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There are 2 sentences which are inconsistent :
A "The Imperial State Crown is worn annually by the Queen at the State Opening of Parliament. Traditionally, the Crown and other jewels leave in their own carriage and arrive at the Palace of Westminster prior to the Queen's departure from Buckingham Palace. They are then transported to the Robing Room, where the Queen dons her robes and wears the Crown." (The jewels are being kept at the Tower)
B "Because of its weight (910 g), monarchs often choose to wear the Imperial State Crown in their private apartments on and off for a couple of hours on the morning of the State Opening of Parliament so they can get used to the weight and feel comfortable with it on. (One courtier reported on the morning of a State Opening witnessing Queen Elizabeth eating her breakfast and reading newspapers while wearing it.)" (The sovereign has breakfast at Buckingham Palace)
How can statement B then be true ?? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 82.35.23.167 ( talk) 11:27, 21 March 2007 (UTC).
There's a different inconsistency there. The weight of the version of the crown made for QEII is stated, yet there is this nebulous mention of "monarchs" often choosing to wear it. If it is intended to mean Queen Elizabeth II, that is what it should say. There is no other monarch for that particular crown. 70.74.188.103 ( talk) 00:21, 6 February 2011 (UTC)
@ Dhtwiki: OK, I'll bite: the article contains various inaccuracies; for example, the weight given on the Royal Collection website is 1.06 kg and Garrard & Co. is not the Crown Jeweller. A lot of it is inappropriate and just holds up the reader. What the Queen does in private is none of our business, and titillating extracts from Paul Burrell's autobiography do not belong here. "It is also the crown that most often requires repair" is stating the obvious; as the crown most frequently used, of course it requires a lot of maintenance compared to the others. Why mention it? Then we have the old frames (ah, the old frames...) which may be in the Tower of London, or, according to another source, the Museum of London – no one is really sure, so best to leave it out altogether. Everything else was still there in a more concise and easy to read format. I also added many citations from a plurality of sources...
By the way, a very good, RECENT image of the crown is better than a 100-year-old DRAWING of an earlier crown, even if the top part is obscured. Unfortunately, it seems you have taken WP:OWNERSHIP of this article and are prone to WP:POV and WP:Original research. For example, "with a hint of magnificent sparkle effect that is often overwhelmed by photographic lighting" is POV and original research. You also added the words "a copy of" to a caption at Crown Jewels of the United Kingdom on a hunch that a crown in a picture of the Imperial Crown of India might be a copy, despite no evidence to suggest it is anything but the original. Please do not add your own thoughts to the encyclopedia. Firebrace ( talk) 00:08, 13 December 2015 (UTC)
It says in the article here that the Imperial State Crown made for Queen Victoria was dropped and flattened, and it says at State Crown of George I that that crown was dropped and flattened too. Have we an erroneous doubling up here or are crowns lobbed about like cricket balls at State Openings? Giano (talk) 18:09, 4 January 2016 (UTC)
Which crown is shown on the right? -- PBS ( talk) 11:47, 26 September 2017 (UTC)
@ Wikiuser100: Re [1], there is no mention in that source of Cromwell, the Coronation Chair, or melting down the Jewels for coins. What it actually says on page 247 is "By order of the Commonwealth all the Crown Jewels unhappily were ordered to be sold." Firebrace ( talk) 16:23, 10 March 2019 (UTC)
References
The article states that only 3 people are allowed to touch the crown; the monarch, the crown jeweller and the Archbishop of Canterbury. However at the end of the committal service on the 19th of September 2022, the crown jeweller handed the crown to someone who was neither the monarch nor the Archbishop of Canterbury (a Yeoman of the guard?). 88.28.19.194 ( talk) 17:00, 19 September 2022 (UTC)
The ceremony hasn't taken place for some time and this is the first time that it was televised so we could see such details. We may find out more during the forthcoming coronation. In the meantime, I have amended the text to address the issue. Andrew🐉( talk) 17:42, 19 September 2022 (UTC)
Do we need a source, that the British monarch doesn't wear the crown if opening Parliament occurs before the coronation? This relates the State Opening of Parliament page, which doesn't mention this. GoodDay ( talk) 17:44, 22 September 2022 (UTC)
I don't dispute that the edited version on the right more closely resembles the current appearance of the Imperial State Crown as seen at rct.uk. But I would argue that this version is nonetheless less suitable than the original on the left: the retouching arguably counts as a mild form of original research, and I don't think we have a way to verify its exactness except by crudely comparing it to present-day photographs. The arches of the retouched crown also look quite unnatural, in my opinion. It would simply be more encyclopedic for this article to provide a definite depiction of how the crown looked at some point in time, rather than a simulated approximation of how it looks like now. — RAVENPVFF · talk · 10:12, 9 May 2023 (UTC)
@ Peter Ormond removed information added by me regarding the Kavi Flag on the Imperial State Crown and related information. Please discuss. Clearly the symbol on the Crown is the Derasfsh Kavian rather than the incorrectly attributed fleur symbol. BarakKavi ( talk) 12:44, 21 February 2024 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Imperial State Crown article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to multiple WikiProjects. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Daily pageviews of this article
A graph should have been displayed here but
graphs are temporarily disabled. Until they are enabled again, visit the interactive graph at
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There are 2 sentences which are inconsistent :
A "The Imperial State Crown is worn annually by the Queen at the State Opening of Parliament. Traditionally, the Crown and other jewels leave in their own carriage and arrive at the Palace of Westminster prior to the Queen's departure from Buckingham Palace. They are then transported to the Robing Room, where the Queen dons her robes and wears the Crown." (The jewels are being kept at the Tower)
B "Because of its weight (910 g), monarchs often choose to wear the Imperial State Crown in their private apartments on and off for a couple of hours on the morning of the State Opening of Parliament so they can get used to the weight and feel comfortable with it on. (One courtier reported on the morning of a State Opening witnessing Queen Elizabeth eating her breakfast and reading newspapers while wearing it.)" (The sovereign has breakfast at Buckingham Palace)
How can statement B then be true ?? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 82.35.23.167 ( talk) 11:27, 21 March 2007 (UTC).
There's a different inconsistency there. The weight of the version of the crown made for QEII is stated, yet there is this nebulous mention of "monarchs" often choosing to wear it. If it is intended to mean Queen Elizabeth II, that is what it should say. There is no other monarch for that particular crown. 70.74.188.103 ( talk) 00:21, 6 February 2011 (UTC)
@ Dhtwiki: OK, I'll bite: the article contains various inaccuracies; for example, the weight given on the Royal Collection website is 1.06 kg and Garrard & Co. is not the Crown Jeweller. A lot of it is inappropriate and just holds up the reader. What the Queen does in private is none of our business, and titillating extracts from Paul Burrell's autobiography do not belong here. "It is also the crown that most often requires repair" is stating the obvious; as the crown most frequently used, of course it requires a lot of maintenance compared to the others. Why mention it? Then we have the old frames (ah, the old frames...) which may be in the Tower of London, or, according to another source, the Museum of London – no one is really sure, so best to leave it out altogether. Everything else was still there in a more concise and easy to read format. I also added many citations from a plurality of sources...
By the way, a very good, RECENT image of the crown is better than a 100-year-old DRAWING of an earlier crown, even if the top part is obscured. Unfortunately, it seems you have taken WP:OWNERSHIP of this article and are prone to WP:POV and WP:Original research. For example, "with a hint of magnificent sparkle effect that is often overwhelmed by photographic lighting" is POV and original research. You also added the words "a copy of" to a caption at Crown Jewels of the United Kingdom on a hunch that a crown in a picture of the Imperial Crown of India might be a copy, despite no evidence to suggest it is anything but the original. Please do not add your own thoughts to the encyclopedia. Firebrace ( talk) 00:08, 13 December 2015 (UTC)
It says in the article here that the Imperial State Crown made for Queen Victoria was dropped and flattened, and it says at State Crown of George I that that crown was dropped and flattened too. Have we an erroneous doubling up here or are crowns lobbed about like cricket balls at State Openings? Giano (talk) 18:09, 4 January 2016 (UTC)
Which crown is shown on the right? -- PBS ( talk) 11:47, 26 September 2017 (UTC)
@ Wikiuser100: Re [1], there is no mention in that source of Cromwell, the Coronation Chair, or melting down the Jewels for coins. What it actually says on page 247 is "By order of the Commonwealth all the Crown Jewels unhappily were ordered to be sold." Firebrace ( talk) 16:23, 10 March 2019 (UTC)
References
The article states that only 3 people are allowed to touch the crown; the monarch, the crown jeweller and the Archbishop of Canterbury. However at the end of the committal service on the 19th of September 2022, the crown jeweller handed the crown to someone who was neither the monarch nor the Archbishop of Canterbury (a Yeoman of the guard?). 88.28.19.194 ( talk) 17:00, 19 September 2022 (UTC)
The ceremony hasn't taken place for some time and this is the first time that it was televised so we could see such details. We may find out more during the forthcoming coronation. In the meantime, I have amended the text to address the issue. Andrew🐉( talk) 17:42, 19 September 2022 (UTC)
Do we need a source, that the British monarch doesn't wear the crown if opening Parliament occurs before the coronation? This relates the State Opening of Parliament page, which doesn't mention this. GoodDay ( talk) 17:44, 22 September 2022 (UTC)
I don't dispute that the edited version on the right more closely resembles the current appearance of the Imperial State Crown as seen at rct.uk. But I would argue that this version is nonetheless less suitable than the original on the left: the retouching arguably counts as a mild form of original research, and I don't think we have a way to verify its exactness except by crudely comparing it to present-day photographs. The arches of the retouched crown also look quite unnatural, in my opinion. It would simply be more encyclopedic for this article to provide a definite depiction of how the crown looked at some point in time, rather than a simulated approximation of how it looks like now. — RAVENPVFF · talk · 10:12, 9 May 2023 (UTC)
@ Peter Ormond removed information added by me regarding the Kavi Flag on the Imperial State Crown and related information. Please discuss. Clearly the symbol on the Crown is the Derasfsh Kavian rather than the incorrectly attributed fleur symbol. BarakKavi ( talk) 12:44, 21 February 2024 (UTC)