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I'm going to rate this as "start". It could use some expansion and scholarly referrences. Pustelnik 21:30, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
I would venture a guess on what "Jimmy crack corn" means. "Jim" as in Jim Crow law, as in a popular name for poor rural black in the 19th century. Corn as in white man, as in "white". "Crack" as in kill. Stbalbach 22:59, 13 September 2005 (UTC)
If the song is that old, it's definitely in the public domain. That being the case, there's really no point to this article unless it includes the lyrics (cf. Yankee Doodle, etc.). I was going to do so myself, but got bogged down trying to find the best variant to include — the one with the best mix of brevity, clarity, and antiquity. Is there somebody out there less obsessive than I? Doops | talk 03:19, 14 September 2005 (UTC)
Isn't there a second refrain that goes "Shoo fly, don't bother me" in place of "Jimmy crack corn, and I don't care"...? In fact, when I was about 5-7 years old, I think I knew the name of the song as "Shoo fly, don't bother me"...! Codex Sinaiticus 13:55, 14 September 2005 (UTC)
The vernacular version seems to have a mix of "the" and "de" There should be no "D" on "And" in the 4th line of the first verse. The first line of 2nd verse has "An'" - that would be more consistent. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 216.39.144.40 ( talk • contribs) 25 November 2006.
The line at the end where the "Master is Forced to lie" sounds awfully suspect. Does anybody have access to an old songbook for possible correction? The line sounds a lot more like a punchline, where the Master is the First to Die of Horse Fly Bite, and this got changed to a reference about his unwillingness to lie in his place of ultimate repose. 216.99.201.35 ( talk) 20:58, 19 June 2009 (UTC)
There is a good discussion there about "tomming". In fact it was that article that made me think of this song and then to look here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.145.60.10 ( talk • contribs)
What's "deliberate negligence"? Surely if you do something deliberately you intend to do it and therefore can't have done it by accident? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 212.219.155.28 ( talk • contribs) 18 May 2006.
I cut the uncited claim "It was a favorite song of Abraham Lincoln." If true, should be easy to cite: there's hardly a human being in the last 200 years about whom more has been written. - Jmabel | Talk 06:21, 21 October 2006 (UTC)
Uncited conjecture cut from article: "'Crack corn' might also refer to popping popcorn, presumably frowned upon by masters." - Jmabel | Talk 04:31, 7 November 2006 (UTC)
In the phone commerical (sorry, don't know the carrier), a "dropped call" causes a future son-in-law to mistakenly think he's offended Jim.
In the original version, the young man ends his attempt to be a "buddy" with the song, "Jimmy Crack Corn and I don't care". The commerical now edits that song out, for whatever reason. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.113.237.156 ( talk) 04:12, 9 January 2007 (UTC).
The cingular "trivia" is trivia. We don't do trivia lists at Wikipedia. See WP:TRIVIA and WP:NOT#INDISCRIMINATE.
Ives last song as his last public performance is notable. -- Stbalbach 00:32, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
Someone recently tagged the article as being "not English", a template that, among other things, threatens deletion if the article is not "translated" in two weeks. This is a misuse of this template, as the article is quite clearly written in English. The lyrics of the song, where the template was placed, are also in English, albeit ersatz black vernacular English. The lyrics do need annotation (and probably should be transwikied to Wikisource), but they do not need "translation". I have removed the template. — Brian ( talk) 04:41, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
Hey guys - I've "been bold" and deleted speculation that "From a petroleum engineer's perspective, this could simply refer to corn whiskey. 'Cracking' is, in general, a process of reducing an input substance to a desired output substance... so 'cracked' corn might be corn whiskey." No insult intended to the editor who threw it in, but it's original research. I didn't slap a "citation needed" tag on it because the song had already been written and performed before that kind of 'cracking' had been invented (the article says that the song became popular in the 1840s, and petroleum cracking was pioneered in the following decade). Cracking in the petroleum context referred specifically to the "cracking" of molecular bonds to leave more simple hydrocarbons. If it's passed into more general use to denote any similar kind of process, which the author seems to claim, then so be it - but that would still be after the song was written. Anyway, if I've got that wrong and someone can correct me (and, more importantly for the article, cite it), then absolutely feel free to throw it back in. Señor Service ( talk) 21:22, 31 May 2009 (UTC)
References 7 & 8 (mudcat.org) are links to forum discussions where most people say things like 'My father taught me it was a slave song.' Are these really credible sources? I think the lines referencing these pages should be removed. -- Marco Passarani ( talk) 01:07, 4 January 2010 (UTC)
In the third paragraph, a minor glitch in its reference to the list of possible interpretations.
Note, the "first interpretation" in the given list is about gimcrack corn. The slang "cracker" for white men is third. I presume the latter fits the cited reference, but I wasn't sure. KhyranLeander ( talk) 13:26, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
During the late 18th Century and early 19th century, a basic sustenance food was cracked corn, from which a porridge was made. Not luxurious by any means, but sustaining if one could afford nothing else. Therefore, "Give me cracked corn, and I don't care"; i.e., as long as I have my basic sustenance I'm satisfied, because "my master's gone away"; i.e., I'm no longer under the master's yoke.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.238.168.85 ( talk) 21:28, 8 April 2011 (UTC)
Perhaps it was at some time "Give me cracked corn.", that being the cheapest of foods? That would seem to make sense to black faced minstrels. — Preceding unsigned comment added by David R. Ingham ( talk • contribs) 02:18, 26 March 2012 (UTC)
I really don't understand why the author thinks the slave was charged with a crime. In the South, as everywhere at the time, cases of sudden death were investigated by a coroner, who summoned a jury to render a verdict on the cause of death. If the verdict was "accidental death" (or in this case, "de blue-tail fly") a criminal prosecution was unlikely. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.142.86.14 ( talk) 23:43, 2 December 2013 (UTC)
Sounds like he is in prison eating gimcrack corn. Just granpa ( talk) 20:27, 14 March 2014 (UTC)
Blue Tail Fly isn't completely unknown, but it's still been the less-common name for 30 years now. The article leads with the page name. — LlywelynII 21:32, 30 June 2014 (UTC)
The 1928 American Negro Folk-Songs (p. 152) cites the The Negro Singer's Own Book, Containing Every Negro Song that Has Ever Been Sung or Printed published by Turner & Fisher in New York &/or Philadelphia in 1846 as having "De Blue Tail Fly" (p. 49) and "De New Blue Tail Fly" "by a U. S. N. officer" (p. 413). No idea if they have the same lyrics and different melodies or what, since there's no version of that work available online. Anyone near a university library? — LlywelynII 10:22, 3 July 2014 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved per TWODABS. DrKiernan ( talk) 10:42, 28 March 2015 (UTC)
– I know Eminem is a pretty well known artist, but there's no way that the folk song, taught to millions of children every year, is not the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC for this title. Indeed, considering there's only two items on the current disambiguation page, there's nor real need for one. This article should have the undisambiguated title, the Eminiem song should keep the parenthetical, and the hatnote should be sufficient for any use. Seems obvious to me. oknazevad ( talk) 04:37, 20 March 2015 (UTC)
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This song by Bill-Jo Spears is a must to be mentioned in this article.-- Mideal ( talk) 10:11, 19 March 2019 (UTC)
Jimmy cracked corn = Jesus cracked corn on the sabbath.
and I dont care = its ok to break the law sometimes.
Just granpa (
talk)
20:07, 15 January 2021 (UTC)
"The idea that Jim or Jimmy is "cracking open" a jug of whiskey is similarly unsupported: that phrasal verb is attested..."
There is no phrasal verb involved at all there, not even elliptically, even given the gnarly topic of phrasal verbs. "open", here, functions as an adjective (not as a verb; the action is leaving the item in question in a state of being open, which is clearly adjectival), which is about the only part of speech universally excluded from grammarian classifications of phrasal verbs.
Merriam-Webster, for their analog entry "break open" does refer to that phrase as a "phrasal verb", which is an editorially-challenged blunder. I suppose lexicographers are specialists in the business of defining things rather than parsing them. See:
Inasmuch as modern lexicographers, like modern grammarians, define things by usage and not by fiat, there's a danger of circularity whereby they start incorporating their own analyses into definitions. Eg.
![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
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This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Jimmy Crack Corn article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
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Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
![]() | A fact from Jimmy Crack Corn appeared on Wikipedia's
Main Page in the
Did you know column on 14 September 2005. The text of the entry was as follows:
| ![]() |
I'm going to rate this as "start". It could use some expansion and scholarly referrences. Pustelnik 21:30, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
I would venture a guess on what "Jimmy crack corn" means. "Jim" as in Jim Crow law, as in a popular name for poor rural black in the 19th century. Corn as in white man, as in "white". "Crack" as in kill. Stbalbach 22:59, 13 September 2005 (UTC)
If the song is that old, it's definitely in the public domain. That being the case, there's really no point to this article unless it includes the lyrics (cf. Yankee Doodle, etc.). I was going to do so myself, but got bogged down trying to find the best variant to include — the one with the best mix of brevity, clarity, and antiquity. Is there somebody out there less obsessive than I? Doops | talk 03:19, 14 September 2005 (UTC)
Isn't there a second refrain that goes "Shoo fly, don't bother me" in place of "Jimmy crack corn, and I don't care"...? In fact, when I was about 5-7 years old, I think I knew the name of the song as "Shoo fly, don't bother me"...! Codex Sinaiticus 13:55, 14 September 2005 (UTC)
The vernacular version seems to have a mix of "the" and "de" There should be no "D" on "And" in the 4th line of the first verse. The first line of 2nd verse has "An'" - that would be more consistent. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 216.39.144.40 ( talk • contribs) 25 November 2006.
The line at the end where the "Master is Forced to lie" sounds awfully suspect. Does anybody have access to an old songbook for possible correction? The line sounds a lot more like a punchline, where the Master is the First to Die of Horse Fly Bite, and this got changed to a reference about his unwillingness to lie in his place of ultimate repose. 216.99.201.35 ( talk) 20:58, 19 June 2009 (UTC)
There is a good discussion there about "tomming". In fact it was that article that made me think of this song and then to look here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.145.60.10 ( talk • contribs)
What's "deliberate negligence"? Surely if you do something deliberately you intend to do it and therefore can't have done it by accident? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 212.219.155.28 ( talk • contribs) 18 May 2006.
I cut the uncited claim "It was a favorite song of Abraham Lincoln." If true, should be easy to cite: there's hardly a human being in the last 200 years about whom more has been written. - Jmabel | Talk 06:21, 21 October 2006 (UTC)
Uncited conjecture cut from article: "'Crack corn' might also refer to popping popcorn, presumably frowned upon by masters." - Jmabel | Talk 04:31, 7 November 2006 (UTC)
In the phone commerical (sorry, don't know the carrier), a "dropped call" causes a future son-in-law to mistakenly think he's offended Jim.
In the original version, the young man ends his attempt to be a "buddy" with the song, "Jimmy Crack Corn and I don't care". The commerical now edits that song out, for whatever reason. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.113.237.156 ( talk) 04:12, 9 January 2007 (UTC).
The cingular "trivia" is trivia. We don't do trivia lists at Wikipedia. See WP:TRIVIA and WP:NOT#INDISCRIMINATE.
Ives last song as his last public performance is notable. -- Stbalbach 00:32, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
Someone recently tagged the article as being "not English", a template that, among other things, threatens deletion if the article is not "translated" in two weeks. This is a misuse of this template, as the article is quite clearly written in English. The lyrics of the song, where the template was placed, are also in English, albeit ersatz black vernacular English. The lyrics do need annotation (and probably should be transwikied to Wikisource), but they do not need "translation". I have removed the template. — Brian ( talk) 04:41, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
Hey guys - I've "been bold" and deleted speculation that "From a petroleum engineer's perspective, this could simply refer to corn whiskey. 'Cracking' is, in general, a process of reducing an input substance to a desired output substance... so 'cracked' corn might be corn whiskey." No insult intended to the editor who threw it in, but it's original research. I didn't slap a "citation needed" tag on it because the song had already been written and performed before that kind of 'cracking' had been invented (the article says that the song became popular in the 1840s, and petroleum cracking was pioneered in the following decade). Cracking in the petroleum context referred specifically to the "cracking" of molecular bonds to leave more simple hydrocarbons. If it's passed into more general use to denote any similar kind of process, which the author seems to claim, then so be it - but that would still be after the song was written. Anyway, if I've got that wrong and someone can correct me (and, more importantly for the article, cite it), then absolutely feel free to throw it back in. Señor Service ( talk) 21:22, 31 May 2009 (UTC)
References 7 & 8 (mudcat.org) are links to forum discussions where most people say things like 'My father taught me it was a slave song.' Are these really credible sources? I think the lines referencing these pages should be removed. -- Marco Passarani ( talk) 01:07, 4 January 2010 (UTC)
In the third paragraph, a minor glitch in its reference to the list of possible interpretations.
Note, the "first interpretation" in the given list is about gimcrack corn. The slang "cracker" for white men is third. I presume the latter fits the cited reference, but I wasn't sure. KhyranLeander ( talk) 13:26, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
During the late 18th Century and early 19th century, a basic sustenance food was cracked corn, from which a porridge was made. Not luxurious by any means, but sustaining if one could afford nothing else. Therefore, "Give me cracked corn, and I don't care"; i.e., as long as I have my basic sustenance I'm satisfied, because "my master's gone away"; i.e., I'm no longer under the master's yoke.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.238.168.85 ( talk) 21:28, 8 April 2011 (UTC)
Perhaps it was at some time "Give me cracked corn.", that being the cheapest of foods? That would seem to make sense to black faced minstrels. — Preceding unsigned comment added by David R. Ingham ( talk • contribs) 02:18, 26 March 2012 (UTC)
I really don't understand why the author thinks the slave was charged with a crime. In the South, as everywhere at the time, cases of sudden death were investigated by a coroner, who summoned a jury to render a verdict on the cause of death. If the verdict was "accidental death" (or in this case, "de blue-tail fly") a criminal prosecution was unlikely. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.142.86.14 ( talk) 23:43, 2 December 2013 (UTC)
Sounds like he is in prison eating gimcrack corn. Just granpa ( talk) 20:27, 14 March 2014 (UTC)
Blue Tail Fly isn't completely unknown, but it's still been the less-common name for 30 years now. The article leads with the page name. — LlywelynII 21:32, 30 June 2014 (UTC)
The 1928 American Negro Folk-Songs (p. 152) cites the The Negro Singer's Own Book, Containing Every Negro Song that Has Ever Been Sung or Printed published by Turner & Fisher in New York &/or Philadelphia in 1846 as having "De Blue Tail Fly" (p. 49) and "De New Blue Tail Fly" "by a U. S. N. officer" (p. 413). No idea if they have the same lyrics and different melodies or what, since there's no version of that work available online. Anyone near a university library? — LlywelynII 10:22, 3 July 2014 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved per TWODABS. DrKiernan ( talk) 10:42, 28 March 2015 (UTC)
– I know Eminem is a pretty well known artist, but there's no way that the folk song, taught to millions of children every year, is not the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC for this title. Indeed, considering there's only two items on the current disambiguation page, there's nor real need for one. This article should have the undisambiguated title, the Eminiem song should keep the parenthetical, and the hatnote should be sufficient for any use. Seems obvious to me. oknazevad ( talk) 04:37, 20 March 2015 (UTC)
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This song by Bill-Jo Spears is a must to be mentioned in this article.-- Mideal ( talk) 10:11, 19 March 2019 (UTC)
Jimmy cracked corn = Jesus cracked corn on the sabbath.
and I dont care = its ok to break the law sometimes.
Just granpa (
talk)
20:07, 15 January 2021 (UTC)
"The idea that Jim or Jimmy is "cracking open" a jug of whiskey is similarly unsupported: that phrasal verb is attested..."
There is no phrasal verb involved at all there, not even elliptically, even given the gnarly topic of phrasal verbs. "open", here, functions as an adjective (not as a verb; the action is leaving the item in question in a state of being open, which is clearly adjectival), which is about the only part of speech universally excluded from grammarian classifications of phrasal verbs.
Merriam-Webster, for their analog entry "break open" does refer to that phrase as a "phrasal verb", which is an editorially-challenged blunder. I suppose lexicographers are specialists in the business of defining things rather than parsing them. See:
Inasmuch as modern lexicographers, like modern grammarians, define things by usage and not by fiat, there's a danger of circularity whereby they start incorporating their own analyses into definitions. Eg.