the man behind the signature. an inspector, lived in Boston, Massachusetts, served in the Legislature and during World War II worked in a shipyard in Quincy where the famous saying was born. Millions of service men saw the slogan on the outgoing ships and all they knew was that "Kilroy" had been there first. Service men began placing the graffiti wherever the US Forces landed, claiming it was already there when they arrived. Kilroy then became the "Super-GI" who had always already been wherever the GIs went.
That's pure speculation, we should have more theories.
J. J. Kilroy was a rivet counter. He tagged the panels after counting the rivets so those rivets would not get counted again.
per: Research team at the History Channel.
How about adding this [9], or at least a mention of it. Not really off topic given what other articles contain.
gary was here — Preceding unsigned comment added by Garywasheree ( talk • contribs) 21:21, 26 March 2021 (UTC)
I added the following sentence to the "In popular culture" section:
In 1983 the American rock band Styx released a concept album Kilroy Was Here; beyond the title, there's no reference to the Kilroy meme, rather the album is named after its protagonist, one Robert Orin Charles Kilroy. [1]
References
An editor, User:Skyerise, rolled it back (per WP:BRD, and fine), with an edit summary of "That's what we call a 'mere mention' which doesn't merit a listing, indicated by lack of sources". So here I am, to make a case for this material. So let's see...
I don't know what the problem with "mere mention"s is but the entire section is mostly (not entirely) made of mere mentions. If we want to delete or severely trim the section, OK, but that's a different question altogether. Absent that, deleting this one entry seems kind of random... I assume it was picked up on a recent changes watchlist, and fine, I use those a lot myself, but in this case, there's no reason to single it out. Herostratus ( talk) 02:28, 28 June 2021 (UTC)
When trying to decide if a pop culture reference is appropriate to an article, ask yourself the following:
1. Has the subject (if a person or organization) acknowledged the existence of the reference? 2. Have multiple reliable sources pointed out the reference? 3. Did any real-world event occur because of the cultural element covered by the reference? 4. Did the referencing material significantly depend on the specific subject? For example, if the reference is to a specific model of car, did the material use that model car for some reason, or was it just a case of "use a well-known name of a car"?
If you cannot answer "yes" to at least one of these, you are probably just adding trivia. Get three or more, and you are probably adding genuinely encyclopedic content.
See the newly published New Yale Book of Quotations (Yale University Press) for the earliest known citations for "Kilroy" phrases. Fred Shapiro — Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.132.173.152 ( talk) 18:14, 19 October 2021 (UTC)
There's a lot of urban legends in this article, but it is lacking in solid facts. The most authoritative source for quotation origins is the New Yale Book of Quotations, which has documented citations of "Kilroy" appearing as early as April 21, 1945. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:192:80:99D0:BC44:F1D8:A11B:E991 ( talk) 13:35, 1 January 2023 (UTC)
It is extremely surprising that this question has not been brought up more times on the talk page. Firstly, the word "meme" is a neologism, and should not be used to describe a historical topic. Secondly, the materials cited for this claim are all unreliable info articles, the author even citing "Vox.com" The only reason why I didn't edit this is that I don't think I have the authority to make changes to such an important article without any outside input. That being said, does anybody have anything to say concerning this topic? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.141.103.123 ( talk) 19:02, 27 February 2022 (UTC)
It isn't a meme, the people who drew it didn't think it was a meme, the only reference to it as a meme comes from a magazine article in 2020. It's an absolutely preposterous description. Yellowmellow45 ( talk) 02:20, 30 November 2022 (UTC)
Originally, reading Kilroy described as a meme sort of shocked me and I instantly thought "That doesn't seem right." But after reading through the sources, it seems a reasonable description. I think that the word "meme" has seriously evolved over the last few years to include many more ideas and characters. I think even though the word did not exist at the time -it does now- and accurately describes the subject. I would vote to keep the meme description.(Although if someone wanted to, I think it could be useful to add a sentence or two explaining how the word didn't exist at the time and has only been used to describe it recently) GoldMiner24 Talk 05:16, 5 December 2022 (UTC)