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Does anybody have a source for the alleged comments made on NewsTalk and the alleged lawsuit under Incitement to Hatred being brought in that case? There are sources for the first paragraph, but we have to verify any allegations made if true and delete untrue ones, as per Wikipedia:BLP. Autarch ( talk) 12:22, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
Hello, I'm not sure how to use this website. Kevin Myers did make the comment in question. I have filed a complaint to the Gardai. Hope I am using the webpage correctly, if not, it's ok to delete my post. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Saintpadraig ( talk • contribs) 18:49, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
Hi,
The citation given for the deleted paragraph does not support the claim that Myers is homophobic. It was a newspaper column by the subject of this article, which was about political correctness in the press and society. For it to support such a claim, he would actually have to say outright, "I am homophobic" - which he clearly did not. It is not enough for an wikipedia editor to read an article, and find that it is self-evidently biased in one way or another.
This is a WP:BLP, one cannot read a writer's articles, dislike the content and then write on wikipedia that that man is "homophobic" - itself a libellous and outrageous claim. As per WP:Sources, to state that he is homophobic here one must have multiple, reliable, non-partisan sources. Thank you Ktlynch ( talk) 21:09, 3 February 2010 (UTC)
Could contributors to the article please provide sources for their claims, as per WP:BLP. Autarch ( talk) 20:12, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
Myers is referred to as Colonel Myarse or Kevin Myarse reguarly in the Phoenix. I find it odd that this was removed given the fact that on the Peter Carter-Ruck article it mentions the fact that he was referred to as "Carter-Fuck" or "Farter-Fuck" by Private Eye magazine.ĵ
Exiledone ( talk) 15:43, 2 May 2011 (UTC)
Can we just mention the fact that he is a fairly regular target of satire. Exiledone ( talk) 13:06, 14 May 2011 (UTC)
Exiledone ( talk) 12:00, 24 May 2011 (UTC)
This edit, though it removed a section called Style, removed a section which described some of his views. This edit, though made to remove mere mention of a column, removed mention of a column that Myers' then employer refused to publish, as well as removing some mention of his political views about the USA. Autarch ( talk) 23:00, 30 January 2012 (UTC)
Does WP:BLP apply to past edits - specifically edits that would be legally actionable? In other words, would WP:BLP mean that defamatory edits need to be purged from the history of an article? Autarch ( talk) 00:40, 31 January 2012 (UTC)
It's extraordinary that this has been removed from this page, given its role in his infamy and ultimate departure from The Irish Times. Also, his very controversial views of Bloody Sunday, travellers, Irish and Irish nationalists have also been sources of the same infamy. This article seems to have whitewashed them all, leaving readers without a full appreciation of the sheer genius that is Sir Kevin Myers, the ultimate supertroll. 93.107.2.255 ( talk) 10:31, 20 May 2012 (UTC)
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Hi,
I'm Mark Tighe from The Sunday Times. Kevin Myers would like where he lives deleted from this page. He has concerns about his personal safety and would prefer if the exact town he lives in was not on this page. The fact that he lives in Co Kildare should be specific enough without causing him his current concern.
Mark
mark.tighe@sunday-times.ie Toffeeman34 ( talk) 13:05, 27 June 2015 (UTC)
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Cheers.— cyberbot II Talk to my owner:Online 19:28, 31 March 2016 (UTC)
I'm aware that "holocaust denier" can be a contentious label, so is this BBC article sufficient RS? The relevant part of the article text reads "In 2009, Mr Myers wrote a column for the Irish Independent newspaper denying the Holocaust happened." It doesn't use the exact words "holocaust denier" to describe him, so I figured I should query that before reverting MPS1992's revert of the holocaust denier category. The source is already linked in the article, currently #11 in the reflist. Marianna251 TALK 14:50, 30 July 2017 (UTC)
I added Category:Holocaust denial and got reverted. I didn't add Category:Holocaust deniers as that category states it's specifically for individuals who have actively promoted denial; but I think the general denial category is relevant and arguably not a BLP violation, given the well-sourced quotes in the article. Robofish ( talk) 22:52, 30 July 2017 (UTC)
Myers wrote a follow-up article in April, 2009 to answer criticism he received regarding the Holocaust article at issue here. Here is a link. To me it seems clear that he was merely taking issue with Holocaust denial laws in the EU on free speech grounds. In my view, the sine qua non of actual Holocaust denial is rejecting the historical consensus that the Nazis conducted a program for exterminating the Jews. Holocaust deniers believe that no such program existed and that Jews were not put in gas chambers. Myers doesn't seem to be making that argument at all. He calls himself a holocaust denier in the narrow legal sense because he doesn't accept that precisely six million Jews died. He also asserts that "no journalist in Ireland has written as much and as often about the Holocaust, the Final Solution, the Shoah, the Nazi Genocide" as he has. If that's true, it seems inappropriate to cite this one deliberately provocative article as representative of his views on the Holocaust for Wikipedia readers. If we want to put him in the same category as David Irving, we should first look at what else he has written about the Holocaust an how third parties have interpreted those writings. DrQuinnEskimoWoman ( talk) 01:06, 31 July 2017 (UTC)
The phrase "is a self-described holocaust denier" is mendacious as it implies that he is an admitted holocaust denier without actually saying so, which would clearly be false. The phrase should probably read as "has self-described as a holocaust denier".
Given that the lead is meant to summarise the article, surely the controversy surrounding him must be mentioned there? One sentence is not introducing WP:undue weight. WP:LEAD: "Like in the body of the article itself, the emphasis given to material in the lead should roughly reflect its importance to the topic, according to reliable, published sources". Gaia Octavia Agrippa Talk 18:57, 30 July 2017 (UTC)
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Hi - although I understand completely why no-one would want to claim him as a compatriot given recent events, the edit that completely removes his Irish ancestry, and the fact that he self-identifies as Irish, is deeply POV. He describes himself as an "English-born Irish journalist" (see http://kevinmyers.ie/kevin-myers-about/) and in the absence of better sourcing I suggest that this the correct intro to this entry. I would suggest therefore a change to "English-born Irish journalist" as that is what the sources support. There is no evidence supporting the contention that he is, or self-identifies, as English. He has worked in Ireland his whole adult life and was born to Irish parents, he identifies as Irish, so he should be identified by us as such or, at least, reference to that identification made MartinWye ( talk) 11:55, 31 July 2017 (UTC) MartinWye ( talk) 11:55, 31 July 2017 (UTC)
I will add in the source to the other information. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Donn300 ( talk • contribs) 16:28, 31 July 2017 (UTC)
Done
Donn300, please see discussion above. Just because somebody is born abroad doesn't remove their Irishness. You have also introduced unsourced content, which is why it was reverted. Bastun Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 14:35, 31 July 2017 (UTC)
Hi MartinWye/Bastun, I agree in general that "just because somebody is born abroad doesn't remove their Irishness", and have made that point myself about others e.g. the great philosopher G.E.M. Anscombe was born in Limerick but nobody says she was Irish, she was a British person who happened to have been born in Ireland, her father was stationed there, but she was brought up in Britain. Now this is not the same with Myers. He was not just born in England (which is not so important), but he LIVED in England UNTIL he was already an ADULT for a couple of years (& could've served in the army for many years by then). The reason he has an English accent is because he grew up in England - his birth, upbringing & turning into an adult all took place in England. He went to an English Public School, and so had a very particularly English type of upbringing. You said "the edit that completely removes his Irish ancestry", but the change specifically says that his father was Irish (a GP working there) so I don't think it was correct to say that. He is English of Irish heritage. To illustrate this further, think about the English broadcaster Terry Christian, he was brought up in England by Irish parents (often refers to his Irish dad), has a distinct accent from where he grew up in England, but nobody has thought about suggesting that he is anything other than English, nor would they if he had moved to Ireland when he was about 20 years old. Why treat Myers differently to Terry Christian (& countless other British people of Irish heritage)? Myers may self-identify as Irish, but so did Alfred Willmore (he even changed his name to Micheál Mac Liammóir), and Patrick O'Brian also claimed to be Irish, but that did not make them factually Irish. In fact could one not say (to be kind) that Myers saying he is Irish is POV (his POV). I will add in the source to the other information. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Donn300 ( talk • contribs) 16:28, 31 July 2017 (UTC)
Myers was a 19 or 20 year old English man when he came to Ireland. Yes he is of Irish descent, but there are hundreds of thousands of English people of Irish descent. What about the example of Terry Christian, if he moved to Ireland as an adult would you try to say he was Irish? And if someone makes a claim to be something, that does not make it so. Alfred Willmore claimed to be Irish (he even changed his name to Micheál Mac Liammóir), and Patrick O'Brian also claimed to be Irish, but that did not make it so.
Donn asks a good question, given that Myers is not only born and raised in England, but has made a career out of denigrating Irish nationality itself. Is he a West Brit, or simply a fully fleged English Tory? It is a valid question to ask and sociologically there is a big difference between a member of the nation criticising his own country out of love or compassion and a foreigner just attacking it to denigrate or feel superior. Especially given Myers' penchant for wishing to "commemorate" British Empire soldiers from WWI, while attacking the Easter Rising of 1916 as "absolutely nothing to celebrate". Claíomh Solais ( talk) 21:17, 31 July 2017 (UTC)
I don't think that you carefully read my comments above from yesterday.
"self-identifies as Irish" - that does not make it so (Alfred Willmore claimed to be Irish (he even changed his name to Micheál Mac Liammóir), and Patrick O'Brian also claimed to be Irish, but that did not make it so in either case. There are countless other example around the world.
"lives in Ireland" - I think that Joe Duffy said something similar about the London bridge attacker Rachid Redouane when he said one attacker 'is Irish' / 'came from Ireland' because Redouane used to live in Rathmines in Dublin. Sorry to have to make the point with that example, but it really is surprising that you would write "lives in Ireland" as a reason!
"worked (until yesterday) in Ireland" - similar strength of argument as the 'lives' one above. Rachid Redouane also worked in Ireland (pastry chef apparently). A lot of people around the world have English colleagues, that does not turn those English colleagues into French/Irish/Italian... people.
I am not biased against him (I think Ireland a fairly tolerant place that can have him in the country criticizing it without incident and indeed liked by many), but it is factually true that he was an adult of 19 or 20 years of age when he arrived in Ireland to live. He came from England where he was born and raised (just like Terry Christian) and in anyone's language he is English. He can be described as 'English of Irish heritage' (like huge numbers of others). Before my edit there was no mention of the fact that he was an English adult when he arrived in Ireland.
Yes, of course, why would I want to censor what he says. But the fact that someone makes a claim to be something does not make it so. Again: Alfred Willmore claimed to be Irish (he even changed his name to Micheál Mac Liammóir), and Patrick O'Brian also claimed to be Irish, but that did not make it so. I used that reference because it had the detail of him moving to Ireland as an adult after having been born and raised to the age of 19 or 20 in England, and it had the details of his particularly English growing-up experience by attending an English public school. It also had other relevant information (father's death, but staying in school with help of LEA) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Donn300 ( talk • contribs)
Apologies for the misleading locations of my comments but I was trying to put the answers just underneath others' relevant comments. I like and use that Daniel Moynihan line myself ("entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts"). I do not wish to be in an edit war, I was adding agreed known facts: Myers grew into an adult (from birth) in England, and while he may or may not have become a naturalised Irish citizen afterwards, the article made no mention that he was already an English adult when he arrived in Ireland. You have now put in the lead that Myers "is an English-born Irish journalist and writer", but that implies that he probably came to Ireland as a child or baby. Did you see my earlier reference to the great philosopher G.E.M. Anscombe who was born in Limerick but nobody says she was Irish, she was a British person who happened to have been born in Ireland, her father was stationed there, but she was brought up in Britain and that is mainly why people regard her as British. Maybe the opening line should acknowledge Myers first ~20 years and not mislead people, it could say something like Myers "is an English-born-and-raised Irish journalist.." (though if someone read about a "Scottish-born-and-raised journalist" they would think he was Scottish. So maybe instead it should say that he became a naturalised Irish citizen in adulthood (did he?), so maybe Myers "is an English-born-and-raised Irish-naturalised journalist..". Or if we don't know that he is Irish-naturalised for sure then we could say that he self-identifies as Irish though/and is English-born-and-raised. It recently said something like that: Myers "is an English journalist and writer who moved to Ireland at the age of 19 to attend University College Dublin. His father was an Irish GP living and working in Leicester and Myers later self-identified as Irish (also)". I don't think that so bad, it is accurate and not biased, and unlike the current version it does not mislead people into thinking he was taken to Ireland when he was young, implying that England was a trivial detail in his make-up, whereas he was made into a fully grown adult there. Donn300 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Donn300 ( talk • contribs) 14:18, 1 August 2017 (UTC)
Kevin Myers is primarily known in Ireland as a West Brit "contrarian" journalist, who is one of a number of almost exclusively Dublin/Pale-based public figures who have built up a cottage industry of denigrating traditional Irish (read: Gaelic) culture, language and Irish republican politics. I am surprised that there is absolutely no mention of this at all in the article (probably because his Anglomania in this area is seen as highly mature among Dublin 4 types and the reason for his employment at a number of newspapers over the years).
Compared to his anti-Irishness, his anti-Jewishness pales in comparison (he has literally gone as far as to state that the surviving Irish population are "genetically" defective). And in fact he has sometimes taken some positions which are generally unpopular in Ireland, relating to supporting Israeli military actions (he does this mostly to annoy republicans who support Palestine). I am not one to look a gift horse in the mouth and if the West Brit crowd are willing to throw one of their Gael-bashing propagandists under the horse for anti-semitism, then that serves a purpose, but the article does seem somewhat slanted to certain ideas, while completely excluding other (arguably more notable) ones. Claíomh Solais ( talk) 20:22, 31 July 2017 (UTC)
Hello. I'm not sure if these warrant mentioning in the article, but it may be relevant that Myers has written several articles for the highly controversial Breitbart website: [1]
Myers also supported the Second Gulf War, and criticized Irish people who opposed that war: "So no rejoicing from them that freedom has come to the people of Iraq, courtesy of the greatest democracies in the world". (Kevin Myers, "An Irishman's Diary", The Irish Times, April 11, 2003, [2] ).
And in an interview with " Newstalk", Myers said about Donald Trump "He's deplorable, but most politicians are. I don't know if I'd have been able to stomach a Clinton presidency, so maybe Trump is a deplorable character that [sic] be a better President.' [3]. 176.61.15.11 ( talk) 22:31, 1 September 2017 (UTC)
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I am suggesting that as Kevin is subject to abuse that instead of English born. . Kevin is an Irish journalist who was born in the UK. 2A02:8084:D03:8580:4CFC:F10F:2FBA:D684 ( talk) 17:23, 26 May 2022 (UTC)
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23:18, 26 May 2022 (UTC)An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect Secret meeting arranged by journalist Kevin Myers and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 October 6#Secret meeting arranged by journalist Kevin Myers until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. — Red-tailed hawk (nest) 19:44, 6 October 2022 (UTC)
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Does anybody have a source for the alleged comments made on NewsTalk and the alleged lawsuit under Incitement to Hatred being brought in that case? There are sources for the first paragraph, but we have to verify any allegations made if true and delete untrue ones, as per Wikipedia:BLP. Autarch ( talk) 12:22, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
Hello, I'm not sure how to use this website. Kevin Myers did make the comment in question. I have filed a complaint to the Gardai. Hope I am using the webpage correctly, if not, it's ok to delete my post. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Saintpadraig ( talk • contribs) 18:49, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
Hi,
The citation given for the deleted paragraph does not support the claim that Myers is homophobic. It was a newspaper column by the subject of this article, which was about political correctness in the press and society. For it to support such a claim, he would actually have to say outright, "I am homophobic" - which he clearly did not. It is not enough for an wikipedia editor to read an article, and find that it is self-evidently biased in one way or another.
This is a WP:BLP, one cannot read a writer's articles, dislike the content and then write on wikipedia that that man is "homophobic" - itself a libellous and outrageous claim. As per WP:Sources, to state that he is homophobic here one must have multiple, reliable, non-partisan sources. Thank you Ktlynch ( talk) 21:09, 3 February 2010 (UTC)
Could contributors to the article please provide sources for their claims, as per WP:BLP. Autarch ( talk) 20:12, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
Myers is referred to as Colonel Myarse or Kevin Myarse reguarly in the Phoenix. I find it odd that this was removed given the fact that on the Peter Carter-Ruck article it mentions the fact that he was referred to as "Carter-Fuck" or "Farter-Fuck" by Private Eye magazine.ĵ
Exiledone ( talk) 15:43, 2 May 2011 (UTC)
Can we just mention the fact that he is a fairly regular target of satire. Exiledone ( talk) 13:06, 14 May 2011 (UTC)
Exiledone ( talk) 12:00, 24 May 2011 (UTC)
This edit, though it removed a section called Style, removed a section which described some of his views. This edit, though made to remove mere mention of a column, removed mention of a column that Myers' then employer refused to publish, as well as removing some mention of his political views about the USA. Autarch ( talk) 23:00, 30 January 2012 (UTC)
Does WP:BLP apply to past edits - specifically edits that would be legally actionable? In other words, would WP:BLP mean that defamatory edits need to be purged from the history of an article? Autarch ( talk) 00:40, 31 January 2012 (UTC)
It's extraordinary that this has been removed from this page, given its role in his infamy and ultimate departure from The Irish Times. Also, his very controversial views of Bloody Sunday, travellers, Irish and Irish nationalists have also been sources of the same infamy. This article seems to have whitewashed them all, leaving readers without a full appreciation of the sheer genius that is Sir Kevin Myers, the ultimate supertroll. 93.107.2.255 ( talk) 10:31, 20 May 2012 (UTC)
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Hi,
I'm Mark Tighe from The Sunday Times. Kevin Myers would like where he lives deleted from this page. He has concerns about his personal safety and would prefer if the exact town he lives in was not on this page. The fact that he lives in Co Kildare should be specific enough without causing him his current concern.
Mark
mark.tighe@sunday-times.ie Toffeeman34 ( talk) 13:05, 27 June 2015 (UTC)
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Cheers.— cyberbot II Talk to my owner:Online 19:28, 31 March 2016 (UTC)
I'm aware that "holocaust denier" can be a contentious label, so is this BBC article sufficient RS? The relevant part of the article text reads "In 2009, Mr Myers wrote a column for the Irish Independent newspaper denying the Holocaust happened." It doesn't use the exact words "holocaust denier" to describe him, so I figured I should query that before reverting MPS1992's revert of the holocaust denier category. The source is already linked in the article, currently #11 in the reflist. Marianna251 TALK 14:50, 30 July 2017 (UTC)
I added Category:Holocaust denial and got reverted. I didn't add Category:Holocaust deniers as that category states it's specifically for individuals who have actively promoted denial; but I think the general denial category is relevant and arguably not a BLP violation, given the well-sourced quotes in the article. Robofish ( talk) 22:52, 30 July 2017 (UTC)
Myers wrote a follow-up article in April, 2009 to answer criticism he received regarding the Holocaust article at issue here. Here is a link. To me it seems clear that he was merely taking issue with Holocaust denial laws in the EU on free speech grounds. In my view, the sine qua non of actual Holocaust denial is rejecting the historical consensus that the Nazis conducted a program for exterminating the Jews. Holocaust deniers believe that no such program existed and that Jews were not put in gas chambers. Myers doesn't seem to be making that argument at all. He calls himself a holocaust denier in the narrow legal sense because he doesn't accept that precisely six million Jews died. He also asserts that "no journalist in Ireland has written as much and as often about the Holocaust, the Final Solution, the Shoah, the Nazi Genocide" as he has. If that's true, it seems inappropriate to cite this one deliberately provocative article as representative of his views on the Holocaust for Wikipedia readers. If we want to put him in the same category as David Irving, we should first look at what else he has written about the Holocaust an how third parties have interpreted those writings. DrQuinnEskimoWoman ( talk) 01:06, 31 July 2017 (UTC)
The phrase "is a self-described holocaust denier" is mendacious as it implies that he is an admitted holocaust denier without actually saying so, which would clearly be false. The phrase should probably read as "has self-described as a holocaust denier".
Given that the lead is meant to summarise the article, surely the controversy surrounding him must be mentioned there? One sentence is not introducing WP:undue weight. WP:LEAD: "Like in the body of the article itself, the emphasis given to material in the lead should roughly reflect its importance to the topic, according to reliable, published sources". Gaia Octavia Agrippa Talk 18:57, 30 July 2017 (UTC)
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Hi - although I understand completely why no-one would want to claim him as a compatriot given recent events, the edit that completely removes his Irish ancestry, and the fact that he self-identifies as Irish, is deeply POV. He describes himself as an "English-born Irish journalist" (see http://kevinmyers.ie/kevin-myers-about/) and in the absence of better sourcing I suggest that this the correct intro to this entry. I would suggest therefore a change to "English-born Irish journalist" as that is what the sources support. There is no evidence supporting the contention that he is, or self-identifies, as English. He has worked in Ireland his whole adult life and was born to Irish parents, he identifies as Irish, so he should be identified by us as such or, at least, reference to that identification made MartinWye ( talk) 11:55, 31 July 2017 (UTC) MartinWye ( talk) 11:55, 31 July 2017 (UTC)
I will add in the source to the other information. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Donn300 ( talk • contribs) 16:28, 31 July 2017 (UTC)
Done
Donn300, please see discussion above. Just because somebody is born abroad doesn't remove their Irishness. You have also introduced unsourced content, which is why it was reverted. Bastun Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 14:35, 31 July 2017 (UTC)
Hi MartinWye/Bastun, I agree in general that "just because somebody is born abroad doesn't remove their Irishness", and have made that point myself about others e.g. the great philosopher G.E.M. Anscombe was born in Limerick but nobody says she was Irish, she was a British person who happened to have been born in Ireland, her father was stationed there, but she was brought up in Britain. Now this is not the same with Myers. He was not just born in England (which is not so important), but he LIVED in England UNTIL he was already an ADULT for a couple of years (& could've served in the army for many years by then). The reason he has an English accent is because he grew up in England - his birth, upbringing & turning into an adult all took place in England. He went to an English Public School, and so had a very particularly English type of upbringing. You said "the edit that completely removes his Irish ancestry", but the change specifically says that his father was Irish (a GP working there) so I don't think it was correct to say that. He is English of Irish heritage. To illustrate this further, think about the English broadcaster Terry Christian, he was brought up in England by Irish parents (often refers to his Irish dad), has a distinct accent from where he grew up in England, but nobody has thought about suggesting that he is anything other than English, nor would they if he had moved to Ireland when he was about 20 years old. Why treat Myers differently to Terry Christian (& countless other British people of Irish heritage)? Myers may self-identify as Irish, but so did Alfred Willmore (he even changed his name to Micheál Mac Liammóir), and Patrick O'Brian also claimed to be Irish, but that did not make them factually Irish. In fact could one not say (to be kind) that Myers saying he is Irish is POV (his POV). I will add in the source to the other information. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Donn300 ( talk • contribs) 16:28, 31 July 2017 (UTC)
Myers was a 19 or 20 year old English man when he came to Ireland. Yes he is of Irish descent, but there are hundreds of thousands of English people of Irish descent. What about the example of Terry Christian, if he moved to Ireland as an adult would you try to say he was Irish? And if someone makes a claim to be something, that does not make it so. Alfred Willmore claimed to be Irish (he even changed his name to Micheál Mac Liammóir), and Patrick O'Brian also claimed to be Irish, but that did not make it so.
Donn asks a good question, given that Myers is not only born and raised in England, but has made a career out of denigrating Irish nationality itself. Is he a West Brit, or simply a fully fleged English Tory? It is a valid question to ask and sociologically there is a big difference between a member of the nation criticising his own country out of love or compassion and a foreigner just attacking it to denigrate or feel superior. Especially given Myers' penchant for wishing to "commemorate" British Empire soldiers from WWI, while attacking the Easter Rising of 1916 as "absolutely nothing to celebrate". Claíomh Solais ( talk) 21:17, 31 July 2017 (UTC)
I don't think that you carefully read my comments above from yesterday.
"self-identifies as Irish" - that does not make it so (Alfred Willmore claimed to be Irish (he even changed his name to Micheál Mac Liammóir), and Patrick O'Brian also claimed to be Irish, but that did not make it so in either case. There are countless other example around the world.
"lives in Ireland" - I think that Joe Duffy said something similar about the London bridge attacker Rachid Redouane when he said one attacker 'is Irish' / 'came from Ireland' because Redouane used to live in Rathmines in Dublin. Sorry to have to make the point with that example, but it really is surprising that you would write "lives in Ireland" as a reason!
"worked (until yesterday) in Ireland" - similar strength of argument as the 'lives' one above. Rachid Redouane also worked in Ireland (pastry chef apparently). A lot of people around the world have English colleagues, that does not turn those English colleagues into French/Irish/Italian... people.
I am not biased against him (I think Ireland a fairly tolerant place that can have him in the country criticizing it without incident and indeed liked by many), but it is factually true that he was an adult of 19 or 20 years of age when he arrived in Ireland to live. He came from England where he was born and raised (just like Terry Christian) and in anyone's language he is English. He can be described as 'English of Irish heritage' (like huge numbers of others). Before my edit there was no mention of the fact that he was an English adult when he arrived in Ireland.
Yes, of course, why would I want to censor what he says. But the fact that someone makes a claim to be something does not make it so. Again: Alfred Willmore claimed to be Irish (he even changed his name to Micheál Mac Liammóir), and Patrick O'Brian also claimed to be Irish, but that did not make it so. I used that reference because it had the detail of him moving to Ireland as an adult after having been born and raised to the age of 19 or 20 in England, and it had the details of his particularly English growing-up experience by attending an English public school. It also had other relevant information (father's death, but staying in school with help of LEA) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Donn300 ( talk • contribs)
Apologies for the misleading locations of my comments but I was trying to put the answers just underneath others' relevant comments. I like and use that Daniel Moynihan line myself ("entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts"). I do not wish to be in an edit war, I was adding agreed known facts: Myers grew into an adult (from birth) in England, and while he may or may not have become a naturalised Irish citizen afterwards, the article made no mention that he was already an English adult when he arrived in Ireland. You have now put in the lead that Myers "is an English-born Irish journalist and writer", but that implies that he probably came to Ireland as a child or baby. Did you see my earlier reference to the great philosopher G.E.M. Anscombe who was born in Limerick but nobody says she was Irish, she was a British person who happened to have been born in Ireland, her father was stationed there, but she was brought up in Britain and that is mainly why people regard her as British. Maybe the opening line should acknowledge Myers first ~20 years and not mislead people, it could say something like Myers "is an English-born-and-raised Irish journalist.." (though if someone read about a "Scottish-born-and-raised journalist" they would think he was Scottish. So maybe instead it should say that he became a naturalised Irish citizen in adulthood (did he?), so maybe Myers "is an English-born-and-raised Irish-naturalised journalist..". Or if we don't know that he is Irish-naturalised for sure then we could say that he self-identifies as Irish though/and is English-born-and-raised. It recently said something like that: Myers "is an English journalist and writer who moved to Ireland at the age of 19 to attend University College Dublin. His father was an Irish GP living and working in Leicester and Myers later self-identified as Irish (also)". I don't think that so bad, it is accurate and not biased, and unlike the current version it does not mislead people into thinking he was taken to Ireland when he was young, implying that England was a trivial detail in his make-up, whereas he was made into a fully grown adult there. Donn300 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Donn300 ( talk • contribs) 14:18, 1 August 2017 (UTC)
Kevin Myers is primarily known in Ireland as a West Brit "contrarian" journalist, who is one of a number of almost exclusively Dublin/Pale-based public figures who have built up a cottage industry of denigrating traditional Irish (read: Gaelic) culture, language and Irish republican politics. I am surprised that there is absolutely no mention of this at all in the article (probably because his Anglomania in this area is seen as highly mature among Dublin 4 types and the reason for his employment at a number of newspapers over the years).
Compared to his anti-Irishness, his anti-Jewishness pales in comparison (he has literally gone as far as to state that the surviving Irish population are "genetically" defective). And in fact he has sometimes taken some positions which are generally unpopular in Ireland, relating to supporting Israeli military actions (he does this mostly to annoy republicans who support Palestine). I am not one to look a gift horse in the mouth and if the West Brit crowd are willing to throw one of their Gael-bashing propagandists under the horse for anti-semitism, then that serves a purpose, but the article does seem somewhat slanted to certain ideas, while completely excluding other (arguably more notable) ones. Claíomh Solais ( talk) 20:22, 31 July 2017 (UTC)
Hello. I'm not sure if these warrant mentioning in the article, but it may be relevant that Myers has written several articles for the highly controversial Breitbart website: [1]
Myers also supported the Second Gulf War, and criticized Irish people who opposed that war: "So no rejoicing from them that freedom has come to the people of Iraq, courtesy of the greatest democracies in the world". (Kevin Myers, "An Irishman's Diary", The Irish Times, April 11, 2003, [2] ).
And in an interview with " Newstalk", Myers said about Donald Trump "He's deplorable, but most politicians are. I don't know if I'd have been able to stomach a Clinton presidency, so maybe Trump is a deplorable character that [sic] be a better President.' [3]. 176.61.15.11 ( talk) 22:31, 1 September 2017 (UTC)
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I am suggesting that as Kevin is subject to abuse that instead of English born. . Kevin is an Irish journalist who was born in the UK. 2A02:8084:D03:8580:4CFC:F10F:2FBA:D684 ( talk) 17:23, 26 May 2022 (UTC)
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23:18, 26 May 2022 (UTC)An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect Secret meeting arranged by journalist Kevin Myers and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 October 6#Secret meeting arranged by journalist Kevin Myers until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. — Red-tailed hawk (nest) 19:44, 6 October 2022 (UTC)