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This is a great addition (if there is no copyright violation) but I think the chart needs to be modified (and I don't know how to do it). Terms like Uncle, Aunt, and Cousin are really appropriate to Eskimo kinship terminology and just not valid for B-M terminology. I would replace them either with MB, FZ, MBS, MBD, FZS, FZD, or the general word "affine." Slrubenstein
Thanks. I originally created the chart (using Visio - for a class of mine) without using Aunt and Uncle. I added them just before uploading so as to make the chart more clear to western readers. As for the use of "cousin" though, I have been instructed and found in my readings that this is acceptable. While Cross cousins are technically labelled as "Brother" and "Sister", it is extremely confusing to western (and introductory) readers to use the term. Therefore, I labelled them as cousins. For Parallel cousins, I believe you noticed that I did label them as "B" or "Z" in additon to grouping them as parallel. From what I have learned, the use of the term "cousin" is fairly vauge. Specifying parallel or cross clears up this problem though.
I think the article clearly explains the structure, but I could see where someone might misunderstand the chart. Do you think I should edit it to exclude Aunt and Uncle?
FYI, I'm currenly putting together charts (& articles) for all of the other kinship systems. Maclyn611 20:46, 5 May 2004 (UTC)
Any suggestions as to how I should label the cross-cousins? Every chart I've seen has them labelled as "Co". BTW, Eskimo kinship is now up. Maclyn611 03:34, 8 May 2004 (UTC)
the fourth sentence in the 'kinship'partagraph contradicts the third. in one you say they're called aunt and uncle;in the next mother- and father-in-law. i must be missing something, but it needs clarification. Toyokuni3 ( talk) 14:26, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
I was trying to see if there was any genetic basis for distinguishing parallel and cross cousins and I noticed that this system seems to guarantee that if you never marry a parallel cousin there is no chance of a child ending up with two copies of the same X-chromosome. This would offer the society good protection against X-linked recessive inheritance. None of the other chromosomes gain this protection because they don't make it externally visible which copy you got from each parent. —dgies t c 02:57, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
I strongly doubt whether cross-cousin marriage originated or persisted for such reasons. Rather the main reason is unilineal exogamy -- if there are unilineal (either patrilineal or matrilineal) lineages or descent groups in a society, then cross-cousin marriage ensures that the spouses will always belong to two different lineages or descent groups. Cross-cousin marriage is certainly genetically preferable as a long-term practice to the unilineal endogamy (or father's brother's daughter marriage) found in certain Arab or Muslim social groups, but any genetic advantage over the situation when marriage is allowed with anyone but a few close relatives is probably quite small... AnonMoos ( talk) 23:57, 29 April 2018 (UTC)
Traditional Han Chinese families are patrilineal. It does not only makes distinctions with both "father and father's brothers" and "mothers and mother's sisters," but also differentiates older brothers and younger brothers no matter it's ego's, ego's father's, or ego's any other patrilineal blood relative's. The Han Chinese family system has no resemblance with the Iroquois system, instead, it should better be classified as Sudanese kinship system.
The section's description is incorrect unless it is actually referring to some Chinese minority peoples' familial system, but then again the description has no citations.
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I understand that Haudenosaunee is the correct term for the confederacy known also as Iroquois, but per WP:COMMONNAME this article really needs to be located at Iroquois kinship there is a major literature that uses the term Iroquois kinship, and no corresponding literature under this name. Furthermore the term "iroquois kinship" does not refer specifically to the kinship system of the Haudenosaunee people, but to to all kinship systems that use bifurcate merging. ·maunus · snunɐɯ· 17:00, 7 March 2018 (UTC)
I don't think that "Iroquois kinship" and "bifurcate merging" are absolute synonyms. "Iroquois" usually refers to terms on the sibling/cousin generation, while (at least in some usages) "bifurcate merging" refers more to the terms on the parental generation. Usually an Iroquois cousin/sibling terminology goes together with a bifurcate merging parent/aunt/uncle terminology, but a few languages have divergences between terminological sub-systems of different generations, and a bifurcate merging terminology on the parental generation also goes together with Crow and Omaha kinship terminologies... AnonMoos ( talk) 00:08, 30 April 2018 (UTC)
This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||
|
This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 18 January 2022 and 5 May 2022. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): ZlangePSTCC ( article contribs).
This is a great addition (if there is no copyright violation) but I think the chart needs to be modified (and I don't know how to do it). Terms like Uncle, Aunt, and Cousin are really appropriate to Eskimo kinship terminology and just not valid for B-M terminology. I would replace them either with MB, FZ, MBS, MBD, FZS, FZD, or the general word "affine." Slrubenstein
Thanks. I originally created the chart (using Visio - for a class of mine) without using Aunt and Uncle. I added them just before uploading so as to make the chart more clear to western readers. As for the use of "cousin" though, I have been instructed and found in my readings that this is acceptable. While Cross cousins are technically labelled as "Brother" and "Sister", it is extremely confusing to western (and introductory) readers to use the term. Therefore, I labelled them as cousins. For Parallel cousins, I believe you noticed that I did label them as "B" or "Z" in additon to grouping them as parallel. From what I have learned, the use of the term "cousin" is fairly vauge. Specifying parallel or cross clears up this problem though.
I think the article clearly explains the structure, but I could see where someone might misunderstand the chart. Do you think I should edit it to exclude Aunt and Uncle?
FYI, I'm currenly putting together charts (& articles) for all of the other kinship systems. Maclyn611 20:46, 5 May 2004 (UTC)
Any suggestions as to how I should label the cross-cousins? Every chart I've seen has them labelled as "Co". BTW, Eskimo kinship is now up. Maclyn611 03:34, 8 May 2004 (UTC)
the fourth sentence in the 'kinship'partagraph contradicts the third. in one you say they're called aunt and uncle;in the next mother- and father-in-law. i must be missing something, but it needs clarification. Toyokuni3 ( talk) 14:26, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
I was trying to see if there was any genetic basis for distinguishing parallel and cross cousins and I noticed that this system seems to guarantee that if you never marry a parallel cousin there is no chance of a child ending up with two copies of the same X-chromosome. This would offer the society good protection against X-linked recessive inheritance. None of the other chromosomes gain this protection because they don't make it externally visible which copy you got from each parent. —dgies t c 02:57, 26 January 2012 (UTC)
I strongly doubt whether cross-cousin marriage originated or persisted for such reasons. Rather the main reason is unilineal exogamy -- if there are unilineal (either patrilineal or matrilineal) lineages or descent groups in a society, then cross-cousin marriage ensures that the spouses will always belong to two different lineages or descent groups. Cross-cousin marriage is certainly genetically preferable as a long-term practice to the unilineal endogamy (or father's brother's daughter marriage) found in certain Arab or Muslim social groups, but any genetic advantage over the situation when marriage is allowed with anyone but a few close relatives is probably quite small... AnonMoos ( talk) 23:57, 29 April 2018 (UTC)
Traditional Han Chinese families are patrilineal. It does not only makes distinctions with both "father and father's brothers" and "mothers and mother's sisters," but also differentiates older brothers and younger brothers no matter it's ego's, ego's father's, or ego's any other patrilineal blood relative's. The Han Chinese family system has no resemblance with the Iroquois system, instead, it should better be classified as Sudanese kinship system.
The section's description is incorrect unless it is actually referring to some Chinese minority peoples' familial system, but then again the description has no citations.
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I understand that Haudenosaunee is the correct term for the confederacy known also as Iroquois, but per WP:COMMONNAME this article really needs to be located at Iroquois kinship there is a major literature that uses the term Iroquois kinship, and no corresponding literature under this name. Furthermore the term "iroquois kinship" does not refer specifically to the kinship system of the Haudenosaunee people, but to to all kinship systems that use bifurcate merging. ·maunus · snunɐɯ· 17:00, 7 March 2018 (UTC)
I don't think that "Iroquois kinship" and "bifurcate merging" are absolute synonyms. "Iroquois" usually refers to terms on the sibling/cousin generation, while (at least in some usages) "bifurcate merging" refers more to the terms on the parental generation. Usually an Iroquois cousin/sibling terminology goes together with a bifurcate merging parent/aunt/uncle terminology, but a few languages have divergences between terminological sub-systems of different generations, and a bifurcate merging terminology on the parental generation also goes together with Crow and Omaha kinship terminologies... AnonMoos ( talk) 00:08, 30 April 2018 (UTC)