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@ Beyond My Ken: Given that Bytwerk merely implied in his biography on Streicher that he was Catholic is not proof necessarily, so I am not entirely disputing your revert. However, consider the following observations taken directly from the book: Besides the statement, "The rural village in which Streicher grew up was strongly Catholic," (p. 2) one reads the following: "As a teacher Streicher was expected to attend to the spiritual as well as to the intellectual development of his pupils. Particularly in the small towns in which he taught, the local priest often had supervisory authority over the schoolmaster. Now, Streicher was never to be a man who easily accepted interference in his affairs, and his childhood had not left him a loyal Catholic. In July 1904 he decided to change the time at which the Sunday school (for which the schoolmaster was also responsible) met, against the wishes of the parish priest. Having other complaints against the troublesome nineteen-year-old as well, the priest made a formal complaint to Streicher's superiors. The altercation did Streicher's career no harm, for he soon after received more permanent teaching assignments." (p. 3)
Overseeing "spiritual development" and changing the time of Sunday school make it abundantly clear that this is a church-related school. Since, as Bytwerk relates earlier on the same page that in 1904 Streicher had "taught in six Bavarian villages within seven months," (p. 3) the likelihood of him being allowed to teach in these schools and not being a Catholic are nearly next to none. Not exactly sure why you outright removed verbatim quotes, unless you thought they too strongly supported the idea that he was in fact a Catholic. BTW - "not a loyal Catholic" also strongly suggests he was after all, at least at that time, a practicing Catholic.-- Obenritter ( talk) 23:01, 11 January 2021 (UTC)
I know no evidence that Streicher was Catholic by belief or practice after his early years. The schools he taught at were not church schools. German schools at the time, and even today, can include religious instruction in the public schools. I'll dig into my sources a little more when time allows.
An IP is attempting to add the the middle name "Sebastian" to the lede sentence. I have several concerns about this:
If someone has any additional information about this, or could read the German sources and report as to what, exactly, they say about "Sebatsian", that would be helpful.
Google Books: [2]
Beyond My Ken ( talk) 23:05, 6 May 2021 (UTC)
"During his trial, Streicher claimed that he had been mistreated by Allied soldiers after his capture." - He did indeed say so, when he was on trial. But I don't recall that this in anyway was disproven or discredited during the trial by the prosecution. The mistreatments were mostly humiliations in a rather mean way not severe injuries. If that was deliberate (as to prime him for the trial) is of course an open question. Streicher's description of the details can't be found in the transcripts, but can be found in an audio-recording thereof (From 22min onward): https://archive.org/details/JuliusStreicherVerteidigungsrede -- 105.8.7.22 ( talk) 11:08, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 18:37, 17 April 2022 (UTC)
"Joseph Kingsbury-Smith... said in his filed report that after the hood descended over Streicher's head, he also apparently said "Adele, meine liebe Frau!" ("Adele, my dear wife!")."
Why the "apparently"? Kingsbury-Smith was an eye witness and clearly writes:
"When the black hood was raised over his head, Streicher's muffled voice could be heard to say, 'Adele, my dear wife.'" (Source: http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/nuremberg/NurembergNews10_16_46.html )
Perhaps this is an unreliable account, but "apparently" is nonsense. 2A02:AA1:1018:BA8C:F8D2:3D00:A320:A2A0 ( talk) 20:24, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Julius Streicher article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: 1 |
![]() | Julius Streicher was nominated as a History good article, but it did not meet the good article criteria at the time (August 5, 2016). There are suggestions on the review page for improving the article. If you can improve it, please do; it may then be renominated. |
![]() | This ![]() It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
@ Beyond My Ken: Given that Bytwerk merely implied in his biography on Streicher that he was Catholic is not proof necessarily, so I am not entirely disputing your revert. However, consider the following observations taken directly from the book: Besides the statement, "The rural village in which Streicher grew up was strongly Catholic," (p. 2) one reads the following: "As a teacher Streicher was expected to attend to the spiritual as well as to the intellectual development of his pupils. Particularly in the small towns in which he taught, the local priest often had supervisory authority over the schoolmaster. Now, Streicher was never to be a man who easily accepted interference in his affairs, and his childhood had not left him a loyal Catholic. In July 1904 he decided to change the time at which the Sunday school (for which the schoolmaster was also responsible) met, against the wishes of the parish priest. Having other complaints against the troublesome nineteen-year-old as well, the priest made a formal complaint to Streicher's superiors. The altercation did Streicher's career no harm, for he soon after received more permanent teaching assignments." (p. 3)
Overseeing "spiritual development" and changing the time of Sunday school make it abundantly clear that this is a church-related school. Since, as Bytwerk relates earlier on the same page that in 1904 Streicher had "taught in six Bavarian villages within seven months," (p. 3) the likelihood of him being allowed to teach in these schools and not being a Catholic are nearly next to none. Not exactly sure why you outright removed verbatim quotes, unless you thought they too strongly supported the idea that he was in fact a Catholic. BTW - "not a loyal Catholic" also strongly suggests he was after all, at least at that time, a practicing Catholic.-- Obenritter ( talk) 23:01, 11 January 2021 (UTC)
I know no evidence that Streicher was Catholic by belief or practice after his early years. The schools he taught at were not church schools. German schools at the time, and even today, can include religious instruction in the public schools. I'll dig into my sources a little more when time allows.
An IP is attempting to add the the middle name "Sebastian" to the lede sentence. I have several concerns about this:
If someone has any additional information about this, or could read the German sources and report as to what, exactly, they say about "Sebatsian", that would be helpful.
Google Books: [2]
Beyond My Ken ( talk) 23:05, 6 May 2021 (UTC)
"During his trial, Streicher claimed that he had been mistreated by Allied soldiers after his capture." - He did indeed say so, when he was on trial. But I don't recall that this in anyway was disproven or discredited during the trial by the prosecution. The mistreatments were mostly humiliations in a rather mean way not severe injuries. If that was deliberate (as to prime him for the trial) is of course an open question. Streicher's description of the details can't be found in the transcripts, but can be found in an audio-recording thereof (From 22min onward): https://archive.org/details/JuliusStreicherVerteidigungsrede -- 105.8.7.22 ( talk) 11:08, 8 February 2022 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 18:37, 17 April 2022 (UTC)
"Joseph Kingsbury-Smith... said in his filed report that after the hood descended over Streicher's head, he also apparently said "Adele, meine liebe Frau!" ("Adele, my dear wife!")."
Why the "apparently"? Kingsbury-Smith was an eye witness and clearly writes:
"When the black hood was raised over his head, Streicher's muffled voice could be heard to say, 'Adele, my dear wife.'" (Source: http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/nuremberg/NurembergNews10_16_46.html )
Perhaps this is an unreliable account, but "apparently" is nonsense. 2A02:AA1:1018:BA8C:F8D2:3D00:A320:A2A0 ( talk) 20:24, 21 January 2023 (UTC)