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He used the name Al-Afghani because being from the Shia world wouldn't have exactly worked in Egypt. So, he said he was from Afghanistan while really from Iran. Trying to figure out if it's the same town name but in Iran. gren グレン 05:41, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
I have found conflicting info who is right.
http://www.afghanan.net/biographies/afghani.htm
http://afghanland.com/history/jamaluddin.html
I removed the following text added by User:Aryob:
The Moslem worlds were living under colonial suppression, internal discord and poverty, and they, badly were, in need of a leader such as Jamaluddin. No one can deny reading the history of that period, that Afghani was one of the most outstanding figures and redeemers of the East. With all the qualification that he possessed, he was a great political and unique intellectual of his time. The great French philosopher Renan says about Afghani: (Few people have produced on me a more vivid impression; it is a large measure the conversation that I had with him that decided me to chose as a subject for my lecture at the Sorbonne, the relations between the “scientific spirit and Islam……” The liberty of his thought, his noble and loyal character, made me believe, while I was talking with him, that I had before me, restored to life, one of my old acquaintances----Wicenna, Arerroes, or another of those great infidels, who represented to five centuries the tradition of the human mind.”
This statement which is made by a great philosopher of Europe is enough to understand the high qualification of this Afghan genius, who was considered also by late Pandit Nehru as a great religious reformist, by doctor Iqbal and Namek Kamal as a religious revolutionary and defenders of Pan-Islamism, by Professor Edward G. Brown the author of “Persian revolution” as a man who helped to animate the fight of Moslem resistance against the expansion and Domination of European colonialism.
Some people likens the great personalities of history to precious stones like rubies, amber, turquoise, emerald having special glow, shines, color and beauty, but, Jamal ud-Din was like a diamond shining and glowing from every angle. HE was a reformist, religious leader, philosopher, writer, journalist and above all a politician and emancipator of the East and Moslem world. In fact what made Jamaluddin a great hero of the east and an enemy of colonialism is indeed his political activism, who’s effects and influence spread beyond the borders of his own country Afghanistan, and touched the destiny of people from Bengal to the Atlantic shores of Africa.
Considering what Afghani had accomplished as a one man, with empty hands and no support from any quarter against the formidable powers of Europe, facing many odds and intrigues of the western countries and their agents and spies, is indeed a great achievement. Contrary to the views of some contemporary writers such as the Author of ‘Afghani’ and Abdoh’ and many others like him Jamaluddin was the most dedicated and unselfish politician and the leader of the East- that while the whole Asia and the Moslem world were in a deep sleep of ignorance during the 19 th century he was fighting with a power of his pen and the strength of his spirit to emancipate his people from the European yoke. He continued his fight by every means, in every city and country, even in the heart of colonial centers such as London, Paris, Berlin, and Petersburg until he died. Although he was unable to see the fruits of his labor in his life time, but certainly all the seeds which he sowed, bore fruits soon after his death. His home land Afghanistan only 22 years after his death received independence and what he wanted form his own pupil Amir Mohammad Azam Khan was accomplished by another student of his, Mahmud Tarzi through his son-in-law Amir Amanullah during his reign.
In Egypt another devoted desciple Sad Zaglole Became the father of modern Egypt, in Turkey, Namek Kamal and his follower Ataturk did what Jamal-ad- Din wanted to be done by Turks. In India his efforts to unite Hindu and Moslems to fight the British was realized, and all his political and social principles were followed by Moslem and Hindu leaders such as Abdul Kalam Azad and Alama Iqbal as well as Gandhi and Pandit Nehru.
He wanted Moslem unity through “Um-ul-Qura” now this is also realized and it’s headquarter has been established in Saudi Arabia, He was in favour of Arab unity soon after the First World War the Arab League came to function on the bank of the Nile.
Jamaluddin was considered ‘new traditionalist’ as well as ‘Islamic reformist; because of Afghani’s teaching today most of the Moslem reject rigid traditionalist as well as pure westernism, as once Sir Sayed Ahmad founder of Aligarh University wanted the Moslems to follow. The middle of the road policy of Jamaluddin is a proper way for the Moslems to be the followed even at present time.
As I stated above, it was mainly political activities of Jamaluddin which has attracted International and world wide attention because during the 19 th century he was the greatest champion of liberty and self-determination for oppressed people of the East and a great fighter against European imperialism. To achieve this noble aim, he was following five main political principals, some times using each principal separately, and more often together. But in application of these principles in order to help his people, he followed the main British political theory which one of their great leaders once stated:
“The British never had a permanent friend but she had always a permanent interest”.
The political Principals followed by Afghani are as follows:
He wanted to carry his views from the top, in order to achieve internal reforms as well as to resist foreign domination. Though this principal, he wanted to established a model country in order to be followed by other Asian and Moslem countries. He wanted to use France and Germany as a third power to support the Asian struggle against the British as well as Tsarist Russia. In case of failure of the above theory, he wanted to acquire the British to support the eastern nations in order to push out of Asia, the Tsarist imperialist. To get the Tsarist to help the Asians against the British.
Jamaluddin wanted to use the 3 rd and fourth theories because he knew that Asia and Moslem countries are not able to match the military, technical and economic power of the West and the only way to fight the British or Tsarist Russia is to reply on the Theory of ‘Balance of Power;
The most important theory upon which Afghani was relying was the theory of ‘Pan-Islamism’, or Moslem Unity “, he always wanted to use this weapon, against colonial domination for liberation of Moslems in Asia and Africa. How Afghani applied these theories and how was the results here we will examine in the following pages:
The reasons:
Hey, I am not an expert on this subject so I did not actually edit this article, but I just want to point out that according to everything I have ever heard and read, Jamal-ud-din al-Afghani was a PERSIAN SHIA and was most likely born in Asadabad Persia(modern-day Iran) not in Afghanistan. He called himself al-Afghani and said he was an Afghan to his Sunni co-religionists because he wanted to hide the fact that he was a Shia. This seems natural given the prejudice that many Sunnis have towards Shias.
While it is possible that he was born in Asadabad Afghanistan and latter moved back to Persia when he was very young, it is also likely that he was born in Iran. Where he was born is really not that important, but what is fairly clear is that he was in fact a Persian Shia and not an Afghan.
He may have himself made up the story about being born in Asadabad Afghanistan in order to maintain his story that he was an Afghan in order to hide the fact that he was a Shia.
One last thing, the first reference on this article, the link to the Encylopedia Britannica clearly states that he was born in Asadabad Persia and that he called himself al-Afgani in order conceal the fact that he was a Persian Shia.
This seems logical. He may have felt that his Sunni co-religioinists would have been prejudiced towards him and reject his ideas, if they knew that he was in fact a Shia and not a Sunni like themselves. Umaru Ahmad 03:01, 15 April 2007 (UTC)
Umaru Ahmad is correct. Sayed Jamal ud-Din "al-Afghani" was not an Afghan, but an Iranian. He was born in Asadabad in Iran, and he spent his childhood there. Overwhelming documentation and contemporary sources prove his Iranian origin. 90% of his political activism was concentrated on Iran. I have added two scholary sources, one from Encyclopaedia Iranica and the other from Prof. Keddie (one of the leading authorities on Jamal ud-Din al-Afghani's life and biography) to the article. I'll try to add direct references from the collection of Afshari and Mahdavi (two other imprtant scholars and experts on al-Afghani) to article. Unfortunately, I do not have direct access to the original Persian collection of his letters. As for the article, please notice that the Encyclopaedia Iranica is an authoritative scholarly work, and that its message has to be put above other sources (except for primary sources and/or written literature by notable scholars). However, in this case, it does not matter, since the Iranica article was written by Prof. Keddie, the most important Western scholar on al-Afghani's life, and is directly based on primary sources (al-Afghani's letters). Also Britannica says that he was Iranian. -- 82.83.129.121 22:42, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
There are some sources saying he was born in asadabad of Hamedan in Iran and also some sources are saying he was born in asadabad of Kunar in Afghanistan. But the important thing is his thoughts. He believed in unity of Muslims(Iranian or Afghani), so why should we Muslims fight on him and for our nationality?!! Iranway ( talk) 18:19, 25 March 2008 (UTC)
Al-Afghani was not born in Iran, neither was he Iranian or Shia. Al-Afghani was born in
Asadabad, Afghanistan, this is explained in every school book in Afghanistan and Pakistan. If Al-Afghan was born in Iran then how on earth is it possible for Iran to deport him from his own country? If Al-Afghani committed crimes then Iran would have arrested and charged him but not deport him. The only country that did not deport him was Afghanistan because he was natural born citizen of Afghanistan.--
ZmaGhurnStaKona
06:26, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
An article in the New Dawn Magazine, " The Masons and the Moors", mentions him as a Sufi scholar. This is something that should be mentioned in the article if we can produce some better sourcing for the information. The article associates him with the Khwajagan and professes that he was the teacher of Madame Blavatsky. Also according to that article it is rumoured that the parents of Noble Drew Ali, the founder of the Moorish Science Temple of America were students of al-Afghani, so a strong link may exist between him and that organization as well as the Moorish Orthodox Church of America. __ meco ( talk) 13:53, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
fight over al-Afghani. How about we keep drop Assadabadi but put in the lead something like, "even though he is known throughout the Muslim world as al-Afghani, scholars agree Jamal al-Din was an Iranian Shia born in Asadabad"? -- BoogaLouie ( talk) 17:33, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
Even if he was born in modern Afghanistan that does not mean that he was a dirty backward and nomading Pashtun dog and barbarian. That his ancestor´s name was Termizi showes that he was at least of Tajik origine if not of Iranian-Persian origine. Even modern historian from Afghanistan considere him as a Tajik and not as a Pashtun. It is thought that he became a sunni muslim.
Ps:Kunar province is still inhabitet by urban Tajiks while Pashtuns are nomads there.-- 88.68.192.188 ( talk) 09:26, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
FOR ONCE AND FOR ALL AL-Afghani was afghan from the start and afghan when he died there was never a iranian in the middle, so for those iranians who say hes from hamdam Let me ask u a question? If sayed jamaluddin afghani is from IRAN than how would you explain that he Speaks PASHTO he wrote history of afghanistan in pashto a true afghan language??????????? 71.139.6.230 ( talk) 06:53, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
Source???? you say did you read where he was born? In Kunar, Afghanistan where it is the heart of the pashtuns. The question is how does he not know pashto? thats should be ur question. Give it a break you persians claim everyone as your own with bogus evidence. He is known all over the world as AFGHANI and u dare call him persian loooool PLEAZ save ur selves some fresh air!!! 71.139.6.230 ( talk) 05:40, 11 April 2008 (UTC)Pashtun786
"It is thought Al-Afghani claimed to be an Afghan in order to present himself as a Sunni Muslim - the sect adhered to by most Muslims and most Muslim rulers -and to escape oppression by the Iranian government",[6] or to be associated with the larger branch of Islam so "reach a wider audience" " READ THE ABOVE COMPLETE CONTRADICTION If he was Shia why would he say hes sunni and say he excaped oppression by the iranian government. looooooool COMPLETE STUPID who ever wrote this article most likely was persian. 71.139.6.230 ( talk) 05:48, 11 April 2008 (UTC)Pashtun786
For the title of this page, it doesn't matter if he was born in Iran or Afghanistan. The name that he used was "Afghani" and he is mostly known as "Jamal-al-din al-Afghani" in English Academic texts ( 866 search results, compared to 64 for Asadabadi) and English books ( 672, compared to 58 for Asadabadi). Almost all reputable encyclopedias call him "Jamal-al-din al-Afghani" (For example, see Iranica and Britannica). Alefbe ( talk) 15:18, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
First, in a very prominent book, Arabic Thought in the Liberal Age, Albert Hourani discusses his mysterious origin but calls him al-Afghani throughout his work. Additionally, even if it wasn't his original name, of which we have no knowledge, his prominence was achieved under the name al-Afghani. On wikipedia, Mark Twain's article is called that, not Samuel Clemens; George Sand as such even though the author was female; and Baruch Spinoza as that name as opposed the name he would have been called in his native Portugal, Bento de Espinosa. It really should be changed to al-Afghani. —Preceding unsigned comment added by No1cubfan ( talk • contribs) 06:41, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
Al-afghani in all none-Iranian documents, especially almost all alnguages of Wikipedia, is an Afghan, even his images in English Wikipedia is titled as al-afghani, then why English Wikipedia shoul call him Asadabadi? Isn't it an Iranian influence? Please do not forget your impartiality. If they change it a million times, I will revise a zillion times. 84.13.162.105 ( talk) 09:53, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
The German Wiki does has a handwritten document of Al-Afghani, where he ask to become a membership of the Freemansons. Never saw that before, so what do you think? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.59.204.35 ( talk) 18:38, 21 July 2008 (UTC)
Inuit18, come you with your academic sources and i will come with my academic sources. we will see who is right. so, come with your academic sources please...... Abasin-اباسین 02:39, 29 January 2010 (UTC)
currently three academic sources which is accepted by all Orientalists is used in this article. Encyclopedia of Islam, Encyclopedia of Iranica and Britannica.-- Inuit18 ( talk) 07:32, 29 January 2010 (UTC)
Inuit18, you are right about this Encyclopendias, but the qeustion is; who are this people who has edited this Encyclopedias, what is their goal by posting wrong information on this Encyclopedias, are they Persians like you..? if yes, than it is clear but if they aren't Persians than is the qeustion from where have they this information and second, have they any political ambitions or did they first read Encyclopedias like this and have wrong information and than write this Encyclopedias and also the qeustion is, are behind this Encyclopedias the same people..? who use have linked this Encyclopedias to each others....?
Here this are my academic sources. is it enough or do you want more...?
1. www.Afghan-Network.net [2] 2. www.studying-islam.org [3] 3. www.scribd.com [4] 4. www.afghanan.net [5] 5. www.laghman.net [6] 6. malaysiana1.blogspot.com [7] 7. krex.k-state.edu [8] 8. lsinsight.org [9] 9. www.afghan-web.com [10] 10. www.america.gov , U.S. Helps Restore a Monument to Afghanistan’s Proud Past 19th Century Afghan Thinker Sayed Jamaludin al-Afghani Honored [11] 11. www.renaissance.com [12] 12. wiki.answers.com [13] 13. www.afghansite.com [14] 14. www.afghanland.com [15] 15. www.bashiransari.com [16] 16. knol.google.com [17] 17. www.facebook.com [18] 18. www.scribd.com , Important Dates in the Life of Sayed Jamaluddin Afghani [19]
And Except from this, some fact. the fact is that Jamalludin Afghan has claimed himself as a very proud Afghan and not as a Persian, the fact is that Jamalludin Afghan has gived his Bornplace as Asadabad, Kunar province, Afghanistan and not as Asadabad, near Hamedan, Persia. and the qeustion is, how long does this Asadabad village exist in Persia...? the fact is that Jamalludin Afghan has writed a book about Afghan History and not about Persia History, the fact is that Jamalludin Afghans tomb is in Kabul, Afghanistan and not in Persia, the fact is that Afghanistan and Persia has asked for his body, but the world (people with knowleg, not people like on this English wikipedia) has recognises Jamalludin Afghan as a Afghan and not as a Persian, and so give the body remains to Afghanistan. the fact is that persian people are allways trying to make Afghan History their own, for exemple; Jamalludin Afghan, Jalaludin Balkhi (Rumi) and even the History of Ariana by calling their country Iran and not Persian (ARIANA, make from 3 A,s one A, read the first 3 letters of ARIANA in mirror line and place there the 5th letter of ARIANA (the N) and you wil read IRAN so this why i call it Persia and not Iran because ARIANA belongs to Afghanistan and not to Persia. and the fact is that Ariana is one of the old names of Afghanistan (Historical name of Afghanistan).
By someone else and this writed by some one else about the Conflict between Persians and Afghans about the Nationality of Jamalludin Afghan; Sayed Jamal-u-Din Afghan is one of the greatest scholars that Afghanistan has produced. But there has been confusion surrounding the citizenship of Afghani, which originates from misguided sources. This misunderstanding roots back from the British reporters and agents who suspected the entry and departure of Afghans and foreigners into and from Afghanistan during the late 18th century and 19th century. This is due to the "Great Game" going on at that time between the Czarist Russian Empire and British Empire for the control of the Indian Subcontinent. Iran is disputing the origin of Jamal-u-din Afghan, Iran is claiming that Sayed Jamal-u-din was born in the city of Asad Abad, Iran. This confuses some people because the provincial capital of Kunar in Afghanistan is also called Asadabad. But Jamal-u-din himself claimed in his own writing to be a true proud Afghan. (He was born1839 in Shair Garh, Kunar, Afghanistan)One of the reasons that these rumors was spread about his nationality was because he was a prominent figure in the anti-colonialism compaign against the British Empire in Afghanistan and its neighbours. Western powers used these rumor to destroy his image and start a dispute between the two neighbours. He was also a great promoter of Islamic Unity in India, Afghanistan, Iran and the Middle East. The Western powers also opposed this kind of unity in central Asia and looked at it as a treat to the British and Russian Empire, mostly in Central Asian Republics for Czarist Russia and India and Pakistan for the British Empire.To conclude, there is no doubt that Sayed Jamal-u-din Afghan is an Afghan. In 1944 Remains of Jamaludin was returned to Afghanistan from Turkey. Afghanistan honours this great scholar and has built a monument for his great achievements in the capital, Kabul. This monument is located in the garden of one of the great universities in Asia, University of Kabul.
for more info visit: wiki.answers.com [20]
I think that this English wikipedia has choice a side or the admins are who are working on this project are defently Persians, if they where not Persians or have not choice a side than they would place his bornplace as Asadabad, Afghanistan, because his tomb in Kabul, Afghanistan because their are enough aproves that he is a Afghan and not a Persian, he claims himself as a proud Afghan and he claims his own Bornplace Asadabad, Kunar province Afghanistan, in his own Book about the Afghan History. if you people, specially admins. if you thing i am not right; you haven't choice a side and you are not a Persian then you would have placed his Bornplace as both Asadabad, from Afghanistan and From Persia and give refences to it and let the people think what is right in their own point of view, but no, you have claimed his bornplace as Asadabad, Persia, you have writed his name as Asadabadi and you have deleted the picture of the monument of Jamalludin Afghan in Kabul. So than i claim and very one who has a little bite knowlege will claim you as a men/women who has choiced a side or you are a Persian, so automaticly choice the side of Persia sources and claim him as a Persian!!
In my point of view, what most be the policy of wikipedia (specially English section, because the most of the world people can read and understand English, so it is not right to give the people wrong information. i think it is not right). if wikipedia want to be a neutral Encyclopendi and a respected Encyclopendia, they most place his bornplace as Asadabad, Kunar province, Afghanistan. Because Jamalludin Afghan claims himself as a Afghan, he claims his own bornplace as Asadabad, Kunar province, Afghanistan, he has writed a book about the Afghan history (where he claims himself as a Proud Afghan) and specially because his body was returned from Istanbul, Turkey to Kabul, Afghanistan to give him his finanly rest place.
Abasin-اباسین 15:20, 29 January 2010 (UTC)
Abasin-اباسین 16:34, 29 January 2010 (UTC)
Even if he was born in Afghanistan, Adabaad, Kunar, local historian consider him as a Tajik neverlessness his last name Afghan. The term Afghan is in modern sense not something ethnical, but a national term, used even by some Hazaras and Tajiks to relate themself with the state with the name AFGHANISTAN. Local historians consider him as Tajik. So what? Pushtuns had never a political movement against British-Raj or against anyone, except the Taliban, Haqqani, Gulbuddini, Al-Qaida movements which were a movement of Pashtun-Arab chauvinism. There was only one time when Pushtuns really were incooperated into a movement, an that was the Roshanian Movement, first established by eastern-Tajiks of Ismaeli faith like Ansari and Bayazid Roshan. But I guess, that Pushtuns were incooperated in the movement was again nothing else than just using of Pushtun people and their ghairat and nang. Tajiks like Jamaluddin Afghani, Maulana Rumi etc. were living in that region before Pashtuns existed and before they came down from the hills of the Sulaiman Mountains and Tajiks/Persians were famous as cultural people, heroes, rulers and sub-rulers, scholars, generals, people of pen before the world could inventate it´s own renessance. Btw, Tajiks always called themself and identified themself with Persians and Persian civilization, not with Pushtuns, Afghans, who were unknown to them since they were living on mountains and Greater India and in Arab states.-- 94.219.218.150 ( talk) 21:55, 29 January 2010 (UTC)
It doesn't mather what he was, a Pakhtun, Tajik, Uzbak, Hazara, Balooch, Nooristani or something else. The fact is that he was a Afghan and born in Asadabad, Kunar province, Afghanistan. We are all Afghans, we are all brothers, we are all the same. By our soul, body, life, mind or whatever. We are like a familly, We are all brothers!! Our eldest Brother is Pakhtun and than Tajik brother, Uzbek brother, Hazara brother, Balooch brother, Nooristani brother and etc. We are all one!! We will never give you Persian people and Britisch people the chance, to make different parts from this brothers!! We will never give you people the chance to break us!! We will never give you people the chance to make pieces from us!! to beat each one of us easly in different parts!! We will late happen this!! put this in your head, full of sawdust and hay!! We where allways one, we are allways one and will be allways one and stay together!! Remembers this, before you next time have the bravados to talk about Afghans!!
let me tell you something about Jamalludin Afghan and the term Afghan. His name is Sayed Jamaludin Afghan. Born in Asadabad, Kunar province, Afghanistan. He was a sayed and sayeds are mostly Sunni Moslims. Sayeds are still living in Asadabad, Kunar province, Afghanistan. The name Jamaludin is a name which is gived more to childeren in Afghanistan than in Persia as childname. By calling himself a Afghan, he wants to hide his Persian origins and being a Shi'ia Moslim. This is the theory and philosophy of Persians. i am right..? if yes listen than, if he was a from Persians origins and shi'ia moslim, he wasn't but stil image it like this. By calling himself a Afghan it doesn't means that he is automaticly a Pakhtun and a sunni moslim. Because in Afghanistan lives not only Pakhtun brothers. But also Tajik brothers, Uzbek brothers and etc. In Afghanistan are not only sunni moslims but also shi'ia moslims, hindus and even some jews. The fact that he is a Afghan and Sunni moslim is very clearly. He was a sayed and sayeds are mostly Sunni moslims, maybe even just and only sunni moslims. Sayeds lives in Asadabad, Kunar province, Afghanistan. In the Kunar Province lives 95% Pakhtuns brothers (Afghan proud) and 5% are Nooristanian (proud Afghans) brothers and sisters. So leave Asadabad, my Tajik brothers don't even live in Kunar province. I think it is now enough about Sayed Jamaludin Afghan (The Afghan proud).
So now about Afghan. The name Afghan is used by Pakhtun brothers from the islamic period to indicate themselfs. But in this time there wasn't any country in the world with the name Afghan or Afghanistan. And it is has not any true that Persians call the Pakhtun brothers Afghans, to identify the Pakhtun brothers. The fact is that Pakhtun brothers called themselfs Afghans from the islamic period. The name Pakhtun comes at himself from Bactria (Afghans call it Bakhteria or Bakhter). The changing from Bakhter to Pakhtun needed more steps. but i will you it in 3 steps, Bakhter => Pakhter => Pakhtun.
Will we have not only Taliban of Mullah Omar and Hesb-e-Islam of Gulbuddin Hekmatyar. But, if we look back in the history. Afghanistan was the only country in the world which was never a colony of British people. The British people are trying to destroy the history of Afghanistan. Because Afghans where the people who has destroyed the dream of British people of making Afghanistan their colony and also their dream of being the rulers of the world. Losing 3 time the war against Afghans and Afghanistan was the start of ending of British people as world power and the ending of the Colonialism and Colonisation, not only in Asia but also in the world. It was also the start of world change, the way of thinking, in the world was changed and etc. People who have fight against the British Raj, where Dost Mohammad Khan, his sons and also Abdul Rahman Khan, Amir Amanullah Khan, Sayed Jamaludin Afghan and many more. And the Persian are trying to destroy the history of Afghans and Afghanistan. In simply way to claim it after destroying.
User:inuit18 I guess, you don’t know the history of Afghans or you have very wrong information and based on nothing else than lies of Persian side. One thing is good of you and I like it. You recognises that Afghans people have ghairat, nang, namus, rich history, braves, heroes, leaders, rulers etc and Persian people are be-ghairat, be-nang, be-namus, history less and etc. By saying, they use only the Afghans and their ghairat and nang. Wwwooowww so lovely and feels great, that Persian people have accept that they are BeGhairat, BeNang, BeNamus, History less and etc. just to nice:D Maybe this is the reason why you Persian people are trying to claim Afghan history.
Jalaludin Balkhi is from Balkh and he was the one who have brought Mili-Attan (The National Dance of Afghanistan.) to Turkey. Now knows to European people as the Rumi Dance. Which is originly founded by Pakhtuns. I don’t care about what he was a Pakhtun or a Tajik. Whatever he was, he was a Afghan!
Afghans have a very long history of thousands years. Some people say 12 thousand year but there are approves in Kabul museum of 9 or 10 thousand year. I know you have this knowledge from willem vogelsang’s book and I’m sure he has got this information from Persian people. I have no other reasons except this or British people. His name sounds like a Dutch man. By saying things like this, you agree that you have not any knowledge and accept everything from every one. By talking like this you have showed that you haven’t any knowledge about Afghans and Afghanistan. And you people believe even a Dutchmen! I hope you are not coming and say to me that a Hollander knows more about me than myself.
What do you Persian people have..? Nothing else than liars and slaves. We Afghans have a rich culture, rich history, famous personality like Ahmad Shah Durrani (Ahmad Shah Baba), Mirwais Hotaki (Mirwais Neeka), Khoshal Khan Khattak, Jalaludin Balkhi, Jamaludin Afghan, Rahman Baba, Yama (the first have koning is the history), Khan Abdul Ghaffar Khan, Hamza Shinwari, Ghani Khan, Dost Mohammad Khan, Malalai Nia, Nazo Nia, Amanullah Khan. Is it enough or do you want to have more…? We have Ariana, Bakhteria (Bactria), Kushans and many more. Oh i’m sorry you people also claim Ariana as yours…hahah.. sorry but it is to funny. Ariana is one of the Historical names of Afghanistan. Today we have Ariana Afghan Airlines in Afghanistan, Germans are also Arians and they say we are originly from Afghanistan. They don’t say we are originly from Persia.
The Heart of Asia, The Key of East, The Lock of Asia, The Black Poort of World Powers, The Country of Rich History, The Land of Brave, The Land of True Moslims, The Land of Attan and Jirga. Too much to say them all.
The Gallant People of Afghanistan, The Honorable People of Afghanistan. People of their word, Freedom Lovers, Peace lovers, Cultural People, Land of Brave and many more.
When the Alexander the great (Iskander) was in Afghanistan, he can’t take the control of Afghanistan. He can’t even capture it. After some time his mother send him a letter and asked him why he can’t capture Afghanistan? He send a letter back with the ground of Afghanistan and write back, in this ground is so much habit, proud, honour, sense of honour, pride that they are ready to die but are not ready to loss their freedom. Alexander the Great lost his first and only battle in Kunar province, Afghanistan. After Alexander the Great was Asadabad called Damkale (Dam, is taked from the Afghan word dama, which means rest and kale is also a Afghan word and means village. so in facts it means rest village). Asadabad was called Damkale because Alexander the Great stays there for some days. The rest place of Alexander the Great.
I have read the article of Nikki R. Keddie and Persianca Enclopendia a little bite. Nikki R. Keddie write in his article (THE BIOGRAPHIES WHICH WHERE WRITED BY THE PEOPLE WHO KNOWED HIM VERY WELL, ARE DESTROYED WITH POLITICAL INTENTIONS/REASONS). So the qeustion is, who have done this...? Afghans... British people.... Persians... or someone else...? Answer Afghanistan; Afghanistan would never do things like this. Even if they wanted, they are simply not able to do things like this and have also no reasons. British people; well British people want to destroy his image and have also the possibilities and the habit to do jobs like this. as a British people knower. Read this [25]. Persians; Persians want to claim Jamaludin Afghan as a Persian personality and are able to do jobs like this. Let it be clear, his real biographies are destroyed and sometime later comes Persia with letters, with Jamaludin Afghan would have writed and after a time, comes his biographies of being from a Persian origins. Well is it not a little bite strange.... don't do you think so...? Except from this, the Persian people have allways try to claim Afghan history and the personalities of Afghans as their own. To claim Jamaludin Afghan as a Persian, they needed to have proves, to have proves, they needed to destroy the real proves (like his Biographies) and to prove what they are saying is right, they needed to create prove. So what is the true behind this letters..? IN PERSIANCA ENCLOPENDIA, they write (Government of India and Maǰmūʿa sources show that in Afghanistan he called himself the Sayyed “Rūmī” (Anatolian) or “Estanbolī” and claimed to be from Istanbul. The government of India reporter noted that he was a stranger to Afghanistan and spoke Persian like an Iranian.) well he have never claimed himself as a Estanboli or if being from Istanbul. this is what i call the propaganda of Persians! if he is not our, we will also don't late make it yours. well in letters and article wite where writed about him in Afghanistan (when he was in Afghanistan), they write only Sayed Jamalludin Afghan, nothing else. And about he was a stranger to Afghanistan. Well if he was a stranger to Afghanistan. How could he write a book about the Afghan History..? I think it says enough. And except from this i have found 2 books on internet on his biography. Abasin-اباسین ( Tofaan-توفان) 23:57, 2 February 2010 (UTC)
Abasin-اباسین ( Tofaan-توفان) 00:09, 3 February 2010 (UTC)
If nobody has objection, i am going to make some changes in this article (look to academic sources). Abasin-اباسین ( Tofaan-توفان) 16:10, 5 February 2010 (UTC)
These links are not academic. unless you provide us with academic and scholarly sources we will keep the article as it is. The current information is going no where since three academic encyclopedias(Britannica, Islam, and Iranica) are used.--
Inuit18 (
talk)
21:34, 5 February 2010 (UTC)
Goo nakho kussmadar Pashtunzai —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.219.198.90 ( talk) 09:48, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
This article needs some copy-edit work. First of all, the most common version of his name in English is "al-Afghani" and not "Asadabadi". Therefore, "al-Afghani" should be used in the article. Secondly, due to the many edits and the constant IP vandalism, this article looks very amateurish. Tajik ( talk) 15:04, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
I propose changing "Asadabadi" used throughout the article to "al-Afghani." Any objections? -- BoogaLouie ( talk) 16:48, 23 April 2009 (UTC)
From his lifetime, his name was Al Afghani. Why do we change his name to Asadabadi ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.113.246.94 ( talk) 20:13, 6 May 2009 (UTC)
I have reverted obvious falsifications by an anon IP. Tajik ( talk) 22:13, 16 June 2009 (UTC)
It should be mentioned that to modern view of Afghan scholars Jamaludin Afghani was an ethnic Tajik, unnoted his last title since Asabad was during his time a predominant Tajik city. The fake claim of some Iranians on him because of some ridicolous facts (he was a Persian-speaker, possibly his parents moved/fled from Gulnar when Pashtun nomads moved to the region and gained it for their own people->Pashtunization, where Shia and turned out as Sunni etc etc.). With all respect dear writers, but it should also noted the view of Afghan scholars, not only of Iranians. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.219.214.232 ( talk) 00:32, 2 August 2009 (UTC)
I reverted the article to the previous version.-- Inuit18 ( talk) 04:34, 15 October 2009 (UTC)
Before changing and removing content from the article please discuss it here with other editors and after a consensus you can change it.-- Inuit18 ( talk) 02:10, 27 January 2010 (UTC)
i said i talk with everyone who want to talk tonight, why has this virtueelSteve or what every have blocked me for 31 hours..?
come and talk, what is wrong with you people..? he is from my province Kunar, Afghanistan if some has there problems with it or is he/she thinking that i am not right, than come and talk. and i will tell all the admins, i have respect for your works, but if you someone block me, this time than you people have choice a side. and i think it is not right for the reputation of wikipedia and your admins.
it not right that people are playing with Afghan history, for example watch Ahmad Shah Durrani, Balkhi, Afghanistan history and etc. how do you all would feel if people are playing with the history of your country..? i am sure than you people will view it from other side. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Abasin ( talk • contribs) 23:47, 28 January 2010 (UTC)
While the English part ot the plate only reads "Asad Abadi Sq.", the Persian text reads "Midan Sayyid Jamalu-d-din Asadabadi", i.e. "Square of the Sayyid Jamalu-d-din Asadabadi" (میدان سید جمال الدین اسدآبادی). So the square honours the person, not the city. Worth mentioning is the use of "Asadabadi" as part of his name instead of "Afghani"; I assume the former is preferred in Iran.-- Filius Rosadis ( talk) 13:43, 26 December 2010 (UTC)
The result of the move request was no consensus. -- Aervanath ( talk) 16:57, 6 February 2009 (UTC)
Jamal-al-Din Afghani →
Jamāl-al-dīn Asadābādī — Please consult the following sites:
—
[26]. An introduction to the Collected Works of Sayyed Jamal al-Din Asadabadi.
—
Iran Digital Library. This site gives the full text of the collected letters of Sayyed Jamal al-Din Asadabadi (collection has been done by Abol-Hassan Jamali Asadabadi and the book has a foreword by one of Iran's all-time greatest scholars, Mohammad Mohit Tabatabai)
—
Iran Chamber Society, by
Iraj Bashiri
—
Encyclopaedia Iranica, by Nikki R. Keddie.
—
Wayiran (
talk)
14:58, 31 January 2009 (UTC)
*'''Support'''
or *'''Oppose'''
, then sign your comment with ~~~~
. Since
polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account
Wikipedia's naming conventions.
You people have to understand, this is our history, this are our people and not yours. all i want to tell you al wikipedias and specially Persia people, you can write it 100 times (even by help of non Persia people like virtueelSteve or what ever), to claim Afghan stuffs as your owns but the true will not change, they where Afghans, they are Afghans and will be allways Afghans! my dear brother;) get a life:P Abasin اباسين افعان Afghan 23:25, 28 January 2010 (UTC)
In Persian the proportion of the use of "Asadabadi" over "Alafghani" is 14:1. That means at least in internet, the use of "Asadabadi" is 14 times more than "Alafghani". -- Wayiran ( talk) 13:05, 6 February 2009 (UTC)
http://www.h-net.org/~bahai/areprint/afghani/namihha/namihha.htm
The result of the move request was: Moved: reverted move made after no consensus to move. Omitted macrons in al-Afghani as they were not requested for Jamal-al-Din and were not in the original title. — kwami ( talk) 23:16, 6 May 2011 (UTC)
Sayyid Jamal-ad-Din Asadabadi → Jamal-al-Din al-Afghānī — This is the correct title and the stable version of the article had that title. A user moved this page without discussion and was against the request with result "no consensus". I think the page has to be moved back. -- Xashaiar ( talk) 16:34, 23 March 2011 (UTC)
Life. Jamāl-al-dīn was born in the village of Asadābād, near Hamadān, into a family of local sayyeds. According to the best evidence, he was educated first at home, then taken by his father for further education to Qazvīn, to Tehran, and finally, while he was still a youth, to the ʿatabāt, the Shiʿite shrine cities in Iraq. Judging from his early copying and lifelong retention of treatises by leaders of Shaikhism, he was influenced by this Shiʿite school, which was noted for its “Fourth Pillar,” the need for the world always to have a “perfect man.” This idea was echoed in Afḡānī’s famous speech that caused his expulsion from Istanbul in 1870 (see below). Afḡānī was also influenced by the ideas of certain Muslim philosophers, especially Iranian ones; works of such figures as Avicenna, Naṣīr-al-dīn Ṭūsī, and Mollā Ṣadrā are found among his books. In addition, Afḡānī’s approach to modern problems was influenced by the still living school of traditional Islamic philosophy with its strong emphasis upon the use of the rational faculty. (N. R. Keddie)
In reply to someone says "it doesn't matter where he was born. What matters is that what name is more common in English books and Academic sources." I just have to say that there are lots of wrong thing in what they say. such as naming Iran for years as Persia - according to the Sassanid dynasty and as they called them in Rome. but all over history and Persian literature named as Iran/Iran-zamin (especially in Shahname) and you wont find any Persia in these documents. so It is not an Iranization. We just try to fix wrong habits. to those who say that Asadābād is a newly built town, maybe want to see its page for more information. Beside, how we have to know that his hometown is big or small? This is a bad reason for your claim. Here we don't talk about nationalism, its about a man that think about united Muslims. Now, we just want to talk and know the truth by documents. After all, according to the documents, there are two other proves: 1- "Reports from the colonial British Indian and Afghan government stated that he was a stranger in Afghanistan, and spoke the Persian language with Iranian accent and followed European lifestyle more than that of Muslims, not observing Ramadan or other Muslim rites." [1] It is nonsense for an Afghan to talk "with Iranian accent" out of Iran and in Afghanistan. 2 - Why would Naser al-Din Shah Qajar invite and deport a foreigner when there are lots of Iranian clerics and Ayatollahs - include Grand Ayatollah Mirza Hassan Shirazi? P. Pajouhesh ( talk) 22:32, 23 March 2011 (UTC)
I also want to add that the comments by user:Mazdakabedi (P. Pajouhesh) and user:BehnamFarid (BF) contain anti-Afghanistan/anti-Afghan tone while trying to lecture us on Iran's history from their perspective. There was no political state or entity by the name of Iran before 1935, it was a loose territory which was known by many different names depending on the inquirers but it was more commonly refered to Persia (Parsi or Parsia... area of Parsi-speaking people), ruled by the Qajar dynasty. Many, including Afghanistan, claim that al-Afghani was born in Asadabad, a village or town in what was then Kabulistan (now Kunar Province) Afghanistan, and from there he immigrated as a child to Iran where he lived for a number of years as Afghan refugee, from Iran he returned to Afghanistan during his late teens and moved to neighboring British-India (Pakistan-India) to advance his studies... and from there he started travelling to other places of the Middle East and then Europe, etc. Changing his article from "Jamal-al-Din al-Afghānī" to "Sayyid Jamal-ad-Din Asadabadi" is Iranian nationalistic POV-pushing, misleading, and falsification.-- ANP member ( talk) 16:02, 31 March 2011 (UTC)
Writing stuff like "It is nonsense for an Afghan to talk "with Iranian accent" out of Iran and in Afghanistan" itself is a nonsense statement. There are about 1 million Afghans in Iran and I'm sure majority of these (especially the ones born in Iran) speak Persian "with Iranian accent". This is normal for someone who grows up as a child in whatever land (i.e. the Afghans in Britain speak English with British accent and while those who grow up in the United States speak it with American accent).-- ANP member ( talk) 16:33, 31 March 2011 (UTC)
In search I got 3,230,000 results for al-Afghani: but only 7,510 for Asadabadi.-- ANP member ( talk) 15:13, 1 April 2011 (UTC)
- Afghan American: This is just to let you know that you seem to be in the wrong place! This is not the place were people lodge complaints about other people and other nations! You may or may not be in the mood for whatever thing, none of which can be any of my business, nor the business of any other Wikipedia editor chancing this page. Regarding your story of Afghanistan in Kabulistan, four points are in order: First, cite a reliable reference in support of your statement; where is Asadabadi's claim recorded? Where and to whom did Asadabadi make such claim? (This is aside from the fact that Asadabadi being a fugitive -- the Iranian state badly wanted him extradited to Iran, he said different things to different people, just to save his skin). Second, it is pertinently not true that "some Iranians claim"! I for one turn out to know Asadabadi through my grandparents and great-grandparents (at home Asadabadi was just a household name). Third, regarding the possibility of so-called "forged documents", this does not belong to the area of history! In writing history, one relies on historical documents and historical evidences that strongly correlate with each other. Things written otherwise, are not historical accounts, but historical novels. Just consider the claim that Asadabadi's left foot had four fingers. This is not impossible (it may even be true), but so long as it is not recorded in some reliable historical documents, such claim cannot be accepted as being part of history. Fourth, that Nikki Keddie were "biased", that is your personal opinion, for which there is no place in Wikipedia. She may or may not be biased, but that is not for us to decide; you had a point if you were able to present references to writings by some professional historians in which they pronounce judgements regarding Keddie's supposed lack of professional integrity, for that is the essence of your claim: that she were a person who distorts history for some ulterior reasons of hers. In closing, I recommend you to address people more politely than you have been doing here (that you are not in some mood is just contemptible language -- it is just undignified for me to even take you seriously with this streetwise language of yours). Elsewhere you accuse me and others of nationalism, which is not a matter up for discussion here -- worse still, you accuse someone of nationalism even while you are demonstrably ignorant of the name of the person who discovered alcohol. You seem to have convinced yourself that people owe you something, which very baldy reflects on your character and your general attitude towards other people who happen not to be Afghan, or Afghan-American, as you seem to be considering yourself. --BF 01:00, 22 April 2011 (UTC)
- I just wonder why are you people talk in this rude way. Why are you spread these amount off hate toward the pages. We are just try to talk about an article. Please talk in a polite way. Dear BF, you don't have right to say to others something like "keep away from the place" you say something like that over and over under any discussion. Dear ANP, I don't know how you say something in this way that Iranians hate Afghans! I just wonder according to what you say that. Why every Afghanistani in any article just say something like that. It hurts others. I think you hate Iranians because of their governments behaviors to you. Please people, just talk about the article in a civilized way and just don't spread hate from anyone to any other. And remember, don't write something nationalistic, Just write about something with adequate documents.
- As I told before, there are lots of proof for this claim. you say something about accent, but it is not true, every ethnic people talk in themselves in their own accent everywhere they live - especially in cities like Tehran: Gilaks in Gilaki, Lors in Lori, Hazara in Hazarajati and etc and in other places at least in first and second generation. so It is not true what you said. Beside, I told another reasons for this claim such as invitation form Nasser-ad-Din Shah. British documents and etc.
- As I told it before, there are no document about what you said about the trip from Afghanistan to Iran. Document means: a work of non-fiction writing intended to store and communicate information, thus acting as a recording. There are no auto-biography or any kind of signed documents that proof this claim (look at British India documents). P. Pajouhesh ( talk) 02:40, 2 April 2011 (UTC)
- Mazdakabedi, please do not dispense advice! I have been very clear in my statement: I have not taken any person's right to comment, rather said that a comment must contain reasoned arguments and not unfounded accusations. Those who come only to hit and run, by accusing people of unwholesome things, are simply not commenting on what matters, but undermining other people's credibility. -BF 04:25, 4 April 2011 (UTC)
- I followed some of Mazdakabedi's (P. Pajouhesh's) edits and he/she appears to be a vandal, an Iranian nationalist, and a heavy POV-pusher. [28] [29] [30] I get very frustrated when seeing someone do things like this, he/she wastes not only its time but also others'.-- Afghan American ( talk) 21:09, 7 April 2011 (UTC)
I got 141,000 hits for Jamal-al-Din al-Afghānī and only 140 for Jamal-ad-Din Asadabadi and only 81 for Sayyid Jamal-ad-Din Asadabadi.-- Afghan American ( talk) 04:34, 8 April 2011 (UTC)
- Dear Afghan American friend, It is you that behave like a vandal, I even not nationalist, but I'm against any kind of that. You delete others claims and resources. You are really vandal that adding your info to any page without any discussion. I asked you to discuss about your claims first, but you add your info again. Next time be polite or by your rude way, I will request to block you. Beside, which one of these pages you linked are vandalized? If your History knowledge is poor, it's not others problem.
Just for your information:
- Every kid knows Muhammad ibn Zakariya al-Razi who first discovered Rubbing alcohol.
- Everyone knows that Mughal Empire has ties to Iranian history. Today Afghanistan and Pakistan (complete or parts of them) was some days as a part of Mughal Empire and some other day Iranian's (Safavid, Afsharid, Zandid, Qajars). Beside, lots of Iranian artist move to there, co-military actions in Safavid days, Persian language, etc. You are really poor in history.
- Kabul Shahi is a kingdom in days of collapsing of Sassanids and was a part of Historic Iran (not today Iran). This is not about a politic today Iran. It's about Historic Iran (or as someone named it in west Persia).
As it seen one time your account become blocked of your behaviors. Please, behave in a civilised way and discuss about your claims first, or you will be blocked again by other users. Here we just talk. It is not about nationalistic behaviors. I answered to your claim in up but you act uncivilized. P. Pajouhesh ( talk) 00:59, 10 April 2011 (UTC)
- Support for Jamal-al-Din al-Afghani, just because at least in English this is his best known name. There's no conflict if the Persian wiki adopts another criteria, many historical personages are named differently in different countries or languages. The different theories about Jamaluddin's reasons for using this surname should be part of the article. I have to add that I don't see any necessary "nationalism", let alone hatred, in any of the postures. You can be an Iranian nationalist and call him "Afghani" and viceversa. -- Filius Rosadis ( talk) 15:08, 11 April 2011 (UTC)
- I think that we had talked about this reason and its inadequacy, above. P. Pajouhesh ( talk) 18:41, 12 April 2011 (UTC)
- I have no idea who is correct. But the move was made after a request to move had been closed with no consensus. I have therefore restored the article to al-Afghani. (No-one seems to object to the al-, which was not in the original title; I can remove it if they do.) — kwami ( talk) 23:16, 6 May 2011 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.
References
Salaam Please remove the word shia under Al-Afghani's photo. He was not shia and it is rubbish. I think that this article has been written by a shia iranian. First of all his name is Al-Afghani, so no shia connecion. Secondly Al-Afghani was one of the precursors of the salaf movement. Then how could Al-Afghani be a shia? Please correct it — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.237.80.228 ( talk) 20:19, 22 August 2011 (UTC)
What a big surprise, Jamal-al-din was shia, very funny. 90% of muslims (sunnis) consider him as one of the biggest ulema of Ahl Sunna, but in this article he becomes a shia. This article is not neutral and should be written by someone neutral and who knows something about Syed Jamal-Al-Din Al-Afghani. Thank you — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.237.80.228 ( talk) 11:59, 24 August 2011 (UTC)
There is something odd in the similarity between this sentence, at the bottom of the political views section:
It is a surprising information that Hanna Abi Rashid, then chief of the masonic lodge in Beirut, wrote in the book "Da’irat al-ma’arif al-Masoniyya" that “Jamal ad-Din Afghani was the chief of the masonic lodge in Egypt, which had about three hundred members, mostly scholars and state officials." [25]
and this sentence in the page on Mohammed Abduh, at the end of the biography section:
It is a surprising information that Hanna Abi Rashid, then chief of the masonic lodge in Beirut, wrote in the book "Da’irat al-ma’arif al-Masoniyya" that “Muhammad Abduh was one of the leading names of the masonic lodge in Egypt, which had about three hundred members, mostly scholars and state officials." [9]
I don't have access to the book, but it seems odd to me that the author would write almost the exact same thing about Afghani and Abduh in almost identical words. The only difference in wording is that Afghani is said to have been chief of the Masonic lodge and Abduh is said to have been a leading member. Is the reference accurate? Is the book reliable? That is, should we trust that Afghani and Abduh were Masons?
Whoever added the information seems to have just done a cut and paste job - as evidenced by the beginning "It is a surprising information"
I recommend that the lines on the Masonic lodge be deleted in both articles unless the source can be verified and someone can explain why this 'surprising information' is relevant.
I'm also going to post this on the talk page for Mohammed Abduh
Update: No one replied. I'll remove the lines. -- 204.191.130.148 ( talk) 04:21, 12 October 2011 (UTC) Kno InRes
again, the masonic link cannot be verified. the same post if you google it is found on wahabi / salafi websites. extremists seems to be posting the same thing.
until the person (whom i suspect is a wahabi / salafi) who added this line verifies these accusations I will remove it. Mmafactscheck ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 21:46, 11 December 2011 (UTC).
i have actually found reference to him being a mason at http://www.iranicaonline.org/articles/afgani-jamal-al-din which seems quite credible. the previous entry made no sense, a simple cut and past job. Mmafactscheck ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 21:58, 11 December 2011 (UTC).
Encyclopædia Iranica is a Jewish publication in the Colombia University! Have you got a reliable source? Preferably Non-Jewish? ~~ — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
46.64.75.124 (
talk)
07:18, 25 December 2011 (UTC)
What a big mistake in this page. Al-Afghani's followers and disciples are: Hassan Al-Bana, Syed Qotb, Ghulam Mohammad Niazi, the muslim brotherhood movement,... Are these people shia? NO NO NO It is strange! A shia ulema who has only sunni followers and no shia follower. Please correct this article and remove the word shia, because he was not a shia. Thank you for your comprehension — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.237.80.228 ( talk) 17:53, 26 August 2011 (UTC)
Ayatollah Khomeiny was a follower of Assadabadi. All Iranians are followers of Assadabadi. Why do you think we say Death To America? How many of you dare to say that? None! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.64.75.124 ( talk) 07:28, 25 December 2011 (UTC)
There is a discrepancy on his death date. Could someone confirm the correct date? Nobletripe ( talk) 12:44, 5 June 2012 (UTC)
IDNETITY:
I HAVE GOT A VERY GOOD NEWS FOR IRANIZ AND THAT IS EVEN THOUGH THEY TRIED TO FAKE AL-AFGHANI'S IDENTITY AND PRETENDED THAT HE WAS FROM IRAN BUT RECENTLY UNITED NATIONS EDUCATION SCIENTIC ORGANIZATION OF THE UNITED NATIONS (UNESCO) HAS ANNOUNCED THAT THEY HAVE REGIESTED AL-AFGHANI AS AN AFGHAN PHILOSOPH AND THAT HE WAS FROM ASADABAD OF AFGHANISTAN NOT FROM THE FAKE ASADABAD OF FAKE IRAN.
LET ME REPEAT MYSELF AGAIN THAT YOU CANT FOOL THE WORLD. THIS HAPPENS DESPITE IRANINANS STRUGGLED A LOT TO FAKE AL-AFGHANI'S IDENTITY.
NOW NO BODY CARE WHAT IRANIS SAY CAUSE THEY KNOW IT IS ALL LIE AND WORLD WILL LAUGH ON IRAN AGAIN AND AGAIN.
AL-KABULI — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.63.57.27 ( talk) 07:18, 12 March 2014 (UTC)
![]() | This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
He used the name Al-Afghani because being from the Shia world wouldn't have exactly worked in Egypt. So, he said he was from Afghanistan while really from Iran. Trying to figure out if it's the same town name but in Iran. gren グレン 05:41, 5 October 2005 (UTC)
I have found conflicting info who is right.
http://www.afghanan.net/biographies/afghani.htm
http://afghanland.com/history/jamaluddin.html
I removed the following text added by User:Aryob:
The Moslem worlds were living under colonial suppression, internal discord and poverty, and they, badly were, in need of a leader such as Jamaluddin. No one can deny reading the history of that period, that Afghani was one of the most outstanding figures and redeemers of the East. With all the qualification that he possessed, he was a great political and unique intellectual of his time. The great French philosopher Renan says about Afghani: (Few people have produced on me a more vivid impression; it is a large measure the conversation that I had with him that decided me to chose as a subject for my lecture at the Sorbonne, the relations between the “scientific spirit and Islam……” The liberty of his thought, his noble and loyal character, made me believe, while I was talking with him, that I had before me, restored to life, one of my old acquaintances----Wicenna, Arerroes, or another of those great infidels, who represented to five centuries the tradition of the human mind.”
This statement which is made by a great philosopher of Europe is enough to understand the high qualification of this Afghan genius, who was considered also by late Pandit Nehru as a great religious reformist, by doctor Iqbal and Namek Kamal as a religious revolutionary and defenders of Pan-Islamism, by Professor Edward G. Brown the author of “Persian revolution” as a man who helped to animate the fight of Moslem resistance against the expansion and Domination of European colonialism.
Some people likens the great personalities of history to precious stones like rubies, amber, turquoise, emerald having special glow, shines, color and beauty, but, Jamal ud-Din was like a diamond shining and glowing from every angle. HE was a reformist, religious leader, philosopher, writer, journalist and above all a politician and emancipator of the East and Moslem world. In fact what made Jamaluddin a great hero of the east and an enemy of colonialism is indeed his political activism, who’s effects and influence spread beyond the borders of his own country Afghanistan, and touched the destiny of people from Bengal to the Atlantic shores of Africa.
Considering what Afghani had accomplished as a one man, with empty hands and no support from any quarter against the formidable powers of Europe, facing many odds and intrigues of the western countries and their agents and spies, is indeed a great achievement. Contrary to the views of some contemporary writers such as the Author of ‘Afghani’ and Abdoh’ and many others like him Jamaluddin was the most dedicated and unselfish politician and the leader of the East- that while the whole Asia and the Moslem world were in a deep sleep of ignorance during the 19 th century he was fighting with a power of his pen and the strength of his spirit to emancipate his people from the European yoke. He continued his fight by every means, in every city and country, even in the heart of colonial centers such as London, Paris, Berlin, and Petersburg until he died. Although he was unable to see the fruits of his labor in his life time, but certainly all the seeds which he sowed, bore fruits soon after his death. His home land Afghanistan only 22 years after his death received independence and what he wanted form his own pupil Amir Mohammad Azam Khan was accomplished by another student of his, Mahmud Tarzi through his son-in-law Amir Amanullah during his reign.
In Egypt another devoted desciple Sad Zaglole Became the father of modern Egypt, in Turkey, Namek Kamal and his follower Ataturk did what Jamal-ad- Din wanted to be done by Turks. In India his efforts to unite Hindu and Moslems to fight the British was realized, and all his political and social principles were followed by Moslem and Hindu leaders such as Abdul Kalam Azad and Alama Iqbal as well as Gandhi and Pandit Nehru.
He wanted Moslem unity through “Um-ul-Qura” now this is also realized and it’s headquarter has been established in Saudi Arabia, He was in favour of Arab unity soon after the First World War the Arab League came to function on the bank of the Nile.
Jamaluddin was considered ‘new traditionalist’ as well as ‘Islamic reformist; because of Afghani’s teaching today most of the Moslem reject rigid traditionalist as well as pure westernism, as once Sir Sayed Ahmad founder of Aligarh University wanted the Moslems to follow. The middle of the road policy of Jamaluddin is a proper way for the Moslems to be the followed even at present time.
As I stated above, it was mainly political activities of Jamaluddin which has attracted International and world wide attention because during the 19 th century he was the greatest champion of liberty and self-determination for oppressed people of the East and a great fighter against European imperialism. To achieve this noble aim, he was following five main political principals, some times using each principal separately, and more often together. But in application of these principles in order to help his people, he followed the main British political theory which one of their great leaders once stated:
“The British never had a permanent friend but she had always a permanent interest”.
The political Principals followed by Afghani are as follows:
He wanted to carry his views from the top, in order to achieve internal reforms as well as to resist foreign domination. Though this principal, he wanted to established a model country in order to be followed by other Asian and Moslem countries. He wanted to use France and Germany as a third power to support the Asian struggle against the British as well as Tsarist Russia. In case of failure of the above theory, he wanted to acquire the British to support the eastern nations in order to push out of Asia, the Tsarist imperialist. To get the Tsarist to help the Asians against the British.
Jamaluddin wanted to use the 3 rd and fourth theories because he knew that Asia and Moslem countries are not able to match the military, technical and economic power of the West and the only way to fight the British or Tsarist Russia is to reply on the Theory of ‘Balance of Power;
The most important theory upon which Afghani was relying was the theory of ‘Pan-Islamism’, or Moslem Unity “, he always wanted to use this weapon, against colonial domination for liberation of Moslems in Asia and Africa. How Afghani applied these theories and how was the results here we will examine in the following pages:
The reasons:
Hey, I am not an expert on this subject so I did not actually edit this article, but I just want to point out that according to everything I have ever heard and read, Jamal-ud-din al-Afghani was a PERSIAN SHIA and was most likely born in Asadabad Persia(modern-day Iran) not in Afghanistan. He called himself al-Afghani and said he was an Afghan to his Sunni co-religionists because he wanted to hide the fact that he was a Shia. This seems natural given the prejudice that many Sunnis have towards Shias.
While it is possible that he was born in Asadabad Afghanistan and latter moved back to Persia when he was very young, it is also likely that he was born in Iran. Where he was born is really not that important, but what is fairly clear is that he was in fact a Persian Shia and not an Afghan.
He may have himself made up the story about being born in Asadabad Afghanistan in order to maintain his story that he was an Afghan in order to hide the fact that he was a Shia.
One last thing, the first reference on this article, the link to the Encylopedia Britannica clearly states that he was born in Asadabad Persia and that he called himself al-Afgani in order conceal the fact that he was a Persian Shia.
This seems logical. He may have felt that his Sunni co-religioinists would have been prejudiced towards him and reject his ideas, if they knew that he was in fact a Shia and not a Sunni like themselves. Umaru Ahmad 03:01, 15 April 2007 (UTC)
Umaru Ahmad is correct. Sayed Jamal ud-Din "al-Afghani" was not an Afghan, but an Iranian. He was born in Asadabad in Iran, and he spent his childhood there. Overwhelming documentation and contemporary sources prove his Iranian origin. 90% of his political activism was concentrated on Iran. I have added two scholary sources, one from Encyclopaedia Iranica and the other from Prof. Keddie (one of the leading authorities on Jamal ud-Din al-Afghani's life and biography) to the article. I'll try to add direct references from the collection of Afshari and Mahdavi (two other imprtant scholars and experts on al-Afghani) to article. Unfortunately, I do not have direct access to the original Persian collection of his letters. As for the article, please notice that the Encyclopaedia Iranica is an authoritative scholarly work, and that its message has to be put above other sources (except for primary sources and/or written literature by notable scholars). However, in this case, it does not matter, since the Iranica article was written by Prof. Keddie, the most important Western scholar on al-Afghani's life, and is directly based on primary sources (al-Afghani's letters). Also Britannica says that he was Iranian. -- 82.83.129.121 22:42, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
There are some sources saying he was born in asadabad of Hamedan in Iran and also some sources are saying he was born in asadabad of Kunar in Afghanistan. But the important thing is his thoughts. He believed in unity of Muslims(Iranian or Afghani), so why should we Muslims fight on him and for our nationality?!! Iranway ( talk) 18:19, 25 March 2008 (UTC)
Al-Afghani was not born in Iran, neither was he Iranian or Shia. Al-Afghani was born in
Asadabad, Afghanistan, this is explained in every school book in Afghanistan and Pakistan. If Al-Afghan was born in Iran then how on earth is it possible for Iran to deport him from his own country? If Al-Afghani committed crimes then Iran would have arrested and charged him but not deport him. The only country that did not deport him was Afghanistan because he was natural born citizen of Afghanistan.--
ZmaGhurnStaKona
06:26, 28 September 2007 (UTC)
An article in the New Dawn Magazine, " The Masons and the Moors", mentions him as a Sufi scholar. This is something that should be mentioned in the article if we can produce some better sourcing for the information. The article associates him with the Khwajagan and professes that he was the teacher of Madame Blavatsky. Also according to that article it is rumoured that the parents of Noble Drew Ali, the founder of the Moorish Science Temple of America were students of al-Afghani, so a strong link may exist between him and that organization as well as the Moorish Orthodox Church of America. __ meco ( talk) 13:53, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
fight over al-Afghani. How about we keep drop Assadabadi but put in the lead something like, "even though he is known throughout the Muslim world as al-Afghani, scholars agree Jamal al-Din was an Iranian Shia born in Asadabad"? -- BoogaLouie ( talk) 17:33, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
Even if he was born in modern Afghanistan that does not mean that he was a dirty backward and nomading Pashtun dog and barbarian. That his ancestor´s name was Termizi showes that he was at least of Tajik origine if not of Iranian-Persian origine. Even modern historian from Afghanistan considere him as a Tajik and not as a Pashtun. It is thought that he became a sunni muslim.
Ps:Kunar province is still inhabitet by urban Tajiks while Pashtuns are nomads there.-- 88.68.192.188 ( talk) 09:26, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
FOR ONCE AND FOR ALL AL-Afghani was afghan from the start and afghan when he died there was never a iranian in the middle, so for those iranians who say hes from hamdam Let me ask u a question? If sayed jamaluddin afghani is from IRAN than how would you explain that he Speaks PASHTO he wrote history of afghanistan in pashto a true afghan language??????????? 71.139.6.230 ( talk) 06:53, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
Source???? you say did you read where he was born? In Kunar, Afghanistan where it is the heart of the pashtuns. The question is how does he not know pashto? thats should be ur question. Give it a break you persians claim everyone as your own with bogus evidence. He is known all over the world as AFGHANI and u dare call him persian loooool PLEAZ save ur selves some fresh air!!! 71.139.6.230 ( talk) 05:40, 11 April 2008 (UTC)Pashtun786
"It is thought Al-Afghani claimed to be an Afghan in order to present himself as a Sunni Muslim - the sect adhered to by most Muslims and most Muslim rulers -and to escape oppression by the Iranian government",[6] or to be associated with the larger branch of Islam so "reach a wider audience" " READ THE ABOVE COMPLETE CONTRADICTION If he was Shia why would he say hes sunni and say he excaped oppression by the iranian government. looooooool COMPLETE STUPID who ever wrote this article most likely was persian. 71.139.6.230 ( talk) 05:48, 11 April 2008 (UTC)Pashtun786
For the title of this page, it doesn't matter if he was born in Iran or Afghanistan. The name that he used was "Afghani" and he is mostly known as "Jamal-al-din al-Afghani" in English Academic texts ( 866 search results, compared to 64 for Asadabadi) and English books ( 672, compared to 58 for Asadabadi). Almost all reputable encyclopedias call him "Jamal-al-din al-Afghani" (For example, see Iranica and Britannica). Alefbe ( talk) 15:18, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
First, in a very prominent book, Arabic Thought in the Liberal Age, Albert Hourani discusses his mysterious origin but calls him al-Afghani throughout his work. Additionally, even if it wasn't his original name, of which we have no knowledge, his prominence was achieved under the name al-Afghani. On wikipedia, Mark Twain's article is called that, not Samuel Clemens; George Sand as such even though the author was female; and Baruch Spinoza as that name as opposed the name he would have been called in his native Portugal, Bento de Espinosa. It really should be changed to al-Afghani. —Preceding unsigned comment added by No1cubfan ( talk • contribs) 06:41, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
Al-afghani in all none-Iranian documents, especially almost all alnguages of Wikipedia, is an Afghan, even his images in English Wikipedia is titled as al-afghani, then why English Wikipedia shoul call him Asadabadi? Isn't it an Iranian influence? Please do not forget your impartiality. If they change it a million times, I will revise a zillion times. 84.13.162.105 ( talk) 09:53, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
The German Wiki does has a handwritten document of Al-Afghani, where he ask to become a membership of the Freemansons. Never saw that before, so what do you think? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.59.204.35 ( talk) 18:38, 21 July 2008 (UTC)
Inuit18, come you with your academic sources and i will come with my academic sources. we will see who is right. so, come with your academic sources please...... Abasin-اباسین 02:39, 29 January 2010 (UTC)
currently three academic sources which is accepted by all Orientalists is used in this article. Encyclopedia of Islam, Encyclopedia of Iranica and Britannica.-- Inuit18 ( talk) 07:32, 29 January 2010 (UTC)
Inuit18, you are right about this Encyclopendias, but the qeustion is; who are this people who has edited this Encyclopedias, what is their goal by posting wrong information on this Encyclopedias, are they Persians like you..? if yes, than it is clear but if they aren't Persians than is the qeustion from where have they this information and second, have they any political ambitions or did they first read Encyclopedias like this and have wrong information and than write this Encyclopedias and also the qeustion is, are behind this Encyclopedias the same people..? who use have linked this Encyclopedias to each others....?
Here this are my academic sources. is it enough or do you want more...?
1. www.Afghan-Network.net [2] 2. www.studying-islam.org [3] 3. www.scribd.com [4] 4. www.afghanan.net [5] 5. www.laghman.net [6] 6. malaysiana1.blogspot.com [7] 7. krex.k-state.edu [8] 8. lsinsight.org [9] 9. www.afghan-web.com [10] 10. www.america.gov , U.S. Helps Restore a Monument to Afghanistan’s Proud Past 19th Century Afghan Thinker Sayed Jamaludin al-Afghani Honored [11] 11. www.renaissance.com [12] 12. wiki.answers.com [13] 13. www.afghansite.com [14] 14. www.afghanland.com [15] 15. www.bashiransari.com [16] 16. knol.google.com [17] 17. www.facebook.com [18] 18. www.scribd.com , Important Dates in the Life of Sayed Jamaluddin Afghani [19]
And Except from this, some fact. the fact is that Jamalludin Afghan has claimed himself as a very proud Afghan and not as a Persian, the fact is that Jamalludin Afghan has gived his Bornplace as Asadabad, Kunar province, Afghanistan and not as Asadabad, near Hamedan, Persia. and the qeustion is, how long does this Asadabad village exist in Persia...? the fact is that Jamalludin Afghan has writed a book about Afghan History and not about Persia History, the fact is that Jamalludin Afghans tomb is in Kabul, Afghanistan and not in Persia, the fact is that Afghanistan and Persia has asked for his body, but the world (people with knowleg, not people like on this English wikipedia) has recognises Jamalludin Afghan as a Afghan and not as a Persian, and so give the body remains to Afghanistan. the fact is that persian people are allways trying to make Afghan History their own, for exemple; Jamalludin Afghan, Jalaludin Balkhi (Rumi) and even the History of Ariana by calling their country Iran and not Persian (ARIANA, make from 3 A,s one A, read the first 3 letters of ARIANA in mirror line and place there the 5th letter of ARIANA (the N) and you wil read IRAN so this why i call it Persia and not Iran because ARIANA belongs to Afghanistan and not to Persia. and the fact is that Ariana is one of the old names of Afghanistan (Historical name of Afghanistan).
By someone else and this writed by some one else about the Conflict between Persians and Afghans about the Nationality of Jamalludin Afghan; Sayed Jamal-u-Din Afghan is one of the greatest scholars that Afghanistan has produced. But there has been confusion surrounding the citizenship of Afghani, which originates from misguided sources. This misunderstanding roots back from the British reporters and agents who suspected the entry and departure of Afghans and foreigners into and from Afghanistan during the late 18th century and 19th century. This is due to the "Great Game" going on at that time between the Czarist Russian Empire and British Empire for the control of the Indian Subcontinent. Iran is disputing the origin of Jamal-u-din Afghan, Iran is claiming that Sayed Jamal-u-din was born in the city of Asad Abad, Iran. This confuses some people because the provincial capital of Kunar in Afghanistan is also called Asadabad. But Jamal-u-din himself claimed in his own writing to be a true proud Afghan. (He was born1839 in Shair Garh, Kunar, Afghanistan)One of the reasons that these rumors was spread about his nationality was because he was a prominent figure in the anti-colonialism compaign against the British Empire in Afghanistan and its neighbours. Western powers used these rumor to destroy his image and start a dispute between the two neighbours. He was also a great promoter of Islamic Unity in India, Afghanistan, Iran and the Middle East. The Western powers also opposed this kind of unity in central Asia and looked at it as a treat to the British and Russian Empire, mostly in Central Asian Republics for Czarist Russia and India and Pakistan for the British Empire.To conclude, there is no doubt that Sayed Jamal-u-din Afghan is an Afghan. In 1944 Remains of Jamaludin was returned to Afghanistan from Turkey. Afghanistan honours this great scholar and has built a monument for his great achievements in the capital, Kabul. This monument is located in the garden of one of the great universities in Asia, University of Kabul.
for more info visit: wiki.answers.com [20]
I think that this English wikipedia has choice a side or the admins are who are working on this project are defently Persians, if they where not Persians or have not choice a side than they would place his bornplace as Asadabad, Afghanistan, because his tomb in Kabul, Afghanistan because their are enough aproves that he is a Afghan and not a Persian, he claims himself as a proud Afghan and he claims his own Bornplace Asadabad, Kunar province Afghanistan, in his own Book about the Afghan History. if you people, specially admins. if you thing i am not right; you haven't choice a side and you are not a Persian then you would have placed his Bornplace as both Asadabad, from Afghanistan and From Persia and give refences to it and let the people think what is right in their own point of view, but no, you have claimed his bornplace as Asadabad, Persia, you have writed his name as Asadabadi and you have deleted the picture of the monument of Jamalludin Afghan in Kabul. So than i claim and very one who has a little bite knowlege will claim you as a men/women who has choiced a side or you are a Persian, so automaticly choice the side of Persia sources and claim him as a Persian!!
In my point of view, what most be the policy of wikipedia (specially English section, because the most of the world people can read and understand English, so it is not right to give the people wrong information. i think it is not right). if wikipedia want to be a neutral Encyclopendi and a respected Encyclopendia, they most place his bornplace as Asadabad, Kunar province, Afghanistan. Because Jamalludin Afghan claims himself as a Afghan, he claims his own bornplace as Asadabad, Kunar province, Afghanistan, he has writed a book about the Afghan history (where he claims himself as a Proud Afghan) and specially because his body was returned from Istanbul, Turkey to Kabul, Afghanistan to give him his finanly rest place.
Abasin-اباسین 15:20, 29 January 2010 (UTC)
Abasin-اباسین 16:34, 29 January 2010 (UTC)
Even if he was born in Afghanistan, Adabaad, Kunar, local historian consider him as a Tajik neverlessness his last name Afghan. The term Afghan is in modern sense not something ethnical, but a national term, used even by some Hazaras and Tajiks to relate themself with the state with the name AFGHANISTAN. Local historians consider him as Tajik. So what? Pushtuns had never a political movement against British-Raj or against anyone, except the Taliban, Haqqani, Gulbuddini, Al-Qaida movements which were a movement of Pashtun-Arab chauvinism. There was only one time when Pushtuns really were incooperated into a movement, an that was the Roshanian Movement, first established by eastern-Tajiks of Ismaeli faith like Ansari and Bayazid Roshan. But I guess, that Pushtuns were incooperated in the movement was again nothing else than just using of Pushtun people and their ghairat and nang. Tajiks like Jamaluddin Afghani, Maulana Rumi etc. were living in that region before Pashtuns existed and before they came down from the hills of the Sulaiman Mountains and Tajiks/Persians were famous as cultural people, heroes, rulers and sub-rulers, scholars, generals, people of pen before the world could inventate it´s own renessance. Btw, Tajiks always called themself and identified themself with Persians and Persian civilization, not with Pushtuns, Afghans, who were unknown to them since they were living on mountains and Greater India and in Arab states.-- 94.219.218.150 ( talk) 21:55, 29 January 2010 (UTC)
It doesn't mather what he was, a Pakhtun, Tajik, Uzbak, Hazara, Balooch, Nooristani or something else. The fact is that he was a Afghan and born in Asadabad, Kunar province, Afghanistan. We are all Afghans, we are all brothers, we are all the same. By our soul, body, life, mind or whatever. We are like a familly, We are all brothers!! Our eldest Brother is Pakhtun and than Tajik brother, Uzbek brother, Hazara brother, Balooch brother, Nooristani brother and etc. We are all one!! We will never give you Persian people and Britisch people the chance, to make different parts from this brothers!! We will never give you people the chance to break us!! We will never give you people the chance to make pieces from us!! to beat each one of us easly in different parts!! We will late happen this!! put this in your head, full of sawdust and hay!! We where allways one, we are allways one and will be allways one and stay together!! Remembers this, before you next time have the bravados to talk about Afghans!!
let me tell you something about Jamalludin Afghan and the term Afghan. His name is Sayed Jamaludin Afghan. Born in Asadabad, Kunar province, Afghanistan. He was a sayed and sayeds are mostly Sunni Moslims. Sayeds are still living in Asadabad, Kunar province, Afghanistan. The name Jamaludin is a name which is gived more to childeren in Afghanistan than in Persia as childname. By calling himself a Afghan, he wants to hide his Persian origins and being a Shi'ia Moslim. This is the theory and philosophy of Persians. i am right..? if yes listen than, if he was a from Persians origins and shi'ia moslim, he wasn't but stil image it like this. By calling himself a Afghan it doesn't means that he is automaticly a Pakhtun and a sunni moslim. Because in Afghanistan lives not only Pakhtun brothers. But also Tajik brothers, Uzbek brothers and etc. In Afghanistan are not only sunni moslims but also shi'ia moslims, hindus and even some jews. The fact that he is a Afghan and Sunni moslim is very clearly. He was a sayed and sayeds are mostly Sunni moslims, maybe even just and only sunni moslims. Sayeds lives in Asadabad, Kunar province, Afghanistan. In the Kunar Province lives 95% Pakhtuns brothers (Afghan proud) and 5% are Nooristanian (proud Afghans) brothers and sisters. So leave Asadabad, my Tajik brothers don't even live in Kunar province. I think it is now enough about Sayed Jamaludin Afghan (The Afghan proud).
So now about Afghan. The name Afghan is used by Pakhtun brothers from the islamic period to indicate themselfs. But in this time there wasn't any country in the world with the name Afghan or Afghanistan. And it is has not any true that Persians call the Pakhtun brothers Afghans, to identify the Pakhtun brothers. The fact is that Pakhtun brothers called themselfs Afghans from the islamic period. The name Pakhtun comes at himself from Bactria (Afghans call it Bakhteria or Bakhter). The changing from Bakhter to Pakhtun needed more steps. but i will you it in 3 steps, Bakhter => Pakhter => Pakhtun.
Will we have not only Taliban of Mullah Omar and Hesb-e-Islam of Gulbuddin Hekmatyar. But, if we look back in the history. Afghanistan was the only country in the world which was never a colony of British people. The British people are trying to destroy the history of Afghanistan. Because Afghans where the people who has destroyed the dream of British people of making Afghanistan their colony and also their dream of being the rulers of the world. Losing 3 time the war against Afghans and Afghanistan was the start of ending of British people as world power and the ending of the Colonialism and Colonisation, not only in Asia but also in the world. It was also the start of world change, the way of thinking, in the world was changed and etc. People who have fight against the British Raj, where Dost Mohammad Khan, his sons and also Abdul Rahman Khan, Amir Amanullah Khan, Sayed Jamaludin Afghan and many more. And the Persian are trying to destroy the history of Afghans and Afghanistan. In simply way to claim it after destroying.
User:inuit18 I guess, you don’t know the history of Afghans or you have very wrong information and based on nothing else than lies of Persian side. One thing is good of you and I like it. You recognises that Afghans people have ghairat, nang, namus, rich history, braves, heroes, leaders, rulers etc and Persian people are be-ghairat, be-nang, be-namus, history less and etc. By saying, they use only the Afghans and their ghairat and nang. Wwwooowww so lovely and feels great, that Persian people have accept that they are BeGhairat, BeNang, BeNamus, History less and etc. just to nice:D Maybe this is the reason why you Persian people are trying to claim Afghan history.
Jalaludin Balkhi is from Balkh and he was the one who have brought Mili-Attan (The National Dance of Afghanistan.) to Turkey. Now knows to European people as the Rumi Dance. Which is originly founded by Pakhtuns. I don’t care about what he was a Pakhtun or a Tajik. Whatever he was, he was a Afghan!
Afghans have a very long history of thousands years. Some people say 12 thousand year but there are approves in Kabul museum of 9 or 10 thousand year. I know you have this knowledge from willem vogelsang’s book and I’m sure he has got this information from Persian people. I have no other reasons except this or British people. His name sounds like a Dutch man. By saying things like this, you agree that you have not any knowledge and accept everything from every one. By talking like this you have showed that you haven’t any knowledge about Afghans and Afghanistan. And you people believe even a Dutchmen! I hope you are not coming and say to me that a Hollander knows more about me than myself.
What do you Persian people have..? Nothing else than liars and slaves. We Afghans have a rich culture, rich history, famous personality like Ahmad Shah Durrani (Ahmad Shah Baba), Mirwais Hotaki (Mirwais Neeka), Khoshal Khan Khattak, Jalaludin Balkhi, Jamaludin Afghan, Rahman Baba, Yama (the first have koning is the history), Khan Abdul Ghaffar Khan, Hamza Shinwari, Ghani Khan, Dost Mohammad Khan, Malalai Nia, Nazo Nia, Amanullah Khan. Is it enough or do you want to have more…? We have Ariana, Bakhteria (Bactria), Kushans and many more. Oh i’m sorry you people also claim Ariana as yours…hahah.. sorry but it is to funny. Ariana is one of the Historical names of Afghanistan. Today we have Ariana Afghan Airlines in Afghanistan, Germans are also Arians and they say we are originly from Afghanistan. They don’t say we are originly from Persia.
The Heart of Asia, The Key of East, The Lock of Asia, The Black Poort of World Powers, The Country of Rich History, The Land of Brave, The Land of True Moslims, The Land of Attan and Jirga. Too much to say them all.
The Gallant People of Afghanistan, The Honorable People of Afghanistan. People of their word, Freedom Lovers, Peace lovers, Cultural People, Land of Brave and many more.
When the Alexander the great (Iskander) was in Afghanistan, he can’t take the control of Afghanistan. He can’t even capture it. After some time his mother send him a letter and asked him why he can’t capture Afghanistan? He send a letter back with the ground of Afghanistan and write back, in this ground is so much habit, proud, honour, sense of honour, pride that they are ready to die but are not ready to loss their freedom. Alexander the Great lost his first and only battle in Kunar province, Afghanistan. After Alexander the Great was Asadabad called Damkale (Dam, is taked from the Afghan word dama, which means rest and kale is also a Afghan word and means village. so in facts it means rest village). Asadabad was called Damkale because Alexander the Great stays there for some days. The rest place of Alexander the Great.
I have read the article of Nikki R. Keddie and Persianca Enclopendia a little bite. Nikki R. Keddie write in his article (THE BIOGRAPHIES WHICH WHERE WRITED BY THE PEOPLE WHO KNOWED HIM VERY WELL, ARE DESTROYED WITH POLITICAL INTENTIONS/REASONS). So the qeustion is, who have done this...? Afghans... British people.... Persians... or someone else...? Answer Afghanistan; Afghanistan would never do things like this. Even if they wanted, they are simply not able to do things like this and have also no reasons. British people; well British people want to destroy his image and have also the possibilities and the habit to do jobs like this. as a British people knower. Read this [25]. Persians; Persians want to claim Jamaludin Afghan as a Persian personality and are able to do jobs like this. Let it be clear, his real biographies are destroyed and sometime later comes Persia with letters, with Jamaludin Afghan would have writed and after a time, comes his biographies of being from a Persian origins. Well is it not a little bite strange.... don't do you think so...? Except from this, the Persian people have allways try to claim Afghan history and the personalities of Afghans as their own. To claim Jamaludin Afghan as a Persian, they needed to have proves, to have proves, they needed to destroy the real proves (like his Biographies) and to prove what they are saying is right, they needed to create prove. So what is the true behind this letters..? IN PERSIANCA ENCLOPENDIA, they write (Government of India and Maǰmūʿa sources show that in Afghanistan he called himself the Sayyed “Rūmī” (Anatolian) or “Estanbolī” and claimed to be from Istanbul. The government of India reporter noted that he was a stranger to Afghanistan and spoke Persian like an Iranian.) well he have never claimed himself as a Estanboli or if being from Istanbul. this is what i call the propaganda of Persians! if he is not our, we will also don't late make it yours. well in letters and article wite where writed about him in Afghanistan (when he was in Afghanistan), they write only Sayed Jamalludin Afghan, nothing else. And about he was a stranger to Afghanistan. Well if he was a stranger to Afghanistan. How could he write a book about the Afghan History..? I think it says enough. And except from this i have found 2 books on internet on his biography. Abasin-اباسین ( Tofaan-توفان) 23:57, 2 February 2010 (UTC)
Abasin-اباسین ( Tofaan-توفان) 00:09, 3 February 2010 (UTC)
If nobody has objection, i am going to make some changes in this article (look to academic sources). Abasin-اباسین ( Tofaan-توفان) 16:10, 5 February 2010 (UTC)
These links are not academic. unless you provide us with academic and scholarly sources we will keep the article as it is. The current information is going no where since three academic encyclopedias(Britannica, Islam, and Iranica) are used.--
Inuit18 (
talk)
21:34, 5 February 2010 (UTC)
Goo nakho kussmadar Pashtunzai —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.219.198.90 ( talk) 09:48, 9 August 2010 (UTC)
This article needs some copy-edit work. First of all, the most common version of his name in English is "al-Afghani" and not "Asadabadi". Therefore, "al-Afghani" should be used in the article. Secondly, due to the many edits and the constant IP vandalism, this article looks very amateurish. Tajik ( talk) 15:04, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
I propose changing "Asadabadi" used throughout the article to "al-Afghani." Any objections? -- BoogaLouie ( talk) 16:48, 23 April 2009 (UTC)
From his lifetime, his name was Al Afghani. Why do we change his name to Asadabadi ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.113.246.94 ( talk) 20:13, 6 May 2009 (UTC)
I have reverted obvious falsifications by an anon IP. Tajik ( talk) 22:13, 16 June 2009 (UTC)
It should be mentioned that to modern view of Afghan scholars Jamaludin Afghani was an ethnic Tajik, unnoted his last title since Asabad was during his time a predominant Tajik city. The fake claim of some Iranians on him because of some ridicolous facts (he was a Persian-speaker, possibly his parents moved/fled from Gulnar when Pashtun nomads moved to the region and gained it for their own people->Pashtunization, where Shia and turned out as Sunni etc etc.). With all respect dear writers, but it should also noted the view of Afghan scholars, not only of Iranians. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.219.214.232 ( talk) 00:32, 2 August 2009 (UTC)
I reverted the article to the previous version.-- Inuit18 ( talk) 04:34, 15 October 2009 (UTC)
Before changing and removing content from the article please discuss it here with other editors and after a consensus you can change it.-- Inuit18 ( talk) 02:10, 27 January 2010 (UTC)
i said i talk with everyone who want to talk tonight, why has this virtueelSteve or what every have blocked me for 31 hours..?
come and talk, what is wrong with you people..? he is from my province Kunar, Afghanistan if some has there problems with it or is he/she thinking that i am not right, than come and talk. and i will tell all the admins, i have respect for your works, but if you someone block me, this time than you people have choice a side. and i think it is not right for the reputation of wikipedia and your admins.
it not right that people are playing with Afghan history, for example watch Ahmad Shah Durrani, Balkhi, Afghanistan history and etc. how do you all would feel if people are playing with the history of your country..? i am sure than you people will view it from other side. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Abasin ( talk • contribs) 23:47, 28 January 2010 (UTC)
While the English part ot the plate only reads "Asad Abadi Sq.", the Persian text reads "Midan Sayyid Jamalu-d-din Asadabadi", i.e. "Square of the Sayyid Jamalu-d-din Asadabadi" (میدان سید جمال الدین اسدآبادی). So the square honours the person, not the city. Worth mentioning is the use of "Asadabadi" as part of his name instead of "Afghani"; I assume the former is preferred in Iran.-- Filius Rosadis ( talk) 13:43, 26 December 2010 (UTC)
The result of the move request was no consensus. -- Aervanath ( talk) 16:57, 6 February 2009 (UTC)
Jamal-al-Din Afghani →
Jamāl-al-dīn Asadābādī — Please consult the following sites:
—
[26]. An introduction to the Collected Works of Sayyed Jamal al-Din Asadabadi.
—
Iran Digital Library. This site gives the full text of the collected letters of Sayyed Jamal al-Din Asadabadi (collection has been done by Abol-Hassan Jamali Asadabadi and the book has a foreword by one of Iran's all-time greatest scholars, Mohammad Mohit Tabatabai)
—
Iran Chamber Society, by
Iraj Bashiri
—
Encyclopaedia Iranica, by Nikki R. Keddie.
—
Wayiran (
talk)
14:58, 31 January 2009 (UTC)
*'''Support'''
or *'''Oppose'''
, then sign your comment with ~~~~
. Since
polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account
Wikipedia's naming conventions.
You people have to understand, this is our history, this are our people and not yours. all i want to tell you al wikipedias and specially Persia people, you can write it 100 times (even by help of non Persia people like virtueelSteve or what ever), to claim Afghan stuffs as your owns but the true will not change, they where Afghans, they are Afghans and will be allways Afghans! my dear brother;) get a life:P Abasin اباسين افعان Afghan 23:25, 28 January 2010 (UTC)
In Persian the proportion of the use of "Asadabadi" over "Alafghani" is 14:1. That means at least in internet, the use of "Asadabadi" is 14 times more than "Alafghani". -- Wayiran ( talk) 13:05, 6 February 2009 (UTC)
http://www.h-net.org/~bahai/areprint/afghani/namihha/namihha.htm
The result of the move request was: Moved: reverted move made after no consensus to move. Omitted macrons in al-Afghani as they were not requested for Jamal-al-Din and were not in the original title. — kwami ( talk) 23:16, 6 May 2011 (UTC)
Sayyid Jamal-ad-Din Asadabadi → Jamal-al-Din al-Afghānī — This is the correct title and the stable version of the article had that title. A user moved this page without discussion and was against the request with result "no consensus". I think the page has to be moved back. -- Xashaiar ( talk) 16:34, 23 March 2011 (UTC)
Life. Jamāl-al-dīn was born in the village of Asadābād, near Hamadān, into a family of local sayyeds. According to the best evidence, he was educated first at home, then taken by his father for further education to Qazvīn, to Tehran, and finally, while he was still a youth, to the ʿatabāt, the Shiʿite shrine cities in Iraq. Judging from his early copying and lifelong retention of treatises by leaders of Shaikhism, he was influenced by this Shiʿite school, which was noted for its “Fourth Pillar,” the need for the world always to have a “perfect man.” This idea was echoed in Afḡānī’s famous speech that caused his expulsion from Istanbul in 1870 (see below). Afḡānī was also influenced by the ideas of certain Muslim philosophers, especially Iranian ones; works of such figures as Avicenna, Naṣīr-al-dīn Ṭūsī, and Mollā Ṣadrā are found among his books. In addition, Afḡānī’s approach to modern problems was influenced by the still living school of traditional Islamic philosophy with its strong emphasis upon the use of the rational faculty. (N. R. Keddie)
In reply to someone says "it doesn't matter where he was born. What matters is that what name is more common in English books and Academic sources." I just have to say that there are lots of wrong thing in what they say. such as naming Iran for years as Persia - according to the Sassanid dynasty and as they called them in Rome. but all over history and Persian literature named as Iran/Iran-zamin (especially in Shahname) and you wont find any Persia in these documents. so It is not an Iranization. We just try to fix wrong habits. to those who say that Asadābād is a newly built town, maybe want to see its page for more information. Beside, how we have to know that his hometown is big or small? This is a bad reason for your claim. Here we don't talk about nationalism, its about a man that think about united Muslims. Now, we just want to talk and know the truth by documents. After all, according to the documents, there are two other proves: 1- "Reports from the colonial British Indian and Afghan government stated that he was a stranger in Afghanistan, and spoke the Persian language with Iranian accent and followed European lifestyle more than that of Muslims, not observing Ramadan or other Muslim rites." [1] It is nonsense for an Afghan to talk "with Iranian accent" out of Iran and in Afghanistan. 2 - Why would Naser al-Din Shah Qajar invite and deport a foreigner when there are lots of Iranian clerics and Ayatollahs - include Grand Ayatollah Mirza Hassan Shirazi? P. Pajouhesh ( talk) 22:32, 23 March 2011 (UTC)
I also want to add that the comments by user:Mazdakabedi (P. Pajouhesh) and user:BehnamFarid (BF) contain anti-Afghanistan/anti-Afghan tone while trying to lecture us on Iran's history from their perspective. There was no political state or entity by the name of Iran before 1935, it was a loose territory which was known by many different names depending on the inquirers but it was more commonly refered to Persia (Parsi or Parsia... area of Parsi-speaking people), ruled by the Qajar dynasty. Many, including Afghanistan, claim that al-Afghani was born in Asadabad, a village or town in what was then Kabulistan (now Kunar Province) Afghanistan, and from there he immigrated as a child to Iran where he lived for a number of years as Afghan refugee, from Iran he returned to Afghanistan during his late teens and moved to neighboring British-India (Pakistan-India) to advance his studies... and from there he started travelling to other places of the Middle East and then Europe, etc. Changing his article from "Jamal-al-Din al-Afghānī" to "Sayyid Jamal-ad-Din Asadabadi" is Iranian nationalistic POV-pushing, misleading, and falsification.-- ANP member ( talk) 16:02, 31 March 2011 (UTC)
Writing stuff like "It is nonsense for an Afghan to talk "with Iranian accent" out of Iran and in Afghanistan" itself is a nonsense statement. There are about 1 million Afghans in Iran and I'm sure majority of these (especially the ones born in Iran) speak Persian "with Iranian accent". This is normal for someone who grows up as a child in whatever land (i.e. the Afghans in Britain speak English with British accent and while those who grow up in the United States speak it with American accent).-- ANP member ( talk) 16:33, 31 March 2011 (UTC)
In search I got 3,230,000 results for al-Afghani: but only 7,510 for Asadabadi.-- ANP member ( talk) 15:13, 1 April 2011 (UTC)
- Afghan American: This is just to let you know that you seem to be in the wrong place! This is not the place were people lodge complaints about other people and other nations! You may or may not be in the mood for whatever thing, none of which can be any of my business, nor the business of any other Wikipedia editor chancing this page. Regarding your story of Afghanistan in Kabulistan, four points are in order: First, cite a reliable reference in support of your statement; where is Asadabadi's claim recorded? Where and to whom did Asadabadi make such claim? (This is aside from the fact that Asadabadi being a fugitive -- the Iranian state badly wanted him extradited to Iran, he said different things to different people, just to save his skin). Second, it is pertinently not true that "some Iranians claim"! I for one turn out to know Asadabadi through my grandparents and great-grandparents (at home Asadabadi was just a household name). Third, regarding the possibility of so-called "forged documents", this does not belong to the area of history! In writing history, one relies on historical documents and historical evidences that strongly correlate with each other. Things written otherwise, are not historical accounts, but historical novels. Just consider the claim that Asadabadi's left foot had four fingers. This is not impossible (it may even be true), but so long as it is not recorded in some reliable historical documents, such claim cannot be accepted as being part of history. Fourth, that Nikki Keddie were "biased", that is your personal opinion, for which there is no place in Wikipedia. She may or may not be biased, but that is not for us to decide; you had a point if you were able to present references to writings by some professional historians in which they pronounce judgements regarding Keddie's supposed lack of professional integrity, for that is the essence of your claim: that she were a person who distorts history for some ulterior reasons of hers. In closing, I recommend you to address people more politely than you have been doing here (that you are not in some mood is just contemptible language -- it is just undignified for me to even take you seriously with this streetwise language of yours). Elsewhere you accuse me and others of nationalism, which is not a matter up for discussion here -- worse still, you accuse someone of nationalism even while you are demonstrably ignorant of the name of the person who discovered alcohol. You seem to have convinced yourself that people owe you something, which very baldy reflects on your character and your general attitude towards other people who happen not to be Afghan, or Afghan-American, as you seem to be considering yourself. --BF 01:00, 22 April 2011 (UTC)
- I just wonder why are you people talk in this rude way. Why are you spread these amount off hate toward the pages. We are just try to talk about an article. Please talk in a polite way. Dear BF, you don't have right to say to others something like "keep away from the place" you say something like that over and over under any discussion. Dear ANP, I don't know how you say something in this way that Iranians hate Afghans! I just wonder according to what you say that. Why every Afghanistani in any article just say something like that. It hurts others. I think you hate Iranians because of their governments behaviors to you. Please people, just talk about the article in a civilized way and just don't spread hate from anyone to any other. And remember, don't write something nationalistic, Just write about something with adequate documents.
- As I told before, there are lots of proof for this claim. you say something about accent, but it is not true, every ethnic people talk in themselves in their own accent everywhere they live - especially in cities like Tehran: Gilaks in Gilaki, Lors in Lori, Hazara in Hazarajati and etc and in other places at least in first and second generation. so It is not true what you said. Beside, I told another reasons for this claim such as invitation form Nasser-ad-Din Shah. British documents and etc.
- As I told it before, there are no document about what you said about the trip from Afghanistan to Iran. Document means: a work of non-fiction writing intended to store and communicate information, thus acting as a recording. There are no auto-biography or any kind of signed documents that proof this claim (look at British India documents). P. Pajouhesh ( talk) 02:40, 2 April 2011 (UTC)
- Mazdakabedi, please do not dispense advice! I have been very clear in my statement: I have not taken any person's right to comment, rather said that a comment must contain reasoned arguments and not unfounded accusations. Those who come only to hit and run, by accusing people of unwholesome things, are simply not commenting on what matters, but undermining other people's credibility. -BF 04:25, 4 April 2011 (UTC)
- I followed some of Mazdakabedi's (P. Pajouhesh's) edits and he/she appears to be a vandal, an Iranian nationalist, and a heavy POV-pusher. [28] [29] [30] I get very frustrated when seeing someone do things like this, he/she wastes not only its time but also others'.-- Afghan American ( talk) 21:09, 7 April 2011 (UTC)
I got 141,000 hits for Jamal-al-Din al-Afghānī and only 140 for Jamal-ad-Din Asadabadi and only 81 for Sayyid Jamal-ad-Din Asadabadi.-- Afghan American ( talk) 04:34, 8 April 2011 (UTC)
- Dear Afghan American friend, It is you that behave like a vandal, I even not nationalist, but I'm against any kind of that. You delete others claims and resources. You are really vandal that adding your info to any page without any discussion. I asked you to discuss about your claims first, but you add your info again. Next time be polite or by your rude way, I will request to block you. Beside, which one of these pages you linked are vandalized? If your History knowledge is poor, it's not others problem.
Just for your information:
- Every kid knows Muhammad ibn Zakariya al-Razi who first discovered Rubbing alcohol.
- Everyone knows that Mughal Empire has ties to Iranian history. Today Afghanistan and Pakistan (complete or parts of them) was some days as a part of Mughal Empire and some other day Iranian's (Safavid, Afsharid, Zandid, Qajars). Beside, lots of Iranian artist move to there, co-military actions in Safavid days, Persian language, etc. You are really poor in history.
- Kabul Shahi is a kingdom in days of collapsing of Sassanids and was a part of Historic Iran (not today Iran). This is not about a politic today Iran. It's about Historic Iran (or as someone named it in west Persia).
As it seen one time your account become blocked of your behaviors. Please, behave in a civilised way and discuss about your claims first, or you will be blocked again by other users. Here we just talk. It is not about nationalistic behaviors. I answered to your claim in up but you act uncivilized. P. Pajouhesh ( talk) 00:59, 10 April 2011 (UTC)
- Support for Jamal-al-Din al-Afghani, just because at least in English this is his best known name. There's no conflict if the Persian wiki adopts another criteria, many historical personages are named differently in different countries or languages. The different theories about Jamaluddin's reasons for using this surname should be part of the article. I have to add that I don't see any necessary "nationalism", let alone hatred, in any of the postures. You can be an Iranian nationalist and call him "Afghani" and viceversa. -- Filius Rosadis ( talk) 15:08, 11 April 2011 (UTC)
- I think that we had talked about this reason and its inadequacy, above. P. Pajouhesh ( talk) 18:41, 12 April 2011 (UTC)
- I have no idea who is correct. But the move was made after a request to move had been closed with no consensus. I have therefore restored the article to al-Afghani. (No-one seems to object to the al-, which was not in the original title; I can remove it if they do.) — kwami ( talk) 23:16, 6 May 2011 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.
References
Salaam Please remove the word shia under Al-Afghani's photo. He was not shia and it is rubbish. I think that this article has been written by a shia iranian. First of all his name is Al-Afghani, so no shia connecion. Secondly Al-Afghani was one of the precursors of the salaf movement. Then how could Al-Afghani be a shia? Please correct it — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.237.80.228 ( talk) 20:19, 22 August 2011 (UTC)
What a big surprise, Jamal-al-din was shia, very funny. 90% of muslims (sunnis) consider him as one of the biggest ulema of Ahl Sunna, but in this article he becomes a shia. This article is not neutral and should be written by someone neutral and who knows something about Syed Jamal-Al-Din Al-Afghani. Thank you — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.237.80.228 ( talk) 11:59, 24 August 2011 (UTC)
There is something odd in the similarity between this sentence, at the bottom of the political views section:
It is a surprising information that Hanna Abi Rashid, then chief of the masonic lodge in Beirut, wrote in the book "Da’irat al-ma’arif al-Masoniyya" that “Jamal ad-Din Afghani was the chief of the masonic lodge in Egypt, which had about three hundred members, mostly scholars and state officials." [25]
and this sentence in the page on Mohammed Abduh, at the end of the biography section:
It is a surprising information that Hanna Abi Rashid, then chief of the masonic lodge in Beirut, wrote in the book "Da’irat al-ma’arif al-Masoniyya" that “Muhammad Abduh was one of the leading names of the masonic lodge in Egypt, which had about three hundred members, mostly scholars and state officials." [9]
I don't have access to the book, but it seems odd to me that the author would write almost the exact same thing about Afghani and Abduh in almost identical words. The only difference in wording is that Afghani is said to have been chief of the Masonic lodge and Abduh is said to have been a leading member. Is the reference accurate? Is the book reliable? That is, should we trust that Afghani and Abduh were Masons?
Whoever added the information seems to have just done a cut and paste job - as evidenced by the beginning "It is a surprising information"
I recommend that the lines on the Masonic lodge be deleted in both articles unless the source can be verified and someone can explain why this 'surprising information' is relevant.
I'm also going to post this on the talk page for Mohammed Abduh
Update: No one replied. I'll remove the lines. -- 204.191.130.148 ( talk) 04:21, 12 October 2011 (UTC) Kno InRes
again, the masonic link cannot be verified. the same post if you google it is found on wahabi / salafi websites. extremists seems to be posting the same thing.
until the person (whom i suspect is a wahabi / salafi) who added this line verifies these accusations I will remove it. Mmafactscheck ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 21:46, 11 December 2011 (UTC).
i have actually found reference to him being a mason at http://www.iranicaonline.org/articles/afgani-jamal-al-din which seems quite credible. the previous entry made no sense, a simple cut and past job. Mmafactscheck ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 21:58, 11 December 2011 (UTC).
Encyclopædia Iranica is a Jewish publication in the Colombia University! Have you got a reliable source? Preferably Non-Jewish? ~~ — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
46.64.75.124 (
talk)
07:18, 25 December 2011 (UTC)
What a big mistake in this page. Al-Afghani's followers and disciples are: Hassan Al-Bana, Syed Qotb, Ghulam Mohammad Niazi, the muslim brotherhood movement,... Are these people shia? NO NO NO It is strange! A shia ulema who has only sunni followers and no shia follower. Please correct this article and remove the word shia, because he was not a shia. Thank you for your comprehension — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.237.80.228 ( talk) 17:53, 26 August 2011 (UTC)
Ayatollah Khomeiny was a follower of Assadabadi. All Iranians are followers of Assadabadi. Why do you think we say Death To America? How many of you dare to say that? None! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.64.75.124 ( talk) 07:28, 25 December 2011 (UTC)
There is a discrepancy on his death date. Could someone confirm the correct date? Nobletripe ( talk) 12:44, 5 June 2012 (UTC)
IDNETITY:
I HAVE GOT A VERY GOOD NEWS FOR IRANIZ AND THAT IS EVEN THOUGH THEY TRIED TO FAKE AL-AFGHANI'S IDENTITY AND PRETENDED THAT HE WAS FROM IRAN BUT RECENTLY UNITED NATIONS EDUCATION SCIENTIC ORGANIZATION OF THE UNITED NATIONS (UNESCO) HAS ANNOUNCED THAT THEY HAVE REGIESTED AL-AFGHANI AS AN AFGHAN PHILOSOPH AND THAT HE WAS FROM ASADABAD OF AFGHANISTAN NOT FROM THE FAKE ASADABAD OF FAKE IRAN.
LET ME REPEAT MYSELF AGAIN THAT YOU CANT FOOL THE WORLD. THIS HAPPENS DESPITE IRANINANS STRUGGLED A LOT TO FAKE AL-AFGHANI'S IDENTITY.
NOW NO BODY CARE WHAT IRANIS SAY CAUSE THEY KNOW IT IS ALL LIE AND WORLD WILL LAUGH ON IRAN AGAIN AND AGAIN.
AL-KABULI — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.63.57.27 ( talk) 07:18, 12 March 2014 (UTC)