Iole was a Philosophy and religion good articles nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There may be suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake. | |||||||||||||
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A fact from this article appeared on Wikipedia's
Main Page in the "
Did you know?" column on
August 30, 2008. The text of the entry was: Did you know ... that in the
Greek mythology tale of
Iole,
Deianira (pictured) inadvertently killed her husband
Heracles with a
love charm because of jealousy? | |||||||||||||
Current status: Former good article nominee |
This article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
To-do list for Iole:
|
What does that image have to do with this article?? J. Van Meter 02:16, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
I couldn't find any source that supported some of the information here (like that Iole was Heracles' concubine) so I replaced it with information from Apollodorus. If anyone finds more reputable information that conflicts they can add it of course - as long as it has an ancient source :) Verloren Hoop ( talk) 04:20, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
This article has been recently expanded, but the content that's been added is not very informative. Iole is a minor figure in Greek mythology, and probably doesn't require this level of detail. But certainly, if the article is going to give detailed accounts of ancient myths, and say that there are different versions of said myths, we need references to ancient primary sources, and it needs to be made clear if the narrative is relying on Sophocles, Apollodorus, or whomever. The vagueness of the current article helps no one--it says things like "According to one late Classical version of the tale, the king of Oichalia, Eurytus, had a young daughter that was quite beautiful, eligible for marriage..." but never tells us which late classical version it's referring to. --Akhilleus ( talk) 14:46, 25 August 2008 (UTC)
I've tagged this phrase with a "which?" template, because it appears to be a reference to a specific version of the story, but the sentence never tells us which one. There's also a problem with the use of the word "mytheme", which are supposed to be elements from which a mythological story is made up--but this sentence seems to be using it to mean the entire myth. --Akhilleus ( talk) 00:44, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
"Eurytus years earlier had taught Heracles to become an archer.[3]" This sentence appears at the end of the paragraph concerning the archery contest as if someone is telling a joke and forgot to mention a crucial fact until after the punch line. It sounds like a stream of consciousness rather than a well-thought out treatise.
"When the king seen it was Heracles winning,..." Seen it?! Who is writing this?! How can this be a Did You Know article? This is atrocious. Kwyjibear ( talk) 01:56, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
I quote this as it stands; it is ungrammatical, diffuse, and uninformative. (It also indicates a fundamental procedural error of confounding the mythographers with literary treatments - and it omits Sophocles. But that is another set of howlers altogether. ) Septentrionalis PMAnderson 15:22, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
I'm a bit confused by this section. We have what appears to be a series of quotes from Ovid Heroides 9, and each is said to be from "another version". But they're all from the same work, aren't they? --Akhilleus ( talk) 02:48, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
Thanks Akhilleus for making the major edits and contributions to help bring this up to a potential Good article status. If you see any other improvements that can be made to get it to a Wikipedia Good article please give me some additional pointers or edit accordingly to improve the article since you have more knowledge on Greek mythology than I do. Perhaps you know of others that might be interested in improving the quality of the article. In any case, thanks again for your major contributions to improve the article. Do appreciate it.-- Doug Coldwell talk 22:59, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
Thanks for the hints. After you have done the research, perhaps you can show me better the separated treatments of how Sophocles, Apollodorus, and Seneca treat her. We will work together to get this to GA quickly. Where I found much of this ancient source information on Apollodorus, Seneca, and Ovid was at this site. Perhaps that will help in your research - anyway it will be a good start. -- Doug Coldwell talk 23:24, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
-- Redtigerxyz ( talk) 14:35, 1 September 2008 (UTC)
Parallel Lives of Iole and Clusia: An exact citation, please, for this figment. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 02:32, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
Shouldn't the Graves source and above reference material be put into the article? -- 74.219.90.114 ( talk) 23:25, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
Concerning the "Expand" template - isn't it assumed already that short articles probably should be expanded by others that would have knowledge on the subject? There doesn't seems to be anything in particular asked for in any section. What specifically should be expanded, so that the template is no longer needed? If the editor that entered the template has additional specific information on the subject they are interested in or a specific section - why not enter it to make the section complete. If there isn't anything specific, then I assume the template isn't necessary. -- Doug Coldwell talk 17:45, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
Removed tag since apparently there isn't additional material about Iole in Sophocles that isn't already referenced by Ovid. -- Doug Coldwell talk 12:06, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
Put in the parts of the play that pertain to Iole. -- Doug Coldwell talk 16:51, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
I also agree that the primary source quotes should not be there and have removed them - replaced with a synopsis of Ovid and Sophocles. -- Doug Coldwell talk 10:52, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
i've replaced the image at the top of the page because according to the entry here, the painting is a depiction of Omphale and not Iole. J. Van Meter ( talk) 16:01, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
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Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Iole. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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Iole was a Philosophy and religion good articles nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There may be suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake. | |||||||||||||
| |||||||||||||
A fact from this article appeared on Wikipedia's
Main Page in the "
Did you know?" column on
August 30, 2008. The text of the entry was: Did you know ... that in the
Greek mythology tale of
Iole,
Deianira (pictured) inadvertently killed her husband
Heracles with a
love charm because of jealousy? | |||||||||||||
Current status: Former good article nominee |
This article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
To-do list for Iole:
|
What does that image have to do with this article?? J. Van Meter 02:16, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
I couldn't find any source that supported some of the information here (like that Iole was Heracles' concubine) so I replaced it with information from Apollodorus. If anyone finds more reputable information that conflicts they can add it of course - as long as it has an ancient source :) Verloren Hoop ( talk) 04:20, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
This article has been recently expanded, but the content that's been added is not very informative. Iole is a minor figure in Greek mythology, and probably doesn't require this level of detail. But certainly, if the article is going to give detailed accounts of ancient myths, and say that there are different versions of said myths, we need references to ancient primary sources, and it needs to be made clear if the narrative is relying on Sophocles, Apollodorus, or whomever. The vagueness of the current article helps no one--it says things like "According to one late Classical version of the tale, the king of Oichalia, Eurytus, had a young daughter that was quite beautiful, eligible for marriage..." but never tells us which late classical version it's referring to. --Akhilleus ( talk) 14:46, 25 August 2008 (UTC)
I've tagged this phrase with a "which?" template, because it appears to be a reference to a specific version of the story, but the sentence never tells us which one. There's also a problem with the use of the word "mytheme", which are supposed to be elements from which a mythological story is made up--but this sentence seems to be using it to mean the entire myth. --Akhilleus ( talk) 00:44, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
"Eurytus years earlier had taught Heracles to become an archer.[3]" This sentence appears at the end of the paragraph concerning the archery contest as if someone is telling a joke and forgot to mention a crucial fact until after the punch line. It sounds like a stream of consciousness rather than a well-thought out treatise.
"When the king seen it was Heracles winning,..." Seen it?! Who is writing this?! How can this be a Did You Know article? This is atrocious. Kwyjibear ( talk) 01:56, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
I quote this as it stands; it is ungrammatical, diffuse, and uninformative. (It also indicates a fundamental procedural error of confounding the mythographers with literary treatments - and it omits Sophocles. But that is another set of howlers altogether. ) Septentrionalis PMAnderson 15:22, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
I'm a bit confused by this section. We have what appears to be a series of quotes from Ovid Heroides 9, and each is said to be from "another version". But they're all from the same work, aren't they? --Akhilleus ( talk) 02:48, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
Thanks Akhilleus for making the major edits and contributions to help bring this up to a potential Good article status. If you see any other improvements that can be made to get it to a Wikipedia Good article please give me some additional pointers or edit accordingly to improve the article since you have more knowledge on Greek mythology than I do. Perhaps you know of others that might be interested in improving the quality of the article. In any case, thanks again for your major contributions to improve the article. Do appreciate it.-- Doug Coldwell talk 22:59, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
Thanks for the hints. After you have done the research, perhaps you can show me better the separated treatments of how Sophocles, Apollodorus, and Seneca treat her. We will work together to get this to GA quickly. Where I found much of this ancient source information on Apollodorus, Seneca, and Ovid was at this site. Perhaps that will help in your research - anyway it will be a good start. -- Doug Coldwell talk 23:24, 30 August 2008 (UTC)
-- Redtigerxyz ( talk) 14:35, 1 September 2008 (UTC)
Parallel Lives of Iole and Clusia: An exact citation, please, for this figment. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 02:32, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
Shouldn't the Graves source and above reference material be put into the article? -- 74.219.90.114 ( talk) 23:25, 13 October 2008 (UTC)
Concerning the "Expand" template - isn't it assumed already that short articles probably should be expanded by others that would have knowledge on the subject? There doesn't seems to be anything in particular asked for in any section. What specifically should be expanded, so that the template is no longer needed? If the editor that entered the template has additional specific information on the subject they are interested in or a specific section - why not enter it to make the section complete. If there isn't anything specific, then I assume the template isn't necessary. -- Doug Coldwell talk 17:45, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
Removed tag since apparently there isn't additional material about Iole in Sophocles that isn't already referenced by Ovid. -- Doug Coldwell talk 12:06, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
Put in the parts of the play that pertain to Iole. -- Doug Coldwell talk 16:51, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
I also agree that the primary source quotes should not be there and have removed them - replaced with a synopsis of Ovid and Sophocles. -- Doug Coldwell talk 10:52, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
i've replaced the image at the top of the page because according to the entry here, the painting is a depiction of Omphale and not Iole. J. Van Meter ( talk) 16:01, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Iole. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
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have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 18 January 2022).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 13:12, 12 April 2017 (UTC)
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on Iole. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
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have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
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source check}}
(last update: 18 January 2022).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 02:05, 16 November 2017 (UTC)